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Running x850 pro on 4x agp.. worth it?

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December 4, 2005 9:50:42 AM

Hey guys.. hopefully someone can give me an answer, as I've not been able to just "google" it.

I've got a fairly old pc, and i'm looking for a cheap upgrade from my radeon 9800 pro. I saw the x850 pro agp on sale for around 230.00 and I was wondering if it would be worth the purchase. My main concern is that it's an 8xagp card and I only have 4x agp on my main board. I know that they're all backwards compatible.. but how much performance am I sacrificing? I don't want to spend any money if I'm only going to experience small gains.

Thanks in advance. =)
December 5, 2005 2:08:58 AM

I was also thiking of upgrading my 5700utra to this x850pro AGP.

I have a 8X Ait AI7. How much do you lose with the 12 vs 16 pipelines?
December 10, 2005 2:19:36 PM

Going from a 9800 Pro [Default not OC'd = 5866] to an X850 Pro [Default not OC'd = 10,390] in 3D Mark 2003, I'll say you'll see some major difference, those were my changes and my scores.

Some games like FarCry I constantly had problems with freezing and crashes to blue screens with no explanations or errors as to why with the 9800 Pro, those problems completely disappeared with the x850 Pro!

In my opinion its a great card you won't regret acquiring for an AGP slot M/B!
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December 10, 2005 3:07:39 PM

OK in regards to the 8X vs 4X AGP question I decided to best answer you by running 3D Mark 2003 with the X850 Pro in 8X AGP mode the score was as previously stated 10390, in 4X AGP mode the score was 10333, so for sure between the 9800 Pros score even in 4X AGP slot M/B you'll see close to a 4500 point increase with the X850 Pro.

I hope that helped answer your questions. Ryan
December 10, 2005 6:20:58 PM

You will lose proformace but its a realy nice card. If you ever get a new pc with a agp slot then you can throw that x850 in there and have a pretty kewl pc
December 17, 2005 3:49:37 AM

No, he won't loose performance. Framerate differences of less than 1FPS are not noticeable.
December 17, 2005 3:53:11 AM

The difference between 4x and 8x isn't noticeable. 8x will never be needed, because nobody will ever release an AGP card that can exceed 4x bandwidth for more than a fraction of a second at a time.

What happened is 8x was released simply to impress people with new technology. Graphics card and motherboard makers were already planning the conversion to PCI-Express when they released AGP 8x products. 8x wasn't needed at its release, and because AGP is going away slowly, the fastest cards to be introduced this year won't have AGP versions.
December 25, 2005 10:09:34 PM

I actually had this same question in mind. Im looking to upgrade from 9800 to an x850. I also have AGP4x. My specs are:

Pentium4 2.0ghz
512DDR Ram
80GB harddrive
WindowsXP Home
ATI Radeon 9800XT (On AGP 4X)

I understand that you ran those tests on 3dMark03 but what is the comparison of AGP4x and AGP8x of the X850 in 3dMark05?

-Thanks alot
-Sam
December 25, 2005 10:24:48 PM

99% of the time the videocards doesn't use anything more than AGP x4. The difference in 3Dmark05 will be as small as in 3Dmark 2003.
December 25, 2005 10:32:29 PM

Around 1% last I looked. But hey, you're doing a fairly weak system, is that a Northwood or Willimatte P4?
December 25, 2005 10:58:03 PM

Im not sure. Its a Compaq I bought 3 years ago. Its been running like new cuz Ive been taking extremely good care of it.

So since the difference between AGP8x and AGP4x wont be that much, will I be able to run Quake 4 with no problem?

Cuz with my 9800 I ran Quake 4 it looks pretty good but the fps is like around 30-40 which is not that good. I know for sure I cant run BF2 and FEAR properly even with the x850 because my RAM is extremely low.

PS. Im planning on building a new computer around Fall 2006 with PCI-E. So will the x850 last me through new games until then?

My friend just bought a new computer last week thats 3.0ghz, 2gb RAM, 300GB harddrive with a Geforce 6200 and I want better gaming performance than him. Will the x850 deliver?

-sorry if i sounds kinda stupid
December 25, 2005 11:08:23 PM

Quote:

So since the difference between AGP8x and AGP4x wont be that much, will I be able to run Quake 4 with no problem?

PS. Im planning on building a new computer around Fall 2006 with PCI-E. So will the x850 last me through new games until then?

My best friend just bought a new computer last week thats 3.0ghz, 2gb RAM, 300GB harddrive with a Geforce 6200 and I want better gaming performance than him. Will the x850 deliver?

