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Unplugging power cord

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Anonymous
a b B Homebuilt system
August 11, 2004 6:40:08 PM

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt,alt.comp.hardware,uk.comp.homebuilt (More info?)

I see in the manual for my new motherboard - an MSI K8N Neo - it says to
remove the power cord when inserting and removing cards and DIMMs.

Is this good advice or excessive caution? With my current board I never did
that.

--
Derek

More about : unplugging power cord

Anonymous
a b B Homebuilt system
August 11, 2004 6:40:09 PM

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt (More info?)

> I see in the manual for my new motherboard - an MSI K8N Neo - it says to
> remove the power cord when inserting and removing cards and DIMMs.
>
> Is this good advice or excessive caution? With my current board I never
did
> that.

Good advice. 99% of the time you're probably okay anyway, but why take
chances.
Anonymous
a b B Homebuilt system
August 11, 2004 6:40:09 PM

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt,alt.comp.hardware,uk.comp.homebuilt (More info?)

Derek Baker wrote:

> I see in the manual for my new motherboard - an MSI K8N Neo - it says to
> remove the power cord when inserting and removing cards and DIMMs.
>
> Is this good advice or excessive caution? With my current board I never did
> that.
>

There's still standby power active in the system when it's 'off'.

Unplug it when working inside.
Related resources
Anonymous
a b B Homebuilt system
August 11, 2004 6:40:09 PM

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt,alt.comp.hardware,uk.comp.homebuilt (More info?)

"Derek Baker" <me@derekbaker.eclipse.co.uk> wrote in message
news:Jt6dnbWXkY0ovIfcRVn-tw@eclipse.net.uk...
> I see in the manual for my new motherboard - an MSI K8N Neo - it says to
> remove the power cord when inserting and removing cards and DIMMs.
>
> Is this good advice or excessive caution? With my current board I never
did
> that.

Good advice! But if your PSU has a power switch near the cord, this should
be good enough when switched off and will keep the case grounded (touch it
often).

ATX computers keep the PCI slots, standby power, and other components turned
on even when the PC is off. You have to make sure that the PC is getting NO
power before working inside.
Anonymous
a b B Homebuilt system
August 11, 2004 6:46:09 PM

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt,alt.comp.hardware,uk.comp.homebuilt (More info?)

Derek Baker wrote:
> I see in the manual for my new motherboard - an MSI K8N Neo - it says to
> remove the power cord when inserting and removing cards and DIMMs.
>
> Is this good advice or excessive caution? With my current board I never did
> that.

Good advise - else there's still the standby power to your mobo!

--
Paul
Anonymous
a b B Homebuilt system
August 11, 2004 7:02:33 PM

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt,alt.comp.hardware,uk.comp.homebuilt (More info?)

David Maynard wrote:
> Derek Baker wrote:
>
>> I see in the manual for my new motherboard - an MSI K8N Neo - it
>> says to remove the power cord when inserting and removing cards and
>> DIMMs.
>>
>> Is this good advice or excessive caution? With my current board I
>> never did that.
>>
>
> There's still standby power active in the system when it's 'off'.
>
> Unplug it when working inside.

Thanks for the replies. Guess I got lucky with my current setup. :) 

--
Derek
Anonymous
a b B Homebuilt system
August 11, 2004 7:04:54 PM

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt,alt.comp.hardware,uk.comp.homebuilt (More info?)

Paul Hill wrote:

> Derek Baker wrote:
>> I see in the manual for my new motherboard - an MSI K8N Neo - it says to
>> remove the power cord when inserting and removing cards and DIMMs.
>>
>> Is this good advice or excessive caution? With my current board I never did
>> that.
>
> Good advise - else there's still the standby power to your mobo!
>

My ASUS A7M266-D has a (rather bright) green LED between two of the PCI
slots when the standby power is on to remind you to turn it off. Also my
PSU also has a power switch to save unplugging the power lead which is a
Good Thing(TM) as it means the chassis is still earthed.

Parish
Anonymous
a b B Homebuilt system
August 11, 2004 7:06:10 PM

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt,alt.comp.hardware,uk.comp.homebuilt (More info?)

Parish wrote:
> Paul Hill wrote:
>
>> Derek Baker wrote:
>>> I see in the manual for my new motherboard - an MSI K8N Neo - it
>>> says to remove the power cord when inserting and removing cards and
>>> DIMMs.
>>>
>>> Is this good advice or excessive caution? With my current board I
>>> never did that.
>>
>> Good advise - else there's still the standby power to your mobo!
>>
>
> My ASUS A7M266-D has a (rather bright) green LED between two of the
> PCI slots when the standby power is on to remind you to turn it off.
> Also my PSU also has a power switch to save unplugging the power lead
> which is a Good Thing(TM) as it means the chassis is still earthed.
>
> Parish

My PSUs - old and new - have switches on them. I've always used that, when
I've left the cable in.

--
Derek
Anonymous
a b B Homebuilt system
August 11, 2004 7:11:45 PM

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt,alt.comp.hardware,uk.comp.homebuilt (More info?)

"Derek Baker" <me@derekbaker.eclipse.co.uk> wrote in message
news:Jt6dnbWXkY0ovIfcRVn-tw@eclipse.net.uk...
> I see in the manual for my new motherboard - an MSI K8N Neo - it says
to
> remove the power cord when inserting and removing cards and DIMMs.
>
> Is this good advice or excessive caution? With my current board I
never did
> that.
>

It is always good advice to remove the power cord, or unplug an
appliance from the socket, when carrying out any work. Even if you
switch off at the socket, most sockets only switch the live feed, and if
the socket is incorrectly wired, (it does happen, it happened to me with
a house that had been rewired by the Electric Board, they had crossed
the feeds at the fuse box, reversing live and neutral throughout the
whole house), you could get a shock whilst thinking you were safe. I
grabbed hold of 240 volts, and was not too pleased with the person that
did the rewire.
Anonymous
a b B Homebuilt system
August 11, 2004 7:13:48 PM

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt,alt.comp.hardware,uk.comp.homebuilt (More info?)

