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Recommendations sought for new Athlon64 system

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Anonymous
a b B Homebuilt system
a b à CPUs
October 10, 2004 5:52:50 AM

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.homebuilt (More info?)

I'm building a new system for my father with a pretty decent budget.
He's primarily a flight-simmer. We've decided on an Athlon64
939-level CPU - I'm shooting for the 3500+, but he may go for the
far-more-expensive 3800+. I've been out of the market since I built
my Athlon XP system last year. We've decided not to wait for
PCI-Express motherboards since he wants this system fairly soon. What
motherboards would you recommend for the above CPUs? Also, despite
the fact that we will not be overclocking what aftermarket CPU cooler
would you recommend? I was not all impressed with the retail
heatsink&fan my Athlon XP came with, so I'm leery of the retail
Athlon64 heatsink&fan.

Jack
Remove your coat for email.
Anonymous
a b B Homebuilt system
a b à CPUs
October 10, 2004 5:52:51 AM

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.homebuilt (More info?)

AlphaWoolf wrote:

> I'm building a new system for my father with a pretty decent budget.
> He's primarily a flight-simmer. We've decided on an Athlon64
> 939-level CPU - I'm shooting for the 3500+, but he may go for the
> far-more-expensive 3800+. I've been out of the market since I built
> my Athlon XP system last year. We've decided not to wait for
> PCI-Express motherboards since he wants this system fairly soon. What
> motherboards would you recommend for the above CPUs? Also, despite
> the fact that we will not be overclocking what aftermarket CPU cooler
> would you recommend? I was not all impressed with the retail
> heatsink&fan my Athlon XP came with, so I'm leery of the retail
> Athlon64 heatsink&fan.

Personally, I think it's a mistake to not wait for the PCI Express models,
since this _is_ the future format. I assume you're going with the socket
939 based on future upgradeability, so it makes sense to go with PCI
Express as well. It surely doesn't make sense from a performance point of
view, since the socket 939 processors have half the cache the 754 ones do.
Despite supporting dual channel DDR vs. socket 754's single channel, you'll
take a performance hit because of the diminished cache.

Also, those expensive CPU's just aren't worth the extra $. In 3 to 6 months
they'll cost half of what they go for now. Also, The 3800+ is only slightly
faster than a 3500+ but costs nearly twice as much.

http://www.tomshardware.com/cpu/20040601/index.html

Now that we've crossed that hurdle, the heatsink and fan on the newer Barton
core Athlon XP's and all Athlon64's are a vast improvement over the old
ones. In fact, I've achieved a solid 10% overclock with a stock heatsink on
my Barton core Athlon XP. So, if you don't plan to overclock, then the
stock heatsink and fan should do fine. I'd get the retail CPU for the
warranty alone, and you can check out the heatsink and judge for yourself.
If you're not happy, Thermaltake Volcano's have long been great heatsinks
short of buying something truely exotic like the Gigabyte ones.

As far as boards are concerned, I highly recommend Asus. The A8V Deluxe has
been highly praised and I'd assume it's of the same calliber as the other
Asus boards I've had the pleasure of building with in the past. If you
prefer the nVidia nForce chipsets, look into the Asus K8N-E.
October 10, 2004 5:52:52 AM

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.homebuilt (More info?)

I, too, would wait for the PCI-E boards. Specifically the NForce 4 (or
whatever name they decide to give it). It's supposed to be out within a
month. Along with PCI-E, it has improved I/O speed (the Hypertransport
link), and be available with Soundstorm 2 audio. Additionally, it will be
754 and 939 pin processor capable. Do a google for NForce 4 and read up on
the rumors.

Fitz
Related resources
Anonymous
a b B Homebuilt system
a b à CPUs
October 10, 2004 7:42:59 AM

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.homebuilt (More info?)

On Sat, 09 Oct 2004 22:49:22 -0400, Ruel Smith <NoWay@NoWhere.com>
wrote:

>
>Personally, I think it's a mistake to not wait for the PCI Express models,
>since this _is_ the future format. I assume you're going with the socket
>939 based on future upgradeability, so it makes sense to go with PCI
>Express as well. It surely doesn't make sense from a performance point of
>view, since the socket 939 processors have half the cache the 754 ones do.
>Despite supporting dual channel DDR vs. socket 754's single channel, you'll
>take a performance hit because of the diminished cache.

