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Need input/opinions on a new build Shuttle please

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Anonymous
a b B Homebuilt system
November 12, 2004 3:52:21 AM

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt (More info?)

Hi all,
I am planning to build a Shuttle rig for myself. I am a first
time PC builder and would like some input on the parts I am choosing.
Thanks for your help.
1) ATI RADEON 9800 PRO Video Card, 256MB DDR, 256-bit, DVI/TV-Out,
8X AGP
http://www.newegg.com/app/viewProductDesc.asp?descripti...
2) Intel Pentium 4/ 3.0C GHz 800MHz FSB, 512KB L2 Cache, Hyper
Threading Technology
http://www.newegg.com/app/viewProductDesc.asp?descripti...
3) Corsair XMS Extreme Memory Speed Series, (Twin Pack) 184 Pin
1GB(512MBx2) DDR PC-4000 with Platinum-Silver Heat Spreader Model#
TWINX1024-4000PT
http://www.newegg.com/app/viewProductDesc.asp?descripti...
4) Western Digital 200GB 7200RPM SATA Hard Drive, Model WD2000JD
http://www.newegg.com/app/viewProductDesc.asp?descripti...
5) Plextor 12X DVD+/-RW Drive, Model PX-712A Black
http://www.newegg.com/app/SearchProductResult.asp?Descr...
6) Shuttle XPC Black Barebone System for Socket 478 at
533/800MHz FSB Intel CPU, Model SB75G2 V2
http://www.newegg.com/app/viewproduct.asp?description=5...

On a side note, should i use thermal pad that is included or Artic
Silver paste? heat pipe
or fan/heat sink combo? Will I have any BIOS issues with the SATA HD?
Thanks again..
Anonymous
a b B Homebuilt system
November 12, 2004 3:52:22 AM

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt (More info?)

<MrBacala@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:5128p0peks731t6edship3i60btjkmoc79@4ax.com...
> Hi all,
> I am planning to build a Shuttle rig for myself. I am a first
> time PC builder and would like some input on the parts I am choosing.
> Thanks for your help.
> 1) ATI RADEON 9800 PRO Video Card, 256MB DDR, 256-bit, DVI/TV-Out,
> 8X AGP
>
http://www.newegg.com/app/viewProductDesc.asp?descripti...
> 2) Intel Pentium 4/ 3.0C GHz 800MHz FSB, 512KB L2 Cache, Hyper
> Threading Technology
>
http://www.newegg.com/app/viewProductDesc.asp?descripti...
> 3) Corsair XMS Extreme Memory Speed Series, (Twin Pack) 184 Pin
> 1GB(512MBx2) DDR PC-4000 with Platinum-Silver Heat Spreader Model#
> TWINX1024-4000PT
>
http://www.newegg.com/app/viewProductDesc.asp?descripti...
> 4) Western Digital 200GB 7200RPM SATA Hard Drive, Model WD2000JD
>
http://www.newegg.com/app/viewProductDesc.asp?descripti...
> 5) Plextor 12X DVD+/-RW Drive, Model PX-712A Black
>
http://www.newegg.com/app/SearchProductResult.asp?Descr...
> 6) Shuttle XPC Black Barebone System for Socket 478 at
> 533/800MHz FSB Intel CPU, Model SB75G2 V2
> http://www.newegg.com/app/viewproduct.asp?description=5...
>
> On a side note, should i use thermal pad that is included or Artic
> Silver paste? heat pipe
> or fan/heat sink combo? Will I have any BIOS issues with the SATA HD?
> Thanks again..

Looks good. I built mine last December using the SB65G2 bare bones, 3gHz P4,
ASUS 9600 video, 512mB of Corsair 3200 memory, 160gB SATA, and Plextor 708A
(current at the time), and a Mitsumi combo floppy/flash drive. A very easy
build. No issues with the SATA. You will almost certainly need to use the
Shuttle heatpipe which works quite effectively keeping my CPU at ~50C when
the system is running at 100% load (and have you seen how tight these
computers are inside? probably no room for any other sort of heatsink). One
slight change I made was to add a tiny (40mm?) fan to cool the PWM area on
the right side of the MB which appears to be in an area of stagnant air
flow -- I literally stuck the fan to the tops of the filter caps using
hot-melt glue so it blows a bit of extra air down across the switching
components. No extra noise that I can detect.