Derek Baker wrote:

> Parish wrote:
>> Paul Hill wrote:
>>
>>> Derek Baker wrote:
>>>> I see in the manual for my new motherboard - an MSI K8N Neo - it
>>>> says to remove the power cord when inserting and removing cards and
>>>> DIMMs.
>>>>
>>>> Is this good advice or excessive caution? With my current board I
>>>> never did that.
>>>
>>> Good advise - else there's still the standby power to your mobo!
>>>
>>
>> My ASUS A7M266-D has a (rather bright) green LED between two of the
>> PCI slots when the standby power is on to remind you to turn it off.
>> Also my PSU also has a power switch to save unplugging the power lead
>> which is a Good Thing(TM) as it means the chassis is still earthed.
>>
>> Parish
>
> My PSUs - old and new - have switches on them. I've always used that, when
> I've left the cable in.
>

This is the first ATX PSU I've had that has a switch - and this is an
el-cheapo case. I bought a new PSU for friends PC last week and that
didn't have a switch either.

Problem is with the power lead out the chassis isn't earthed, so where
do you connect your anti-stat wrist strap too? I have one of those
special plugs that go in a mains socket but most straps only seem to
have a croc clip for clipping to the chassis - and yes, I have seen
someone with the power lead out and their wirst strap clipped to the
chassis - teapots and chocolate spring to mind :-)

Parish
Anonymous
a b B Homebuilt system
August 11, 2004 7:13:49 PM

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt,alt.comp.hardware,uk.comp.homebuilt (More info?)

You are not earthing for anti-static protection. You are
grounding charges on your shoes. Ground and earthing are
different. Connect the anti-static strap directly to the
computer chassis. That way you and the computer are always at
same potential. Put computer on a table top that connects to
floor - where those charges on your shoes are located.
Therefore your shoes will not create electricity paths through
computer.

Never work on a computer connected to AC mains. Never.
That is nonsense about "earthing" for static protection.
Even worse, any power cord connected to a computer means the
power will eventually and accidentally be turned on or left
on. Remove the power cord. Do not even trust a power
switch. Remove power cord.

Ground out charges on shoes. Earthing has nothing to do
with anti-static protection.

Parish wrote:
> This is the first ATX PSU I've had that has a switch - and this is an
> el-cheapo case. I bought a new PSU for friends PC last week and that
> didn't have a switch either.
>
> Problem is with the power lead out the chassis isn't earthed, so
> where do you connect your anti-stat wrist strap too? I have one
> of those special plugs that go in a mains socket but most strap
> only seem to have a croc clip for clipping to the chassis - and
> yes, I have seen someone with the power lead out and their wirst
> strap clipped to the chassis - teapots and chocolate spring to
> mind :-)
>
> Parish
Anonymous
a b B Homebuilt system
August 11, 2004 7:17:51 PM

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt,alt.comp.hardware,uk.comp.homebuilt (More info?)

Parish wrote:
> Derek Baker wrote:
>
>> Parish wrote:
>>> Paul Hill wrote:
>>>
>>>> Derek Baker wrote:
>>>>> I see in the manual for my new motherboard - an MSI K8N Neo - it
>>>>> says to remove the power cord when inserting and removing cards
>>>>> and DIMMs.
>>>>>
>>>>> Is this good advice or excessive caution? With my current board I
>>>>> never did that.
>>>>
>>>> Good advise - else there's still the standby power to your mobo!
>>>>
>>>
>>> My ASUS A7M266-D has a (rather bright) green LED between two of the
>>> PCI slots when the standby power is on to remind you to turn it off.
>>> Also my PSU also has a power switch to save unplugging the power
>>> lead which is a Good Thing(TM) as it means the chassis is still
>>> earthed.
>>>
>>> Parish
>>
>> My PSUs - old and new - have switches on them. I've always used
>> that, when I've left the cable in.
>>
>
> This is the first ATX PSU I've had that has a switch - and this is an
> el-cheapo case. I bought a new PSU for friends PC last week and that
> didn't have a switch either.
>

[snipped]

What sort of PSU did you get your friend?
--
Derek
Anonymous
a b B Homebuilt system
August 11, 2004 7:27:41 PM

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt,alt.comp.hardware,uk.comp.homebuilt (More info?)

Derek Baker wrote:

> Parish wrote:
>> Derek Baker wrote:
>>
>>> Parish wrote:
>>>> Paul Hill wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> Derek Baker wrote:
>>>>>> I see in the manual for my new motherboard - an MSI K8N Neo - it
>>>>>> says to remove the power cord when inserting and removing cards
>>>>>> and DIMMs.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Is this good advice or excessive caution? With my current board I
>>>>>> never did that.
>>>>>
>>>>> Good advise - else there's still the standby power to your mobo!
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> My ASUS A7M266-D has a (rather bright) green LED between two of the
>>>> PCI slots when the standby power is on to remind you to turn it off.
>>>> Also my PSU also has a power switch to save unplugging the power
>>>> lead which is a Good Thing(TM) as it means the chassis is still
>>>> earthed.
>>>>
>>>> Parish
>>>
>>> My PSUs - old and new - have switches on them. I've always used
>>> that, when I've left the cable in.
>>>
>>
>> This is the first ATX PSU I've had that has a switch - and this is an
>> el-cheapo case. I bought a new PSU for friends PC last week and that
>> didn't have a switch either.
>>
>
> [snipped]
>
> What sort of PSU did you get your friend?

A Dabsvalue one from, would you believe, Dabs :-)

300w £17.88 inc VAT and p&p

Strangely for a cheapo one it's got a brand name on it (and the box),
Mercury, and a URL for their website www.kobian.com


Parish
Anonymous
a b B Homebuilt system
August 11, 2004 7:30:20 PM

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt,alt.comp.hardware,uk.comp.homebuilt (More info?)

Parish wrote:

[snipped]

>>> This is the first ATX PSU I've had that has a switch - and this is
>>> an el-cheapo case. I bought a new PSU for friends PC last week and
>>> that didn't have a switch either.
>>>
>>
>> [snipped]
>>
>> What sort of PSU did you get your friend?
>
> A Dabsvalue one from, would you believe, Dabs :-)
>
> 300w £17.88 inc VAT and p&p
>
> Strangely for a cheapo one it's got a brand name on it (and the box),
> Mercury, and a URL for their website www.kobian.com
>
>
> Parish

No expense spared, eh? :) 

I've just spent more then eighty pounds for an Antec True Power 550.

--
Derek
Anonymous
a b B Homebuilt system
August 11, 2004 7:34:20 PM

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt,alt.comp.hardware,uk.comp.homebuilt (More info?)

