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1900xt core and memory clock questions

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February 20, 2006 1:36:54 PM

completed my new build a few days ago and began working to overclock my system when, after i opened up ATI's CCC, i noticed the core and memory clock were way below spec.

The spec for the Sapphire card i purchased from Newegg is 625 MHz for the core and 1450 MHz for the memory. According to CCC and ATITool, my core is at 500 Mhz and the memory is 594 Mhz. I know that the card looks like the correct card (size, heatsink and fan) and the sticker on the board itself identifies it as a 1900xt. I realize I could remove the fan and check the chip, but would prefer that my warrenty stay intact until i figure out what the problem is.

I also tried to raise the core clock to 625, but the computer crashed and reverted back to the 500 MHz speed.

Anyone have any ideas?

Thanks in advance.
February 21, 2006 5:54:34 AM

The X1900XTX runs 500mhz core and 1200mhz memory in 2d Apps. When playing games, this will scale up to 650/1500mhz if the game reuires all the throughput, otherwise it will stay at 500mhz/1200mhz. FEAR for example uses the full frequency range, while something like PES5 will stay at 500mhz/1200mhz. No need to run full frequency if not required. This applies to the X1900XT aswell, at slightly lower frequency

Hope that solves your problem!
February 21, 2006 9:34:36 AM

Quote:
The X1900XTX runs 500mhz core and 1200mhz memory in 2d Apps. When playing games, this will scale up to 650/1500mhz if the game reuires all the throughput, otherwise it will stay at 500mhz/1200mhz. FEAR for example uses the full frequency range, while something like PES5 will stay at 500mhz/1200mhz. No need to run full frequency if not required. This applies to the X1900XT aswell, at slightly lower frequency

Hope that solves your problem!


the xtx is 650 core and 775/1550 while the xt is 625/1440 in 3d aps and these cards are kind of tricky to oc but it can be done but its a learning curve basicly u disable the 2d and 3d clocks and leave it @ 2d then you up the voltage to its proper amount and then raise the cpu to 625 or 650 then keep going up untill u hit the max same goes for the memory
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February 21, 2006 10:13:41 AM

A friend of mine had the same problem with the sapphire version of the X1900XTX. He call Sapphire and after a bunch of questions they told him that the Card was defective and that he sloud send it back to new egg. I think you should do the same.
February 21, 2006 10:34:21 AM

then your friend and saphire are very uninformed. In desktop mode I run 500/1200 - in FEAR I run 650/1500 - and you can check for yourself in ATitool at the frequencies.

Also look at the spec on all reviews of the xt/xtx on Toms, Xbit and Anand even the White papers from ATi - the 1900 series has two speeds with differing frequencies, on for 2d and one for 3d.

Or you can send it back, again, again, again and again. The results will stay the same.
February 21, 2006 1:10:02 PM

I called sapphire (althon micro) as well and received the same information. The tech guy told me to use atitool 0.25 beta 10 (was using beta 13) and if it did not report the correct speeds the card was defective. It did not (and furthermore 3d screen was corrupted). When i asked him about the dynamic scalable core and memory speeds, he responded that he had never heard of it.

However, after doing some reading on many different forums yesterday, the information kept coming back the same. . . in 2d apps it runs at about 500/1200, while in 3d apps it runs at 625/1450.

That being said, most of the people on the these forums also stated that you can leave atitool or CCC opened while playing a game (HL2 and BF2 for me), exit out and see the correct 3d core and memory speeds on either one of the applications. Alas, i did not. Everything i have seen so far leads me to believe that this card is underclocked. i have yet to see it come even close to hitting the correct speeds.

Furthermore, if in fact it ramps up to the correct speeds when an application requires it, why did the card stop responding when i raised the core speed to 625 in 2d mode?

Anyone have any other suggestions to determine the speeds this card runs at in 3d mode?

Thing that make you go "hmmmmm" . . . Newegg no longer has the sapphire 1900xt listed on their website at all
February 21, 2006 3:38:17 PM

MAYBE the card is defective. I'll admit that, cos nothing is perfect these days :) 

Okay, as far as leaving ATiTool open while games are being played: I noticed this as I was playing FEAR for a prolonged amount of time. So, the RAM was quite packed and upon exiting my system was slow to recover and thus, ATiTool took quite some time to respond to the normal 2d environment and hence I could see my clocks at the stated speed (650/1550). So, if you have a agile system, chances are that you won't see the delay for ATiTool to recover from high frequencies to 2d frequencies.

Keep in mind, that you will require a game that really stresses the card - not even X3 can stress the XTX. Thus far, only FEAR created the oppurtunity for me to see my clocks increase. The delay from exiting a game to desktop should also be considered.