I did not know this. I've got some more research to do - so the 754s
are actually faster than the latest chips?

>
>Also, those expensive CPU's just aren't worth the extra $. In 3 to 6 months
>they'll cost half of what they go for now. Also, The 3800+ is only slightly
>faster than a 3500+ but costs nearly twice as much.
>
>http://www.tomshardware.com/cpu/20040601/index.html

Agreed. But my father seems rather hung up on getting as close to
4GHz as possible. I think the price differential will persuade him :) 

Thanks for your comments.

Jack
Remove your coat for email.
Anonymous
a b B Homebuilt system
a b à CPUs
October 10, 2004 8:53:44 AM

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.homebuilt (More info?)

On Sat, 09 Oct 2004 22:49:22 -0400, Ruel Smith
<NoWay@NoWhere.com> wrote:

<snip>

>Now that we've crossed that hurdle, the heatsink and fan on the newer Barton
>core Athlon XP's and all Athlon64's are a vast improvement over the old
>ones. In fact, I've achieved a solid 10% overclock with a stock heatsink on
>my Barton core Athlon XP.

But, that's only 10% (usually there is quite a bit more
potential) and the retail 'sink is louder, needs cleaned
more often too.


>o, if you don't plan to overclock, then the
>stock heatsink and fan should do fine. I'd get the retail CPU for the
>warranty alone, and you can check out the heatsink and judge for yourself.
>If you're not happy, Thermaltake Volcano's have long been great heatsinks
>short of buying something truely exotic like the Gigabyte ones.


There is no reason to get retail except the heatsink. CPUs
don't just die, if one does it shouldn't be covered under a
warranty since it would be user or motherboard "error".

Termaltake heatsinks are pretty poor, with the exception of
the silent boost, which is tolerable mostly because of the
Panaflo fan on it, otherwise it's overshadowed by many
better 'sinks, like those from Thermalright. GIgabyte's
aren't all that great, not at twice the price since that
ought to get more than a couple degress difference.

For stock speed or only modest overclock, the key is the
fan. Any 'sink with a copper base (not just a round plug of
copper) will suffice for moderate use so choose an 80x25mm
fan in low, sub-2800 RPM range, even 2000 RPM should be
sufficient for stock speed in a case with good ventilation.
Anonymous
a b B Homebuilt system
a b à CPUs
October 10, 2004 2:04:51 PM

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.homebuilt (More info?)

Fitz wrote:

> I, too, would wait for the PCI-E boards. Specifically the NForce 4 (or
> whatever name they decide to give it). It's supposed to be out within a
> month. Along with PCI-E, it has improved I/O speed (the Hypertransport
> link), and be available with Soundstorm 2 audio. Additionally, it will be
> 754 and 939 pin processor capable. Do a google for NForce 4 and read up on
> the rumors.

Didn't know about that! That sounds like the board to get, as you can get
the faster 754 processor now, and get the 939 when the frequency more than
makes up for the lack of cache.

However, since the memory controller is on the CPU, I assume that means your
memory won't be dual channel when a socket 754 CPU is installed?
Anonymous
a b B Homebuilt system
a b à CPUs
October 10, 2004 2:08:42 PM

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.homebuilt (More info?)

kony wrote:

>>Now that we've crossed that hurdle, the heatsink and fan on the newer
>>Barton core Athlon XP's and all Athlon64's are a vast improvement over the
>>old ones. In fact, I've achieved a solid 10% overclock with a stock
>>heatsink on my Barton core Athlon XP.
>
> But, that's only 10% (usually there is quite a bit more
> potential) and the retail 'sink is louder, needs cleaned
> more often too.

10% overclock is a solid overclock for someone that doesn't invest in more
expensive memory and exotic (usually loud) HSFs. My point is that the stock
HSF would do fine for someone that doesn't overclock.

>>o, if you don't plan to overclock, then the
>>stock heatsink and fan should do fine. I'd get the retail CPU for the
>>warranty alone, and you can check out the heatsink and judge for yourself.
>>If you're not happy, Thermaltake Volcano's have long been great heatsinks
>>short of buying something truely exotic like the Gigabyte ones.
>
>
> There is no reason to get retail except the heatsink. CPUs
> don't just die, if one does it shouldn't be covered under a
> warranty since it would be user or motherboard "error".