Derek Baker wrote:

> Parish wrote:
>
> [snipped]
>
>>>> This is the first ATX PSU I've had that has a switch - and this is
>>>> an el-cheapo case. I bought a new PSU for friends PC last week and
>>>> that didn't have a switch either.
>>>>
>>>
>>> [snipped]
>>>
>>> What sort of PSU did you get your friend?
>>
>> A Dabsvalue one from, would you believe, Dabs :-)
>>
>> 300w £17.88 inc VAT and p&p
>>
>> Strangely for a cheapo one it's got a brand name on it (and the box),
>> Mercury, and a URL for their website www.kobian.com
>>
>>
>> Parish
>
> No expense spared, eh? :) 
>

Certainly not. Only the very best for my friends :-)

> I've just spent more then eighty pounds for an Antec True Power 550.
>

What, brand new? Where from?

Parish
Anonymous
a b B Homebuilt system
August 11, 2004 7:34:21 PM

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt,alt.comp.hardware,uk.comp.homebuilt (More info?)

Parish wrote:
> Derek Baker wrote:
>
>> Parish wrote:
>>
>> [snipped]
>>
>>>>> This is the first ATX PSU I've had that has a switch - and this is
>>>>> an el-cheapo case. I bought a new PSU for friends PC last week and
>>>>> that didn't have a switch either.
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> [snipped]
>>>>
>>>> What sort of PSU did you get your friend?
>>>
>>> A Dabsvalue one from, would you believe, Dabs :-)
>>>
>>> 300w £17.88 inc VAT and p&p
>>>
>>> Strangely for a cheapo one it's got a brand name on it (and the
>>> box), Mercury, and a URL for their website www.kobian.com
>>>
>>>
>>> Parish
>>
>> No expense spared, eh? :) 
>>
>
> Certainly not. Only the very best for my friends :-)
>
>> I've just spent more then eighty pounds for an Antec True Power 550.
>>
>
> What, brand new? Where from?
>
> Parish

http://www.amazon.co.uk/exec/obidos/ASIN/B0000YPUOM/ref...

--
Derek
Anonymous
a b B Homebuilt system
August 11, 2004 7:35:00 PM

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt,alt.comp.hardware,uk.comp.homebuilt (More info?)

GwG wrote:
....
> Even if you
> switch off at the socket, most sockets only switch the live feed, and if
> the socket is incorrectly wired, (it does happen, it happened to me with
> a house that had been rewired by the Electric Board, they had crossed
> the feeds at the fuse box, reversing live and neutral throughout the
> whole house), you could get a shock whilst thinking you were safe. I
> grabbed hold of 240 volts, and was not too pleased with the person that
> did the rewire.

A possibly life-saving tip: if you touch something electrically live
with your fingers in the normal way, your muscles will contract, making
you press or grip the hazard.

If you stroke it gently with the backs of your fingers, you will feel if
it is live, but the muscular contraction will move your hand away from
the hazard.

Best wishes,
--
Michael Salem
Anonymous
a b B Homebuilt system
August 11, 2004 7:58:51 PM

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt,alt.comp.hardware,uk.comp.homebuilt (More info?)

In article <2nunq4F4rlt8U1@uni-berlin.de>, "Parish" me@privacy.net
says...
<snip>
> Problem is with the power lead out the chassis isn't earthed, so where
> do you connect your anti-stat wrist strap too? I have one of those
> special plugs that go in a mains socket but most straps only seem to
> have a croc clip for clipping to the chassis - and yes, I have seen
> someone with the power lead out and their wirst strap clipped to the
> chassis - teapots and chocolate spring to mind :-)
>
Is that really a problem? As long as everything is at the same
potential it doesn't really matter whether it's at ground or 40,000
volts does it?
Anonymous
a b B Homebuilt system
August 11, 2004 8:06:39 PM

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt,alt.comp.hardware,uk.comp.homebuilt (More info?)

Michael Salem wrote:

> GwG wrote:
> ...
>> Even if you
>> switch off at the socket, most sockets only switch the live feed, and if
>> the socket is incorrectly wired, (it does happen, it happened to me with
>> a house that had been rewired by the Electric Board, they had crossed
>> the feeds at the fuse box, reversing live and neutral throughout the
>> whole house), you could get a shock whilst thinking you were safe. I
>> grabbed hold of 240 volts, and was not too pleased with the person that
>> did the rewire.
>

I read a while ago in uk.diy someone who was altering the upstairs
lighting wiring in the loft. He'd isolated the upstairs lighting circuit
but when his wife came upstairs she instintvely switch the stirs light
on and *bang* the guy gets thrown out if the loft. Turned out the
previous owner of the house (or maybe the Leccy Board :-) ) had
connected the downstairs switch to the downstairs lighting circuit and
the upstairs switch to the upstairs circuit!

> A possibly life-saving tip: if you touch something electrically live
> with your fingers in the normal way, your muscles will contract, making
> you press or grip the hazard.
>

Even better tip - get someone else to check it :-)

Seriously, that is good advice that I've read elsewhere (possibly from
you in another NG).

--
By the time you make ends meet, they move the ends.
-=-=-=-
This .sig was brought to you by Tagzilla <http://tagzilla.mozdev.org&gt;
Anonymous
a b B Homebuilt system
August 11, 2004 8:07:08 PM

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt,alt.comp.hardware,uk.comp.homebuilt (More info?)

On Wed, 11 Aug 2004 15:35:00 +0100, Michael Salem
<a$-b$1@ms3.org.uk> wrote:

>GwG wrote:
>...
>> Even if you
>> switch off at the socket, most sockets only switch the live feed, and if
>> the socket is incorrectly wired, (it does happen, it happened to me with
>> a house that had been rewired by the Electric Board, they had crossed
>> the feeds at the fuse box, reversing live and neutral throughout the
>> whole house), you could get a shock whilst thinking you were safe. I
>> grabbed hold of 240 volts, and was not too pleased with the person that
>> did the rewire.
>
>A possibly life-saving tip: if you touch something electrically live
>with your fingers in the normal way, your muscles will contract, making
>you press or grip the hazard.
>
>If you stroke it gently with the backs of your fingers, you will feel if
>it is live, but the muscular contraction will move your hand away from
>the hazard.
>
>Best wishes,

Is that better than using a neon screwdriver :-))
--
Jeff Gaines - Damerham Hampshire UK
Please reply to Newsgroup.
Anonymous
a b B Homebuilt system
August 11, 2004 8:10:22 PM

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt,alt.comp.hardware,uk.comp.homebuilt (More info?)

