Sign in with
Sign up | Sign in
Your question

Connecting network devices to APC UPS with Australian plugs?

Last response: in Systems
Share
Anonymous
a b B Homebuilt system
February 6, 2005 6:37:18 AM

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt,aus.computers.ibm-pc (More info?)

Hi all,

I have a couple of routers and an ADSL modem that I'd like to shield
from the brownouts/short blackouts that we keep getting here in Perth
(that's in Western Australia for those of you who are reading this
crosspost). The network goes down for a minute everytime we get a power
flicker and the ADSL drops as well because the modem power cycles. I
also wonder how good it is for these devices to keep getting hit with
brownouts/short blackouts. I have an APC UPS and I'd like to connect a
power board to it so that the three networking devices can plug their
bulky power packs into it. My problem is, what do I use to connect the
board to the UPS's power ports? It's not as simple as getting a basic
Australia -> US plug adapter and connecting that to the standard
computer power cable (the type used to connect a monitor to the back of
a PC's PSU), because even US plugs don't plug right into these cables.
Any ideas?

Cheers,

Ari


--
spammage trappage: replace fishies_ with yahoo

I'm going to die rather sooner than I'd like. I tried to protect my
neighbours from crime, and became the victim of it. Complications in
hospital following this resulted in a serious illness. I now need a bone
marrow transplant. Many people around the world are waiting for a marrow
transplant, too. Please volunteer to be a marrow donor:
http://www.abmdr.org.au/
http://www.marrow.org/
February 6, 2005 10:40:49 AM

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt,aus.computers.ibm-pc (More info?)

In article <42052144$1@quokka.wn.com.au>, spodosaurus@_yahoo_.com says...
> Hi all,
>
> I have a couple of routers and an ADSL modem that I'd like to shield
> from the brownouts/short blackouts that we keep getting here in Perth
> (that's in Western Australia for those of you who are reading this
> crosspost). The network goes down for a minute everytime we get a power
> flicker and the ADSL drops as well because the modem power cycles. I
> also wonder how good it is for these devices to keep getting hit with
> brownouts/short blackouts. I have an APC UPS and I'd like to connect a
> power board to it so that the three networking devices can plug their
> bulky power packs into it. My problem is, what do I use to connect the
> board to the UPS's power ports? It's not as simple as getting a basic
> Australia -> US plug adapter and connecting that to the standard
> computer power cable (the type used to connect a monitor to the back of
> a PC's PSU), because even US plugs don't plug right into these cables.
> Any ideas?
>
> Cheers,
>
> Ari
>
>
>
Sorry, You have me somewhat confused here, Your description of the components
is not easy to understand.
Where do the US plugs come into it.

If you have some components that DO NOT have the australian style plug you
need to describe which they are.

As an example my UPS is fitted with 4 standard (aussie type) plugs and I am
able to fit a six plug board to it in the normal manner.
Having difficulty in inderstanding your requirement, plug types.


More details will help. :) 
February 6, 2005 10:46:29 AM

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt,aus.computers.ibm-pc (More info?)

In article <42052144$1@quokka.wn.com.au>, spodosaurus@_yahoo_.com says...
> Hi all,
>
> I have a couple of routers and an ADSL modem that I'd like to shield
> from the brownouts/short blackouts that we keep getting here in Perth
> (that's in Western Australia for those of you who are reading this
> crosspost). The network goes down for a minute everytime we get a power
> flicker and the ADSL drops as well because the modem power cycles. I
> also wonder how good it is for these devices to keep getting hit with
> brownouts/short blackouts. I have an APC UPS and I'd like to connect a
> power board to it so that the three networking devices can plug their
> bulky power packs into it. My problem is, what do I use to connect the
> board to the UPS's power ports? It's not as simple as getting a basic
> Australia -> US plug adapter and connecting that to the standard
> computer power cable (the type used to connect a monitor to the back of
> a PC's PSU), because even US plugs don't plug right into these cables.
> Any ideas?
>
> Cheers,
>
> Ari
>
>
>
Just another thought after a re read.

If you have at least one three pin connector on your APC you could connect a
power board to that connector. Your monitor could then be connected directly
to the APC with the Computer Power Supply being connected to the Board along
with the networking components. They would all then be protected from power
fluctations and probs.

Hopefully this will help.
Related resources
Anonymous
a b B Homebuilt system
February 6, 2005 10:46:30 AM

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt,aus.computers.ibm-pc (More info?)

"SoMeOnE" <I.was@home.here> wrote in message
news:MPG.1c6fdbb36aad8099989712@news.westnet.com.au...
> In article <42052144$1@quokka.wn.com.au>, spodosaurus@_yahoo_.com says...
> > Hi all,
> >
> > I have a couple of routers and an ADSL modem that I'd like to shield
> > from the brownouts/short blackouts that we keep getting here in Perth
> > (that's in Western Australia for those of you who are reading this
> > crosspost). The network goes down for a minute everytime we get a power
> > flicker and the ADSL drops as well because the modem power cycles. I
> > also wonder how good it is for these devices to keep getting hit with
> > brownouts/short blackouts. I have an APC UPS and I'd like to connect a
> > power board to it so that the three networking devices can plug their
> > bulky power packs into it. My problem is, what do I use to connect the
> > board to the UPS's power ports? It's not as simple as getting a basic
> > Australia -> US plug adapter and connecting that to the standard
> > computer power cable (the type used to connect a monitor to the back of
> > a PC's PSU), because even US plugs don't plug right into these cables.
> > Any ideas?
> >
> > Cheers,
> >
> > Ari
> >
> >
> >
> Just another thought after a re read.
>
> If you have at least one three pin connector on your APC you could connect
a
> power board to that connector. Your monitor could then be connected
directly
> to the APC with the Computer Power Supply being connected to the Board
along
> with the networking components. They would all then be protected from
power
> fluctations and probs.
>
> Hopefully this will help.

I think there has been some confusion in describing the power outlets on the
back of the UPS in question. They arent 'american', but I suspect are in
fact IEEE outlets. Generally one 'male' IEEE intlet for power in, and 4
'female' IEEE outlets for power out.

