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An open message to Tom's Forum Administrators

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August 21, 2006 3:01:03 PM

:?: ....I can only wonder where the forum administrators are these days and why they don't seem to be interested in taking action against those creating a truly putrid atmosphere in the forums ? I've been lurking around and reading several threads in each forum section and I have noticed a certain pattern repeating itself. There seems to be a small group of about five (5) people who have simply hijacked some of the forums. I am very surprised you administrators allow these same five individuals to flame and bully around other people on an uninterrupted daily basis ?


.....These individuals only use foul language and obscene sexual inuendos to express themselves. The insesant toilet talk from this group is truly disgusting ! :evil:  Frankly, if you don't get a handle on this problem, then it will eventually ruin the forums ! I have seen other forums literally fall apart because of this kind of thing. It would not matter if you banned these people and they simply relisted under another name and returned since they can be easily identified by their actions ! The solution is simple: Administrators kick folks off who set themselves up as bullies and flame and froc artists in Tom's forums ! If you are consistent, then these people (and others) will get the message and the forum atmosphere will only improve.

....There are many good people participating in these forums and many of them are being set upon by a bunch of forum holligans.

Respectfully.
August 21, 2006 6:41:25 PM

Let me guess. you don't like the responses to your weather thread, do you? If you'd have read the stickies in the Other, then you'd realise that anyone who ventures in there is fair game, and it's pretty much no-holds barred.

Nothing is going to change in there. If you don't like it, don't go in there. If you can put up with the insults, bad language and piss-taking, then by all means come on in.
August 21, 2006 6:50:56 PM

Quote:
Let me guess. you don't like the responses to your weather thread, do you? If you'd have read the stickies in the Other, then you'd realise that anyone who ventures in there is fair game, and it's pretty much no-holds barred.

Nothing is going to change in there. If you don't like it, don't go in there. If you can put up with the insults, bad language and piss-taking, then by all means come on in.


8O :x .......You are a MODERATOR and you sanction this kind of absolute nonesense ?! Oh man ! You must be kidding ! So you create a place on an otherwise good internet forum to actually encourage people to behave in such a manner ? So, what's up with that ? Do you think this kind of thing is really hip and cool ? You can't possibly be serious ? 8O

P.S. Yes I read the stickies and I still think it's rediculous. These people do not just carry on like this in that space alone.
Related resources
August 21, 2006 7:33:22 PM

Quote:
Let me guess. you don't like the responses to your weather thread, do you? If you'd have read the stickies in the Other, then you'd realise that anyone who ventures in there is fair game, and it's pretty much no-holds barred.

Nothing is going to change in there. If you don't like it, don't go in there. If you can put up with the insults, bad language and piss-taking, then by all means come on in.


8O :x .......You are a MODERATOR and you sanction this kind of absolute nonesense ?! Oh man ! You must be kidding ! So you create a place on an otherwise good internet forum to actually encourage people to behave in such a manner ? So, what's up with that ? Do you think this kind of thing is really hip and cool ? You can't possibly be serious ? 8O

P.S. Yes I read the stickies and I still think it's rediculous. These people do not just carry on like this in that space alone.

Don't be such a stick in the mud. It's all in good fun, and it's a place unrivalled on the internet. It's not going to change, period. As I said before, no one is making you go in there. And yes, I am a moderator on this site. If you check the Other out, you'll find that's where ALL the moderators hang out. And bait newbies.

If you don't like it, unlucky.
August 21, 2006 10:37:43 PM

Quote:
Don't be such a stick in the mud. It's all in good fun, and it's a place unrivalled on the internet. It's not going to change, period. As I said before, no one is making you go in there. And yes, I am a moderator on this site. If you check the Other out, you'll find that's where ALL the moderators hang out. And bait newbies.

If you don't like it, unlucky.


:evil:  ....Don't be such a stick in the mud ? I just want to be crystal clear here, so am I to understand you consider me a stick in the mud because I am NOT into.....

A) Flaming people.

B) Employing as much foul language as possible.

C) Using all or any form of perverse sexual inuendos to express myself....?

.....I do agree with you on point. This forum definitely is a place unrivalled on the internet.

Respectfully
August 21, 2006 10:41:36 PM

Look, it's always advisable to "lurk" before you jump in - to get a flavor for the place. That applies to the entire internet. I support Rob here. If you had just looked around a bit - you could (should) have picked up on the "style" in the Other. And don't be a crybaby.
August 21, 2006 11:08:50 PM

Quote:
Look, it's always advisable to "lurk" before you jump in - to get a flavor for the place. That applies to the entire internet. I support Rob here. If you had just looked around a bit - you could (should) have picked up on the "style" in the Other. And don't be a crybaby.