Rob Morley wrote:

> In article <2nunq4F4rlt8U1@uni-berlin.de>, "Parish" me@privacy.net
> says...
> <snip>
>> Problem is with the power lead out the chassis isn't earthed, so where
>> do you connect your anti-stat wrist strap too? I have one of those
>> special plugs that go in a mains socket but most straps only seem to
>> have a croc clip for clipping to the chassis - and yes, I have seen
>> someone with the power lead out and their wirst strap clipped to the
>> chassis - teapots and chocolate spring to mind :-)
>>
> Is that really a problem? As long as everything is at the same
> potential it doesn't really matter whether it's at ground or 40,000
> volts does it?

I'm not an electricl/electronic expert but I'd say yes - why do
components always comw in an anti-stat bag?

--
The human mind ordinarily operates at only ten percent of its
capacity -- the rest is overhead for the operating system.
-=-=-=-
This .sig was brought to you by Tagzilla <http://tagzilla.mozdev.org&gt;
Anonymous
a b B Homebuilt system
August 11, 2004 8:15:26 PM

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt,alt.comp.hardware,uk.comp.homebuilt (More info?)

Jeff Gaines wrote:

> On Wed, 11 Aug 2004 15:35:00 +0100, Michael Salem
> <a$-b$1@ms3.org.uk> wrote:
>
>>GwG wrote:
>>...
>>> Even if you
>>> switch off at the socket, most sockets only switch the live feed, and if
>>> the socket is incorrectly wired, (it does happen, it happened to me with
>>> a house that had been rewired by the Electric Board, they had crossed
>>> the feeds at the fuse box, reversing live and neutral throughout the
>>> whole house), you could get a shock whilst thinking you were safe. I
>>> grabbed hold of 240 volts, and was not too pleased with the person that
>>> did the rewire.
>>
>>A possibly life-saving tip: if you touch something electrically live
>>with your fingers in the normal way, your muscles will contract, making
>>you press or grip the hazard.
>>
>>If you stroke it gently with the backs of your fingers, you will feel if
>>it is live, but the muscular contraction will move your hand away from
>>the hazard.
>>
>>Best wishes,
>
> Is that better than using a neon screwdriver :-))

I've always wondered about the reliablity of those with regard to their
failure mode.

The advice is always to check them with a known live source, but how do
they fail? If they fail instantly, like light bulbs, they could work
when you tested them and then when you use them on the thing you want to
check it has failed but you think the circuit you're testing is dead.

Parish

--
If Bill Gates had a dime for every time a Windows box crashed...
... Oh, wait a minute, he already does."
-=-=-=-
This .sig was brought to you by Tagzilla <http://tagzilla.mozdev.org&gt;
Anonymous
a b B Homebuilt system
August 11, 2004 8:18:25 PM

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt,alt.comp.hardware,uk.comp.homebuilt (More info?)

Derek Baker wrote:

>> Certainly not. Only the very best for my friends :-)
>>
>>> I've just spent more then eighty pounds for an Antec True Power 550.
>>>
>>
>> What, brand new? Where from?
>>
>> Parish
>
> http://www.amazon.co.uk/exec/obidos/ASIN/B0000YPUOM/ref...
>

Duh! Must get some new glasses - I read your original post as *eight*
pounds, hence my keeness to know whether it was new :-)

Parish
Anonymous
a b B Homebuilt system
August 11, 2004 8:50:05 PM

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt,alt.comp.hardware,uk.comp.homebuilt (More info?)

In article <2nurdkF4ttiqU1@uni-berlin.de>, "Parish" me@privacy.net
says...
> Jeff Gaines wrote:
<snip>
> > Is that better than using a neon screwdriver :-))
>
> I've always wondered about the reliablity of those with regard to their
> failure mode.
>
> The advice is always to check them with a known live source, but how do
> they fail? If they fail instantly, like light bulbs, they could work
> when you tested them and then when you use them on the thing you want to
> check it has failed but you think the circuit you're testing is dead.
>
In my experience they just gradually get dimmer.
Anonymous
a b B Homebuilt system
August 11, 2004 8:51:56 PM

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt,alt.comp.hardware,uk.comp.homebuilt (More info?)

In article <2nur41F4rp5uU1@uni-berlin.de>, "Parish" me@privacy.net
says...
> Rob Morley wrote:
>
> > In article <2nunq4F4rlt8U1@uni-berlin.de>, "Parish" me@privacy.net
> > says...
> > <snip>
> >> Problem is with the power lead out the chassis isn't earthed, so where
> >> do you connect your anti-stat wrist strap too? I have one of those
> >> special plugs that go in a mains socket but most straps only seem to
> >> have a croc clip for clipping to the chassis - and yes, I have seen
> >> someone with the power lead out and their wirst strap clipped to the
> >> chassis - teapots and chocolate spring to mind :-)
> >>
> > Is that really a problem? As long as everything is at the same
> > potential it doesn't really matter whether it's at ground or 40,000
> > volts does it?
>
> I'm not an electricl/electronic expert but I'd say yes - why do
> components always comw in an anti-stat bag?
>
>
To make sure that everything is at the same potential - if they needed
to be grounded then antistatic bags wouldn't work, because they aren't
:-)
Anonymous
a b B Homebuilt system
August 11, 2004 9:02:48 PM

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt,alt.comp.hardware,uk.comp.homebuilt (More info?)