The space available for the video card is a bit limited so if your intended
one takes any more than 1 slot worth of space it probably won't work. I
chose the ASUS version of the 9600 as being "fast enough" for my purposes
and because it includes video input which many don't. Since you are a first
time builder I'd advise a lot of care with the assembly of the Shuttle -- it
isn't nearly as easy as one of the "big box" systems to put together but it
can be done very neatly if you take your time. You'll need to be especially
careful about lead dress in a system like this since airflow can easily be
blocked by a badly placed ribbon cable and there are no extra fans to make
up the defecit. http://johnmcgaw.com/furn28.html
--
John McGaw
[Knoxville, TN, USA]
http://johnmcgaw.com
November 12, 2004 3:52:22 AM

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt (More info?)

Why a Pentium 4? Why not an Athlon 64?
The Athlon 64 is a great performer running 32 bit software using a
32 bit operating system. If you use a 64 bit operating system, you
can run 32 bit software side by side with 64 bit software. Many
people who buy a 32 bit processor in '04 or ealy '05, will probably
regret not buying a 64 bit processor instead, as plenty of great 64 bit
software is released in the second half of '05.

http://www.anandtech.com/cpuchipsets/showdoc.aspx?i=206...
http://www.short-media.com/review.php?r=257&p=1


John McGaw wrote:

> <MrBacala@hotmail.com> wrote in message
> news:5128p0peks731t6edship3i60btjkmoc79@4ax.com...
> > Hi all,
> > I am planning to build a Shuttle rig for myself. I am a first
> > time PC builder and would like some input on the parts I am choosing.
> > Thanks for your help.
> > 1) ATI RADEON 9800 PRO Video Card, 256MB DDR, 256-bit, DVI/TV-Out,
> > 8X AGP
> >
> http://www.newegg.com/app/viewProductDesc.asp?descripti...
> > 2) Intel Pentium 4/ 3.0C GHz 800MHz FSB, 512KB L2 Cache, Hyper
> > Threading Technology
> >
> http://www.newegg.com/app/viewProductDesc.asp?descripti...
> > 3) Corsair XMS Extreme Memory Speed Series, (Twin Pack) 184 Pin
> > 1GB(512MBx2) DDR PC-4000 with Platinum-Silver Heat Spreader Model#
> > TWINX1024-4000PT
> >
> http://www.newegg.com/app/viewProductDesc.asp?descripti...
> > 4) Western Digital 200GB 7200RPM SATA Hard Drive, Model WD2000JD
> >
> http://www.newegg.com/app/viewProductDesc.asp?descripti...
> > 5) Plextor 12X DVD+/-RW Drive, Model PX-712A Black
> >
> http://www.newegg.com/app/SearchProductResult.asp?Descr...
> > 6) Shuttle XPC Black Barebone System for Socket 478 at
> > 533/800MHz FSB Intel CPU, Model SB75G2 V2
> > http://www.newegg.com/app/viewproduct.asp?description=5...
> >
> > On a side note, should i use thermal pad that is included or Artic
> > Silver paste? heat pipe
> > or fan/heat sink combo? Will I have any BIOS issues with the SATA HD?
> > Thanks again..
>
> Looks good. I built mine last December using the SB65G2 bare bones, 3gHz P4,
> ASUS 9600 video, 512mB of Corsair 3200 memory, 160gB SATA, and Plextor 708A
> (current at the time), and a Mitsumi combo floppy/flash drive. A very easy
> build. No issues with the SATA. You will almost certainly need to use the
> Shuttle heatpipe which works quite effectively keeping my CPU at ~50C when
> the system is running at 100% load (and have you seen how tight these
> computers are inside? probably no room for any other sort of heatsink). One
> slight change I made was to add a tiny (40mm?) fan to cool the PWM area on
> the right side of the MB which appears to be in an area of stagnant air
> flow -- I literally stuck the fan to the tops of the filter caps using
> hot-melt glue so it blows a bit of extra air down across the switching
> components. No extra noise that I can detect.
>
> The space available for the video card is a bit limited so if your intended
> one takes any more than 1 slot worth of space it probably won't work. I
> chose the ASUS version of the 9600 as being "fast enough" for my purposes
> and because it includes video input which many don't. Since you are a first
> time builder I'd advise a lot of care with the assembly of the Shuttle -- it
> isn't nearly as easy as one of the "big box" systems to put together but it
> can be done very neatly if you take your time. You'll need to be especially
> careful about lead dress in a system like this since airflow can easily be
> blocked by a badly placed ribbon cable and there are no extra fans to make
> up the defecit. http://johnmcgaw.com/furn28.html
> --
> John McGaw
> [Knoxville, TN, USA]
> http://johnmcgaw.com
Related resources
Anonymous
a b B Homebuilt system
November 12, 2004 9:42:55 AM

