Just Finished a Backup Server

[michaelahess]

Here's the Backup Server build I just did, kinda overkill for BITS backups, but my client had cash to spare (And who knows what it might do in the future?)

https://michael.hess.name:81/computers

SUPERMICRO SuperServer 7044H-TR 4U Barebone Server-Rackmount - Retail Item #: N82E16856162007

2xIntel Xeon EM64T 3.0 Irwindale 800MHz FSB Socket 604 Processor Model BX80546KG3000FA - Retail Item #: N82E16819117034

4xCORSAIR 1GB 184-Pin DDR SDRAM DDR 333 (PC 2700) ECC Registered System Memory Model CM72SD1024RLP-2700 - Retail Item #: N82E16820145308

2xWestern Digital Raptor WD740GD 74GB 10,000 RPM Serial ATA150 Hard Drive - OEM Item #: N82E16822144160

4xWestern Digital Caviar RE WD3200SD 320GB 7200 RPM Serial ATA150 Hard Drive - OEM Item #: N82E16822144407

ASUS Black IDE DVD Burner With 2X DVD-RAM Read Model DRW-1608P2 BK - OEM Item #: N82E16827135046

iomega 32929 Black 90GB Internal IDE/ATAPI Interface REV Tape Drive - Retail Item #: N82E16840107133

And yes this one is running win2k3 ent server 64bit.

 

[MadModMike]

Okay...and what was the purpose of that post? To get us drooling over the bottlenecked Xeon's, over the "64bit win2k3" OS that is 1000 times slower than a Linux alternative, or is it to get us pepped about the PC2700 RAM that makes that system just so darned sex-a?

~~Mad Mod Mike, pimpin' the world 1 rig at a time

 

[michaelahess]

hehe, wow, just showing a system that works great, give people ideas, that sort of stuff. Can't run Linux with the proprietary apps they need, I wish I could. PC2700 is just as good as 3200 but more stable and there is a negligible performace difference for a system like this. And just out of curiousity, how are the xeon's bottlenecked?

Oh yeah, and it's a HOMEBUILT system so it kinda fits....

Not exactly a gaming rig, deal with it.

Hum, just ran superpi, took 44s for 1m, not as good as you, but that was only flexing one cpu, is there a way to multi-thread it? (I assume you are OC'd and such as well, this is all stock, ya don't OC productions machines, in case you didn't know that.)

 

[MadModMike]

Let me try and deduce what you said, here it goes:

"I'm showing off my great system that I built for somebody else because I am cool. Linux sucks and PC2700 is as fast and stabler than PC3200 because I said so! The Xeon's 800MHz Half Duplex FSB is soooo not a bottleneck, in fact, it pwnz0rs HyperTransport! Who cares if only 1 CPU can access the NB at a time and get to memory, people, we care about the name!"

I think that sums it up. If you need a further explanation as to why a Xeon is bottlenecked, post again and you shall receive.

~~Mad Mod Mike, pimpin' the world 1 rig at a time

 

[michaelahess]

Ok, so you think I'm an intel guy???? Check out the other system on that site jack a$$. All my systems are AMD except a few servers, don't be an a$$.

 

[MadModMike]

Oh wow, now we resort to name calling if we can't defend our beliefs, yikes! (Wonders if this is a major bowel movement). I don't care what you build or what CPU manufacturer you like or what type of shampoo you use, I told you Xeon is a bottleneck and I'm asking if you want to know why.

~~Mad Mod Mike, pimpin' the world 1 rig at a time

 

[michaelahess]

You sure weren't nice about it!

I know how it bottlenecks compared to Hypertransport, but as an intel based server there's nothing much you can do about that. This board, cpu, and memory are fit to work together as efficiently as intels can.

Next time something is posted you don't like, don't start off bigoting it. Some people might find this helpful for building an intel system.

 

[MadModMike]

That's the second time someone called me a bigot, both times they have been incorrect with that assumption. I am not being mean or "bigoting" anything, I asked you a question in words. You can't express emotion in words, at least last time I checked, and I still want to know: Do you want to know why Xeon's are a bottleneck?

~~Mad Mod Mike, pimpin' the world 1 rig at a time

 

[michaelahess]

You can't express emotion in words

That's classic. Why are Xeon's a bottleneck?

 

[MadModMike]

Is it classic like Classic Coke? Probably not, anyways:

The Xeon is bottlenecked due to it's inferior architecture (not describing it) and the fact that it uses the FSB. The Xeon has been proven (ever since the first Xeon back in 200x when SLI was first released in an Intel mobo, before an NForce chipset, weird eh?) to be slower than even a P4 (a 4GHz Xeon gets beat by a 3.6GHz P4) and add in a 2nd CPU, use the same 800MHz FSB, and you're asking for a system that gives you 800MB/s RAM bandwidth, and that's being generous. The fact that even DDR2 is too fast for an 800MHz FSB (that bus is 6.4GB/s MAX at 800MHz, DDR2 667 alone is over 10GB/s) which means that the bus can't even use all the RAM bandwidth it COULD use.