Rob Morley wrote:

> In article <2nur41F4rp5uU1@uni-berlin.de>, "Parish" me@privacy.net
> says...
>> Rob Morley wrote:
>>
>> > In article <2nunq4F4rlt8U1@uni-berlin.de>, "Parish" me@privacy.net
>> > says...
>> > <snip>
>> >> Problem is with the power lead out the chassis isn't earthed, so where
>> >> do you connect your anti-stat wrist strap too? I have one of those
>> >> special plugs that go in a mains socket but most straps only seem to
>> >> have a croc clip for clipping to the chassis - and yes, I have seen
>> >> someone with the power lead out and their wirst strap clipped to the
>> >> chassis - teapots and chocolate spring to mind :-)
>> >>
>> > Is that really a problem? As long as everything is at the same
>> > potential it doesn't really matter whether it's at ground or 40,000
>> > volts does it?
>>
>> I'm not an electricl/electronic expert but I'd say yes - why do
>> components always comw in an anti-stat bag?
>>
>>
> To make sure that everything is at the same potential - if they needed
> to be grounded then antistatic bags wouldn't work, because they aren't
> :-)

I understand that but, without the power lead in the case is not earthed
so you can't discharge yourself through it therefore when you touch a
component you will charge that up to whatever potential you are at which
creates a very large p.d. across the components - doesn't it?

If that's not the case why are you supposed to use an anti-stat wrist
band - connected to earth - when handling e;ectronic devices?

Parish
Anonymous
a b B Homebuilt system
August 11, 2004 9:02:49 PM

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt,alt.comp.hardware,uk.comp.homebuilt (More info?)

> I understand that but, without the power lead in the case is not earthed
> so you can't discharge yourself through it therefore when you touch a
> component you will charge that up to whatever potential you are at which
> creates a very large p.d. across the components - doesn't it?

Not if you are connected to the case... then you have the same potential as
the case as there shouldn't be any static jumping. Of course if you happen
to touch something else at the same time you could have problems.

> If that's not the case why are you supposed to use an anti-stat wrist
> band - connected to earth - when handling e;ectronic devices?

To make sure that there is the least likely chance of a change in potential
and earth is the most commone way to do it.

You don't need to be strapped to the case, just make sure you touch it
before you grab something else.
Anonymous
a b B Homebuilt system
August 11, 2004 9:09:27 PM

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt,alt.comp.hardware,uk.comp.homebuilt (More info?)

Me:

> >If you stroke it gently with the backs of your fingers, you will feel if
> >it is live, but the muscular contraction will move your hand away from
> >the hazard.

Jeff Gaines wrote:
>
> Is that better than using a neon screwdriver :-))

Very much so! You only use a screwdriver when you suspect something may
be wrong; but you don't get it out every time you touch the case of a
metal-bodied toaster, for example (a real example). Having spent time in
Latin America, with 220Vac mains, two-pin wiring, and dodgy appliances
(they were expensive, so kept working indefinitely), I got into the
habit of touching anything metal and plugged-in this way before
committing. Even appliances regularly used, and deemed safe, tended to
make your skin tingle a bit.

(Re another posting: I posted this tip maybe 8 years ago, probably in
demon.tech.pc. Someone has a long memory.)

Best wishes,
--
Michael Salem
Anonymous
a b B Homebuilt system
August 11, 2004 9:29:36 PM

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt,alt.comp.hardware,uk.comp.homebuilt (More info?)

"Michael Salem" <a$-b$1@ms3.org.uk> wrote in message
news:MPG.1b843ef1a785e16f989797@News.individual.NET...
> GwG wrote:
> ...
> > Even if you
> > switch off at the socket, most sockets only switch the live feed,
and if
> > the socket is incorrectly wired, (it does happen, it happened to me
with
> > a house that had been rewired by the Electric Board, they had
crossed
> > the feeds at the fuse box, reversing live and neutral throughout the
> > whole house), you could get a shock whilst thinking you were safe. I
> > grabbed hold of 240 volts, and was not too pleased with the person
that
> > did the rewire.
>
> A possibly life-saving tip: if you touch something electrically live
> with your fingers in the normal way, your muscles will contract,
making
> you press or grip the hazard.
>
> If you stroke it gently with the backs of your fingers, you will feel
if
> it is live, but the muscular contraction will move your hand away from
> the hazard.
>

I am an electrician, so I am used to letting go quick when things get
hot. :-)
Before this, I would judge the state of the house, and wiring, before
just relying on switching off at the socket. This house was immaculate,
and the wiring/installation looked perfect, which it should have been,
as it had been rewired by the EMEB. I was working on a fridge compressor
at the time, and grabbed hold of the relay to remove it, when ouch!. I
tested the socket feeding the fridge, and found the live & neutral
reversed, then checked the other sockets and found them all the same. I
asked the woman who had carried out the rewiring, and she said the EMEB,
I then advised her to contact them, and I put it in writing for her what
I had found. The next time I saw her, I asked her what had happened, she
said that they sent the same electrician that had rewired the house, and
he just kept apologising all the time he was there, but even though I
did not agree with sending the same lad back that had made such a
serious mistake, it gave me a bit of satisfaction knowing that he must
have been squirming before, during, and after the visit.
Anonymous
a b B Homebuilt system
August 11, 2004 10:03:37 PM

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt,alt.comp.hardware,uk.comp.homebuilt (More info?)

Noozer wrote:

>> I understand that but, without the power lead in the case is not earthed
>> so you can't discharge yourself through it therefore when you touch a
>> component you will charge that up to whatever potential you are at which
>> creates a very large p.d. across the components - doesn't it?
>
> Not if you are connected to the case... then you have the same potential as
> the case as there shouldn't be any static jumping.

So, assuming you're charged up with static through walking on a nylon
carpet, you touch the case, which isn't earthed because the power lead
is out, you and the case are now at the same potential. That I
understand, but are you saying that the potential of the case, although
it is at greater than earth potential, is not high enough to damage
electronic devices?

> Of course if you happen
> to touch something else at the same time you could have problems.
>
>> If that's not the case why are you supposed to use an anti-stat wrist
>> band - connected to earth - when handling e;ectronic devices?
>
> To make sure that there is the least likely chance of a change in potential
> and earth is the most commone way to do it.
>

But it could be any potential, the Faraday cgae effect, yes?

> You don't need to be strapped to the case, just make sure you touch it
> before you grab something else.
>
>

Parish
Anonymous
a b B Homebuilt system
August 11, 2004 10:25:06 PM

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt,alt.comp.hardware,uk.comp.homebuilt (More info?)