I suspect that the model UPS the OP is talking about(APCC) has IEEE plugs on
the back, rather than 3-pin GPO outlets that many other manufacturers have.
They will be the female outlets, which are a bit harder to track down plugs
for than the male sockets you see on most computer power supplies, electric
kettles, etc. This is the same as the 2 APCC models I have here.

SOME of these APCC UPS models come with a Standard AUS GPO-IEEE plug for
power in, and supposedly you are going to use the outlets on the back using
a standard IEE extension lead to power all dependant peripherals. This
becomes a bit difficult if you need to power items that dont have an IEEE
type lead...

My solution was to wire a female IEE into the lead on a 6 outlet plug-pack.
This gave me heaps of options to power the plethora of 'hangers-on'. This
solution has worked for the 3 APCC units I have owned over the past 7 years;
I live in hope the next unit I buy has a better arrangement of plugs on the
back...

PLaces like Dick Smith, or Jaycar should be able to source the 'female' IEEE
plug that will fit the sockets on the back of the UPS.

Cheers,

Rod.......Out Back
February 6, 2005 11:12:33 AM

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt,aus.computers.ibm-pc (More info?)

spodosaurus wrote:
> Hi all,
>
> I have a couple of routers and an ADSL modem that I'd like to shield
> from the brownouts/short blackouts that we keep getting here in Perth
> (that's in Western Australia for those of you who are reading this
> crosspost). The network goes down for a minute everytime we get a power
> flicker and the ADSL drops as well because the modem power cycles. I
> also wonder how good it is for these devices to keep getting hit with
> brownouts/short blackouts. I have an APC UPS and I'd like to connect a
> power board to it so that the three networking devices can plug their
> bulky power packs into it. My problem is, what do I use to connect the
> board to the UPS's power ports? It's not as simple as getting a basic
> Australia -> US plug adapter and connecting that to the standard
> computer power cable (the type used to connect a monitor to the back of
> a PC's PSU), because even US plugs don't plug right into these cables.
> Any ideas?
>
> Cheers,
>
> Ari
>
>

One bodgy way around this, which is what I did. Cut the loopback lead in
1/2 and cut the plug off the power board. Then connect the required plug
to the end of the powerboard lead and insulate well.
Anonymous
a b B Homebuilt system
February 6, 2005 6:41:45 PM

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt,aus.computers.ibm-pc (More info?)

"Rod Out back" <someone@IHATESPAM.BIGPOND.COM> writes:
>I think there has been some confusion in describing the power outlets on the
>back of the UPS in question. They arent 'american', but I suspect are in
>fact IEEE outlets. Generally one 'male' IEEE intlet for power in, and 4
>'female' IEEE outlets for power out.

IEC-320 C13/C14 (see http://www.accesscomms.com.au/iec320.htm for pictures).

>My solution was to wire a female IEE into the lead on a 6 outlet plug-pack.

You can buy male IEC to female crowfoot (Aussie standard) extension leads
(some UPSs ship with these). I got some male IEC to female IEC and female
crowfoot leads from Rockby.

>PLaces like Dick Smith, or Jaycar should be able to source the 'female' IEEE
>plug that will fit the sockets on the back of the UPS.

I think you want the male IEC plug to fit the UPS outlets.
--
David Wilson School of IT & CS, Uni of Wollongong, Australia
Anonymous
a b B Homebuilt system
February 6, 2005 7:02:43 PM

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt,aus.computers.ibm-pc (More info?)

Rod Out back wrote:
> "SoMeOnE" <I.was@home.here> wrote in message
> news:MPG.1c6fdbb36aad8099989712@news.westnet.com.au...
>
>>In article <42052144$1@quokka.wn.com.au>, spodosaurus@_yahoo_.com says...
>>
>>>Hi all,
>>>
>>>I have a couple of routers and an ADSL modem that I'd like to shield
>>>from the brownouts/short blackouts that we keep getting here in Perth
>>>(that's in Western Australia for those of you who are reading this
>>>crosspost). The network goes down for a minute everytime we get a power
>>>flicker and the ADSL drops as well because the modem power cycles. I
>>>also wonder how good it is for these devices to keep getting hit with
>>>brownouts/short blackouts. I have an APC UPS and I'd like to connect a
>>>power board to it so that the three networking devices can plug their
>>>bulky power packs into it. My problem is, what do I use to connect the
>>>board to the UPS's power ports? It's not as simple as getting a basic
>>>Australia -> US plug adapter and connecting that to the standard
>>>computer power cable (the type used to connect a monitor to the back of
>>>a PC's PSU), because even US plugs don't plug right into these cables.
>>>Any ideas?
>>>
>>>Cheers,
>>>
>>>Ari
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>>Just another thought after a re read.
>>
>>If you have at least one three pin connector on your APC you could connect
>
> a
>
>>power board to that connector. Your monitor could then be connected
>
> directly
>
>>to the APC with the Computer Power Supply being connected to the Board
>
> along
>
>>with the networking components. They would all then be protected from
>
> power
>
>>fluctations and probs.
>>
>>Hopefully this will help.
>
>
> I think there has been some confusion in describing the power outlets on the
> back of the UPS in question. They arent 'american', but I suspect are in
> fact IEEE outlets. Generally one 'male' IEEE intlet for power in, and 4
> 'female' IEEE outlets for power out.
>

Yes, that's correct. I asked before at an electronical components shop
and the dork told me to just get a travel adapter (Aus -> US) so I
didn't get much help there and wanted to avoid people making that
assumption this time. This APC brand UPS model is similar to the one I
have, but mine is several years old and they've change parts of the
design slightly:

http://www.apc.com/resource/include/techspec_index.cfm?...

> This
> becomes a bit difficult if you need to power items that dont have an IEEE
> type lead...
>

And that's where I'm struggling at the moment.

> My solution was to wire a female IEE into the lead on a 6 outlet plug-pack.
> This gave me heaps of options to power the plethora of 'hangers-on'. This
> solution has worked for the 3 APCC units I have owned over the past 7 years;
> I live in hope the next unit I buy has a better arrangement of plugs on the
> back...

