Postscript or not - Please recommend

G

Guest

Guest
Archived from groups: comp.periphs.printers (More info?)

Hello

i'm looking for a printer for a small (2 persons) advertising company. can
someone explain if a printer with PS is neccessary or not? what are the
disadvantages of not having PS?

these are must have features:
- at least format A3 capable
- good colorprinting (picures, presentations, photos)

should have
- networking already built in or easily attachable (via standard ethernet
printserver)

budget is 1000-2000 US$ (probably inkjet then). Mac OS X environment

i would rather not have a seperate software postscript rip on one of the mac
since it adds cost and complexity.

funny enough, almost every cheapo laserprinter has PS built in, but not many
inkjets.

Thanks for your tips and hints

beat
 
G

Guest

Guest
Archived from groups: comp.periphs.printers (More info?)

> these are must have features:
> - at least format A3 capable
> - good colorprinting (picures, presentations, photos)
>
> should have
> - networking already built in or easily attachable (via standard ethernet
> printserver)
>
> budget is 1000-2000 US$ (probably inkjet then). Mac OS X environment
>

forgot to mention: it's just for occasional printing, no heavy duty.
 
G

Guest

Guest
Archived from groups: comp.periphs.printers (More info?)

Recently, ip-plus <b_ng@solnet.ch> posted:

>> these are must have features:
>> - at least format A3 capable
>> - good colorprinting (picures, presentations, photos)
>>
>> should have
>> - networking already built in or easily attachable (via standard
>> ethernet printserver)
>>
>> budget is 1000-2000 US$ (probably inkjet then). Mac OS X environment
>>
>
> forgot to mention: it's just for occasional printing, no heavy duty.
>
The isssue is not so much how heavy your print load, but the purpose of
your printing. If you're using the printer to create proofs for commercial
pre-press, then a PostScript RIP is absolutely required. Otherwise, you
may not catch problems with your files before sending them off to be
printed. OTOH, if you're doing work that doesn't involve commercial
printing, PostScript may not be necessary. So, it all depends on the
nature of your advertising agency.

Regards,

Neil
 
G

Guest

Guest
Archived from groups: comp.periphs.printers (More info?)

"Neil Gould" <neil@myplaceofwork.com> schrieb im Newsbeitrag
news:QNKid.16369$Rf1.10460@newssvr19.news.prodigy.com...
> Recently, ip-plus <b_ng@solnet.ch> posted:
>
>>> these are must have features:
>>> - at least format A3 capable
>>> - good colorprinting (picures, presentations, photos)
>>>
>>> should have
>>> - networking already built in or easily attachable (via standard
>>> ethernet printserver)
>>>
>>> budget is 1000-2000 US$ (probably inkjet then). Mac OS X environment
>>>
>>
>> forgot to mention: it's just for occasional printing, no heavy duty.
>>
> The isssue is not so much how heavy your print load, but the purpose of
> your printing. If you're using the printer to create proofs for commercial
> pre-press, then a PostScript RIP is absolutely required. Otherwise, you
> may not catch problems with your files before sending them off to be
> printed. OTOH, if you're doing work that doesn't involve commercial
> printing, PostScript may not be necessary. So, it all depends on the
> nature of your advertising agency.
>
> Regards,
>
> Neil
>
>
>

Well ok, then Postscript is probably needed... are there inkjets arround
that have PS integrated? i know the HP2600 has, but it's a bit aged and only
prints 1200x600. i don't know if it's really suitable for pictures.

Thanks for your answer
 
G

Guest

Guest
Archived from groups: comp.periphs.printers (More info?)