In article <2nv1ocF4jnqqU1@uni-berlin.de>, "Parish" me@privacy.net
says...
> Noozer wrote:
>
> >> I understand that but, without the power lead in the case is not earthed
> >> so you can't discharge yourself through it therefore when you touch a
> >> component you will charge that up to whatever potential you are at which
> >> creates a very large p.d. across the components - doesn't it?
> >
> > Not if you are connected to the case... then you have the same potential as
> > the case as there shouldn't be any static jumping.
>
> So, assuming you're charged up with static through walking on a nylon
> carpet, you touch the case, which isn't earthed because the power lead
> is out, you and the case are now at the same potential. That I
> understand, but are you saying that the potential of the case, although
> it is at greater than earth potential, is not high enough to damage
> electronic devices?
>
As far as the components in the PC are concerned the case is at ground
potential. As long as anything that touches them is also at that
potential there won't be a problem. So touch the case to equalise your
potential, touch any new components against the case before you remove
them from their antistatic packaging, and there's no reason for naughty
electrons to want to rush anywhere and do mischief.
Anonymous
a b B Homebuilt system
August 12, 2004 12:01:19 AM

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt,alt.comp.hardware,uk.comp.homebuilt (More info?)

Derek Baker wrote:

> David Maynard wrote:
>
>>Derek Baker wrote:
>>
>>
>>>I see in the manual for my new motherboard - an MSI K8N Neo - it
>>>says to remove the power cord when inserting and removing cards and
>>>DIMMs.
>>>
>>>Is this good advice or excessive caution? With my current board I
>>>never did that.
>>>
>>
>>There's still standby power active in the system when it's 'off'.
>>
>>Unplug it when working inside.
>
>
> Thanks for the replies. Guess I got lucky with my current setup. :) 
>

It isn't as if it's 'guaranteed' to blow something with standby power
active, but it's possible.
Anonymous
a b B Homebuilt system
August 12, 2004 12:18:03 AM

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt,alt.comp.hardware,uk.comp.homebuilt (More info?)

Michael Salem wrote:

> A possibly life-saving tip: if you touch something electrically live
> with your fingers in the normal way, your muscles will contract, making
> you press or grip the hazard.
>
> If you stroke it gently with the backs of your fingers, you will feel if
> it is live, but the muscular contraction will move your hand away from
> the hazard.

Thank you.
Anonymous
a b B Homebuilt system
August 12, 2004 12:37:54 AM

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt,alt.comp.hardware,uk.comp.homebuilt (More info?)

Michael Salem wrote:

> GwG wrote:
> ...
>
>>Even if you
>>switch off at the socket, most sockets only switch the live feed, and if
>>the socket is incorrectly wired, (it does happen, it happened to me with
>>a house that had been rewired by the Electric Board, they had crossed
>>the feeds at the fuse box, reversing live and neutral throughout the
>>whole house), you could get a shock whilst thinking you were safe. I
>>grabbed hold of 240 volts, and was not too pleased with the person that
>>did the rewire.
>
>
> A possibly life-saving tip: if you touch something electrically live
> with your fingers in the normal way, your muscles will contract, making
> you press or grip the hazard.
>
> If you stroke it gently with the backs of your fingers, you will feel if
> it is live, but the muscular contraction will move your hand away from
> the hazard.
>
> Best wishes,

That's an old admonition. I had a friend, that while working on a live
switchboard, remembered to do just that. He hit a live connection and
the muscular contraction doubled up his fist and punched him in the eye.
I suppose a black eye is better than electrocution! :-)

Virg Wall
--
A foolish consistency is the
hobgoblin of little minds,........
Ralph Waldo Emerson
(Microsoft programmer's manual.)
Anonymous
a b B Homebuilt system
August 12, 2004 4:33:11 AM

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt,alt.comp.hardware,uk.comp.homebuilt (More info?)

"Rob Morley" <nospam@ntlworld.com> wrote in message
news:MPG.1b8466d08c5d25d7989e30@news.individual.net...
> In article <2nv1ocF4jnqqU1@uni-berlin.de>, "Parish" me@privacy.net
> says...
> > Noozer wrote:
> >
> > >> I understand that but, without the power lead in the case is not
earthed
> > >> so you can't discharge yourself through it therefore when you touch a
> > >> component you will charge that up to whatever potential you are at
which
> > >> creates a very large p.d. across the components - doesn't it?
> > >
> > > Not if you are connected to the case... then you have the same
potential as
> > > the case as there shouldn't be any static jumping.
> >
> > So, assuming you're charged up with static through walking on a nylon
> > carpet, you touch the case, which isn't earthed because the power lead
> > is out, you and the case are now at the same potential. That I
> > understand, but are you saying that the potential of the case, although
> > it is at greater than earth potential, is not high enough to damage
> > electronic devices?
> >
> As far as the components in the PC are concerned the case is at ground
> potential. As long as anything that touches them is also at that
> potential there won't be a problem. So touch the case to equalise your
> potential, touch any new components against the case before you remove
> them from their antistatic packaging, and there's no reason for naughty
> electrons to want to rush anywhere and do mischief.

Hiya Rob.
I love it whenever this one crops up.. here's my 2p
It doesn't matter a shite whether the case is coupled via the mains lead to
mains earth or not.
The metalwork on the case is a large enough sink to absorb any static charge
without any noticable change in case potential wrt earth.
A good test is to put on your best rubber shoes, switch OFF your big screen
TV and wipe your hand all over the screen as it goes off.
Then discharge your body to the case, and observe the spark length
with/without the mains lead plugged in.
It's also possible to discharge yourself to some poor unsuspecting persons
ear lobe, but of course I wouldn't recomend that ;-)
Anonymous
a b B Homebuilt system
August 12, 2004 4:40:34 AM

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt,alt.comp.hardware,uk.comp.homebuilt (More info?)

"Rob Morley" <nospam@ntlworld.com> wrote in message
news:MPG.1b845084e2b625c4989e2c@news.individual.net...
> In article <2nurdkF4ttiqU1@uni-berlin.de>, "Parish" me@privacy.net
> says...
> > Jeff Gaines wrote:
> <snip>
> > > Is that better than using a neon screwdriver :-))
> >
> > I've always wondered about the reliablity of those with regard to their
> > failure mode.
> >
> > The advice is always to check them with a known live source, but how do
> > they fail? If they fail instantly, like light bulbs, they could work
> > when you tested them and then when you use them on the thing you want to
> > check it has failed but you think the circuit you're testing is dead.
> >
> In my experience they just gradually get dimmer.