I'm still hoping I can find an adapter before I have to resort to
cutting and splicing wires... :-(

>
> PLaces like Dick Smith, or Jaycar should be able to source the 'female' IEEE
> plug that will fit the sockets on the back of the UPS.

I've got a box of old computer cables, several of which can plug into
the back of the UPS. I guess if it comes to it, I'll just cut up one or
two of these and a power board's plug line.

>
> Cheers,
>
> Rod.......Out Back
>
>
>


--
spammage trappage: replace fishies_ with yahoo

I'm going to die rather sooner than I'd like. I tried to protect my
neighbours from crime, and became the victim of it. Complications in
hospital following this resulted in a serious illness. I now need a bone
marrow transplant. Many people around the world are waiting for a marrow
transplant, too. Please volunteer to be a marrow donor:
http://www.abmdr.org.au/
http://www.marrow.org/
Anonymous
a b B Homebuilt system
February 6, 2005 7:19:41 PM

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt,aus.computers.ibm-pc (More info?)

Tsunami wrote:
> spodosaurus wrote:
>
>> Hi all,
>>
>> I have a couple of routers and an ADSL modem that I'd like to shield
>> from the brownouts/short blackouts that we keep getting here in Perth
>> (that's in Western Australia for those of you who are reading this
>> crosspost). The network goes down for a minute everytime we get a
>> power flicker and the ADSL drops as well because the modem power
>> cycles. I also wonder how good it is for these devices to keep getting
>> hit with brownouts/short blackouts. I have an APC UPS and I'd like to
>> connect a power board to it so that the three networking devices can
>> plug their bulky power packs into it. My problem is, what do I use to
>> connect the board to the UPS's power ports? It's not as simple as
>> getting a basic Australia -> US plug adapter and connecting that to
>> the standard computer power cable (the type used to connect a monitor
>> to the back of a PC's PSU), because even US plugs don't plug right
>> into these cables. Any ideas?
>>
>> Cheers,
>>
>> Ari
>>
>>
>
> One bodgy way around this, which is what I did. Cut the loopback lead in
> 1/2 and cut the plug off the power board. Then connect the required plug
> to the end of the powerboard lead and insulate well.

"insulate well" ... ummm ... any url's you can point me to regarding
that? The most cutting and splicing of wires I've done has only required
a bit of solder and some heat shrink tubing... That's why I'm not keen
on the idea of cutting things and splicing them back together, as I
really don't want to start fires or damage equipment if I bugger it all
up :-)

Cheers,

Ari

--
spammage trappage: replace fishies_ with yahoo

I'm going to die rather sooner than I'd like. I tried to protect my
neighbours from crime, and became the victim of it. Complications in
hospital following this resulted in a serious illness. I now need a bone
marrow transplant. Many people around the world are waiting for a marrow
transplant, too. Please volunteer to be a marrow donor:
http://www.abmdr.org.au/
http://www.marrow.org/
February 7, 2005 12:47:44 AM

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt,aus.computers.ibm-pc (More info?)

On Sun, 06 Feb 2005 16:19:41 +0800, spodosaurus <spodosaurus@_yahoo_.com> wrote:

>Tsunami wrote:
>> spodosaurus wrote:
>>
>>> Hi all,
>>>
>>> I have a couple of routers and an ADSL modem that I'd like to shield
>>> from the brownouts/short blackouts that we keep getting here in Perth
>>> (that's in Western Australia for those of you who are reading this
>>> crosspost). The network goes down for a minute everytime we get a
>>> power flicker and the ADSL drops as well because the modem power
>>> cycles. I also wonder how good it is for these devices to keep getting
>>> hit with brownouts/short blackouts. I have an APC UPS and I'd like to
>>> connect a power board to it so that the three networking devices can
>>> plug their bulky power packs into it. My problem is, what do I use to
>>> connect the board to the UPS's power ports? It's not as simple as
>>> getting a basic Australia -> US plug adapter and connecting that to
>>> the standard computer power cable (the type used to connect a monitor
>>> to the back of a PC's PSU), because even US plugs don't plug right
>>> into these cables. Any ideas?
>>>
>>> Cheers,
>>>
>>> Ari
>>>
>>>
>>
>> One bodgy way around this, which is what I did. Cut the loopback lead in
>> 1/2 and cut the plug off the power board. Then connect the required plug
>> to the end of the powerboard lead and insulate well.
>
>"insulate well" ... ummm ... any url's you can point me to regarding
>that? The most cutting and splicing of wires I've done has only required
>a bit of solder and some heat shrink tubing... That's why I'm not keen
>on the idea of cutting things and splicing them back together, as I
>really don't want to start fires or damage equipment if I bugger it all
>up :-)

geez Ari you seem to be making heavy weather of this ;-)

Go buy an aussie 3-pin line socket (like you'd use on the end of an extension
cord) and terminate the appropriate end of your IEC cable to that.
February 7, 2005 3:05:50 AM

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt,aus.computers.ibm-pc (More info?)

spodosaurus wrote:
> Tsunami wrote:
>
>> spodosaurus wrote:
>>
>>> Hi all,
>>>
>>> I have a couple of routers and an ADSL modem that I'd like to shield
>>> from the brownouts/short blackouts that we keep getting here in Perth
>>> (that's in Western Australia for those of you who are reading this
>>> crosspost). The network goes down for a minute everytime we get a
>>> power flicker and the ADSL drops as well because the modem power
>>> cycles. I also wonder how good it is for these devices to keep
>>> getting hit with brownouts/short blackouts. I have an APC UPS and I'd
>>> like to connect a power board to it so that the three networking
>>> devices can plug their bulky power packs into it. My problem is, what
>>> do I use to connect the board to the UPS's power ports? It's not as
>>> simple as getting a basic Australia -> US plug adapter and connecting
>>> that to the standard computer power cable (the type used to connect a
>>> monitor to the back of a PC's PSU), because even US plugs don't plug
>>> right into these cables. Any ideas?
>>>
>>> Cheers,
>>>
>>> Ari
>>>
>>>
>>
>> One bodgy way around this, which is what I did. Cut the loopback lead
>> in 1/2 and cut the plug off the power board. Then connect the required
>> plug to the end of the powerboard lead and insulate well.
>
>
> "insulate well" ... ummm ... any url's you can point me to regarding
> that? The most cutting and splicing of wires I've done has only required
> a bit of solder and some heat shrink tubing... That's why I'm not keen
> on the idea of cutting things and splicing them back together, as I
> really don't want to start fires or damage equipment if I bugger it all
> up :-)
>
> Cheers,
>
> Ari
>

Heat shrink around each core and then around the whole join should be
sufficient (you cant usually get zapped through 1-2layers of heatshrink.
I had to do the same thing and only used electrical tape for mine, but
it is up on a cupboard well out of reach of kids and dickheads.

