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A CPU problem that I really need help with

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November 17, 2005 12:51:24 AM

First off, I don't want opinions. If you want to bitch about my choice in components or dont really know what you are talking about then please do not even respond.


Here it goes.

I have a Gigabyte GA-8N SLI Royal Intel edition
2 GB of OCZ DDR2 PC 5400 2X1024
XFX 7800 GTX 256 MB
Pentium D 830 (3.0GHz)


Ok when the board came it had the default BIOS version F1 on it. Of course they shipped early to get it out and dual core 830 did not work. It only showed as one core 3.0. The computer ran perfectly well, just with one core. Stable in all apps and games that I play. They released the F3 BIOS version very soon after. Now here is the issue. It boots and gets into windows fine. Windows show both CPU's in Task Manager and Device Manager. And it even shows them both at 3.0. But when I use anything multimedia. The PC freezes and I have to reboot. Upon further investigation (CPU-Z, SiSoft Sandra 05 and PC Wizard 2005) Core 1 is 15 X 200 for 3.0 but Core 2 is 14 X 200 for 2.8. This seems like the obvious issue to me. Gigabyte has since emailed me all the way up to beta F5a BIOS and all have the same issue. Both cores there but with different speeds. And my PC crashing all the time.

I have updated releases of all drivers for my PC and do not know what else to do.

Is it my CPU or my board?? Or maybe Video Card?

One interesting thing of note. When doing CPU benchmarks in SiSoft Sandra 05 I can get all the way through the CPU arithmetic Benchmark but the multimedia Benchmark crashes me out. But only when it goes to the video portion of the test.

keep in mind It works perfectly fine as a single core PC. This only happens with Dual core BIOS loaded.

More about : cpu problem

November 17, 2005 12:55:19 PM

My first four thoughts:
1) Your PSU just can't deliver enough juice to run both cores.
2) Your mobo just can't handle the power draw of both cores.
3) The BIOS is still to blame.
4) Windows needs to be reinstalled.
November 17, 2005 1:31:44 PM

Quote:
First off, I don't want opinions. If you want to bitch about my choice in components or dont really know what you are talking about then please do not even respond.


Free country, I'll bitch all I want, bitch. :p 

Frankly, you really should have stayed away from Intel dual-core. If you don't like that, too bad. Quite often what will happen with these chips is one core will throttle almost constantly... whether it's to save power or reduce heat. One core ran hot enough... I can only imagine what two cores are doing.

The other core throttling should have no impact whatsoever on Windows stability. Therefore, there is another issue happening here. One suggestion would be to check your temps in addition to the items Silver mentioned.
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November 17, 2005 1:42:26 PM

Try monitoring voltages and temps during your stress tests. Use MBM5 or whatever utility came with your mobo. What PSU are you using in your rig?
November 17, 2005 8:28:36 PM

I am using a 500w Antec Power Supply. Plenty of juice for a dual core CPU. Temps seem to be completely ok. I check it right after crash and it's around 51 degrees C. Gigabyte says that is normal enough.

I personally still think it's the BIOS. Just seems odd for Windows to be the issue :-) well, sorta. I don't know what the normal voltages should be so I haven't monitored them.

MBM5 didn't have my board listed so I couldn't really run it to monitor

Quote:
Frankly, you really should have stayed away from Intel dual-core. If you don't like that, too bad. Quite often what will happen with these chips is one core will throttle almost constantly... whether it's to save power or reduce heat. One core ran hot enough... I can only imagine what two cores are doing.


Thanks for not putting your opinion of the hardware in there.. I'm not asking what I should have done. I am asking for knowledge on the resolution. Thx anyway though.

It doesn't seem to me that it would be a throttling issue. If I am understanding that by throttling you mean usage. I think it's the whole multiplier thing.
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November 17, 2005 8:47:33 PM

You can get a program to monitor throttling - google it - to see if you are throttling. For voltages, you want them to be within 5% of the rating on the 3.3V, 5V and 12V rails. Is that a TruePower, SmartPower or what?

51C for temps doesn't sound like that is the issue. You can try running it with the case open and a fan blowing into the case as a quick check. One note: If you're checking temps in the BIOS at reboot, then those temps aren't accurate. The chip will cool in the time that it takes to reboot, go into BIOS and check the temps.
November 17, 2005 9:42:05 PM

Quote:


It doesn't seem to me that it would be a throttling issue. If I am understanding that by throttling you mean usage. I think it's the whole multiplier thing.