......Yes that must be it. :wink: Perhaps I'm a little old fashioned. I'm interested in reasonable, non-abusive and non-perverse forms of communication. But you raise an interesting point. I suppose the bottom line is really what kind of forum community you want to have at Tom's Hardware ? I would be interested to know if Rob's vision of this community is shared by ALL of the Tom's hardware forum moderators ?

.....Once you open up the door and make a home for foul, perverse, internet forum bullies, then you are inviting nothing but trouble. At the same time your are also making a CLEAR statement that this is the kind of dialogue Tom's Hardware wants to have with the public.

.....Look ! You can't have it both ways ! A straightforward 'card blanche' has been given to these folks and a home has been made for them. So how can you say you want 'rational' dialogue in the same breathe ? The answer is you can't ! These people have also practiced their 'alternative' forms of communication in places other than their little thread. If this is really the way Tom wants it, then I'll eat it and go away, but I am a long time reader of this web site and I'm very surprised at what I'm hearing from a moderator here. 8O

Respectfully.
August 21, 2006 11:33:43 PM

Lets see..... I joined 1/3/01..... The other has always been the other, through out the entire time..... It was unmoderated until last fall when it became the Forumz......

Now if you go back & do some searching, I'm sure you will quickly find that this place has been a war zone at times..... It's better now than it has been.... We've a lot more people saying that the other is over moderated compared to you saying it's not moderated enough...

Another thing.... One of the goals going to the new Fourmz was to keep the other, exactly that, the other..... As far as possible, it has been accomplished... It is hidden from searches on the web, so that was deemed acceptable from top to bottom......

You joined Mar. 27th, this year.... You want things to change, because you've just found this place.... An arrogant stand at best..... Things will remain the same here, whether your here or not.....
August 22, 2006 12:02:36 AM

Quote:
You joined Mar. 27th, this year.... You want things to change, because you've just found this place.... An arrogant stand at best..... Things will remain the same here, whether your here or not.....


:)  .....I subscribed to be able to begin to make posts earlier this year. I first started reading the site about 5 years ago....

......Excuse me, but I don't think I'm being arrogant just because I don't want to swear, curse, flame, and talk perverse sex to folks. It shouldn't matter even if I registered to post only Yesterday, as far as I'm concerned. The time issue is a false argument. I agree with you that if this behavior is acceptable to all the moderators, then I'm sure nothing will change. It's too bad though. :( 
August 22, 2006 3:24:12 PM

I'd just like to mention this as a thought for you, it's something that instantly came to my mind just from reading this thread.

You are sitting at home with your wife and kids enjoying some good family time, there is a knock at the door. You get up and answer it. It's your mother in law. She walks in and instantly antagonizes you, everything is wrong! You can't do this, you can't do that, even though it's obvious that it's worked for the last how many years, she's a stubborn little bitch and won't take any other answer than, "yes mom". She waltzes around and starts rearranging things "this can't work like this, what were you thinking!?" wanders into the kitchen and bitches about it being a pigsty, even though it's pretty damn spotless aside from some dirty dishes in the sink that were just used for snacks for the kids. But alas... nothing is right, everything is wrong, you can only sit there and hope to hell she goes home soon so you can get on with the way things were in your perfect little home.
August 22, 2006 11:34:36 PM

The Other is exactly the place for offbeat and more 'unique' types of posts. It's where you can get away with the types of discussions and content that would not be tolerated (and rightfully so) throughout the Forum. The Other does not characterise what THCG is all about, it is just a no holds barred area for those who want a bit of fun.

If you don't like it, don't go there. Simple as that. Thank you, drive through.
August 24, 2006 7:41:12 AM

Quote:
I'd just like to mention this as a thought for you, it's something that instantly came to my mind just from reading this thread.

You are sitting at home with your wife and kids enjoying some good family time, there is a knock at the door. You get up and answer it. It's your mother in law. She walks in and instantly antagonizes you, everything is wrong! You can't do this, you can't do that, even though it's obvious that it's worked for the last how many years, she's a stubborn little bitch and won't take any other answer than, "yes mom". She waltzes around and starts rearranging things "this can't work like this, what were you thinking!?" wanders into the kitchen and bitches about it being a pigsty, even though it's pretty damn spotless aside from some dirty dishes in the sink that were just used for snacks for the kids. But alas... nothing is right, everything is wrong, you can only sit there and hope to hell she goes home soon so you can get on with the way things were in your perfect little home.


