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Suggestions for money no object gaming rig please

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January 8, 2006 1:48:05 AM

I am looking to build a rig I can use to play the latest games such as BF2 at 1600x1200 with full details, all options enabled and still get good frame rates.

I have done quite a bit of research but still cannot decide if the first rig (below) will really be worth the extgra cash over the second one. I wont be OC'ing and will be using the components 'as is'

First rig:

CPU AMD FX57
Memory 2x 1GB Premium RAM
Motherboard ASUS AN8 Delux 32 SLI
Graphics 2 x ASUS GT7800 Dual 512MB RAM
PSU SEASonic S12 600w
Case Undecided but want a BIG toolless tower
HD's 2x 150GB Raptors
2x 250GB Samsung Spinpoints (data)
Soundcard Audigy (already own)
Monitor Dell 2405 LCD (already own)

Second rig:

CPU AMD 64 4000
Memory 2x 1GB Premium RAM
Motherboard ASUS AN8 Delux 32 SLI
Graphics 2x 'factory OC'd' 7800 GT's 256MB RAM
PSU SEASonic S12 600w
Case As before
Soundcard and Monitor as before

My quandry is that although i can afford to build the first system I am not really sure that the additional $1500 or so will really give me that big a boost on systems number 1 over system number 2, I mean its a heck of a difference for ....what? 10% more performance??

Could really use some advice here

Thanks,

Mitch
January 8, 2006 2:02:58 AM

Holy cow you got cash to burn!!!!!! Please note, getting the most expensive parts is not gonna get you the best performance

for rig #1

The 7800GT Dual is one grand each but it performs worse than a $470 GTX, not to mention it hogs power like a b*&^%. The best solution is to get that 512mb GTX for $800

The FX-57? Hmmm you don need that bad boy. Some 4000+ or Opty will do for the same performance and less than half the cost... Maybe you wanna get some dual core if you want it to last, like the opty 175

how much are your premium rams and which one is it anyway?

You don't need Sli so get the AN8 Deluxe without Sli

Since for you wanna spend some $$$, get the Thermaltake Kandalf or some high-end Lian-Li cases. But cases are your personal favor so I don wanna say much. As long as it's sturdy, that is.

Since $$$ is not a problem, raptor is fine for you. But the smarter choice is to get some two WD 250GB SATA2 16MB cache then do raid 0, the larger cache will help you out.

so your second build is actually better than the first one and closer to my advice.

rig #2
shave off two 7800GT for one GTX or X1800XT

With this beast you wanna get some cooling so it doesn't catch a fever.

Arctic silver 5
2x120mm case fan(the quite ones)

any more help?
January 8, 2006 2:15:04 AM

Thanks for the reply, was thinking about something like this for the ram:

Corsair 2GB DDR2 XMS2-6400 TwinX (2x1GB) (MY-092-CS)

I am not in the least bothered about having a dual core CPU as from what I read there really are few games that take advantage of it, simply want to play everything maxed at high res.

I have read that an Opteron is the same as a 64 but built to higher tolerances and that 'if' i wanted to OC one I could get some big gains (say 2.8GHZ from a 2.2GHZ chip) with just air cooling but would this really deliver FX57 performance? eg is it just the clock speed that differs between an Opteron and a FX57?

As for the graphics my thinking is that if I just get a single card now then I may run into problems trying to get one to match it later for an SLI setup as I hear many boards are very fussy about having to have 2 identical GPU's so i may as well just get them both now so I'd really rather stick with an SLI setup of some kind that I really wont have to touch for say 18 months. I can afford 2 x 512MB GTX's if that would be the best option.

Cheers,

Mitch
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January 8, 2006 2:39:46 AM

DDR2 Ram doesn't work with AMD, the new M2 socket will tho

so something like this will actually work, OCZ DDR 500 This is one of the fastest RAM out there on stock..but comes with a price(you can pay for it tho)

Just remember, since you don't OC you want some fast DDR like 433 or 500 with low timing. Corsiar, Crucial, Geil, Mushkin, etc. all have great ram for you to look at, I don know them all.

