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Cooling for a "new old" quiet system

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Anonymous
a b B Homebuilt system
a b à CPUs
April 13, 2004 1:13:11 PM

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt (More info?)

Hi,

I'm resurrecting an old KT7E, this time with a Duron 1.2 CPU, with 768MB of
PC133 memory.

The KT7E has a small HSF on the Northbridge, and this fan is really noisy.
It's louder than both the CPU HSF and the power supply it seems.

I'm thinking of replacing that Northbridge HSF with the blue Zalman
Northbridge cooler, and am looking for comments re. the Zalman (the
Northbridge cooler).

Right now, for the CPU, I'm using a stock AMD HSF that I borrowed from a
friend, just to get things working. One of my goals with this machine is to
try to get it as quiet as I can, and I've been experimenting with lowering
the Vcore (which the KT7E BIOS makes very easy to do). So far, I'm down to
1.40v on the Vcore, and the CPU temp is running at 42C in the BIOS display,
at speed 1200 (100).

I'm wondering, if I keep that Vcore, and lower the speed to, say, 900, would
I be able to safely run this CPU without the fan on the HSF? Or, maybe is
there another heatsink that would do a job at passively cooling this CPU?

Another possibility is a quieter HSF that would do a reasonable job. I'm
looking at the TR2-M1. Reviews seem good, and it seems pretty quiet with a
lower speed 80mm fan (the AMD fan runs at ~4200 rpm).

I know this is a bit unusual (most folks want to overclock), but as I
mentioned, I'd really like to get this machine as quiet as possible.

Thanks,
Jim

More about : cooling quiet system

April 13, 2004 1:13:12 PM

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt (More info?)

First, before going any further, I'd suggest running Prime95 on that lower
vCore, just to see how stable it really is. The fact it boots, or even
loads Windows doesn't mean all that much. It will drive you nuts later on
if the system constantly remains unstable while undervolted. I had a
problem on my Abit VI7 because the BIOS is unfortunately undervolting the
CPU (as low as 1.42v at times, usually 1.45v), the thing seems fine
initially, but lots of strange things start happening unless I manually
overvolt.

As far as undervolting to keep temps down, that's not going to be enough to
save you from using a fan, or water cooling, or something. Perhaps the ONLY
thing that might help is a Zalman, they have several VERY large cooper
heatsink solutions. The "flower" type heatsink *may* be able to get by
without a fan under limited conditions, but even a little fanning makes a
big difference. Lower ambient temps help too. The flower type comes w/ a
large 92mm fan (mounted to the PCI slot!) that turns more slowly than a
common 80mm fan, and it's the fan blades that make most of the noise. The
bigger the fan, the slower you can run it for the same CFMs. But going with
NO fan, that's pretty tough, esp. w/ AMD. Their thermal control is terrible
to begin with, that's why the core is exposed! You stand a lot better
chance of running "silent" w/ Intel.

Personally, I think undervolting vCore is a waste of time. As long as the
CPU temps stay within specs, and within reason, far too much is made of it.
Too many people are making extraordinary efforts to keep under 50C (load),
when it's perfectly safe to run as high as 60C. I'd rather run HOTTER than
NOISER! The processor is spec'd to something like 90C (if I recall). And
while I would never let it run THAT hot, I'd still provide some safety
margin, running 55-60C is perfectly fine, well within spec, esp. if not
OC'ing. So what's the point of undervolting?! Keep it stock, get a big
honkin' cooper heatsink w/ lapped bottom, good thermal paste, and LARGE,
slow turning fan (add a speed controller if you like), and it should be fine
*and* quiet. The only guys who have the real problems w/ silence are the
OC'ers. They need the extreme lower temps to make OC'ing possible. For
mere mortals, the temps are not really something to be overly concerned
about, as long as within spec.

HTH

Jim

"Ohaya" <Ohaya@NO_SPAM.cox.net> wrote in message
news:CHRec.6863$55.5304@lakeread02...
> Hi,
>
> I'm resurrecting an old KT7E, this time with a Duron 1.2 CPU, with 768MB
of
> PC133 memory.
>
> The KT7E has a small HSF on the Northbridge, and this fan is really noisy.
> It's louder than both the CPU HSF and the power supply it seems.
>
> I'm thinking of replacing that Northbridge HSF with the blue Zalman
> Northbridge cooler, and am looking for comments re. the Zalman (the
> Northbridge cooler).
>
> Right now, for the CPU, I'm using a stock AMD HSF that I borrowed from a
> friend, just to get things working. One of my goals with this machine is
to
> try to get it as quiet as I can, and I've been experimenting with lowering
> the Vcore (which the KT7E BIOS makes very easy to do). So far, I'm down
to
> 1.40v on the Vcore, and the CPU temp is running at 42C in the BIOS
display,
> at speed 1200 (100).
>
> I'm wondering, if I keep that Vcore, and lower the speed to, say, 900,
would
> I be able to safely run this CPU without the fan on the HSF? Or, maybe is
> there another heatsink that would do a job at passively cooling this CPU?
>
> Another possibility is a quieter HSF that would do a reasonable job. I'm
> looking at the TR2-M1. Reviews seem good, and it seems pretty quiet with
a
> lower speed 80mm fan (the AMD fan runs at ~4200 rpm).
>
> I know this is a bit unusual (most folks want to overclock), but as I
> mentioned, I'd really like to get this machine as quiet as possible.
>
> Thanks,
> Jim
>
>
Anonymous
a b B Homebuilt system
a b à CPUs
April 13, 2004 2:24:15 PM