-sorry if i sounds kinda stupid

Well, you have only 512MBs of RAM. If you take a look at the second graph on this page:
http://www.tomshardware.com/2005/12/13/how_much_ram_do_...
You will see that 512MB will be a huge bottleneck for Quake4.

But you will probably get a good performance increase compared to your current system.

A x850 will keep up with all games released until fall 2006. But your RAM and CPU might not. Especially not the RAM.

And your friend bought himself a lousy gaming system. First a Pentium which is a poor choice compared to AMD64. Secondly a Geforce 6200. For a gamingsystem a 6600GT is minimum.

Your computer will probably outperform your friends computer. I will most certainly do it if you add another 512MB of RAM.
December 25, 2005 11:48:02 PM

Alright so if I just purchase an x850 and a 1gb single stick (along with 1 of my 256mb RAM cards resulting in 1280mb RAM), I should be good for at least until fall of 2006 and beat my friends comp?
December 25, 2005 11:50:45 PM

You probably already have a better gaming system than him! 6200 is terrible!
December 25, 2005 11:52:25 PM

Quote:
Alright so if I just purchase an x850 and a 1gb single stick (along with 1 of my 256mb RAM cards resulting in 1280mb RAM), I should be good for at least until fall of 2006 and beat my friends comp?

Yes you will, but only when it comes to gaming.
December 26, 2005 12:13:32 AM

Oh alright cool. Gaming is pretty much all I care about with my PC. One question though, after I do the upgrades, will I be able to play FEAR or BF2? Or will my computer load like crazy during gameplay?

Also, is there a significant difference between X850 PRO and X850XT?
December 26, 2005 1:26:00 AM

Quote:
Oh alright cool. Gaming is pretty much all I care about with my PC. One question though, after I do the upgrades, will I be able to play FEAR or BF2? Or will my computer load like crazy during gameplay?

Also, is there a significant difference between X850 PRO and X850XT?

You can play both FEAR and BF2. Since you have more than 1GB of RAM your computer will not have to load that much. At start of new maps there could be some chopping but not after that.

The X850XT is a bit better than the X850Pro.
December 26, 2005 3:50:37 AM

I have another question; does the X850 PRO have the temperature thermometer thing on the card for overdrive? or can that only be found on the XT?
December 26, 2005 7:31:01 AM

The only differences I know of is that the Pro-version only has 12 Pixel Pixelines (instead of 16) and a slower core and memory clock. The 4 missing Pixel Pipelines is what affects performance mostly.
December 26, 2005 2:56:29 PM

Will the card even be able to use those extra pipelines because Il be running it on AGP4x
December 26, 2005 3:48:51 PM

It will use all pipelines, graphics cards rarely uses any thing more than AGP x4.
December 27, 2005 3:04:05 AM

So is it worth spending the extra money for the XT? Or should I just go for the PRO?
December 27, 2005 3:07:24 AM

Quote:
So is it worth spending the extra money for the XT? Or should I just go for the PRO?

How much is it for the cards?
December 27, 2005 3:56:08 AM

X850PRO I can get for around $250USD and the X850XTs at around $350USD
December 27, 2005 4:25:25 AM

Also I have this thing about buying other brands. I will only purchase Radeons that are Built By ATI. I know they cost more but I will never purchase anything other than BBA.

Could you possibly give me an estimate of the performance difference between an X850PRO, X850XT, and X850XT-PE.
December 27, 2005 5:57:42 AM

Alright Ive decided that I will not be getting a PRO. But after seeing the benchmarks I really want the Platinum Edition to secure me for 2006. Platinum Edition would cost me more but is it really worth the money? or should I just settle for an XT?

My absolute max budget for the new video is $350-370.
December 27, 2005 6:02:42 AM

I don't know what the price difference is.

You can get a X850XT for less than $300.
And after all a X850XT PE is only an overclocked X850XT.

Unless there's a small difference ($20-$30) you should settle with the X850XT.
December 27, 2005 6:47:37 AM

Too much money. I can get an AIW X800 XT for only $260.
December 27, 2005 6:56:37 AM

Ive searched many sites and I cannot find a Built By ATI RX850XT for less than 300$
December 27, 2005 7:09:02 AM

Quote:
Ive searched many sites and I cannot find a Built By ATI RX850XT for less than 300$


I guess I missed the part about BBA. If you want BBA you have to pay more.
December 27, 2005 6:02:01 PM

Well thanks for all the help guys. I decided Im goin with 2048mb of ram (2 1GB sticks and my motherboard's max ram is 2048) and x850 xt platinum edition because since its gonna serve me for 2006 I might as well invest good money in it. And then Il probably start building my comp early 2007

my friends comp is:

P4 3.0Ghz
2048 RAM
300GB hard drive
Nvidia Geforce 6200 (256MB) PCI-E

my comp will be:

P4 2.0Ghz
2048DDR RAM
80GB hard drive
Ati Radeon X850XT-PE AGP 4x

So for gaming, my comp will infact beat his?
December 27, 2005 7:07:18 PM

Well if realy your not geting to get to much increase in speed with 2gig of memory from the tests I've seen on most gaming right now. If you plan to build another machine in a year you may want to cut back to 1gig.

