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Runway in use?

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Anonymous
April 28, 2005 7:15:08 PM

Archived from groups: alt.games.microsoft.flight-sim (More info?)

I´m sure someone has asked this here before...so bare with me...thanks.

When flight planning how can I determine what´s the landing runway in use
for any specific destination airport?
Althought I understand that weather as influence...

More about : runway

Anonymous
April 28, 2005 7:15:09 PM

Archived from groups: alt.games.microsoft.flight-sim (More info?)

the ATIS of the airport does tell you information like this so planning a
route to the airport then contacting approach to get the correct line up or
pattern is easy enough, but as far as STARS go, or what ever their new name
is now, I aint got a clue, wait for someone else to answer

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"Carlos Sousa" <carlos_30@netcabo.pt> wrote in message
news:4270efeb$0$4570$a729d347@news.telepac.pt...
> I´m sure someone has asked this here before...so bare with me...thanks.
>
> When flight planning how can I determine what´s the landing runway in use
> for any specific destination airport?
> Althought I understand that weather as influence...
>
Anonymous
April 28, 2005 7:15:09 PM

Archived from groups: alt.games.microsoft.flight-sim (More info?)

Carlos wrote:

> When flight planning how can I determine what´s the landing runway
in use
> for any specific destination airport?

Note: All of the following is based in US aviation rules. I am
unfamiliar with other counties' operations.

At towered airports, wind direction and speed are primary factors in
ATC's decision to use a runway, so you could estimate the runway in use
by looking at forecast for the time of your arrival. However, even
this is not a guarantee in real life.

As Chris pointed out, a pilot only knows for sure what runway and
approach are in use at a towered airport by listening to the ATIS when
50-100nm out (reception depends on your altitude, of course). It
normally is at this point that the pilot will plan the approach. When
flying IFR, ATC will vector you to either the final approach course or
an initial approach fix, so the work of how you get there and the
altitudes you need to decend to is done by ATC.

When flying VFR, it will be up to the pilot to determine how s/he needs
to get to the airport and what altitudes are required to fly to place
the aircraft in the right spot for a normal landing.

At untowered airports, the IFR pilot will need to first retrieve the
weather from the airport's ASOS/AWOS (or a nearby airport's weather
frequency, as the case may be), then choose the best approach for the
weather/winds and then request the approach of ATC. The

VFR pilots flying to an untowered airport first listen to the common
traffic advisary frequency (CTAF) to see if other aircraft in the
pattern are using a specific runway. If no other aircraft are there,
the VFR pilot would request an airport advisory of the Unicom operator
(assuming there even is one available). These people, who are on the
ground working the FBO, can state the wind direction and if other
aircraft are in the pattern, but they cannot legally "call" a specific
runway as the active runway. The pilot is ultimately responsible for
this decision at these airports.

And finally, if there is no one in the pattern, no AWOS/ASOS available,
and no Unicom operator, the pilot would overfly the airport at 1,000
feet or so above traffic pattern altitude to look at the windsock, then
make the decision as to what runway to use.
If there is no windsock and no obvious sign of wind direction (trees
blowing, water surface movement, or nearby smoke/steam from a
smokestack), then perhaps it might be better to find another airport
rather than chance landing with the wind and rolling off the other side
of the runway.


--
Peter
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Anonymous
April 28, 2005 8:03:34 PM

Archived from groups: alt.games.microsoft.flight-sim (More info?)

I have to say here Peter, that if a pilot does not know the wind speed and
direction wherever he is, his licence should be removed at once!

Cheers,

Quilly

An individual reply goes into my spam filter
April 28, 2005 9:22:05 PM

Archived from groups: alt.games.microsoft.flight-sim (More info?)

On Thu, 28 Apr 2005 15:15:08 +0100, "Carlos Sousa"
<carlos_30@netcabo.pt> brought the following to our attention:

>I´m sure someone has asked this here before...so bare with me...thanks.
>
>When flight planning how can I determine what´s the landing runway in use
>for any specific destination airport? Althought I understand that weather as influence...
>

was this covered in the replies already? is so then disregard.

Asked the same question a couple times.. and it turns out the easiest
and most straightforward way.. is to open up the WEATHER menu.. zoom
out the map.. scroll over to the destination airport.. zoom back in.
Then click on the WIND tab. View both GLOBAL and LOCAL weather maps
and observe the wind compass when you airfield is clicked and it name
is displayed just below the map.

From this info.. and a knowledge of the activated runway (either by
AFCAD or whichever one is physically longer).. that will be the one in
use.

Be careful when mixing LOCAL and GLOBAL winds.. because ATC can
vector you into the regional wind.. but then on final.. the tower will
change that and send you around to the other end. You can also change
the wind in flight to force the desired runway.