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt (More info?)

"Ohaya" <Ohaya@NO_SPAM.cox.net> wrote in message news:<CHRec.6863$55.5304@lakeread02>...

> I'm resurrecting an old KT7E, this time with a Duron 1.2 CPU, with 768MB of
> PC133 memory.

> One of my goals with this machine is to
> try to get it as quiet as I can, and I've been experimenting with lowering
> the Vcore (which the KT7E BIOS makes very easy to do). So far, I'm down to
> 1.40v on the Vcore, and the CPU temp is running at 42C in the BIOS display,
> at speed 1200 (100).
[...]
> I know this is a bit unusual (most folks want to overclock), but as I
> mentioned, I'd really like to get this machine as quiet as possible.

I don't know the answers myself, but I know where you'll find
plenty of people who do:

http://www.silentpcreview.com/

Take a look at the forums and ask your question there. You'll
find plenty of people who have undervolted and underclocked
their way to silence.

Isaac Kuo
Related resources
Anonymous
a b B Homebuilt system
a b à CPUs
April 13, 2004 3:50:55 PM

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt (More info?)

"Jim" <null@null.com> wrote in message news:aPTec.1695$Yf6.413@fed1read07...
> First, before going any further, I'd suggest running Prime95 on that lower
> vCore, just to see how stable it really is. The fact it boots, or even
> loads Windows doesn't mean all that much. It will drive you nuts later on
> if the system constantly remains unstable while undervolted. I had a
> problem on my Abit VI7 because the BIOS is unfortunately undervolting the
> CPU (as low as 1.42v at times, usually 1.45v), the thing seems fine
> initially, but lots of strange things start happening unless I manually
> overvolt.
>
> As far as undervolting to keep temps down, that's not going to be enough
to
> save you from using a fan, or water cooling, or something. Perhaps the
ONLY
> thing that might help is a Zalman, they have several VERY large cooper
> heatsink solutions. The "flower" type heatsink *may* be able to get by
> without a fan under limited conditions, but even a little fanning makes a
> big difference. Lower ambient temps help too. The flower type comes w/ a
> large 92mm fan (mounted to the PCI slot!) that turns more slowly than a
> common 80mm fan, and it's the fan blades that make most of the noise. The
> bigger the fan, the slower you can run it for the same CFMs. But going
with
> NO fan, that's pretty tough, esp. w/ AMD. Their thermal control is
terrible
> to begin with, that's why the core is exposed! You stand a lot better
> chance of running "silent" w/ Intel.
>
> Personally, I think undervolting vCore is a waste of time. As long as the
> CPU temps stay within specs, and within reason, far too much is made of
it.
> Too many people are making extraordinary efforts to keep under 50C (load),
> when it's perfectly safe to run as high as 60C. I'd rather run HOTTER
than
> NOISER! The processor is spec'd to something like 90C (if I recall). And
> while I would never let it run THAT hot, I'd still provide some safety
> margin, running 55-60C is perfectly fine, well within spec, esp. if not
> OC'ing. So what's the point of undervolting?! Keep it stock, get a big
> honkin' cooper heatsink w/ lapped bottom, good thermal paste, and LARGE,
> slow turning fan (add a speed controller if you like), and it should be
fine
> *and* quiet. The only guys who have the real problems w/ silence are the
> OC'ers. They need the extreme lower temps to make OC'ing possible. For
> mere mortals, the temps are not really something to be overly concerned
> about, as long as within spec.
>
> HTH


Jim,

Thanks for the comments. I'll be sure to run Prime95 as soon as I get the
chance...
Anonymous
a b B Homebuilt system
a b à CPUs
April 13, 2004 7:56:24 PM

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt (More info?)

I think it's unlikely that you can go totally passive on your CPU. A
better heatsink sporting an undervolted 80mm Panaflo L1A fan should be
so quiet that it should be almost inaudible.

If you haven't already visited http://www.silentpcreview.com/ , I
suggest you do so. Be sure to visit the forums, there is a treasure
trove of information there on the kind of issues you are exploring (e.g.
undervolting and underclocking).