As mentioned already though, just make sure your connections are
correct, I can remember having something faulty in a place I was in and
the dumb f%$k who did the fuse board forgot to hookup the earth for the
GPOs and every time I touched a computer case I got a belt. When I
placed a multimeter between true earth and the gpo earth, there was a
60v difference.
Anonymous
a b B Homebuilt system
February 7, 2005 3:50:50 AM

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt,aus.computers.ibm-pc (More info?)

budgie wrote:
> On Sun, 06 Feb 2005 16:19:41 +0800, spodosaurus <spodosaurus@_yahoo_.com> wrote:
>
>
>>Tsunami wrote:
>>
>>>spodosaurus wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>>>Hi all,
>>>>
>>>>I have a couple of routers and an ADSL modem that I'd like to shield
>>>>from the brownouts/short blackouts that we keep getting here in Perth
>>>>(that's in Western Australia for those of you who are reading this
>>>>crosspost). The network goes down for a minute everytime we get a
>>>>power flicker and the ADSL drops as well because the modem power
>>>>cycles. I also wonder how good it is for these devices to keep getting
>>>>hit with brownouts/short blackouts. I have an APC UPS and I'd like to
>>>>connect a power board to it so that the three networking devices can
>>>>plug their bulky power packs into it. My problem is, what do I use to
>>>>connect the board to the UPS's power ports? It's not as simple as
>>>>getting a basic Australia -> US plug adapter and connecting that to
>>>>the standard computer power cable (the type used to connect a monitor
>>>>to the back of a PC's PSU), because even US plugs don't plug right
>>>>into these cables. Any ideas?
>>>>
>>>>Cheers,
>>>>
>>>>Ari
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>>One bodgy way around this, which is what I did. Cut the loopback lead in
>>>1/2 and cut the plug off the power board. Then connect the required plug
>>>to the end of the powerboard lead and insulate well.
>>
>>"insulate well" ... ummm ... any url's you can point me to regarding
>>that? The most cutting and splicing of wires I've done has only required
>>a bit of solder and some heat shrink tubing... That's why I'm not keen
>>on the idea of cutting things and splicing them back together, as I
>>really don't want to start fires or damage equipment if I bugger it all
>>up :-)
>
>
> geez Ari you seem to be making heavy weather of this ;-)
>
> Go buy an aussie 3-pin line socket (like you'd use on the end of an extension
> cord) and terminate the appropriate end of your IEC cable to that.

Assume for a moment (and this isn't assuming too much) that all I know
is how to plug one thing into another. For australian 3-pin line socket
you mean this:
http://www.cis.nu/bilder/dagbok/australian_wall_socket....

For the IEC cable, you mean this:
http://www.blankdiscshop.co.uk/acatalog/AC5071.gif

The end on the left of that IEC cable image is the end that goes into
the PSU.

When I cut the end off the IEC cable, will the wires be colour coded so
I know what to hook up where, like this page instructs:
http://www.accesscomms.com.au/powerplug.htm

Thanks,

Ari


--
spammage trappage: replace fishies_ with yahoo

I'm going to die rather sooner than I'd like. I tried to protect my
neighbours from crime, and became the victim of it. Complications in
hospital following this resulted in a serious illness. I now need a bone
marrow transplant. Many people around the world are waiting for a marrow
transplant, too. Please volunteer to be a marrow donor:
http://www.abmdr.org.au/
http://www.marrow.org/
February 7, 2005 12:08:18 PM

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt,aus.computers.ibm-pc (More info?)

I would suggest that if you are strugglling with this concept that you
need to enlsist the help of someone who actually knows. By this I mean
not this newsgropu, but someone who can do the job for you. An
electrician *should* (too many dumb f^%$& sparkies out there that could
not handle this sort of thing) be able to do this for you.

You may end up giving yourself a permanent blackout...

While there are standards in place for colour coding, they are not
always followed, hence you need to understand how to wire them up. TO
do this you will need a multimeter to identify which core is which from
the lead you cut the end off.