That's the way when planning before takeoff - check the WEATHER
dialogues in MSFS pulldown menu.


-Gregory


p.s. glad you are discussing weather configurations..
April 28, 2005 9:31:51 PM

Archived from groups: alt.games.microsoft.flight-sim (More info?)

On Thu, 28 Apr 2005 17:22:05 -0400, Gregory
<flightsim.maps@bkwds.comcast.net> brought the following to our
attention:

>On Thu, 28 Apr 2005 15:15:08 +0100, "Carlos Sousa"
><carlos_30@netcabo.pt> brought the following to our attention:
>
>>I´m sure someone has asked this here before...so bare with me...thanks.
>>
>>When flight planning how can I determine what´s the landing runway in use
>>for any specific destination airport? Althought I understand that weather as influence...
>>
>
>was this covered in the replies already? is so then disregard.
>
>Asked the same question a couple times.. and it turns out the easiest
>and most straightforward way.. is to open up the WEATHER menu.. zoom
>out the map.. scroll over to the destination airport.. zoom back in.
>Then click on the WIND tab. View both GLOBAL and LOCAL weather ..


oops sorry (no haven't been drinking) after scrolling and zooming..
you must click on the desired airfield so it's data is displayed below
the map before clicking on the WIND tab.. to get local wind info.


-G
Anonymous
April 29, 2005 2:33:24 AM

Archived from groups: alt.games.microsoft.flight-sim (More info?)

Well I don't intend to get into an argument about the CAA rules. But my
point is I agree that a pilot should indeed use all the information
available, but it is only normal good airmanship to know the speed and
direction of the wind wherever you are at all times. Just look out of the
window.
As a retired pro I do know whereof I speak.
I would have lost my life many times if I had not known the direction and
speed of the wind, and with no ATC and radio silence too.
Ah well, perhaps it's a dying skill :-)

Cheers,

Quilly

An individual reply goes into my spam filter
Anonymous
April 29, 2005 2:33:25 AM

Archived from groups: alt.games.microsoft.flight-sim (More info?)

Quilljar <wykehill-flightsim@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:

> Well I don't intend to get into an argument about the CAA rules.

Well, my point was simply that I didn't understand what your brief single
sentence was trying to imply. Hence my rambling on about the arrival
airport when, in fact, you were discussing winds *at that moment.*

A discussion in a newsgroup where one simply asks what the other was
implying is not an argument in my book.

> But my
> point is I agree that a pilot should indeed use all the information
> available, but it is only normal good airmanship to know the speed and
> direction of the wind wherever you are at all times.

I totally agree with the above. Again, though, I thought you were
referring to future winds at the arrival airport, not winds en route.

> Just look out of the window.

Ok, so you are flying at 15,000 feet on a clear day over sparsely populated
terrain devoid of any smoke. I am sincerely curious what clues you would
use when looking out the window to determine wind direction and speed.

I do know that one can determine winds by heading correction and
groundspeed versus true airspeed, but that requires a head in the cockpit.

> As a retired pro I do know whereof I speak.

I'll take your word for it. However, I don't recall questioning your
background, just looking for clarification.

> I would have lost my life many times if I had not known the direction and
> speed of the wind, and with no ATC and radio silence too.

Many times? Was this during war time or have you really had that much
unfortunate luck with aircraft? I would be interested in reading some of
your stories.

> Ah well, perhaps it's a dying skill :-)

Yes, nothing is ever the same as those "good ole days." :)  Us young
whipper snappers don't know anything, nor respect the experience of those
elders! ;-) Ditch the GPS and bring back NDB approaches, I say.

I hope you know that I am totally joking.

--
Peter


















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Anonymous
April 29, 2005 5:51:37 AM

Archived from groups: alt.games.microsoft.flight-sim (More info?)

Thanks a lot guys. You gave more information I was hoping for.


"Carlos Sousa" <carlos_30@netcabo.pt> escreveu na mensagem
news:4270efeb$0$4570$a729d347@news.telepac.pt...
> I´m sure someone has asked this here before...so bare with me...thanks.
>
> When flight planning how can I determine what´s the landing runway in use
> for any specific destination airport?
> Althought I understand that weather as influence...
>
Anonymous
April 29, 2005 1:21:17 PM

Archived from groups: alt.games.microsoft.flight-sim (More info?)

x>
> Ok, so you are flying at 15,000 feet on a clear day over sparsely
> populated terrain devoid of any smoke. I am sincerely curious what
> clues you would use when looking out the window to determine wind
> direction and speed.