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt (More info?)

"JK" <JK9821@netscape.net> wrote in message
news:41943476.5ECF3B10@netscape.net...
> Why a Pentium 4? Why not an Athlon 64?
> The Athlon 64 is a great performer running 32 bit software using a
> 32 bit operating system. If you use a 64 bit operating system, you
> can run 32 bit software side by side with 64 bit software. Many
> people who buy a 32 bit processor in '04 or ealy '05, will probably
> regret not buying a 64 bit processor instead, as plenty of great 64 bit
> software is released in the second half of '05.
>
> http://www.anandtech.com/cpuchipsets/showdoc.aspx?i=206...
> http://www.short-media.com/review.php?r=257&p=1
>
According to www.pricewatch.com, same price range at the moment would be:

P4 3.2 Prescott vs. Athlon64 3200+ or

P4 3.4 Prescott vs. Athlon64 3400+

Beyond that range, you can pay up to several hundred dollars for either an
Intel or AMD chip, but hardly anybody gives a damn about those chips, as
hardly anybody spends as much on a processor as they do on the entire rest
of their system combined.

So the P4 3.2/3.4 and Athlon64 3200/3400 would be the best indicators of who
has the best bang for buck, at the moment.

Gaming: OpenGL: The Intel chips are much faster
Gaming: DX8: The AMD chips are faster, no doubt about it
Gaming: DX9: It's virtually a tie, as the AMD chips are two to three
TENTHS of a percentage point faster than Intel.
So on the gaming benchmarks, that's one win for Intel, one win for AMD and
one tie.
GAMING OVERALL: TIED

Business Applications: Office Applications: Intel blows AMD away
Business Applications: Internet Content Creation: Intel blows AMD away
Business Applications: Overall: Intel blows AMD away

Video Encoding: This one is so lopsided, AMD should have thrown in the
towel before entering the ring. Intel wins by a landslide.

Audio Encoding: Again, Intel wins by a landslide

Synthetic Benchmarks: (PC Mark 2004): Here, Intel blows AMD away on both
*CPU* and memory benchmarks

http://www.tomshardware.com/cpu/20040322/index.html

Even at the same price for CPU, an Intel system can be cheaper to
build, as the P4 boards are more mature at this point, and thus there are
better bargains to be found. Considering that an Intel system will likely
be cheaper to build and WILL perform better on all benchmarks except DX8,
it's kind of a no-brainer as to which chip to build with, at the moment.

The following is an article on the Athlon 64 2800+. But more interesting
is,
the benchmarks included in the article are a GREAT comparison of the 3.2GHz
P4
processors with the Athlon64 3200+. In this article, these two processors
are
pretty evenly matched, with Intel being faster on some benchmarks, and AMD
being faster on others.

http://www.anandtech.com/cpuchipsets/showdoc.aspx?i=203...