I'd still feel better about the warranty and the retail one doesn't cost a
whole lot more than an OEM.

> Termaltake heatsinks are pretty poor, with the exception of
> the silent boost, which is tolerable mostly because of the
> Panaflo fan on it, otherwise it's overshadowed by many
> better 'sinks, like those from Thermalright. GIgabyte's
> aren't all that great, not at twice the price since that
> ought to get more than a couple degress difference.
>
> For stock speed or only modest overclock, the key is the
> fan. Any 'sink with a copper base (not just a round plug of
> copper) will suffice for moderate use so choose an 80x25mm
> fan in low, sub-2800 RPM range, even 2000 RPM should be
> sufficient for stock speed in a case with good ventilation.

If I was going to get serious about overclocking, I'd forget about air
cooling alltogether and get water cooling, but the OP wasn't interested in
overclocking at all.
Anonymous
a b B Homebuilt system
a b à CPUs
October 10, 2004 2:14:21 PM

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.homebuilt (More info?)

AlphaWoolf wrote:

>>Personally, I think it's a mistake to not wait for the PCI Express models,
>>since this _is_ the future format. I assume you're going with the socket
>>939 based on future upgradeability, so it makes sense to go with PCI
>>Express as well. It surely doesn't make sense from a performance point of
>>view, since the socket 939 processors have half the cache the 754 ones do.
>>Despite supporting dual channel DDR vs. socket 754's single channel,
>>you'll take a performance hit because of the diminished cache.
>
> I did not know this. I've got some more research to do - so the 754s
> are actually faster than the latest chips?

Yes, the socket 754 chips (not all) have 1MB cache, whereas the socket 939
chips have 512KB cache. The Athlon64 FX processors all have 1MB cache, but
they're even more expensive.

http://www.amd.com/us-en/Processors/ProductInformation/...

>>Also, those expensive CPU's just aren't worth the extra $. In 3 to 6
>>months they'll cost half of what they go for now. Also, The 3800+ is only
>>slightly faster than a 3500+ but costs nearly twice as much.
>>
>>http://www.tomshardware.com/cpu/20040601/index.html
>
> Agreed. But my father seems rather hung up on getting as close to
> 4GHz as possible. I think the price differential will persuade him :) 

Well, actually the 3800+ runs at 2.4GHz, but I'm sure you already knew that.
Anonymous
a b B Homebuilt system
a b à CPUs
October 10, 2004 2:15:56 PM

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.homebuilt (More info?)

On Sat, 9 Oct 2004 21:44:24 -0800, "Fitz"
<akfitz@mtaonline.net> wrote:

>I, too, would wait for the PCI-E boards. Specifically the NForce 4 (or
>whatever name they decide to give it). It's supposed to be out within a
>month. Along with PCI-E, it has improved I/O speed (the Hypertransport
>link), and be available with Soundstorm 2 audio. Additionally, it will be
>754 and 939 pin processor capable. Do a google for NForce 4 and read up on
>the rumors.
>
>Fitz


Just remember that [early adopters] = [beta testers]

A power user might like to tackle an early board based on
new technology but only the OP can decide who's going to
troubleshoot and maintain this system if it's buggy... and
it almost certainly will be if history is any measure.
Anonymous
a b B Homebuilt system
a b à CPUs
October 10, 2004 4:06:20 PM

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.homebuilt (More info?)

Don't get a 64bit cpu waste of money.

Get a mobile 2500 barton overclock to 2.5 ghz.

Put the money you saved into the bank and save up for a new 64bit
system when their is anything that will run on a 64bit cpu :) 


Just plonk in an X800 Pro that will take care of the high end graphics
no prob, if you want a 20 inch crt would be a good idea, Mitsubitsu,
diamondtron 2070sb.