Mick

spodosaurus wrote:
> budgie wrote:
>
>> On Sun, 06 Feb 2005 16:19:41 +0800, spodosaurus
>> <spodosaurus@_yahoo_.com> wrote:
>>
>>
>>> Tsunami wrote:
>>>
>>>> spodosaurus wrote:
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>> Hi all,
>>>>>
>>>>> I have a couple of routers and an ADSL modem that I'd like to
>>>>> shield from the brownouts/short blackouts that we keep getting here
>>>>> in Perth (that's in Western Australia for those of you who are
>>>>> reading this crosspost). The network goes down for a minute
>>>>> everytime we get a power flicker and the ADSL drops as well because
>>>>> the modem power cycles. I also wonder how good it is for these
>>>>> devices to keep getting hit with brownouts/short blackouts. I have
>>>>> an APC UPS and I'd like to connect a power board to it so that the
>>>>> three networking devices can plug their bulky power packs into it.
>>>>> My problem is, what do I use to connect the board to the UPS's
>>>>> power ports? It's not as simple as getting a basic Australia -> US
>>>>> plug adapter and connecting that to the standard computer power
>>>>> cable (the type used to connect a monitor to the back of a PC's
>>>>> PSU), because even US plugs don't plug right into these cables. Any
>>>>> ideas?
>>>>>
>>>>> Cheers,
>>>>>
>>>>> Ari
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> One bodgy way around this, which is what I did. Cut the loopback
>>>> lead in 1/2 and cut the plug off the power board. Then connect the
>>>> required plug to the end of the powerboard lead and insulate well.
>>>
>>>
>>> "insulate well" ... ummm ... any url's you can point me to regarding
>>> that? The most cutting and splicing of wires I've done has only
>>> required a bit of solder and some heat shrink tubing... That's why
>>> I'm not keen on the idea of cutting things and splicing them back
>>> together, as I really don't want to start fires or damage equipment
>>> if I bugger it all up :-)
>>
>>
>>
>> geez Ari you seem to be making heavy weather of this ;-)
>>
>> Go buy an aussie 3-pin line socket (like you'd use on the end of an
>> extension
>> cord) and terminate the appropriate end of your IEC cable to that.
>
>
> Assume for a moment (and this isn't assuming too much) that all I know
> is how to plug one thing into another. For australian 3-pin line socket
> you mean this:
> http://www.cis.nu/bilder/dagbok/australian_wall_socket....
>
> For the IEC cable, you mean this:
> http://www.blankdiscshop.co.uk/acatalog/AC5071.gif
>
> The end on the left of that IEC cable image is the end that goes into
> the PSU.
>
> When I cut the end off the IEC cable, will the wires be colour coded so
> I know what to hook up where, like this page instructs:
> http://www.accesscomms.com.au/powerplug.htm
>
> Thanks,
>
> Ari
>
>
February 7, 2005 12:20:16 PM

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt,aus.computers.ibm-pc (More info?)

On Mon, 07 Feb 2005 00:50:50 +0800, spodosaurus <spodosaurus@_yahoo_.com> wrote:

>budgie wrote:
(snip)

>> geez Ari you seem to be making heavy weather of this ;-)
>>
>> Go buy an aussie 3-pin line socket (like you'd use on the end of an extension
>> cord) and terminate the appropriate end of your IEC cable to that.
>
>Assume for a moment (and this isn't assuming too much) that all I know
>is how to plug one thing into another. For australian 3-pin line socket
> you mean this:
>http://www.cis.nu/bilder/dagbok/australian_wall_socket....

Yes

>For the IEC cable, you mean this:
>http://www.blankdiscshop.co.uk/acatalog/AC5071.gif

Yes

>The end on the left of that IEC cable image is the end that goes into
>the PSU.

That's what I'm expecting your UPS does. That's an IEC plug on the left.

>When I cut the end off the IEC cable, will the wires be colour coded so
>I know what to hook up where, like this page instructs:
>http://www.accesscomms.com.au/powerplug.htm

They certainly *should_be*. As Mick said, a multimeter is one way to make sure.
Any time I'm doing this sort of thing, the last thing I do before powering it up
is a final (re-)check wih the multimeter.

SOR? How far? I'm up in 6076
Anonymous
a b B Homebuilt system
February 7, 2005 4:42:17 PM

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt,aus.computers.ibm-pc (More info?)

budgie wrote:
> On Mon, 07 Feb 2005 00:50:50 +0800, spodosaurus <spodosaurus@_yahoo_.com> wrote:
>
>
>>budgie wrote:
>
> (snip)
>
>
>>>geez Ari you seem to be making heavy weather of this ;-)
>>>
>>>Go buy an aussie 3-pin line socket (like you'd use on the end of an extension
>>>cord) and terminate the appropriate end of your IEC cable to that.
>>
>>Assume for a moment (and this isn't assuming too much) that all I know
>>is how to plug one thing into another. For australian 3-pin line socket
>> you mean this:
>>http://www.cis.nu/bilder/dagbok/australian_wall_socket....
>
>
> Yes
>
>
>>For the IEC cable, you mean this:
>>http://www.blankdiscshop.co.uk/acatalog/AC5071.gif
>
>
> Yes
>
>
>>The end on the left of that IEC cable image is the end that goes into
>>the PSU.
>
>
> That's what I'm expecting your UPS does. That's an IEC plug on the left.
>
>
>>When I cut the end off the IEC cable, will the wires be colour coded so
>>I know what to hook up where, like this page instructs:
>>http://www.accesscomms.com.au/powerplug.htm
>
>
> They certainly *should_be*. As Mick said, a multimeter is one way to make sure.
> Any time I'm doing this sort of thing, the last thing I do before powering it up
> is a final (re-)check wih the multimeter.
>
> SOR? How far? I'm up in 6076

I'm near Murdoch Uni. I have a multimeter, so I guess it's about time I
learned how to use it. Any url's for a complete novice that you can
recommend? I'd need to know what setting to have the multimeter on, how
not to electrocute myself, etc :-)

cheers,

Ari


--
spammage trappage: replace fishies_ with yahoo

I'm going to die rather sooner than I'd like. I tried to protect my
neighbours from crime, and became the victim of it. Complications in
hospital following this resulted in a serious illness. I now need a bone
marrow transplant. Many people around the world are waiting for a marrow
transplant, too. Please volunteer to be a marrow donor:
http://www.abmdr.org.au/
http://www.marrow.org/
February 8, 2005 1:13:12 PM

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt,aus.computers.ibm-pc (More info?)

voltage setting for voltage, need to select ac for and ac source, dc for
a dc source. Power out of a powerpoint is ac.

current setting is a dead short so dont have it on that setting trying
to measure voltage, the meter will most likely blow up in your hand
(depends on how good the meter is, if it is a catIII meter then it
probably wont, just blow a fuse, if you dont know what it is then assume
the worst).

There is a setting for measuring resistance, this is good for finding
the ends of a wire. If the reisitance is zero between the ends then
that is your wire, if not then you need to keep looking

I still believe you should not be attempting this without help from the
questions you are asking. Please be very very careful.

Dont forget that the UPS has stored power and you can electrocute
yourself, even if it is not plugged in, a second trap for the unwary.
Disconnect thhe battery before you do any testing just to be sure.