"Ohaya" <Ohaya@NO_SPAM.cox.net> wrote in message
news:CHRec.6863$55.5304@lakeread02...
> Hi,
>
> I'm resurrecting an old KT7E, this time with a Duron 1.2 CPU, with
768MB of
> PC133 memory.
>
> The KT7E has a small HSF on the Northbridge, and this fan is really
noisy.
> It's louder than both the CPU HSF and the power supply it seems.
>
> I'm thinking of replacing that Northbridge HSF with the blue Zalman
> Northbridge cooler, and am looking for comments re. the Zalman (the
> Northbridge cooler).
>
> Right now, for the CPU, I'm using a stock AMD HSF that I borrowed from
a
> friend, just to get things working. One of my goals with this machine
is to
> try to get it as quiet as I can, and I've been experimenting with
lowering
> the Vcore (which the KT7E BIOS makes very easy to do). So far, I'm
down to
> 1.40v on the Vcore, and the CPU temp is running at 42C in the BIOS
display,
> at speed 1200 (100).
>
> I'm wondering, if I keep that Vcore, and lower the speed to, say, 900,
would
> I be able to safely run this CPU without the fan on the HSF? Or,
maybe is
> there another heatsink that would do a job at passively cooling this
CPU?
>
> Another possibility is a quieter HSF that would do a reasonable job.
I'm
> looking at the TR2-M1. Reviews seem good, and it seems pretty quiet
with a
> lower speed 80mm fan (the AMD fan runs at ~4200 rpm).
>
> I know this is a bit unusual (most folks want to overclock), but as I
> mentioned, I'd really like to get this machine as quiet as possible.
>
> Thanks,
> Jim
>
>
Anonymous
a b B Homebuilt system
a b à CPUs
April 13, 2004 7:56:25 PM

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt (More info?)

"Biff" <Biff@spamhaters.org> wrote in message
news:I4Uec.8086$A_4.1888@newsread1.news.pas.earthlink.net...
> I think it's unlikely that you can go totally passive on your CPU. A
> better heatsink sporting an undervolted 80mm Panaflo L1A fan should be
> so quiet that it should be almost inaudible.
>
> If you haven't already visited http://www.silentpcreview.com/ , I
> suggest you do so. Be sure to visit the forums, there is a treasure
> trove of information there on the kind of issues you are exploring (e.g.
> undervolting and underclocking).


Biff,

Thanks. I'll keep you comments in mind, and BTW, have already spent a lot
of time on that site :) ...
Anonymous
a b B Homebuilt system
a b à CPUs
April 14, 2004 12:13:51 AM

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt (More info?)

"Ohaya" <Ohaya@NO_SPAM.cox.net> wrote in message
news:ZzUec.6870$55.6550@lakeread02...
>
> "Jim" <null@null.com> wrote in message
news:aPTec.1695$Yf6.413@fed1read07...
> > First, before going any further, I'd suggest running Prime95 on that
lower
> > vCore, just to see how stable it really is. The fact it boots, or even
> > loads Windows doesn't mean all that much. It will drive you nuts later
on
> > if the system constantly remains unstable while undervolted. I had a
> > problem on my Abit VI7 because the BIOS is unfortunately undervolting
the
> > CPU (as low as 1.42v at times, usually 1.45v), the thing seems fine
> > initially, but lots of strange things start happening unless I manually
> > overvolt.
> >
> > As far as undervolting to keep temps down, that's not going to be enough
> to
> > save you from using a fan, or water cooling, or something. Perhaps the
> ONLY
> > thing that might help is a Zalman, they have several VERY large cooper
> > heatsink solutions. The "flower" type heatsink *may* be able to get by
> > without a fan under limited conditions, but even a little fanning makes
a
> > big difference. Lower ambient temps help too. The flower type comes w/
a
> > large 92mm fan (mounted to the PCI slot!) that turns more slowly than a
> > common 80mm fan, and it's the fan blades that make most of the noise.
The
> > bigger the fan, the slower you can run it for the same CFMs. But going
> with
> > NO fan, that's pretty tough, esp. w/ AMD. Their thermal control is
> terrible
> > to begin with, that's why the core is exposed! You stand a lot better
> > chance of running "silent" w/ Intel.
> >
> > Personally, I think undervolting vCore is a waste of time. As long as
the
> > CPU temps stay within specs, and within reason, far too much is made of
> it.
> > Too many people are making extraordinary efforts to keep under 50C
(load),
> > when it's perfectly safe to run as high as 60C. I'd rather run HOTTER
> than
> > NOISER! The processor is spec'd to something like 90C (if I recall).
And
> > while I would never let it run THAT hot, I'd still provide some safety
> > margin, running 55-60C is perfectly fine, well within spec, esp. if not
> > OC'ing. So what's the point of undervolting?! Keep it stock, get a big
> > honkin' cooper heatsink w/ lapped bottom, good thermal paste, and LARGE,
> > slow turning fan (add a speed controller if you like), and it should be
> fine
> > *and* quiet. The only guys who have the real problems w/ silence are
the
> > OC'ers. They need the extreme lower temps to make OC'ing possible. For
> > mere mortals, the temps are not really something to be overly concerned
> > about, as long as within spec.
> >
> > HTH
>
>
> Jim,
>
> Thanks for the comments. I'll be sure to run Prime95 as soon as I get the
> chance...