Furthermore, I also stressed when I first got my card - as I stated in previous posts, we pay up to $1000.00 for a XTX or XT, so when I saw 500/1200 I also freaked. But I did check the forums/websites and it was confirmed by them and myself that the Frequency adjusts dynamically.

Luckily your card has a year waranty, so try it for a few days and see what happens.

Lastly, if you increase the slider for frequency in the CCC to max, then chances are good it will crash - from what I've experienced. It may differ from other users. That might explain your crash when you just increased your frequencies in the CCC.
February 21, 2006 3:46:33 PM

Quote:
MAYBE the card is defective. I'll admit that, cos nothing is perfect these days :) 

Okay, as far as leaving ATiTool open while games are being played: I noticed this as I was playing FEAR for a prolonged amount of time. So, the RAM was quite packed and upon exiting my system was slow to recover and thus, ATiTool took quite some time to respond to the normal 2d environment and hence I could see my clocks at the stated speed (650/1550). So, if you have a agile system, chances are that you won't see the delay for ATiTool to recover from high frequencies to 2d frequencies.

Keep in mind, that you will require a game that really stresses the card - not even X3 can stress the XTX. Thus far, only FEAR created the oppurtunity for me to see my clocks increase. The delay from exiting a game to desktop should also be considered.

Furthermore, I also stressed when I first got my card - as I stated in previous posts, we pay up to $1000.00 for a XTX or XT, so when I saw 500/1200 I also freaked. But I did check the forums/websites and it was confirmed by them and myself that the Frequency adjusts dynamically.

Luckily your card has a year waranty, so try it for a few days and see what happens.

Lastly, if you increase the slider for frequency in the CCC to max, then chances are good it will crash - from what I've experienced. It may differ from other users. That might explain your crash when you just increased your frequencies in the CCC.


time to upgrade to 2gigs of ram that will kill that slowdown... or a good defrag might help also
February 23, 2006 4:02:13 PM

Quote:
I called sapphire (althon micro).......When i asked him about the dynamic scalable core and memory speeds, he responded that he had never heard of it.


Ouch. That sucks when a customer service rep dosnt know about their product. As soon as i saw that my XT was running at 500/600 i gasped a bit, but then did a quick search on google and found that it is a feature. Its a great idea for keeping idle temps down. Why would you need 2d clocks as high as your 3d clocks? You dont. The way that i tested it was by leaving CCC open on the desktop with the Overdrive Tab active. Right in the middle of an intense fighting scene in Serious Sam 2 (highly intense 3d game with detail at max) i hit alt+tab and BAM, clock 625 mem 725. It only appeared for about a second before dropping to 2d temps, but i was satisfied with what i found out enough to be reassured with my purchase.

Quote:
I also tried to raise the core clock to 625, but the computer crashed and reverted back to the 500 MHz speed.


Did you do this in ATItool? I had great luck overclocking with CCC but when i tried with ATItool, i kept getting lock-ups when bumping up the clock. I dont think it likes the extremely high 2d clocks. Im sure it will get fixed with the next release because the x1900xt/x isnt fully supported in ATItools yet.
February 23, 2006 4:12:58 PM

I think that beat 12 of ATiTool supports the X1900 to a certain degree, enough for overclocking. I know that when you install ATiTool there is a prompt stating that using ATiTool to overclock may result in crashes/lock ups if the CCC overclock/overdrive funtion isn't disabled in the registry (done by AtiTool). You prbably did this, but that's the only reason I can see for lockups when doing any overclocking on a 1900XTX
February 23, 2006 4:29:32 PM

I know that beta 10 and 13 disable the ati registry function. I tried overclocking to regular spec. speeds with both CCC and atitool (with atitool beta 10 and 13) all to no avail. the card either stopped responding and automatically reverted back to the 500/600 speeds or locked up and had to be rebooted.

Also left both atitool and CCC open while playing HL2, BF2, or FEAR, alt-tabed out, and saw the same speeds (500/600). Granted, i have 2 gigs of mem in my system so a delay might not exist, but most other people seem to have been able to verify gpu and mem speeds this way.

After all of these discussions with all of you, newegg and sapphire, i have decided to RMA. It's not that i'm unhappy with the card's performance, just uncertain whether or not i received what i paid so much money for. If the replacement i receive exibits the same behavior, then i'll know that either a) the card is indeed ramping up and i just have no way to verify that or b) i am extremely unlucky and received another faulty card. This is most definately not the way i prefer to verify this, but i have yet to receive any information that allows me to independently check the card's 3d speeds.