Ha! ha! now you are giving me indeed a hard task, but not one that would
particularly affect a runway choice. In the navy I seldom flew higher than
3000 feet and, of course usually over water, which is always a good
indicator of surface wind speed and direction. But over land, drift would be
reasonably apparent. There are several quick wind finding methods. You can
choose a point over land such as a tree or rock, or if over desert or sea,
drop a smoke float (I am talking military here!) Then a three minute timed
circuit using accurate rate one turns will allow you to take a bearing and
distance from the mark thus you have a pretty accurate wind at the height
you are working.

Yes, I have been very fortunate, rather than the opposite to have survived a
number of incidents. I guess many hours of returning to a moving carrier at
night would be the most exciting. Although supposed to be routine, I was
always extremely relieved to see our floating home.

Cheers,

Quilly

An individual reply goes into my spam filter
Anonymous
April 29, 2005 6:30:36 PM

Archived from groups: alt.games.microsoft.flight-sim (More info?)

Maybe he has Radar vision and a keen eye for ground track movement. Many
pilots cannot estimate accuratley wind movement with just their eye without
an aid such as a windsock/smoke/trees/water around. Even Trees and Water can
be quite a chore and some pilots may not be able to pick up the clues
without windsock and smoke.

Plotting a ground point with the eye and pointing the nose at it can show
crosswind component, but for tail/head component it can get a little harder
to spot. However there is the trick of finding a straight length that you
know the length of, set an expected airspeed and count seconds how long it
takes you to traverse that length. A runway is a good starting point. Which
brings us to the circuit. If you are flying into a non-towered aerodrome
with nothing but the concrete/dirt/grass strip to land on and nothing else
around, you should go through your full percautionary circuits, Counting the
length of the field, Checking the 5 S's (surface Slope (s)ivilization
Suitability obSticales) by counting the length of the field one way and then
the other you will figure out pretty quick which direction you went faster.
and should approach from the slower direction (assuming a constant KIAS and
Altitude were kept both directions)

"pr" <nope@nospam.com> wrote in message
news:1138octwgmmuc$.dlg@ID-259643.user.individual.net...
> Quilljar <wykehill-flightsim@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:
>
>> Well I don't intend to get into an argument about the CAA rules.
>
> Well, my point was simply that I didn't understand what your brief single
> sentence was trying to imply. Hence my rambling on about the arrival
> airport when, in fact, you were discussing winds *at that moment.*
>
> A discussion in a newsgroup where one simply asks what the other was
> implying is not an argument in my book.
>
>> But my
>> point is I agree that a pilot should indeed use all the information
>> available, but it is only normal good airmanship to know the speed and
>> direction of the wind wherever you are at all times.
>
> I totally agree with the above. Again, though, I thought you were
> referring to future winds at the arrival airport, not winds en route.
>
>> Just look out of the window.
>
> Ok, so you are flying at 15,000 feet on a clear day over sparsely
> populated
> terrain devoid of any smoke. I am sincerely curious what clues you would
> use when looking out the window to determine wind direction and speed.
>
> I do know that one can determine winds by heading correction and
> groundspeed versus true airspeed, but that requires a head in the cockpit.
>
>> As a retired pro I do know whereof I speak.
>
> I'll take your word for it. However, I don't recall questioning your
> background, just looking for clarification.
>
>> I would have lost my life many times if I had not known the direction and
>> speed of the wind, and with no ATC and radio silence too.
>
> Many times? Was this during war time or have you really had that much
> unfortunate luck with aircraft? I would be interested in reading some of
> your stories.
>
>> Ah well, perhaps it's a dying skill :-)
>
> Yes, nothing is ever the same as those "good ole days." :)  Us young
> whipper snappers don't know anything, nor respect the experience of those
> elders! ;-) Ditch the GPS and bring back NDB approaches, I say.
>
> I hope you know that I am totally joking.
>
> --
> Peter
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> ----== Posted via Newsfeeds.Com - Unlimited-Uncensored-Secure Usenet
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Anonymous
April 30, 2005 2:29:50 AM

Archived from groups: alt.games.microsoft.flight-sim (More info?)

Quilljar <wykehill-flightsim@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:

> In the navy I seldom flew higher than
> 3000 feet and, of course usually over water, which is always a good
> indicator of surface wind speed and direction. But over land, drift would be
> reasonably apparent. There are several quick wind finding methods. You can
> choose a point over land such as a tree or rock, or if over desert or sea,
> drop a smoke float (I am talking military here!) Then a three minute timed
> circuit using accurate rate one turns will allow you to take a bearing and
> distance from the mark thus you have a pretty accurate wind at the height
> you are working.

You and Trent are definitely on to something. Thanks for the explanation.

--
Peter


















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