Yes your machine will beat his, realy your fried should be running at least a 6600GT PCI card (and your computer would still beat his if he went to the GT on most games though his loading may be quicker between levels).
December 27, 2005 11:39:30 PM

Is $315 USD a good deal for a BBA Platinum Edition?
December 27, 2005 11:49:19 PM

Quote:
Is $315 USD a good deal for a BBA Platinum Edition?

I think it's a good deal. I don't think you will find any cheaper BBA.
December 28, 2005 5:32:15 PM

Alright cool I sent payment today. Its a sealed brand new Built by Ati Radeon X850 XT Platinum Edition for $299USD plus $15USD for shipping. Now I wait for it to arrive. BTW whats the required power supply thing for it? I bought a 450w psu last year for my radeon 9800, will that run it?
December 28, 2005 7:26:06 PM

450W is more than adequate, but some power supplies are such poor quality that they're inadequate regardless of rated output.
December 31, 2005 4:17:03 AM

I have a question; in HL2 Lost Coast and FarCry, will I be able to enable HDR with the x850?

Because Ive been searching and searching and only found that FarCry HDR is for Nvidia cards??
December 31, 2005 5:39:20 AM

Quote:
I have a question; in HL2 Lost Coast and FarCry, will I be able to enable HDR with the x850?

Because Ive been searching and searching and only found that FarCry HDR is for Nvidia cards??

X850 doesn't support HDR.

The following cards support HDR:

ATI Radeon X1000-series
Nvidia Geforce 6000-series
Nvidia Geforce 7000-series
January 1, 2006 4:07:41 AM

Oh I see. So that means that my friends GF6200 has SM 3.0?
January 1, 2006 8:10:37 AM

Quote:
Oh I see. So that means that my friends GF6200 has SM 3.0?

Yepp, but your card is much better. The visual difference between SM3.0 and SM 2.0 i very small and his card is so slow it can't really take advantage of it while your card can use High graphical detail in all games. And your card can use ansotropic filtering and anti aliasing much better than any 6000-series card.

Your system will be much better than your friends system when it comes to gaming.

Som charts for comparison:

Your card is no1 while his card is 7 from the bottom.



Your card would have been placed similar to the Radeon X850XT PE. While his card would be similar to the card dead last. So he wouldn't be able to play Quake4 at these settings while you could. 4xAF, 8xAA, Ultra quality looks really good.
January 1, 2006 1:17:08 PM

what about getting the x800pro vivo & flashing the bios to make it an xt pe? thats what i did about a year ago.
January 1, 2006 4:35:18 PM

thats awesome i love it when my friends card is dead last lol. could i get the link to the page you got the 2nd graph from? and I searched all over for COD2 benchmarks but couldnt find any with x850XT PE. any suggestions?

-thanks
January 1, 2006 5:42:36 PM

Here is the link to the page where I got the second graph:

http://www.tomshardware.com/2005/12/02/vga_charts_viii/...


Here is a CoD 2 Demo benchmark with the X850XT PE:

http://www.neoseeker.com/Articles/Hardware/Reviews/ati_...

The fps looks kind of low but they have run the tests using maximum detail. The X850XT PE is below 40 fps at all resolutions so you might wanna run the game at medium graphical detail. CoD 2 is a really demanding game.

And this is only the demo, both the drivers and the game might have been more optimized in the full version.
January 1, 2006 5:56:40 PM

But in COD2 with my friends 6200 it ran kinda smooth because i play with "force directx 7". And in games I never use any AA or AF except for hl2.
January 1, 2006 6:25:16 PM

Quote:
But in COD2 with my friends 6200 it ran kinda smooth because i play with "force directx 7". And in games I never use any AA or AF except for hl2.

Force directx7? 8O Doesn't that look really ugly?
January 1, 2006 6:49:03 PM

lol not really it looks fine to me. its look like this



But in FEAR on the other hand, when force directx8 shaders are on it looks like garbage. Its like Doom 3 with no bump mapping. This is what fear looks like on my friends comp:

!