Now lets look at what Sharky Extreme has to report in their article about
the
3.4GHz Prescott processor. This one has benchmarks that are a great
comparison
of the 3.4GHz Intel chips with the Athlon64 3400+. Here, you have to be
careful,
as Sharky doesn't organize their charts in order of fastest to slowest. And
on
some charts, LOWER scores are better. But if you read all the benchmarks,
you
will again notice that the two chips are pretty evenly matched, with AMD
faster
on some and Intel faster on others.

http://www.sharkyextreme.com/hardware/cpu/article.php/3...

Intel is better than AMD, at the moment. The only way AMD could change that
would be to drop their prices by 30% or better. -Dave, updated 10/19/04
Anonymous
a b B Homebuilt system
November 12, 2004 10:16:15 AM

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt (More info?)

<MrBacala@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:5128p0peks731t6edship3i60btjkmoc79@4ax.com...
> Hi all,
> I am planning to build a Shuttle rig for myself. I am a first
> time PC builder and would like some input on the parts I am choosing.
> Thanks for your help.
> 1) ATI RADEON 9800 PRO Video Card, 256MB DDR, 256-bit, DVI/TV-Out,
> 8X AGP
> http://www.newegg.com/app/viewProductDesc.asp?descripti...
> 2) Intel Pentium 4/ 3.0C GHz 800MHz FSB, 512KB L2 Cache, Hyper
> Threading Technology
> http://www.newegg.com/app/viewProductDesc.asp?descripti...
> 3) Corsair XMS Extreme Memory Speed Series, (Twin Pack) 184 Pin
> 1GB(512MBx2) DDR PC-4000 with Platinum-Silver Heat Spreader Model#
> TWINX1024-4000PT
> http://www.newegg.com/app/viewProductDesc.asp?descripti...
> 4) Western Digital 200GB 7200RPM SATA Hard Drive, Model WD2000JD
> http://www.newegg.com/app/viewProductDesc.asp?descripti...
> 5) Plextor 12X DVD+/-RW Drive, Model PX-712A Black
> http://www.newegg.com/app/SearchProductResult.asp?Descr...
> 6) Shuttle XPC Black Barebone System for Socket 478 at
> 533/800MHz FSB Intel CPU, Model SB75G2 V2
> http://www.newegg.com/app/viewproduct.asp?description=5...
>
> On a side note, should i use thermal pad that is included or Artic
> Silver paste? heat pipe
> or fan/heat sink combo? Will I have any BIOS issues with the SATA HD?
> Thanks again..

Everybody seems to be choosing Plextor, probably cause it's Plextor. But
dual layer burners have been out for quite a while now. Shame on Plextor
for being so slow to get their dual layer burner on the market. Plextor is
great, but any single layer burner is obsolete already, even if it's the
fastest burner on the market. Try the following instead . . .

http://www.newegg.com/app/ViewProductDesc.asp?descripti...

I believe that comes with Roxio software, which is OK. If it does come with
Roxio, and you prefer Nero (I've used recent versions of both, and they are
both great), you can get Nero for about 20 bucks here:
http://www.isellsurplus.com/product.asp?id=6362&c=30&s=...

Everything else looks OK. Shuttle is a great brand, if you are building
SFF. I'm going to suggest an alternative that you might not have
considered, though. The following is great quality, almost as small, and
much more flexible, as far as upgrading goes.

http://www.newegg.com/app/viewProductDesc.asp?descripti...

Note that it's also $200 less than the shuttle box you chose, which leaves
plenty of money in your budget to find any micro-ATX format mainboard for
it. The following doesn't look too bad:
http://www.newegg.com/app/ViewProductDesc.asp?descripti...

On a side note, I've also built a similar system with the following board
and a Prescott processor. Although it's a VIA chipset, it turned out to be
a very stable and EXTREMELY fast system, according to several benchmarks we
ran on it. We paired it up with a Chaintech brand FX5900XT video card, but
your Radeon 9800 Pro would be even faster.
http://www.newegg.com/app/ViewProductDesc.asp?descripti...