Unfortunately they fail to danger, and they're neon bulbs so can go quickly
due to shock damage.
I have had one fail, but they do seem pretty sturdy.
Used to deal with small neons a lot in the old GEC TVs and they went dim,
went out, did all sorts of wierd stuff.
The thing about the tingle on the back of the hand is often a first warning,
but I always put my life in he hands of a neon screwdriver in the overall
pocket.
Anonymous
a b B Homebuilt system
August 12, 2004 5:12:04 AM

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt,alt.comp.hardware,uk.comp.homebuilt (More info?)

jim. wrote:

> The metalwork on the case is a large enough sink to absorb any static charge
> without any noticable change in case potential wrt earth.

Ah, thank you. I was assuming that discharging static from your body to
a case with the mains lead out could raise the potential of the case to
a level sufficient to damage electronic components.

Parish
Anonymous
a b B Homebuilt system
August 12, 2004 6:22:05 AM

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt,alt.comp.hardware,uk.comp.homebuilt (More info?)

David Maynard wrote:
> Derek Baker wrote:
>
>> David Maynard wrote:
>>
>>> Derek Baker wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>>> I see in the manual for my new motherboard - an MSI K8N Neo - it
>>>> says to remove the power cord when inserting and removing cards and
>>>> DIMMs.
>>>>
>>>> Is this good advice or excessive caution? With my current board I
>>>> never did that.
>>>>
>>>
>>> There's still standby power active in the system when it's 'off'.
>>>
>>> Unplug it when working inside.
>>
>>
>> Thanks for the replies. Guess I got lucky with my current setup. :) 
>>
>
> It isn't as if it's 'guaranteed' to blow something with standby power
> active, but it's possible.

As I always turn off the PSU using it's switch, turns out it wasn't luck.

--
Derek
Anonymous
a b B Homebuilt system
August 12, 2004 6:22:06 AM

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt,alt.comp.hardware,uk.comp.homebuilt (More info?)

Derek Baker wrote:

> David Maynard wrote:
>
>>Derek Baker wrote:
>>
>>
>>>David Maynard wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>>>Derek Baker wrote:
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>I see in the manual for my new motherboard - an MSI K8N Neo - it
>>>>>says to remove the power cord when inserting and removing cards and
>>>>>DIMMs.
>>>>>
>>>>>Is this good advice or excessive caution? With my current board I
>>>>>never did that.
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>There's still standby power active in the system when it's 'off'.
>>>>
>>>>Unplug it when working inside.
>>>
>>>
>>>Thanks for the replies. Guess I got lucky with my current setup. :) 
>>>
>>
>>It isn't as if it's 'guaranteed' to blow something with standby power
>>active, but it's possible.
>
>
> As I always turn off the PSU using it's switch, turns out it wasn't luck.
>

Yes. Well, that has the same effect, except for the times I've seen people
accidentally turn it back on.

Dern rare to accidentally plug the power cord back in, though.
August 12, 2004 6:35:49 AM

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt,alt.comp.hardware,uk.comp.homebuilt (More info?)

On Wed, 11 Aug 2004 14:40:08 +0100, Derek Baker wrote:

> I see in the manual for my new motherboard - an MSI K8N Neo - it says to
> remove the power cord when inserting and removing cards and DIMMs.
>
> Is this good advice or excessive caution? With my current board I never did
> that.

Plug the PC power cord into a "power strip" that is plugged into the
electrical outlet. The "power strip" is turned OFF. Your PC is grounded,
but it receives no current. Any suggestion that you remove the power cord
is, of course, ridiculous, since there is no grounding path.
--
r.s.nevin@att.net
Anonymous
a b B Homebuilt system
August 12, 2004 6:35:50 AM

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt,alt.comp.hardware,uk.comp.homebuilt (More info?)

Bob@see-below-for-address.com wrote:

> On Wed, 11 Aug 2004 14:40:08 +0100, Derek Baker wrote:
>
>
>>I see in the manual for my new motherboard - an MSI K8N Neo - it says to
>>remove the power cord when inserting and removing cards and DIMMs.
>>
>>Is this good advice or excessive caution? With my current board I never did
>>that.
>
>
> Plug the PC power cord into a "power strip" that is plugged into the
> electrical outlet. The "power strip" is turned OFF. Your PC is grounded,
> but it receives no current. Any suggestion that you remove the power cord
> is, of course, ridiculous, since there is no grounding path.

No, it isn't 'ridiculous' because there is no great over-riding cosmic
significance to having the 'earth ground' connection. What matters is
everything being at the same potential, whether it's 'earth ground' or not.
Anonymous
a b B Homebuilt system
August 12, 2004 7:23:48 AM

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt,alt.comp.hardware,uk.comp.homebuilt (More info?)

Parish wrote:
> jim. wrote:
>
>> The metalwork on the case is a large enough sink to absorb any
>> static charge without any noticable change in case potential
>> wrt earth.
>
> Ah, thank you. I was assuming that discharging static from your
> body to a case with the mains lead out could raise the potential
> of the case to a level sufficient to damage electronic components.

Bushwah. Static charges can accumulate. Find a Windhurst machine
to see what can be done. That is a baby version of a Van de Graaf
generator, which can often generate 5 megavolts. Wattage is
another matter. The Windhurst can easily generate 3 to 5 inch
sparks.

The saving grace is that modern circuits tend to have protective
diodes to bypass the sensitive gates.

--
"Churchill and Bush can both be considered wartime leaders, just
as Secretariat and Mr Ed were both horses." - James Rhodes.
"A man who is right every time is not likely to do very much."
- Francis Crick, co-discover of DNA
Anonymous
a b B Homebuilt system
August 12, 2004 7:42:19 AM

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt,alt.comp.hardware,uk.comp.homebuilt (More info?)

David Maynard wrote:
>
.... snip ...
>
> Yes. Well, that has the same effect, except for the times I've
> seen people accidentally turn it back on.
>
> Dern rare to accidentally plug the power cord back in, though.

Helpful 6 year old: I see why it doesn't work Daddy <plug>

--
"Churchill and Bush can both be considered wartime leaders, just
as Secretariat and Mr Ed were both horses." - James Rhodes.
"A man who is right every time is not likely to do very much."
- Francis Crick, co-discover of DNA
Anonymous
a b B Homebuilt system
August 12, 2004 7:42:20 AM

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt,alt.comp.hardware,uk.comp.homebuilt (More info?)