Thanks for all of the info.
February 23, 2006 4:47:36 PM

Another thing that just came to mind...you could try and find another monitor (any one will do) and set up a temporary dual monitor setup. Open atitool or CCC and drag it onto your extended desktop...run a game on your primary monitor. It should display the 3d clock on the other monitor. Havent tested this, but i dont see why it wouldnt work.
February 23, 2006 4:49:41 PM

No problem! MAYBE your system is too damn fast :lol: 

Send it back, and look at another card. Just maybe you did get a card that couldn't ramp the frequencies. I just hope that you won't get a second faulty card - that will be shyte. :evil: 

I think it's a bad thing that one can't verify max frequency via the product manufacturer. Just now, sum1 really gets a faulty card, and he has NO idea that this exists. So he goes to the forums, and maybe he gets convinced that the card ramps but with no real evidence.

It's might be a stupid/trivial issue, but it annoyed me and it's surely annoying other people! Maybe we can beg the developer of MBM to add functionality for MBM to show us a frequency indication in game... :lol:  :lol:  It's like buying a Subaru WRX STi without a damn speedometer! They say it's fast, but you wouldn't know better would you?
February 23, 2006 4:55:49 PM

Quote:
It's like buying a Subaru WRX STi without a damn speedometer! They say it's fast, but you wouldn't know better would you?


Absolutely. As far as using a second monitor goes, that's a great idea. I'll try that tonight and report back my findings.

Thanks again for all the help.
February 23, 2006 11:52:54 PM

AT LAST!!!

ellis, you're my new best friend.

Quote:
Another thing that just came to mind...you could try and find another monitor (any one will do) and set up a temporary dual monitor setup.


you are a freakin' genius. Hooked up another monitor, ran fear and lo and behold. . . the card ramped up!! so now it's overclocked to XTX speeds and life is good.

you guys saved me some serious grief. it's much appreicated.

thanks,

jason

----System----
Asus a8n32-sli deluxe
amd 64 x2 3800+ @ 2.2 w/ thermaltake bigwater se
sapphire 1900xt @ 650/750
creative x-fi fatal1ty
ocz ddr 400 platinum
WD raptor 74gb
viewsonic g220fb 21"
February 24, 2006 4:14:44 AM

Glad to hear your sorted now!

Looks like you have a very good balanced system, as the delay you were initially looking for from exiting a game to observe ATiTool frequencies did not happen. I guess it's time I slap 2gig in my system, although I really can't see a tangible benefit.

NEcase, have fun!
February 24, 2006 4:35:28 AM

Glad i could help :D 

ps: what are your 3dmark 05 | 06 scores? Just curious
February 24, 2006 7:10:01 PM

ellis,

generally i don't benchmark my system because i'm usually disappointed. however, after spendng all this money i was curious to see how the scores compared. they are as follows

3dmark 06 - 5541

3dmark 05 - 10476

Thanks again for the advice.

----System----
Asus a8n32-sli deluxe
amd 64 x2 3800+ @ 2.2 w/ thermaltake bigwater se
sapphire 1900xt @ 650/750
creative x-fi fatal1ty
ocz ddr 400 platinum (2 x 1024)
WD raptor 74gb
viewsonic g220fb 21"
February 24, 2006 7:22:54 PM

Quote:
ellis,

generally i don't benchmark my system because i'm usually disappointed. however, after spendng all this money i was curious to see how the scores compared. they are as follows

3dmark 06 - 5541

3dmark 05 - 10476

Thanks again for the advice.

----System----
Asus a8n32-sli deluxe
amd 64 x2 3800+ @ 2.2 w/ thermaltake bigwater se
sapphire 1900xt @ 650/750
creative x-fi fatal1ty
ocz ddr 400 platinum (2 x 1024)
WD raptor 74gb
viewsonic g220fb 21"


your scores seem alittle low... with either the ati 6.2 or omega 6.2 drivers you should be around 11.1k well yours is overclocked almost 11.3k-11.4k

im getting 11.4k with the omega 6.2 drivers(12.2k with 725core and 820 mem and cpu @ 2.8ghz)

opteron 165 oced 2.6ghz @ 1.3volts stock fan
dfi landparty ultra d
ocz 2gig 2x1 2-3-2-5 oced 2-2-2-5 @ddr400
sapphire x1900xtx 650core/775mem
maxtor 250gig 16mb sata 150
nec3550a dvd burner
ocz powerstream 520watt sli/crossfire ready

some people are getting 13k I dont know how yet but they posting there 3dmark pics

3dmark06 6.4k
3dmark05 11.4k
February 24, 2006 7:51:25 PM

With scores like that, you wont have to worry about playing any of the new games at max detail. I still have to tweak my overclock a bit cause im at 4990 on 06.
February 24, 2006 7:57:09 PM

I like omega drivers better than the ati's because you dont need that dotnetframework 1.1 or whatever, plus he tweaks the drivers for better details and performace vs the standard ati's.
February 25, 2006 5:41:14 AM

I wish I can get 3dmark05 scores like that!