Games don't need Dual-core doesn't mean it won't like 6 month down the road. Are you gonna throw this away in 6 month?? I don't think so. Plus you won't notice any difference with all these top notch stuff.

If you wanna game on MAX for 18 month, I'd really suggest you look at the 512mb GTX. BUT even that won't do it. Games simply change way to quick for that. Right now the best value is a single 256mb GTX or X1800XT for you (all of which will do MAX MAX). NO OC + single card = no Sli mobo. By the time you grab that second GTX a newer, cheaper, and better single card will be out (like the ATI's 48 piper)

NO the clock speed won't matter for the game, whether the 4000+ or X2 4800+, or opty 175 will all be more than fast enough for the games you'll be playing.

Oh yes the older opty is the same as the fx-57 for a quarter of the cost
January 8, 2006 3:48:50 AM

These options/components I have listed below are not for the people on a budget, these are for the Ultra high end PowerUser/Gamer. Even if you don't have an interest or a budget for any, check them out anyway, kinda fun and can I say 8O WOW 8O (not to be confused with WoW :lol:  )

I'd suggest either the AMD Opteron 180 or the AMD Athlon 64 X2 4800+.

As for RAM, I agree with godlyatheist, go for the OCZ. The Platinum 4800 or 5000 will give you kick a$$ performance.

If you were interested in learning to overclock, you could go for the VapoChill cooling system, and you should be safe for almost anything you try to do to your poor cpu. $1000, but well worth it (i've seen top of the line P4 EE 3.42 GHz AND P4 3.8 GHz cpu's overclocked with the VapoChill to a very stable 5 GHz+ while running at -5 degrees C) If you do this, go with a DFi LANParty mobo. (VapoChill=$1000)

If you opt for either dual 7800 GTX 512mb or the
go for the ASUS extreme geforce 7800GT Dual ($800 for 1, $1600 for 2), or any SLi configured 7800's for that matter, you might want to check out the TurboCool 1KW Power Supply ($400-$500)

The Coolermaster CM Stacker 830 is an AMAZING case that you would be pleased with for as long as your system lasts. ($250)

If you opt for the CM Stacker Case, be sure to get the CM Cross-Flow Fan and 9 of the Cooler Master Ultra Silent Fans for maximum cooling.

I realize that you already have a good soundcard, but if you wanted, you could go with one of the cards from the Creative Labs X-Fi series.

You could even opt for 4 gigs of the OCZ Platinum 4800 or 5000 series. (in dual channel of course)

Just some elite poweruser/gamer suggestions. Do what you want, it's your money.

-Good Luck-
January 8, 2006 4:26:57 AM

DUDE!!!!

You may be suggesting some of the most cutting-edge stuff for him but it's definitely overkilling

Quote:
go for the ASUS extreme geforce 7800GT Dual ($800 for 1, $1600 for 2)

I just wrote in my first reply it (meaning Sli) doesn't do as good as the GTX, why suggesting it again?

Quote:
you might want to check out the TurboCool 1KW Power Supply ($400-$500)

If he does go GT Dual, they have their own powersupply. Most likely he won't and that PSU can power 2 of the rig he's building. 600W is more than enough for him and he's not upgrading anytime soon is he?

Quote:
If you opt for the CM Stacker Case, be sure to get the CM Cross-Flow Fan and 9 of the Cooler Master Ultra Silent Fans for maximum cooling.

9 FANS????????????? Even if he chooses the most quite fan he's gonna complain about noise. Besides, what PSU powers 9 fans plus all the stuff he's putting in? Even if it does, it will probably blow up or die very quickly due to stress.

Quote:
You could even opt for 4 gigs of the OCZ Platinum 4800 or 5000 series. (in dual channel of course)

Did you know that AMD slows down when using 4gig??? DO SOME HOMEWORK!!!!