Hi,

Well, I got everything loaded up. I ran Prime95 for about 20 minutes, using
the Abit/Via hardware monitor, and am getting to about 45C. This is still
with Vcore at 1.40v!

Jim
Anonymous
a b B Homebuilt system
a b à CPUs
April 14, 2004 1:41:09 AM

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt (More info?)

On Tue, 13 Apr 2004 09:13:11 -0400, Ohaya wrote:

> The KT7E has a small HSF on the Northbridge, and this fan is really noisy.
> It's louder than both the CPU HSF and the power supply it seems.
>
So take it off. It isn't needed. Put a large passive HS on it if you like.

> I'm thinking of replacing that Northbridge HSF with the blue Zalman
> Northbridge cooler, and am looking for comments re. the Zalman (the
> Northbridge cooler).
>
Havn't seen it, but it'll work. As would any other.

> Right now, for the CPU, I'm using a stock AMD HSF that I borrowed from a
> friend, just to get things working. One of my goals with this machine
> is to try to get it as quiet as I can, and I've been experimenting with
> lowering the Vcore (which the KT7E BIOS makes very easy to do). So far,
> I'm down to 1.40v on the Vcore, and the CPU temp is running at 42C in
> the BIOS display, at speed 1200 (100).
>
> I'm wondering, if I keep that Vcore, and lower the speed to, say, 900,
> would I be able to safely run this CPU without the fan on the HSF? Or,
> maybe is there another heatsink that would do a job at passively cooling
> this CPU?
>
> Another possibility is a quieter HSF that would do a reasonable job. I'm
> looking at the TR2-M1. Reviews seem good, and it seems pretty quiet
> with a lower speed 80mm fan (the AMD fan runs at ~4200 rpm).
>
The TR2-M1 (M3 without lights) will work well for any cpu you use. Put a
speed control on it and you would even be able to hear it, if you can now.

> I know this is a bit unusual (most folks want to overclock), but as I
> mentioned, I'd really like to get this machine as quiet as possible.
>
Unless you run your system at 100% for long periods of time you don't even
need a fan on the cpu if you use softeware cooling, like Vcool. Running
LVcool (Linux version) on an athlon XP Palomino core over clocked to
1750MHz and overvolted to 1.85v (the hottest I could make it) idle temp
was only 28.8C with the TR2-M3 cooler and case temp of 26.5C. Under full
load, it climbed to 47C. Now that was with the stock fan running. Without
the fan, idle temp went up only about 2C. Your PSU fan will probably drown
out the TR2-M1 cooler fan anyway. With your Duron not overclocked and
undervolted, it won't put out half the heat as the one I used for testing.

--
Abit KT7-Raid (KT133) Tbred B core CPU @2400MHz (24x100FSB)
http://mysite.verizon.net/res0exft/cpu.htm
April 14, 2004 5:14:47 AM

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt (More info?)

Ohaya wrote:

> Hi,
>
> I'm resurrecting an old KT7E, this time with a Duron 1.2 CPU, with 768MB
> of PC133 memory.
>
> The KT7E has a small HSF on the Northbridge, and this fan is really noisy.
> It's louder than both the CPU HSF and the power supply it seems.
>
> I'm thinking of replacing that Northbridge HSF with the blue Zalman
> Northbridge cooler, and am looking for comments re. the Zalman (the
> Northbridge cooler).
>
> Right now, for the CPU, I'm using a stock AMD HSF that I borrowed from a
> friend, just to get things working. One of my goals with this machine is
> to try to get it as quiet as I can, and I've been experimenting with
> lowering
> the Vcore (which the KT7E BIOS makes very easy to do). So far, I'm down
> to 1.40v on the Vcore, and the CPU temp is running at 42C in the BIOS
> display, at speed 1200 (100).
>


I agree with the others, don't undervolt unless you also are going to
underclock. As far as quiet, get a BIG zalman flower for a faster cpu and
gently move some air across it and it should be fine. I'm using an XP2000
rated HS on a P3-800 passive cooled with a hole in the side of the PSU to
pull some air across it and it's fine. I even used a 47 ohm 1 watt resistor
to tone down the PSU.

And no I'm not 3d gaming nor plan to run 100% load benchmarks to see how hot
I can get it as it will never see that kinda stress in the real use that
box sees.
--

Stacey
!