NOTE: The shuttle box you chose has a 250W power supply, which is not
adequate for a FX5900XT video card (300W minimum). While I don't anticipate
you'll have any problems building the Shuttle box, you might want to check
the system requirements for your Radeon 9800 Pro before you build anything.
That card might be too much for the Antec Aria also, as the Aria has a 300W
power supply. (just adequate for the FX5900XT) -Dave
November 12, 2004 11:03:55 AM

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt (More info?)

"Dave C." wrote:

> "JK" <JK9821@netscape.net> wrote in message
> news:41943476.5ECF3B10@netscape.net...
> > Why a Pentium 4? Why not an Athlon 64?
> > The Athlon 64 is a great performer running 32 bit software using a
> > 32 bit operating system. If you use a 64 bit operating system, you
> > can run 32 bit software side by side with 64 bit software. Many
> > people who buy a 32 bit processor in '04 or ealy '05, will probably
> > regret not buying a 64 bit processor instead, as plenty of great 64 bit
> > software is released in the second half of '05.
> >
> > http://www.anandtech.com/cpuchipsets/showdoc.aspx?i=206...
> > http://www.short-media.com/review.php?r=257&p=1
> >
> According to www.pricewatch.com, same price range at the moment would be:
>
> P4 3.2 Prescott vs. Athlon64 3200+ or
>
> P4 3.4 Prescott vs. Athlon64 3400+

Not quite. The Athlon 64 3500+ is virtually the same price as the Prescott 3.4 ghz.


>
>
> Beyond that range, you can pay up to several hundred dollars for either an
> Intel or AMD chip, but hardly anybody gives a damn about those chips, as
> hardly anybody spends as much on a processor as they do on the entire rest
> of their system combined.
>
> So the P4 3.2/3.4 and Athlon64 3200/3400 would be the best indicators of who
> has the best bang for buck, at the moment.
>
> Gaming: OpenGL: The Intel chips are much faster

Not quite.

http://www.anandtech.com/cpuchipsets/showdoc.aspx?i=206...



>
> Gaming: DX8: The AMD chips are faster, no doubt about it
> Gaming: DX9: It's virtually a tie, as the AMD chips are two to three
> TENTHS of a percentage point faster than Intel.
> So on the gaming benchmarks, that's one win for Intel, one win for AMD and
> one tie.
> GAMING OVERALL: TIED
>
> Business Applications: Office Applications: Intel blows AMD away

Not quite. Even an Athlon XP3000+($95) beats a Pentium 4 3.2 ghz in Business Winstone
2004.

http://www.anandtech.com/cpuchipsets/showdoc.aspx?i=206...




>
> Business Applications: Internet Content Creation: Intel blows AMD away

Not quite. See the Content Creation Winstone 2004 results.

http://www.anandtech.com/cpuchipsets/showdoc.aspx?i=206...



>
> Business Applications: Overall: Intel blows AMD away

Even an Athlon XP3000+($95) beats a Pentium 4 3.2 ghz in Business Winstone 2004.

http://www.anandtech.com/cpuchipsets/showdoc.aspx?i=206...



>
>
> Video Encoding: This one is so lopsided, AMD should have thrown in the
> towel before entering the ring. Intel wins by a landslide.
>
> Audio Encoding: Again, Intel wins by a landslide
>
> Synthetic Benchmarks: (PC Mark 2004): Here, Intel blows AMD away on both
> *CPU* and memory benchmarks
>
> http://www.tomshardware.com/cpu/20040322/index.html
>
> Even at the same price for CPU, an Intel system can be cheaper to
> build, as the P4 boards are more mature at this point, and thus there are
> better bargains to be found. Considering that an Intel system will likely
> be cheaper to build and WILL perform better on all benchmarks except DX8,
> it's kind of a no-brainer as to which chip to build with, at the moment.
>
> The following is an article on the Athlon 64 2800+. But more interesting
> is,
> the benchmarks included in the article are a GREAT comparison of the 3.2GHz
> P4
> processors with the Athlon64 3200+. In this article, these two processors
> are
> pretty evenly matched, with Intel being faster on some benchmarks, and AMD
> being faster on others.
>
> http://www.anandtech.com/cpuchipsets/showdoc.aspx?i=203...
>
> Now lets look at what Sharky Extreme has to report in their article about
> the
> 3.4GHz Prescott processor. This one has benchmarks that are a great
> comparison
> of the 3.4GHz Intel chips with the Athlon64 3400+. Here, you have to be
> careful,
> as Sharky doesn't organize their charts in order of fastest to slowest. And
> on
> some charts, LOWER scores are better. But if you read all the benchmarks,
> you
> will again notice that the two chips are pretty evenly matched, with AMD
> faster
> on some and Intel faster on others.
>
> http://www.sharkyextreme.com/hardware/cpu/article.php/3...
>
> Intel is better than AMD, at the moment. The only way AMD could change that
> would be to drop their prices by 30% or better. -Dave, updated 10/19/04