2 X 512meg pc3200 ram and your set.



On Sun, 10 Oct 2004 01:52:50 GMT, AlphaWoolf
<alpha.woolf@yourcoatsbcglobal.net> wrote:

>I'm building a new system for my father with a pretty decent budget.
>He's primarily a flight-simmer. We've decided on an Athlon64
>939-level CPU - I'm shooting for the 3500+, but he may go for the
>far-more-expensive 3800+. I've been out of the market since I built
>my Athlon XP system last year. We've decided not to wait for
>PCI-Express motherboards since he wants this system fairly soon. What
>motherboards would you recommend for the above CPUs? Also, despite
>the fact that we will not be overclocking what aftermarket CPU cooler
>would you recommend? I was not all impressed with the retail
>heatsink&fan my Athlon XP came with, so I'm leery of the retail
>Athlon64 heatsink&fan.
>
>Jack
>Remove your coat for email.
Anonymous
a b B Homebuilt system
a b à CPUs
October 10, 2004 4:06:21 PM

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.homebuilt (More info?)

Avid Gamer wrote:

> Don't get a 64bit cpu waste of money.

I disagree. The Athlon 64 is a spot-on rival for the Prescotts and higher
frequency Northwoods, yet they'll get approximately 20% additional speed
when Windows64 hits.

> Get a mobile 2500 barton overclock to 2.5 ghz.
>
> Put the money you saved into the bank and save up for a new 64bit
> system when their is anything that will run on a 64bit cpu :) 

Linux runs natively in 64 bit right now. They'll be releasing the 3rd
generation of SuSE Linux for x86-64 in November and all the applications
that ship with it are in 64 bit, as well.
October 10, 2004 4:06:21 PM

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.homebuilt (More info?)

Avid Gamer wrote:

> Don't get a 64bit cpu waste of money.

LOL! Athlon 64 chips are fantastic performers running 32 bit software.

http://www.anandtech.com/cpuchipsets/showdoc.aspx?i=206...
http://www.anandtech.com/cpuchipsets/showdoc.aspx?i=214...

>
>
> Get a mobile 2500 barton overclock to 2.5 ghz.

Many people don't want to overclock. I doubt that you would be
able to overclock it that much without elaborate cooling
(perhaps water cooling?). The Athlon 64 has integrated
memory controller(s) and SSE2, which are some of the reasons
why it performs so much better than an Athlon XP for many
applications.


>
>
> Put the money you saved into the bank and save up for a new 64bit
> system when their is anything that will run on a 64bit cpu :) 

All 32 bit X86 software runs on an Athlon 64.

>
>
> Just plonk in an X800 Pro that will take care of the high end graphics
> no prob,

Using such an expensive video card with an Athlon XP would be
a waste of money. The processor would be a bottleneck for it.
For those with a relatively low budget, an Athlon 64 3000+
socket 754 is only around $150. For those with an even lower budget,
a Sempron 3100+(K8 based) is only around $100.

> if you want a 20 inch crt would be a good idea, Mitsubitsu,
> diamondtron 2070sb.
>
> 2 X 512meg pc3200 ram and your set.
>
> On Sun, 10 Oct 2004 01:52:50 GMT, AlphaWoolf
> <alpha.woolf@yourcoatsbcglobal.net> wrote:
>
> >I'm building a new system for my father with a pretty decent budget.
> >He's primarily a flight-simmer. We've decided on an Athlon64
> >939-level CPU - I'm shooting for the 3500+, but he may go for the
> >far-more-expensive 3800+. I've been out of the market since I built
> >my Athlon XP system last year. We've decided not to wait for
> >PCI-Express motherboards since he wants this system fairly soon. What
> >motherboards would you recommend for the above CPUs? Also, despite
> >the fact that we will not be overclocking what aftermarket CPU cooler
> >would you recommend? I was not all impressed with the retail
> >heatsink&fan my Athlon XP came with, so I'm leery of the retail
> >Athlon64 heatsink&fan.
> >
> >Jack
> >Remove your coat for email.
Anonymous
a b B Homebuilt system
a b à CPUs
October 10, 2004 6:05:34 PM

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.homebuilt (More info?)

Your DAD is a Twat.

More money than sense.