Mick

spodosaurus wrote:
> budgie wrote:
>
>> On Mon, 07 Feb 2005 00:50:50 +0800, spodosaurus
>> <spodosaurus@_yahoo_.com> wrote:
>>
>>
>>> budgie wrote:
>>
>>
>> (snip)
>>
>>
>>>> geez Ari you seem to be making heavy weather of this ;-)
>>>>
>>>> Go buy an aussie 3-pin line socket (like you'd use on the end of an
>>>> extension
>>>> cord) and terminate the appropriate end of your IEC cable to that.
>>>
>>>
>>> Assume for a moment (and this isn't assuming too much) that all I
>>> know is how to plug one thing into another. For australian 3-pin line
>>> socket you mean this:
>>> http://www.cis.nu/bilder/dagbok/australian_wall_socket....
>>
>>
>>
>> Yes
>>
>>
>>> For the IEC cable, you mean this:
>>> http://www.blankdiscshop.co.uk/acatalog/AC5071.gif
>>
>>
>>
>> Yes
>>
>>
>>> The end on the left of that IEC cable image is the end that goes into
>>> the PSU.
>>
>>
>>
>> That's what I'm expecting your UPS does. That's an IEC plug on the left.
>>
>>
>>> When I cut the end off the IEC cable, will the wires be colour coded
>>> so I know what to hook up where, like this page instructs:
>>> http://www.accesscomms.com.au/powerplug.htm
>>
>>
>>
>> They certainly *should_be*. As Mick said, a multimeter is one way to
>> make sure.
>> Any time I'm doing this sort of thing, the last thing I do before
>> powering it up
>> is a final (re-)check wih the multimeter.
>>
>> SOR? How far? I'm up in 6076
>
>
> I'm near Murdoch Uni. I have a multimeter, so I guess it's about time I
> learned how to use it. Any url's for a complete novice that you can
> recommend? I'd need to know what setting to have the multimeter on, how
> not to electrocute myself, etc :-)
>
> cheers,
>
> Ari
>
>
Anonymous
a b B Homebuilt system
February 8, 2005 1:13:13 PM

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt,aus.computers.ibm-pc (More info?)

"Mick" <stuck@work.com> wrote in message
news:36qau1F5687gmU1@individual.net...
> voltage setting for voltage, need to select ac for and ac source, dc for
> a dc source. Power out of a powerpoint is ac.
>
> current setting is a dead short so dont have it on that setting trying
> to measure voltage, the meter will most likely blow up in your hand
> (depends on how good the meter is, if it is a catIII meter then it
> probably wont, just blow a fuse, if you dont know what it is then assume
> the worst).
>
> There is a setting for measuring resistance, this is good for finding
> the ends of a wire. If the reisitance is zero between the ends then
> that is your wire, if not then you need to keep looking
>
> I still believe you should not be attempting this without help from the
> questions you are asking. Please be very very careful.
>
> Dont forget that the UPS has stored power and you can electrocute
> yourself, even if it is not plugged in, a second trap for the unwary.
> Disconnect thhe battery before you do any testing just to be sure.
>
> Mick
>
> spodosaurus wrote:
> > budgie wrote:
> >
> >> On Mon, 07 Feb 2005 00:50:50 +0800, spodosaurus
> >> <spodosaurus@_yahoo_.com> wrote:
> >>
> >>
> >>> budgie wrote:
> >>
> >>
> >> (snip)
> >>
> >>
> >>>> geez Ari you seem to be making heavy weather of this ;-)
> >>>>
> >>>> Go buy an aussie 3-pin line socket (like you'd use on the end of an
> >>>> extension
> >>>> cord) and terminate the appropriate end of your IEC cable to that.
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> Assume for a moment (and this isn't assuming too much) that all I
> >>> know is how to plug one thing into another. For australian 3-pin line
> >>> socket you mean this:
> >>> http://www.cis.nu/bilder/dagbok/australian_wall_socket....
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> Yes
> >>
> >>
> >>> For the IEC cable, you mean this:
> >>> http://www.blankdiscshop.co.uk/acatalog/AC5071.gif
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> Yes
> >>
> >>
> >>> The end on the left of that IEC cable image is the end that goes into
> >>> the PSU.
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> That's what I'm expecting your UPS does. That's an IEC plug on the
left.
> >>
> >>
> >>> When I cut the end off the IEC cable, will the wires be colour coded
> >>> so I know what to hook up where, like this page instructs:
> >>> http://www.accesscomms.com.au/powerplug.htm
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> They certainly *should_be*. As Mick said, a multimeter is one way to
> >> make sure.
> >> Any time I'm doing this sort of thing, the last thing I do before
> >> powering it up
> >> is a final (re-)check wih the multimeter.
> >>
> >> SOR? How far? I'm up in 6076
> >
> >
> > I'm near Murdoch Uni. I have a multimeter, so I guess it's about time I
> > learned how to use it. Any url's for a complete novice that you can
> > recommend? I'd need to know what setting to have the multimeter on, how
> > not to electrocute myself, etc :-)
> >
> > cheers,
> >
> > Ari
> >
> >

Ari, I'd also strongly reccommend someone like a sparkey do the wiring. My
previous post was to point out the type of plug you were looking for was not
'american', but for some stupid reason, I kept calling them IEEE(rather than
IEC). Anyway, I simply wanted to highlight that there are plugs that fit
this model UPS, and it is simple to get someone to wire up a lead for you.
The old style monitor power leads that plugged into the computer power
supply (remember those??) leads usually have one of these plugs at one end.

SOME of the larger APCC UPS units (1400Va) were supplied with an IEC -
female 3-pin gpo power lead to plug a flat-pack into. Of the 5 or 6 APCC
units I set up when working in IT support, 2 of them had this little lead.
Most of them didnt, and certainly the 3 I have had at home (one is a 650 the
same as yours) didnt get these leads supplied.

Cheers,

Rod.......Out Back
February 8, 2005 3:24:24 PM

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt,aus.computers.ibm-pc (More info?)