Add in high performance HDD's in RAID 5's or 0's, and that 800MHz FSB just became the focal point of slowness. That sir, is why Xeon's are crap and that is their bottleneck.

~~Mad Mod Mike, pimpin' the world 1 rig at a time

 

[michaelahess]

This machine is only running DDR 1 by the way. I understand the issues with the FSB, I've been in this game since the 286 era, and I know Hypertransport is better. You say you don't care what chip is used, yadda, yadda, yadda, but by stating the FSB issue you alienate the entire Intel community. This server will crunch the 468-bit blowfish encryption I need it to faster than an AMD (just like audio encoding where the P4 beats the AMD 64's), raw clock cyles here are what count, not the memory bandwidth. And any FSB since the Pentium2 can handle the throughput of an SATA Raid5 array, which is the intended use of this machine.

Classic like 'don't say that to Shakespeare'

Edit: Sandra just showed a 3588MB/s memory bandwidth, faster than the reference E7520 with 3200 ram. Not quite 800MB/s, but close.

 

[MadModMike]

This machine is only running DDR 1 by the way. I understand the issues with the FSB, I've been in this game since the 286 era, and I know Hypertransport is better. You say you don't care what chip is used, yadda, yadda, yadda, but by stating the FSB issue you alienate the entire Intel community. This server will crunch the 468-bit blowfish encryption I need it to faster than an AMD (just like audio encoding where the P4 beats the AMD 64's), raw clock cyles here are what count, not the memory bandwidth. And any FSB since the Pentium2 can handle the throughput of an SATA Raid5 array, which is the intended use of this machine.

Classic like 'don't say that to Shakespeare'

Or classic like "I think, therefore I am". And in this case, I Think you're an idiot, and therefore, you are. isn't this fun!

PS: AMD is releasing a 3Ghz Opteron, care to challenge your Dual 3GHz Xeon's against a Dual 3Ghz Opteron? Let me get a diaper as I may piss my pants from laughter when I hear you say "it will pwnz0r it!".

BTW: I don't care when you "joined the game", you're still an idiot.

EDIT: SiSoftware + Futuremark + Intel = Marriage Made In Worthless Products Hell

EDIT2: 2.4GHz Opties w/ Corsair Value PC3200 gets 4.5GB/s SINGLE CHANNEL. Hmm....Interesting.

~~Mad Mod Mike, pimpin' the world 1 rig at a time

 

[michaelahess]

Dude, back off, I'm sure the Opteron system I built before this would own this system too, that's not the point. This system was purpose built, and it works better than an AMD at the same price point. I will admit that's VERY rare. But that's it, that's all, end of story. A dual opteron of that calliber will cost a LOT more than this system. Consider price here too bud.

Edit:

Single core opteron 2.8g @ $716

Single core xeon 3.0g @ $278

Get it yet?

 

[MadModMike]

What, are you on crack? You think that setup would be cheaper than an AMD alternative? Tell me what you paid and I will build an Opteron 64 system twice as fast and half the price.

BTW: That system is about a .22 caliber.

EDIT: OMGOMGOMGOMGOMGOMGOMGOMGOMGOMGOMGOMGOMGOMGOMGOMGOMGOMGOMGOMGOGMOGMGOMGOMGOMGOMGOMGOMGOMGOMGOMGOMGOMGOMGOMGOMGOMGOMGOMGOMGOMGOMGOGMOGMG YOU'RE ONE OF THOSE "GHZ MATTERS" IGNORANT PEOPLE!!! AHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHA A Dual 1.8GHz Opteron will beat that Dual 3.0GHz Xeon buddy. So much for "being in the game since 286". As I said, you're an idiot!

~~Mad Mod Mike, pimpin' the world 1 rig at a time

 

[michaelahess]

$3400, let's see a combined 6ghz amd for that price with redundent ps's and those hd's, in a real rack mount server chassis with SATA backplane.

 

[michaelahess]

Then why do P4's dominate on encoding tasks? AMD is fixing that issue, but they aren't quite there yet. If the xeon is served a staight line of data so as not to interupt the longer pipes, it will churn data out faster than an athlon. Athlons are better when there are shorter chunks that very more, like 3d rendering, hence the gaming community (me included) using amd 64's instead.

 

[MadModMike]

First off, P4's don't dominate A64's in encoding, a 4GHz P4 beats a 2.6GHz A64 by less than 5%, that's sad since it's 1.4GHz faster and only a few seconds faster, pretty much throws your "Ghz matter" theory out the window.