No throttling means that the CPU slow itself down in case of overheating. So, maybe one core is getting too hot and the slow down while the other does not.

You said 51 when crashing. were it used full load or with normal load. While those chip run hot, if not too hot, 51 normal load should be tolerable. At idle, maybe a bit too hot, but it is a Prescott, so there something you'll have to live with.[/AMDMeltdown]

What I would do is to give more voltage to the CPU and RAM. This can be done in BIOS. 0.1volt [ie, 1.6 instead of 1.5) for the CPU and RAM should help. This should help to compensate for the extra load when the video card 3d chip is kicking in...
November 17, 2005 9:51:29 PM

It's a 500w Smartpower 2.0

And I'll give the voltage bump a try and see about that.

edit -- CPU-Z is reporting the voltage at around 1.2v. I have not changed anything in the BIOS for voltage, and I do not O?C the system. Does that seem low?
November 17, 2005 10:03:54 PM

I cannot really help with Intel CPU because I don't use them. If you have is running stable with a boost of .1 or .2v on voltage for the CPU, check the temp and download throttle watch, to see if both core can actually run at full speed under stress. If not, then liquid cooling might help to get the most of your system.

I cannot really help more for that, I only use AMD cpu, to simply avoid heat problem. I'm not bashing your choice, but you get something that could be hard to get running properly.

But good cooling, good power and good case vent should do the job.
November 17, 2005 10:59:04 PM

Since a fully throttled chip runs @ 2.8, I think it reasonable to assume the one core is throttling.
While it is normal for one core to throttle before the other, they should bothe throttle, before your system crashes.
That this is not the case, suggests the chip is not being evenly cooled.
There have been more than a few cases recently, where the s755 heatsink fan setup has not been fully engaged. Make sure the heat sink is flush to the chip, and is parralel to the mobo. Even a slight angle will cause your type of problem. Make sure the holddown is fully engaged.
If that is not any help, you may need a better hsf, or additional case fans (with a balance of intakes and exhausts)
If somehow, you got an OEM chip, make sure the board and hsf are bothe using the 4 pin connection.
November 18, 2005 4:43:55 PM

Quote:
Thanks for not putting your opinion of the hardware in there.. I'm not asking what I should have done. I am asking for knowledge on the resolution. Thx anyway though.


And I said too bad, you were getting it anyway.

:p 

Like I said, it sounds like one core is throttling... and that is a common issue with the dual-core Intel chips. Check your HSF, and if necessary, get something other that the stock HSF (if you bought a retail CPU).
November 21, 2005 12:08:17 AM

OK so I bought some Arctic Silver 5 and applied it. Temp came down quite a bit. Was running around 50 degrees C after 10 CPU arithmetic benchmarks in SiSoft Sandra 2005. This was with both cores. CPU-Z still reported one at 2.8 and the other at 3.0. with multipliers of 14 and 15 respectively.

However as soon as I run the Multimedia benchmark, when it goes to the fullscreen image that it puts up it crashes.

That leads me to believe that there is something maybe with my video card. But when I revert back to the original BIOS that only runs one core everything still works fine. Which leads me back to the MOBO.

I am confused... and rather annoyed as well.
November 21, 2005 12:19:15 AM

Ok first off I'm not bitching that you bought an Intel DC but the second core (or first) always seems to throttle ( I have no experience with Intel cuz I dont care for them). In my experience RMA the chip.

PS: Why did I respond to this...Let the Intel Idiots handle their own problems. That maybe harsh but dont care.

EDIT: Ouch that was quite rude, Sorry.
November 21, 2005 4:37:01 AM

Duel Core Processing in not 100 percent compatiable with all software. This is some of the problem right now and it is because users like yourself that buy these products before thay are actually ready to go. Its not your fault that companies want the millions or be the first to get the market. Change everthing to single mode and you wont have a problem. I am sure Bill Bob is working on the the os to support this fuction but its not ready yet. This is a fact.

Remember when the 100 mhz boards hit the market!, the intell 820 was the first,, it too failed, a year since via made it, and now the same problem with dual core, in time the issues will be fixed. I'm not saying you cant use this feature its the mainframes and os are not fully ready to meet the requirements for duel core.
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