Recently, ip-plus <b_ng@solnet.ch> posted:

> "Neil Gould" <neil@myplaceofwork.com> schrieb im Newsbeitrag
> news:QNKid.16369$Rf1.10460@newssvr19.news.prodigy.com...
>> Recently, ip-plus <b_ng@solnet.ch> posted:
>>
>>>> these are must have features:
>>>> - at least format A3 capable
>>>> - good colorprinting (picures, presentations, photos)
>>>>
>>>> should have
>>>> - networking already built in or easily attachable (via standard
>>>> ethernet printserver)
>>>>
>>>> budget is 1000-2000 US$ (probably inkjet then). Mac OS X
>>>> environment
>>>>
>>>
>>> forgot to mention: it's just for occasional printing, no heavy duty.
>>>
>> The isssue is not so much how heavy your print load, but the purpose
>> of your printing. If you're using the printer to create proofs for
>> commercial pre-press, then a PostScript RIP is absolutely required.
>> Otherwise, you may not catch problems with your files before sending
>> them off to be printed. OTOH, if you're doing work that doesn't
>> involve commercial printing, PostScript may not be necessary. So, it
>> all depends on the nature of your advertising agency.
>>
>> Regards,
>>
>> Neil
>>
>
> Well ok, then Postscript is probably needed... are there inkjets
> arround that have PS integrated? i know the HP2600 has, but it's a
> bit aged and only prints 1200x600. i don't know if it's really
> suitable for pictures.
>
I'm only aware of the higher-end products, such as some from Epson, Encad,
and others that have PostScript built in. I have an aging SC3000
w/PostScript, but don't use it much anymore since moving to Xerox color
lasers. The important thing is that if you need PostScript, don't scrimp.
Get a printer with a genuine Adobe PostScript RIP (see Adobe's site for a
list of products). Clone RIPs can be hit-or-miss, and if you miss, it will
cost you.

Regards,

Neil
 
G

Guest

Guest
Archived from groups: comp.periphs.printers (More info?)

Firstly, let's only consider printers with firmware PS.
Host-RIP software-based PS is not PS at the printer.

Apart from the risk that the RIP may not even run on
the OS you have, it may provide none of the benefits below,
and may even conflict with any "real" PS drivers you have
installed on that system.

> ... if a printer with PS is necessary or not?

If your printing is part of a pre-press workflow, then you
already know the answer, but for generic users ...

If you are printing from any machines running an operating
system (e.g. Linux) for which there is no "driver" optimized
to the printer's native PDL (Page Description Language),
then having PS may be a lifesaver.

> ... what are the disadvantages of not having PS?

Printing in PS mode may correctly render jobs that fail with
the native PDL (or vice-versa). Having two PDLs is useful.

PS usually expects gamma 1.8 contone images, whereas many
PDLs are 2.2, or on older printers, 1.0. This can cause
images to render more correctly on PS vs. the native PDL.

Halftoning can be entirely different between PS and the
native, providing yet another output preference.

The same job may render at dramatically different speeds
on the native vs. PS. PDF, for example, is basically device-
independent PS, and often prints faster to PS printers.

My old laser printer has both the vendor's PDL and PS level 2.
When a job won't render properly on one PDL, it usually does
on the other.

My inkjet had only host-RIP PS available, so I didn't bother
getting it. This printer often loses track of downloaded
fonts during long jobs, and renders everything as WingDings.
Without the alternative to print in another PDL, like PS,
I have to power-cycle and re-start the job before the failed
page number.

Bottom line - if you can get real printer-resident PostScript,
in addition to the maker's native PDL, do it.

--
Regards, Bob Niland mailto:name@ispname.tld
http://www.access-one.com/rjn email4rjn AT yahoo DOT com
NOT speaking for any employer, client or Internet Service Provider.
 
G

Guest

Guest
Archived from groups: comp.periphs.printers (More info?)

In article <d97c4731.0411061714.14d7608d@posting.google.com>,
email4rjn@yahoo.com (Bob Niland) wrote:

> Firstly, let's only consider printers with firmware PS.
> Host-RIP software-based PS is not PS at the printer.

It doesn't matter.