On Sun, 10 Oct 2004 03:42:59 GMT, AlphaWoolf
<alpha.woolf@yourcoatsbcglobal.net> wrote:

>On Sat, 09 Oct 2004 22:49:22 -0400, Ruel Smith <NoWay@NoWhere.com>
>wrote:
>
>>
>>Personally, I think it's a mistake to not wait for the PCI Express models,
>>since this _is_ the future format. I assume you're going with the socket
>>939 based on future upgradeability, so it makes sense to go with PCI
>>Express as well. It surely doesn't make sense from a performance point of
>>view, since the socket 939 processors have half the cache the 754 ones do.
>>Despite supporting dual channel DDR vs. socket 754's single channel, you'll
>>take a performance hit because of the diminished cache.
>
>I did not know this. I've got some more research to do - so the 754s
>are actually faster than the latest chips?
>
>>
>>Also, those expensive CPU's just aren't worth the extra $. In 3 to 6 months
>>they'll cost half of what they go for now. Also, The 3800+ is only slightly
>>faster than a 3500+ but costs nearly twice as much.
>>
>>http://www.tomshardware.com/cpu/20040601/index.html
>
>Agreed. But my father seems rather hung up on getting as close to
>4GHz as possible. I think the price differential will persuade him :) 
>
>Thanks for your comments.
>
>Jack
>Remove your coat for email.
Anonymous
a b B Homebuilt system
a b à CPUs
October 10, 2004 6:35:09 PM

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.homebuilt (More info?)

On Sun, 10 Oct 2004 10:08:42 -0400, Ruel Smith
<NoWay@NoWhere.com> wrote:

>kony wrote:
>
>>>Now that we've crossed that hurdle, the heatsink and fan on the newer
>>>Barton core Athlon XP's and all Athlon64's are a vast improvement over the
>>>old ones. In fact, I've achieved a solid 10% overclock with a stock
>>>heatsink on my Barton core Athlon XP.
>>
>> But, that's only 10% (usually there is quite a bit more
>> potential) and the retail 'sink is louder, needs cleaned
>> more often too.
>
>10% overclock is a solid overclock for someone that doesn't invest in more
>expensive memory and exotic (usually loud) HSFs. My point is that the stock
>HSF would do fine for someone that doesn't overclock.


Yes, it is sufficient, but not very quiet. Same story as
always, it boils down to time spent looking for better 'sink
and a few dollars more... not too hard to find a sink that
performs better at lower noise levels though, which might be
desirable for even a non-overclocked system.

>
>>>o, if you don't plan to overclock, then the
>>>stock heatsink and fan should do fine. I'd get the retail CPU for the
>>>warranty alone, and you can check out the heatsink and judge for yourself.
>>>If you're not happy, Thermaltake Volcano's have long been great heatsinks
>>>short of buying something truely exotic like the Gigabyte ones.
>>
>>
>> There is no reason to get retail except the heatsink. CPUs
>> don't just die, if one does it shouldn't be covered under a
>> warranty since it would be user or motherboard "error".
>
>I'd still feel better about the warranty and the retail one doesn't cost a
>whole lot more than an OEM.

Yes it is nice insurance but on the other hand I feel that
insurance is often abused, that CPUs are returned for
warranty replacement when the warranty shouldn't cover what
happened to them, potentially increasing costs for everyone
(else).

>
>> Termaltake heatsinks are pretty poor, with the exception of
>> the silent boost, which is tolerable mostly because of the
>> Panaflo fan on it, otherwise it's overshadowed by many
>> better 'sinks, like those from Thermalright. GIgabyte's
>> aren't all that great, not at twice the price since that
>> ought to get more than a couple degress difference.
>>
>> For stock speed or only modest overclock, the key is the
>> fan. Any 'sink with a copper base (not just a round plug of
>> copper) will suffice for moderate use so choose an 80x25mm
>> fan in low, sub-2800 RPM range, even 2000 RPM should be
>> sufficient for stock speed in a case with good ventilation.
>
>If I was going to get serious about overclocking, I'd forget about air
>cooling alltogether and get water cooling, but the OP wasn't interested in
>overclocking at all.
>

Naw, no need to watercool except for the most extreme of
overclocks, and then it starts getting harder to justify due
to maintenance and that the addt'l cost could just buy
faster parts again, sooner.

A very good air-cooled 'sink, even if not THE very best, is
$ well spent to get 90% of the potential o'c out of a chip,
at a fraction of the cost of water cooling.

Plus, water cooling is often detrimental to the
motherboard's lifespan, there is still need for a fan
blowing across the board when raising CPU vcore enough to
"need" watercooling. Too many people assume water cooling
means temps are ok, but the truth is that the CPU is far
more resistant to high temps than capacitors are.
Anonymous
a b B Homebuilt system
a b à CPUs
October 10, 2004 10:35:26 PM

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.homebuilt (More info?)