CBFalconer wrote:

> David Maynard wrote:
>
> ... snip ...
>
>>Yes. Well, that has the same effect, except for the times I've
>>seen people accidentally turn it back on.
>>
>>Dern rare to accidentally plug the power cord back in, though.
>
>
> Helpful 6 year old: I see why it doesn't work Daddy <plug>
>

LOL

Not really an 'accident' then, is it? hehe

Reminds me of a Sylvester the Cat, and his son, cartoon. Kid ends up
shooting him and setting his tail on fire while 'saving' him and Sylvester,
snuffing out the tail flame, comments "let's just not help 'save' dear old
dad any more, hmmm?"
Anonymous
a b B Homebuilt system
August 12, 2004 10:13:30 AM

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt,alt.comp.hardware,uk.comp.homebuilt (More info?)

On Wed, 11 Aug 2004 14:40:08 +0100, "Derek Baker"
<me@derekbaker.eclipse.co.uk> wrote:

>I see in the manual for my new motherboard - an MSI K8N Neo - it says to
>remove the power cord when inserting and removing cards and DIMMs.
>
>Is this good advice or excessive caution? With my current board I never did
>that.

Many boards have an LED on them to warn you when it's still
powered by 5VSB... wonder why they'd do that...
Anonymous
a b B Homebuilt system
August 12, 2004 1:55:11 PM

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt,alt.comp.hardware,uk.comp.homebuilt (More info?)

kony wrote:

> On Wed, 11 Aug 2004 14:40:08 +0100, "Derek Baker"
> <me@derekbaker.eclipse.co.uk> wrote:
>
>>I see in the manual for my new motherboard - an MSI K8N Neo - it says to
>>remove the power cord when inserting and removing cards and DIMMs.
>>
>>Is this good advice or excessive caution? With my current board I never did
>>that.
>
> Many boards have an LED on them to warn you when it's still
> powered by 5VSB... wonder why they'd do that...

So you can see the slots if your PC is under the desk, like mine :-)

Parish
Anonymous
a b B Homebuilt system
August 12, 2004 3:18:03 PM

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt,alt.comp.hardware,uk.comp.homebuilt (More info?)

Parish wrote:
> Derek Baker wrote:
>
>>> Certainly not. Only the very best for my friends :-)
>>>
>>>> I've just spent more then eighty pounds for an Antec True Power
>>>> 550.
>>>>
>>>
>>> What, brand new? Where from?
>>>
>>> Parish
>>
>>
http://www.amazon.co.uk/exec/obidos/ASIN/B0000YPUOM/ref...
>>
>
> Duh! Must get some new glasses - I read your original post as *eight*
> pounds, hence my keeness to know whether it was new :-)
>
> Parish

That's funny: I typed eight first, but corrected it before I posted. :) 

--
Derek
Anonymous
a b B Homebuilt system
August 12, 2004 4:25:13 PM

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt,alt.comp.hardware,uk.comp.homebuilt (More info?)

"CBFalconer" <cbfalconer@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:411AD46D.B1D97320@yahoo.com...
> Parish wrote:
> > jim. wrote:
> >
> >> The metalwork on the case is a large enough sink to absorb any
> >> static charge without any noticable change in case potential
> >> wrt earth.
> >
> > Ah, thank you. I was assuming that discharging static from your
> > body to a case with the mains lead out could raise the potential
> > of the case to a level sufficient to damage electronic components.
>
> Bushwah. Static charges can accumulate. Find a Windhurst machine
> to see what can be done. That is a baby version of a Van de Graaf
> generator, which can often generate 5 megavolts. Wattage is
> another matter. The Windhurst can easily generate 3 to 5 inch
> sparks.

Yes I think we've all played with them, but your likening a case to a leyden
jar doesn't hold much water ;-)
August 12, 2004 10:59:06 PM

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt,alt.comp.hardware,uk.comp.homebuilt (More info?)

On Wed, 11 Aug 2004 22:21:25 -0500, David Maynard wrote:

> Bob@see-below-for-address.com wrote:
>
>> On Wed, 11 Aug 2004 14:40:08 +0100, Derek Baker wrote:
>>
>>
>>>I see in the manual for my new motherboard - an MSI K8N Neo - it says to
>>>remove the power cord when inserting and removing cards and DIMMs.
>>>
>>>Is this good advice or excessive caution? With my current board I never did
>>>that.
>>
>>
>> Plug the PC power cord into a "power strip" that is plugged into the
>> electrical outlet. The "power strip" is turned OFF. Your PC is grounded,
>> but it receives no current. Any suggestion that you remove the power cord
>> is, of course, ridiculous, since there is no grounding path.
>
> No, it isn't 'ridiculous' because there is no great over-riding cosmic
> significance to having the 'earth ground' connection. What matters is
> everything being at the same potential, whether it's 'earth ground' or not.

Except that there is no guarantee that everything is at the same potential.
That is why you ground the PC and wear a grounding strap. Done deal.
--
r.s.nevin@att.net
Anonymous
a b B Homebuilt system
August 13, 2004 12:23:30 AM

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt,alt.comp.hardware,uk.comp.homebuilt (More info?)

"David Maynard" <dNOTmayn@ev1.net> wrote in message
news:10hlohsbah26065@corp.supernews.com...
> Bob@see-below-for-address.com wrote:
>
> > On Wed, 11 Aug 2004 14:40:08 +0100, Derek Baker wrote:
> >
> >
> >>I see in the manual for my new motherboard - an MSI K8N Neo - it says to
> >>remove the power cord when inserting and removing cards and DIMMs.
> >>
> >>Is this good advice or excessive caution? With my current board I never
did
> >>that.
> >
> >
> > Plug the PC power cord into a "power strip" that is plugged into the
> > electrical outlet. The "power strip" is turned OFF. Your PC is
grounded,
> > but it receives no current. Any suggestion that you remove the power
cord
> > is, of course, ridiculous, since there is no grounding path.
>
> No, it isn't 'ridiculous' because there is no great over-riding cosmic
> significance to having the 'earth ground' connection. What matters is
> everything being at the same potential, whether it's 'earth ground' or
not.

Dead right.
This one crops up with monotonous regularity and a significant group seem
unable to get their heads round it (every time).
Try explaining how the anti-static bag saves cmos devices without being
earthed throughout its postal perambulations, that might work.
but I doubt it ;-)
!