With my P4 660 I only get 8000 points! :(  Dunno why...
February 25, 2006 10:54:01 AM

Quote:
I wish I can get 3dmark05 scores like that!

With my P4 660 I only get 8000 points! :(  Dunno why...


ddr2 533 is slow... ddr2 667 is not as fast as ddr1 400 (ddr2 800 is faster than ddr 400). p4 660 = 3.6ghz right? and do u have any hardware acceleration on?

im getting 11.4k with a sapphire x1900xtx, opteron 165 oced 2.6ghz, ocz 2gig 2x1 2-2-2-5. the only way my score gets that low in 3dmark05 is with 1280x1024 with 4x aa and 16x af(then I run 8.6k)
February 25, 2006 1:23:47 PM

Yes, 3.6Ghz - but for some reason my system is slow.... Could be the damn latencies on my DDR2 (I know the hole story around DDR400 vs DDR533).... :( 
March 10, 2006 3:42:22 PM

Quote:
I wish I can get 3dmark05 scores like that!

With my P4 660 I only get 8000 points! :(  Dunno why...


Hello all.
A friend of mine bought the sapphire ati 1900 xtx and we are having the same problem. We get 8000 in 3d mark 2005!!! too. We tried 3 deferent configurations (p4 670 with 945, amd 3500 xp with nvidia 4, p4 670 with Intel 915) the card always marks around 8000. Also we tried several versions of driver (btw the best by far is the latest beta driver from ati), and we tried to overclock the card with the latest beta ati tool but we are getting the 2d clocks of memory and core and if we move the slider just a little, either we get corrupted image or the system just freezes. We found out that the card does not overclocks with ati tool but with a utility that is called overclocker. We tried that and we raised the clock of memory and the core 100 MHz above the default 3d frequencies. BUT GUESS WHAT THE CARD GAVE THE EXACT SAME MARKS!!!! (Around 8000).... anyone knows what the hell is going on?


p.s the card never and i mean never freezed or showed something wierd (with default clock settings).. We have verified that the card is actualy a XTX model

p.s 2 here in greece the impoter which is QUEST S.A ordered very limited quantites of this card and so we can not change the card right now :( 

Thank you
March 10, 2006 3:55:50 PM

I don't think that you should return the card. If I look at my 3dmark03 score, then I'm not too far off as in 3dmark05. I quess that 05/06 is very dependent on CPU power along with memory sub system. Strangely, my 06 scores are good if I factor in my 3.2Ghz CPU (4900 @ 3.2 / 5000 @ 3.4 and 5100 at 3.6).

Still don't know why 05 gives me this crap - but who cares, all my gaming benchmarks are pretty close to what one can find on internet benchmarks!
March 16, 2006 6:05:03 PM

ATI tools doesnt work with the X1800XT and up due to the seperate 2d/3d clocks, use this one:

http://www.driverheaven.net/showthread.php?t=88559&high...

It works best by using ATI tool to set the voltages, then overclocking the 2D, not 3D clocks in Overclocker. It reverts to normal with each reset, so if your system crashes, resseting should bring it back.

I managed to get my X1800XT to 729/846 using the combo of voltage modding in ATI tool and OC'ing in overclocker.

http://i4memory.com/showthread.php?t=1865

Check this for more thorough info on overclocking the X1800XT.
March 17, 2006 12:18:30 PM

Personally I dont like screwing around with the Voltages, basicly coz i dont know where the danger areas are and where to stop.

Like vokofpoliesiekar, I live in South Africa and Money is an object for me, and yes I almost spent 3/4 of my salary last month on this X1900XTX card.

And a warranty is my best friend, but if im assured of the voltages that can be set, then I will go into the voltages and set them for OC'ing.


So any of you guys have tips and stuff, ratio's , setttings what eva.

I would like to know them :D 

O Yeah, I got 4822 in 3Dmark2006 @ standard Clock and MEM settings.

I get envious to see other ppl score more than me, thats why i wanna over clock.

My old athlon I OC from 2400 to a 3200, that was the fastest chip I had for ten minutes :D 

JKS!!!!

It ran fine in windows but bombed out in when playing games so i set it too 2800 and it ran stabble.


And dont even get me started on my old Pentium II 300A chipset that baby
could move mountains :p 
:lol:  :lol:  :lol:  :lol: 
March 17, 2006 6:15:03 PM

ATI tool gives you a warning when you set the Volts to high. For the mem volts, the warning kicks in at 2.25v, hence I stopped there with 846mhz untill I confirm whether or not I have 1.1ns ram and research how many volts it can take. Im not sure about the core, It wont run at 729mhz with an extra .2 volts, so im leaving it at 700mhz on stock which runs fine. Just hoping I can somehow squeeze 900mhz out of the ram without killing it.
!