On Sun, 10 Oct 2004 10:04:51 -0400, Ruel Smith <NoWay@NoWhere.com>
wrote:

>Fitz wrote:
>
>> I, too, would wait for the PCI-E boards. Specifically the NForce 4 (or
>> whatever name they decide to give it). It's supposed to be out within a
>> month. Along with PCI-E, it has improved I/O speed (the Hypertransport
>> link), and be available with Soundstorm 2 audio. Additionally, it will be
>> 754 and 939 pin processor capable. Do a google for NForce 4 and read up on
>> the rumors.
>
>Didn't know about that! That sounds like the board to get, as you can get
>the faster 754 processor now, and get the 939 when the frequency more than
>makes up for the lack of cache.
>
>However, since the memory controller is on the CPU, I assume that means your
>memory won't be dual channel when a socket 754 CPU is installed?

Thanks for all the discussion!

I myself would wait for PCI-E, but this system's not for me. I've
told my father to wait, but he wants the system by Christmas. As Kony
pointed out PCI-E will be bleeding edge stuff, something I try to
avoid anyway. :)  The Nforce4 board sounds like something I may be
interested in myself next year.

754 vs 939? Actually Ruel from the link you provided to Tom's
Hardware I drew the conclusion that the 939 3500+ is the way to go
based on performance and price. Looks like the increased bus speed
makes up for the lower clock speed. Thanks a lot for the link, I had
looked there but the site is a bit of a chore to find things on if you
don't visit regularly.

Anyone have any specific model recommendations for heatsink/fan combos
on these chips? Kony mentioned some brands, but surely there are
folks here with some actual experience to share? Are all of them back
to the clip-on method? I have a Zalman for my XP that mounts on 4
posts, much easier on the nerves. The one big plus I attribute to
Intel's stuff is the much easier heatsink installation.

Jack
Remove your coat for email.
October 10, 2004 10:35:27 PM

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.homebuilt (More info?)

The AMD64 heatsink mounting system is much easier than previous versions.
I'm told it's much like the Intel, though I have never built an Intel
system. The retail heatsink and fan that came with my 754 pin 3200+ has
worked fine, even with mild overclocking (the motherboard has a
"performance" setting that boost the bus from 400 to 416). I was going to
upgrade to heatsink/fan, but after running the stock one for awhile decided
it was unnecessary. Of course, it's not the most quiet cooler out there, and
if that's a consideration, you'll want to upgrade it.

As far as new tech buyers=beta testers, I would agree in most cases. But the
technology involved in this new board is basically an upgrade of proven
technology. There are already systems shipping with PCI-E. Soundstorm has
been around, and this is just an improved version of a proven product. The
NForce 3 was revised from the 150 to the 250 chipset, improving the
hypertransport link and solving some memory issues. The NForce 4 seems to be
a further revision, with enough improvements and features to warrant a new
name. I don't believe the "bugs" that drove me insane on the 150 chipset
will be a problem with the NForce 4 (this opinion is free and may very well
be worth exactly what you paid for it!).

It should ship well in advance of Christmas, as I'm sure "they" intend on
making a killing with the new board in a short period of time. Two months
before Christmas, and everyone who wants the latest and greatest will pay a
premium price for it.

Fitz





..
Anonymous
a b B Homebuilt system
a b à CPUs
October 11, 2004 5:07:41 AM

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.homebuilt (More info?)

On Sun, 10 Oct 2004 16:33:29 -0800, "Fitz" <akfitz@mtaonline.net>
wrote:


>As far as new tech buyers=beta testers, I would agree in most cases. But the
>technology involved in this new board is basically an upgrade of proven
>technology. There are already systems shipping with PCI-E. Soundstorm has
>been around, and this is just an improved version of a proven product. The
>NForce 3 was revised from the 150 to the 250 chipset, improving the
>hypertransport link and solving some memory issues. The NForce 4 seems to be
>a further revision, with enough improvements and features to warrant a new
>name. I don't believe the "bugs" that drove me insane on the 150 chipset
>will be a problem with the NForce 4 (this opinion is free and may very well
>be worth exactly what you paid for it!).
>
>It should ship well in advance of Christmas, as I'm sure "they" intend on
>making a killing with the new board in a short period of time. Two months
>before Christmas, and everyone who wants the latest and greatest will pay a
>premium price for it.
>
>Fitz

I've got an Nforce2 board for my XP (Asus A7N8X Deluxe) so I agree the
Nvidia chipset is a good one. If they can get Nforce4 boards to
market before mid-November I'll consider it. Though the SoundStorm is
audio is good (I use mine) for this system I will be going with an
Audigy for sound duties regardless what board I get. SoundStorm is
good, but it's been a bit fussy compatibility-wise (IME).