Very funny. A $150 Athlon 64 3000+ (socket 754 )beats an $780 Pentium 4 3.2 ghz in Doom 3.

http://www.anandtech.com/cpuchipsets/showdoc.aspx?i=214...

A $95 Athlon XP3000+ beats a $210 Pentium 4 3.2 ghz in Business Winstone 2004.

http://www.anandtech.com/cpuchipsets/showdoc.aspx?i=206...


http://techny.com/articles.cfm?getarticle=606&go=0.5376...
Anonymous
a b B Homebuilt system
November 12, 2004 11:05:30 AM

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt (More info?)

MrBacala@hotmail.com wrote:

>Hi all,

Hi one

> I am planning to build a Shuttle rig for myself. I am a first
>time PC builder and would like some input on the parts I am choosing.
>Thanks for your help.

Here is some guessing.
The one you're choosing might not be very upgradable. I guess there are
other reasons to build a PC, but the ability to upgrade as I go is most
important to me. I also realize that a bare-bones system plus peripherals
might be good for your first time. However, if you want an easy
introduction, why not buy a preassembled but upgradable PC? I'm no expert
on the choices there, many new systems I have noticed are not very
upgradable. You would need advice about that. If you were to do so, maybe
after upgrading a few components, sooner or later you would buy a new
mainboard, or case and power supply. At that point, you would be
completely into building a PC. Since you want to build it, you're only
interest isn't just the fastest or the best.

Providing more information about what you want might help.

Why do you want to build your own? What do you want out of it? What
applications/games do you want to run?

Good luck.






>1) ATI RADEON 9800 PRO Video Card, 256MB DDR, 256-bit, DVI/TV-Out,
>8X AGP
>http://www.newegg.com/app/viewProductDesc.asp?descripti...
&depa=0
>2) Intel Pentium 4/ 3.0C GHz 800MHz FSB, 512KB L2 Cache, Hyper
>Threading Technology
>http://www.newegg.com/app/viewProductDesc.asp?descripti...
&depa=0
>3) Corsair XMS Extreme Memory Speed Series, (Twin Pack) 184 Pin
>1GB(512MBx2) DDR PC-4000 with Platinum-Silver Heat Spreader Model#
>TWINX1024-4000PT
>http://www.newegg.com/app/viewProductDesc.asp?descripti...
&depa=0
>4) Western Digital 200GB 7200RPM SATA Hard Drive, Model WD2000JD
>http://www.newegg.com/app/viewProductDesc.asp?descripti...
&depa=0
>5) Plextor 12X DVD+/-RW Drive, Model PX-712A Black
>http://www.newegg.com/app/SearchProductResult.asp?Descr...
&DEPA=
>6) Shuttle XPC Black Barebone System for Socket 478 at
>533/800MHz FSB Intel CPU, Model SB75G2 V2
>http://www.newegg.com/app/viewproduct.asp?description=5...
>
>On a side note, should i use thermal pad that is included or Artic
>Silver paste? heat pipe
>or fan/heat sink combo? Will I have any BIOS issues with the SATA HD?
>Thanks again..
!