On Mon, 07 Feb 2005 13:42:17 +0800, spodosaurus <spodosaurus@_yahoo_.com> wrote:

(snip)

WES components have the required lead, part# ACL601. $13.90 plus their standard
$8.95 delivery via overnight.
Anonymous
a b B Homebuilt system
February 8, 2005 5:51:36 PM

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt,aus.computers.ibm-pc (More info?)

budgie wrote:
> On Mon, 07 Feb 2005 13:42:17 +0800, spodosaurus <spodosaurus@_yahoo_.com> wrote:
>
> (snip)
>
> WES components have the required lead, part# ACL601. $13.90 plus their standard
> $8.95 delivery via overnight.

I'm havnig a look into that. They could really do with some improvements
to their website! I've had a look at an old Altronics catalogue, and I
could just buy an IEC male and 3pin plug with bare ends and connect the
ends.

Cheers,

Ari

--
spammage trappage: replace fishies_ with yahoo

I'm going to die rather sooner than I'd like. I tried to protect my
neighbours from crime, and became the victim of it. Complications in
hospital following this resulted in a serious illness. I now need a bone
marrow transplant. Many people around the world are waiting for a marrow
transplant, too. Please volunteer to be a marrow donor:
http://www.abmdr.org.au/
http://www.marrow.org/
Anonymous
a b B Homebuilt system
February 8, 2005 5:54:13 PM

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt,aus.computers.ibm-pc (More info?)

Rod Out back wrote:
> "Mick" <stuck@work.com> wrote in message
> news:36qau1F5687gmU1@individual.net...
>
>>voltage setting for voltage, need to select ac for and ac source, dc for
>>a dc source. Power out of a powerpoint is ac.
>>
>>current setting is a dead short so dont have it on that setting trying
>>to measure voltage, the meter will most likely blow up in your hand
>>(depends on how good the meter is, if it is a catIII meter then it
>>probably wont, just blow a fuse, if you dont know what it is then assume
>>the worst).
>>
>>There is a setting for measuring resistance, this is good for finding
>>the ends of a wire. If the reisitance is zero between the ends then
>>that is your wire, if not then you need to keep looking
>>
>>I still believe you should not be attempting this without help from the
>>questions you are asking. Please be very very careful.
>>
>>Dont forget that the UPS has stored power and you can electrocute
>>yourself, even if it is not plugged in, a second trap for the unwary.
>>Disconnect thhe battery before you do any testing just to be sure.
>>
>>Mick
>>
>>spodosaurus wrote:
>>
>>>budgie wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>>>On Mon, 07 Feb 2005 00:50:50 +0800, spodosaurus
>>>><spodosaurus@_yahoo_.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>budgie wrote:
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>(snip)
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>geez Ari you seem to be making heavy weather of this ;-)
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Go buy an aussie 3-pin line socket (like you'd use on the end of an
>>>>>>extension
>>>>>>cord) and terminate the appropriate end of your IEC cable to that.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>Assume for a moment (and this isn't assuming too much) that all I
>>>>>know is how to plug one thing into another. For australian 3-pin line
>>>>>socket you mean this:
>>>>>http://www.cis.nu/bilder/dagbok/australian_wall_socket....
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>Yes
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>For the IEC cable, you mean this:
>>>>>http://www.blankdiscshop.co.uk/acatalog/AC5071.gif
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>Yes
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>The end on the left of that IEC cable image is the end that goes into
>>>>>the PSU.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>That's what I'm expecting your UPS does. That's an IEC plug on the
>
> left.
>
>>>>
>>>>>When I cut the end off the IEC cable, will the wires be colour coded
>>>>>so I know what to hook up where, like this page instructs:
>>>>>http://www.accesscomms.com.au/powerplug.htm
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>They certainly *should_be*. As Mick said, a multimeter is one way to
>>>>make sure.
>>>>Any time I'm doing this sort of thing, the last thing I do before
>>>>powering it up
>>>>is a final (re-)check wih the multimeter.
>>>>
>>>>SOR? How far? I'm up in 6076
>>>
>>>
>>>I'm near Murdoch Uni. I have a multimeter, so I guess it's about time I
>>>learned how to use it. Any url's for a complete novice that you can
>>>recommend? I'd need to know what setting to have the multimeter on, how
>>>not to electrocute myself, etc :-)
>>>
>>>cheers,
>>>
>>>Ari
>>>
>>>
>
>
> Ari, I'd also strongly reccommend someone like a sparkey do the wiring. My
> previous post was to point out the type of plug you were looking for was not
> 'american', but for some stupid reason, I kept calling them IEEE(rather than
> IEC). Anyway, I simply wanted to highlight that there are plugs that fit
> this model UPS, and it is simple to get someone to wire up a lead for you.
> The old style monitor power leads that plugged into the computer power
> supply (remember those??) leads usually have one of these plugs at one end.
>
> SOME of the larger APCC UPS units (1400Va) were supplied with an IEC -
> female 3-pin gpo power lead to plug a flat-pack into. Of the 5 or 6 APCC
> units I set up when working in IT support, 2 of them had this little lead.
> Most of them didnt, and certainly the 3 I have had at home (one is a 650 the
> same as yours) didnt get these leads supplied.
>
> Cheers,
>
> Rod.......Out Back
>
>

I think I'm going to go into Altronics in northbridge, buy an IEC male
and a 3pin plug (both with bare ends) and ask the guys there exactly
which wires need to be connected. The wires will be the same colour from
the same manufacturer to cut down on confusion.

Cheers,

Ari


--
spammage trappage: replace fishies_ with yahoo

I'm going to die rather sooner than I'd like. I tried to protect my
neighbours from crime, and became the victim of it. Complications in
hospital following this resulted in a serious illness. I now need a bone
marrow transplant. Many people around the world are waiting for a marrow
transplant, too. Please volunteer to be a marrow donor:
http://www.abmdr.org.au/
http://www.marrow.org/
Anonymous
a b B Homebuilt system
February 8, 2005 8:34:40 PM

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt,aus.computers.ibm-pc (More info?)

spodosaurus wrote:
> budgie wrote:
>
>> On Mon, 07 Feb 2005 13:42:17 +0800, spodosaurus
>> <spodosaurus@_yahoo_.com> wrote:
>>
>> (snip)
>>
>> WES components have the required lead, part# ACL601. $13.90 plus
>> their standard
>> $8.95 delivery via overnight.
>
>
> I'm havnig a look into that. They could really do with some improvements
> to their website! I've had a look at an old Altronics catalogue, and I
> could just buy an IEC male and 3pin plug with bare ends and connect the
> ends.
>
> Cheers,
>
> Ari
>

Found one here in Perth at Altronics, a new product. I picked a new
catalogue that has the rest of their new products in it.