Please, your intent was good. But some of the stuff you suggested are just way off course and misleading.
January 8, 2006 5:54:02 AM

Quote:
DDR2 Ram doesn't work with AMD, the new M2 socket will tho

so something like this will actually work, OCZ DDR 500 This is one of the fastest RAM out there on stock..but comes with a price(you can pay for it tho)

Just remember, since you don't OC you want some fast DDR like 433 or 500 with low timing. Corsiar, Crucial, Geil, Mushkin, etc. all have great ram for you to look at, I don know them all.


Okay I'm confused. I can't seem to find an AMD-compatible motherboard on newegg.com that features DDR 500. Is this M2 socket for a processor not available from newegg? Would you buy faster ram than PC3200 and put it in a 184-pin pc3200 slot for some reason?
January 8, 2006 4:04:26 PM

Just wanted to clear up a few things:

As I stated, those were cutting edge products that I listed!
I also stated that they were likely to be overkill, even for him!

As for 4 gigs of ram with AMD, what you said is generally true. There are VERY few mobos out there that benefit from 4 gigs, but they exist nonetheless.

Correction, the CM-Stacker's crossflow fan that I suggested takes the place of 4 of the fans (on the side pannel) leaving room for only 5 other fans (CM ultra quiet).

With the 2 ASUS GFX cards, they scored slightly higher benchmarks than the 7800 GTX on some games, just mentioned it as a comparison for the two 7800GTX 512mb on SLI that I mentioned.

Sorry about the confusion

-SiLeNt
January 8, 2006 8:33:36 PM

[quote="tylerthedruidOkay I'm confused. I can't seem to find an AMD-compatible motherboard on newegg.com that features DDR 500. Is this M2 socket for a processor not available from newegg? Would you buy faster ram than PC3200 and put it in a 184-pin pc3200 slot for some reason?[/quote]
Most of them won't 'feature' it because the highest 'official' DDR speed is 400. Check the mfg's website - most of the 'big name' mfgs probably support it but a bios update may be necessary.

And, yes you would - that's how overclockers get their memory to run in synch with the FSB at 250 or 300mhz.

Mike.
January 10, 2006 4:56:38 AM

Quote:

Most of them won't 'feature' it because the highest 'official' DDR speed is 400. Check the mfg's website - most of the 'big name' mfgs probably support it but a bios update may be necessary.

And, yes you would - that's how overclockers get their memory to run in synch with the FSB at 250 or 300mhz.

Mike.


Thank you for the clarification. Can you name one of these motherboards for me? When you say 'in-synch with the FSB at 250 or 300mhz', what do you mean? I'm a RAM noob. As far as I know most modern FSBs are 1ghz, but perhaps that is referring only to processors. Perhaps you are referring to 250mhz as half of DDR500's speed?
January 10, 2006 2:26:06 PM

Here Anand has mention of it in a review (there are others as well - I just picked a random one). It doesn't surprise me that the mfg website doesn't show it (but I only checked DFI's) because its only applicable to the newest A64 CPUs. There was an article (on Anandtech I think - probably elsewhere too) about the time the Venice & SD cores were released telling that this was coming.

THe mobo sends a "FSB" clock signal to the CPU. When Intel says it has an 800MHZ FSB, they're lying. It's a 200MHZ, Quad-Data-Rate (transfers 4 times every clock tick) FSB. But QDR is a concept marketing had trouble with so they said since it transfers 4 times per clock, I can multiply the clock by 4 and say its 800mhz. Same thing with DDR RAM. DDR = Double Data Rate. DDR400 RAM really runs at 200mhz. AMD's FSB is truly 1000mhz, but it's derived off a 200mhz bus clock and that's what I mean when I say 'in synch' - the bus clock and the memory clock are the same. Generally (there are exceptions) its best to run memory at the same speed as the fsb clock.

Mike.
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