The job gets to the interpreter; the interpreter rasterizes the job and
sends the raster data to the marking engine.

Whether this happens all inside one set of covers using a proprietary
cable between the RIP and the marking engine, or if it happens with the
RIP under one set of covers and the marking engine under another set of
cables, with something like a standard parallel or USB cable to connect
the RIP to the marking engine, is immaterial.

You apparently had some problems with a RIP that sat under different
covers than the marking engine, and now you've decided that it's the
arrangement of RIP and marking engine that was to blame.

Not so.

The RIP was to blame, pure and simple. It matters not one whit whether
that RIP was under the same set of covers as the marking engine or not.
 
G

Guest

Guest
Archived from groups: comp.periphs.printers (More info?)

Sorry about the de-threading, but my posting host doesn't
have the current replies, and my reading host is broken
for posting.

>> Firstly, let's only consider printers with firmware PS.
>> Host-RIP software-based PS is not PS at the printer.

Let me clarify to say that whether the PS is ROM, PROM,
or downloadable EPROM doesn't matter to me, as long as
the RIP is being done inside the printer, and has direct
access to the marking engine.

And further, I'm only discussing PS as a second PDL.
Printers that are strictly host-RIP PS only, are not the
topic here.

> It doesn't matter.

It absolutely does if you are running on a host OS not
supported by the software RIP. In the case of my present
inkjet printer, for example, the "ps" version of it does
not include RIP code for Linux.

Even if we presently have a supporting host OS, what are
the odds that the printer maker will continue to supply
updates for new OS'es coming along? How many existing
Win32 host RIPs will get Win64 releases when XP64 arrives?
(How many ever got Win64 for IA-64?)

Printers tend to last far longer than major OS releases. My
laser printer is over 10 years old, and still going strong,
even though now probably off the maker's support life.
The maker's driver updates ended some 8 years ago, but I
can still print to it using either the native PDL or PS.

> The job gets to the interpreter; the interpreter rasterizes
> the job and sends the raster data to the marking engine.

With host RIP, the question becomes: How?
The data has to go from the RIP host to the printer via the
normal I/O connection, and in some data format.

What is that data format?

Chances are, the RIP is translating the PS to the native PDL
or some subset of it.

If the translation is to high-level native PDL, you have
PDL dependencies. If, for example, the native PDL has a
defect, printing in PS mode may or may not work around it.

If the translation is to the PDL's raster object syntax,
you could suffer from sloggy I/O performance, because the
data objects will be huge, and/or experience some loss of
some finesse in the engine (like font smoothing).

Now, the native PDL may have some extensions that provide a
more primitive access to the engine. Or the printer may have
some alternative mini-PDL that similarly provides low-level
access to the marking engine. If so, the vendor needs to tell us.

If the host RIP is sending high-level PDL to the printer, the
workflow may be little different than Distilling the PS to PDF
on the host, and printing that.

If the RIP is sending nearly pure raster to the printer, that
may be little different than the "print as graphics" option some
drivers have. Huge data objects, and on my inkjet, unimpressive
page quality. I wouldn't expect a host RIP to be so marginal,
but unless the maker tells us how it works, I'm nervous.

And if the printer maker won't explain the details of what
is crossing the I/O port, I assume that the RIP is merely a
PS to PDL translator. If, for example, I already own
the full Acrobat product, what's the point?

> You apparently had some problems with a RIP that sat
> under different covers than the marking engine, and
> now you've decided that it's the arrangement of RIP
> and marking engine that was to blame.

Nope. I've just always had a policy of avoiding host RIP.

The main reason I want PS in a printer is to have a second
host-independent printer-resident PDL, that will have a
useful life equal to that of the print engine,
and host RIP just doesn't deliver that.

--
Regards, Bob Niland mailto:name@ispname.tld
http://www.access-one.com/rjn email4rjn AT yahoo DOT com
NOT speaking for any employer, client or Internet Service Provider.