--
spammage trappage: replace fishies_ with yahoo

I'm going to die rather sooner than I'd like. I tried to protect my
neighbours from crime, and became the victim of it. Complications in
hospital following this resulted in a serious illness. I now need a bone
marrow transplant. Many people around the world are waiting for a marrow
transplant, too. Please volunteer to be a marrow donor:
http://www.abmdr.org.au/
http://www.marrow.org/
Anonymous
a b B Homebuilt system
February 8, 2005 8:35:15 PM

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt,aus.computers.ibm-pc (More info?)

spodosaurus wrote:
> Rod Out back wrote:
>
>> "Mick" <stuck@work.com> wrote in message
>> news:36qau1F5687gmU1@individual.net...
>>
>>> voltage setting for voltage, need to select ac for and ac source, dc for
>>> a dc source. Power out of a powerpoint is ac.
>>>
>>> current setting is a dead short so dont have it on that setting trying
>>> to measure voltage, the meter will most likely blow up in your hand
>>> (depends on how good the meter is, if it is a catIII meter then it
>>> probably wont, just blow a fuse, if you dont know what it is then assume
>>> the worst).
>>>
>>> There is a setting for measuring resistance, this is good for finding
>>> the ends of a wire. If the reisitance is zero between the ends then
>>> that is your wire, if not then you need to keep looking
>>>
>>> I still believe you should not be attempting this without help from the
>>> questions you are asking. Please be very very careful.
>>>
>>> Dont forget that the UPS has stored power and you can electrocute
>>> yourself, even if it is not plugged in, a second trap for the unwary.
>>> Disconnect thhe battery before you do any testing just to be sure.
>>>
>>> Mick
>>>
>>> spodosaurus wrote:
>>>
>>>> budgie wrote:
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>> On Mon, 07 Feb 2005 00:50:50 +0800, spodosaurus
>>>>> <spodosaurus@_yahoo_.com> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>> budgie wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> (snip)
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>>> geez Ari you seem to be making heavy weather of this ;-)
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Go buy an aussie 3-pin line socket (like you'd use on the end of an
>>>>>>> extension
>>>>>>> cord) and terminate the appropriate end of your IEC cable to that.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Assume for a moment (and this isn't assuming too much) that all I
>>>>>> know is how to plug one thing into another. For australian 3-pin line
>>>>>> socket you mean this:
>>>>>> http://www.cis.nu/bilder/dagbok/australian_wall_socket....
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Yes
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>> For the IEC cable, you mean this:
>>>>>> http://www.blankdiscshop.co.uk/acatalog/AC5071.gif
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Yes
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>> The end on the left of that IEC cable image is the end that goes into
>>>>>> the PSU.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> That's what I'm expecting your UPS does. That's an IEC plug on the
>>
>>
>> left.
>>
>>>>>
>>>>>> When I cut the end off the IEC cable, will the wires be colour coded
>>>>>> so I know what to hook up where, like this page instructs:
>>>>>> http://www.accesscomms.com.au/powerplug.htm
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> They certainly *should_be*. As Mick said, a multimeter is one way to
>>>>> make sure.
>>>>> Any time I'm doing this sort of thing, the last thing I do before
>>>>> powering it up
>>>>> is a final (re-)check wih the multimeter.
>>>>>
>>>>> SOR? How far? I'm up in 6076
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> I'm near Murdoch Uni. I have a multimeter, so I guess it's about time I
>>>> learned how to use it. Any url's for a complete novice that you can
>>>> recommend? I'd need to know what setting to have the multimeter on, how
>>>> not to electrocute myself, etc :-)
>>>>
>>>> cheers,
>>>>
>>>> Ari
>>>>
>>>>
>>
>>
>> Ari, I'd also strongly reccommend someone like a sparkey do the
>> wiring. My
>> previous post was to point out the type of plug you were looking for
>> was not
>> 'american', but for some stupid reason, I kept calling them
>> IEEE(rather than
>> IEC). Anyway, I simply wanted to highlight that there are plugs that fit
>> this model UPS, and it is simple to get someone to wire up a lead for
>> you.
>> The old style monitor power leads that plugged into the computer power
>> supply (remember those??) leads usually have one of these plugs at one
>> end.
>>
>> SOME of the larger APCC UPS units (1400Va) were supplied with an IEC -
>> female 3-pin gpo power lead to plug a flat-pack into. Of the 5 or 6 APCC
>> units I set up when working in IT support, 2 of them had this little
>> lead.
>> Most of them didnt, and certainly the 3 I have had at home (one is a
>> 650 the
>> same as yours) didnt get these leads supplied.
>>
>> Cheers,
>>
>> Rod.......Out Back
>>
>>
>
> I think I'm going to go into Altronics in northbridge, buy an IEC male
> and a 3pin plug (both with bare ends) and ask the guys there exactly
> which wires need to be connected. The wires will be the same colour from
> the same manufacturer to cut down on confusion.
>
> Cheers,
>
> Ari
>
>

Altronics here in Perth have IEC male to three pin Australian plug now.
I picked a new catalogue that has the rest of their new products in it.

--
spammage trappage: replace fishies_ with yahoo

I'm going to die rather sooner than I'd like. I tried to protect my
neighbours from crime, and became the victim of it. Complications in
hospital following this resulted in a serious illness. I now need a bone
marrow transplant. Many people around the world are waiting for a marrow
transplant, too. Please volunteer to be a marrow donor:
http://www.abmdr.org.au/
http://www.marrow.org/
!