$3,136.92 Complete Opteron 64 Build

Dual AMD Opteron 90nm Troy 246 2.0GHz CPU's
Tyan K8WE Motherboard
6x WD 250KS 250GB HDD's
Same Tape Drive
4x 1GB Corsair XMS PC3200 RAM
I-Star Storm Series Rackmount 4U Case
Plextor DVD Burner (better than ASUS)
And I had money left to throw in a $400 RAID controller for the 6 ATA drives, I guarantee that system will be about 25-45% faster in everything. From "encryption cracking" to encoding and even gaming. And, it's cheaper! OMG!

~~Mad Mod Mike, pimpin' the world 1 rig at a time

 

[michaelahess]

Too bad ya left out the raptors, 8 bay hot swap SATA backplane, 3.0ghz operational cpu's (you just said the p4 was 5% faster, xeon's are faster than p4's) and the fact that I can do 10 RAID hd's, oh, and the TRIPLE redundent PS. Drop it already. Plextor? In a server where the drive is used maybe 5 times a year? Yeah right. And I didn't need to take up a slot for the raid controller.

Edit: What tape drive? REV is a hard disk based system.

 

[MadModMike]

Alright buddy, you've just pissed me off. I left out the raptors because you're such a god damn ignorant bastard you don't know anything about raptors. I have 6 Raptors, in a RAID 0, and I put 6 200GB SATA 7200RPM in RAID 0 and they're faster. Why? Because Raptors aren't good in huge RAID arrays for straight speed, only when many users access it at once.

F*ck the 8 bay swappable crap, nobody needs that worthless crap. 3.0Ghz Opterational? 2.0GHz Opterons > 3.0GHz Xeon's, It's called IPC buddy, learn something before posting you newb. And "Xeon's > P4's"? NOPE! WRONG AGAIN CHARLIE! The Xeon is inferior to the P4 in performance, such as I've said before. Triple Redundant PSU's? If you get a good one to start, you don't need 3. Plextor? Why the hell do you need a DVD-RW in a f-ing server anyways?

If you compare direct price to performance of Opteron 64 vs. Xeon, it's definitive that Opteron 64 > Xeon.

3.6GHz Xeon - This Xeon will be beat by the Opteron I have below.

2.8GHz Opteron 64 - This CPU is overkill anyways, it's about the same price, but the one I have listed below will also beat that 3.6Ghz Xeon

2.6GHz Opteron 64 - Even this is overkill, a 2.4GHz Opteron 64 would beat that 3.6GHz Xeon.

You sir, are a freakin' huge newb. You take that 3.6GHz Xeon and compare it to a 2.6Ghz Opteron 64, ANY f-ing benchmark you run, or realworld test, will tell you the Opteron 64 > Xeon. Learn something before posting like you're a God like me.

EDIT: Obviously you're also too stupid to read. I said "SAME TAPE DRIVE" meaning the SAME ONE YOU HAVE!!

~~Mad Mod Mike, pimpin' the world 1 rig at a time

 

[michaelahess]

You've obviously never built highly redundent production servers. Hot swap backplanes are essential if you have an HD fail, you need to swap it fast, this is not the kind of server you can shut down on a whim, it has to be up 24/7/365, hence the triple PS's.

If you had a brain, you would realize I have the OS on the raptors in a RAID 0, and the 250's in a RAID 5, thus the raptor is not in a "huge RAID array". My primary Terminal Server at this site which hosts 70 users has 15k SCSI drives in a dual RAID 10 Setup so I can have two hd's die simultaniously without disaster, even in the same array. These are CRITICAL systems!!! This is a real time backup server so "only when many users access it at once" applies, around 30 additional machines and 3 servers will be using it, the raptors are the scratch disk for the backup software also, hence them not being in the RAID 5 where data is simply dumped from the RAID 1.

DVD-R in case I feel the need to dump a chuck of backup data for a single computer, I don't need to drag it over the network, I can burn it faster than our gigabyte network can send it.

Until you start doing professional IT maybe you should shut the hell up.

It's not a tape drive, you said tape drive, I corrected you.

 

[MadModMike]

God you're an idiot.

You're emphasizing "critical" so much you sound like these are servers for the stability of the planet, oh my!

~~Mad Mod Mike, pimpin' the world 1 rig at a time

 

[michaelahess]

What the reliability concept eludes you?

 

[MadModMike]

No, the part where you may be good in knowing about Servers, you're the most ignorant moron there is on CPU's, which happens to be a strong point for me. You're right, I'm not a "professional IT" person, and it doesn't take one to know A) You're an idiot, and B) You have no idea about computers other than what another idiot told you.

EDIT: Here's that TAPE DRIVE you keep saying isn't a TAPE DRIVE.

~~Mad Mod Mike, pimpin' the world 1 rig at a time

 

[michaelahess]

So you believe what you read? Dam dude, look at the last picture on that item.

 

[michaelahess]

I'm sure hospitals would agree with you that critical isn't so critical, what these are for is even more important. Stop talking man, you're making yourself sound dumber by the minute.