Jack
Remove your coat for email.
October 11, 2004 5:07:42 AM

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.homebuilt (More info?)

Wow- we have completely different experiences with audio. I have had no luck
getting a Creative product to run without problems, while both Soundstorm
and M-Audio (Revolution 7.1) have been flawless. You've done your research
though- hope all goes well with the new system.

Fitz
October 11, 2004 2:03:15 PM

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.homebuilt (More info?)

"AlphaWoolf" <alpha.woolf@yourcoatsbcglobal.net> wrote in message
news:o uuim05j01hai97182kno20nmtlqjdhbjf@4ax.com...
> On Sun, 10 Oct 2004 10:04:51 -0400, Ruel Smith <NoWay@NoWhere.com>
> wrote:
>
> Anyone have any specific model recommendations for heatsink/fan combos
> on these chips? Kony mentioned some brands, but surely there are
> folks here with some actual experience to share? Are all of them back
> to the clip-on method? I have a Zalman for my XP that mounts on 4
> posts, much easier on the nerves. The one big plus I attribute to
> Intel's stuff is the much easier heatsink installation.
>

Thermalright SLK948, XP-90, XP-120
Zalman 7000B
Much easier to fit HSFs on K8 than on K7

Re 939 boards - MSI K8N Neo2 (Platinum if you want a few more bits)
If you look at the ASUS AV8 make sure that you get a Rev2
ABIT has a new VIA chipset board with PCI-E about to come out the AX-8
Anonymous
a b B Homebuilt system
a b à CPUs
October 13, 2004 1:40:33 AM

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.homebuilt (More info?)

On Sun, 10 Oct 2004 17:50:27 -0800, "Fitz" <akfitz@mtaonline.net>
wrote:

>Wow- we have completely different experiences with audio. I have had no luck
>getting a Creative product to run without problems, while both Soundstorm
>and M-Audio (Revolution 7.1) have been flawless. You've done your research
>though- hope all goes well with the new system.
>
>Fitz
>

SoundStorm has worked flawlessly for me, but game compatibility and/or
Nvidia's drivers have been a problem from time to time. I myself
aren't bothered, but someone like my father who I'm building this
system for really doesn't want to spend much time tweaking things, so
an Audigy it will be.

Jack
Remove your coat for email.
Anonymous
a b B Homebuilt system
a b à CPUs
October 13, 2004 1:43:28 AM

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.homebuilt (More info?)

On Mon, 11 Oct 2004 10:03:15 GMT, "BUFF" <NOSPAM@HERE.COM> wrote:

>
>"AlphaWoolf" <alpha.woolf@yourcoatsbcglobal.net> wrote in message
>news:o uuim05j01hai97182kno20nmtlqjdhbjf@4ax.com...
>> On Sun, 10 Oct 2004 10:04:51 -0400, Ruel Smith <NoWay@NoWhere.com>
>> wrote:
>>
>> Anyone have any specific model recommendations for heatsink/fan combos
>> on these chips? Kony mentioned some brands, but surely there are
>> folks here with some actual experience to share? Are all of them back
>> to the clip-on method? I have a Zalman for my XP that mounts on 4
>> posts, much easier on the nerves. The one big plus I attribute to
>> Intel's stuff is the much easier heatsink installation.
>>
>
>Thermalright SLK948, XP-90, XP-120
>Zalman 7000B
>Much easier to fit HSFs on K8 than on K7
>
>Re 939 boards - MSI K8N Neo2 (Platinum if you want a few more bits)
>If you look at the ASUS AV8 make sure that you get a Rev2
>ABIT has a new VIA chipset board with PCI-E about to come out the AX-8

Thanks very much! I was considering an ABIT KT800 Pro board, but with
PCI-E so close at hand I dunno.

Jack
Remove your coat for email.
!