.... :)  I sympathise with your marital difficulties. My only point was that I don't think you can really make a credible argument that the "other" section isolates from reflecting on the whole Tom's Forumz. I think what goes on there brings the whole credibility of the forum down. Also, as I mentioned before, I've been reading through ALL of the different forum sections over the last year and I have been lurking for over two years before I eventually jumped in this year. I guess I was sadly mistaken to think the "Other" section was not the "Foul Mouth and Flammo section" in the sense that you could post anything else there and your responses would be based on your posts. i.e. Serious post gets you serious responses. Foul mouth toilette talk posts = foul mouth toilette responses. - WRONG ! 8O K...Whatever
August 24, 2006 7:46:25 AM

Quote:
The Other is exactly the place for offbeat and more 'unique' types of posts. It's where you can get away with the types of discussions and content that would not be tolerated (and rightfully so) throughout the Forum. The Other does not characterise what THCG is all about, it is just a no holds barred area for those who want a bit of fun.

If you don't like it, don't go there. Simple as that. Thank you, drive through.


.....Yeah, you could say those posts are 'offbeat' or 'unique' in the sense they are utterly ridiculous, offensive and disgusting. Yep, I definitely will stay away from this section from now on. If you see a post from me in the future and you find yourself asking the question of why this post is in this section, I apologise in advance. It is me raising what I think is a "unique" issue. :wink:
August 24, 2006 10:31:42 AM

Well, you certainly are 'unique'. ... 8)
August 24, 2006 2:31:14 PM

*just shakes her head...

if you've been lurking for years, you should have known.

for shame
August 24, 2006 3:30:34 PM

Quote:
Well, you certainly are 'unique'. ... 8)


:p  ....Thank you. I will take that as a compliment. Another thing which I find annoying about the whole Forumz deal is I don't think it's fair to publicly identify subscribers in terms of status, like "Newbies," for example. When you have a certain status name, then you call into play a pile of human nature reactions which are not good.

.....For example: A person who has been posting for several years can be as much of a jerk as someone who just joined, yet one guy who joined only two months before me is listed as an "Honarary Poster," while another guy is listed as a "pervert," and I'm a "newbie." I think the forumz should be set up in such a way as to list the time you have been a member, but not the number of posts you have made nor should their be any nick name or expression above your avitar. In this way, all members of the forum could be seen as just that - members and nothing else. Everyone is equal. I'm not suggesting members should not be allowed to post whatever avatar they want as a way to personalize their presence. Apart from identifying moderators, everyone else should just be a member with no special status based on number of posts or time served as a participant. I believe avatars only would make the forum atmosphere more democratic.
August 24, 2006 3:45:02 PM

oh christ, go make your own forum...


fuck you're annoying
August 24, 2006 4:01:48 PM

Quote:
oh christ, go make your own forum...


**** you're annoying


:)  ....Why ? It wouldn't be that much of a change to the forum. You would still have your spectacular avatar and the date you joined and a link to your stats, but none of this 'newbie' or 'honorary poster' or 'pervert' names for folks. Think about it. It makes good sense. What's wrong with being democratic about things ? It is when you pick favorites and people to hate (Like me probably :wink: ) that things head south in my opinion. BTW, please don't take the name of my Lord and God in vain ! :evil: 
August 24, 2006 4:41:22 PM

Quote:
What's wrong with being democratic about things ?

Nothing, when it is a public entity, like a government or club that you are talking about. Tom's is not a government or club, it is a private company. As such, the democracy stops when you cross its 'lot line'.

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oh christ, go make your own forum...


Quote:
please don't take the name of my Lord and God in vain ! :evil: 

You worship christ? I pity you for your mistaken belief. I worship God. I follow the teachings of my savior Jesus Christ. If a non-believer wants to take someone who you hold sacred's name in vain, let them - it does you no harm.

Now, If you can reach the owners of THG and maybe bribe/force/whatever them to make changes, go right ahead. But currently, you're not talking to them, you're talking to the customers who like it the way it is - or at least are willing to live with it the way it is. The mods are not the right people to talk to either, as they are the relative equivelant (excuse the corrolary mods, but it is apt) of burger-flippers at McDonald's. Does complaining about the ingredients in a McDonald's Big Mac's special sauce to the person serving you do any good? Nope. Nothing they can do about it.

Sheesh... While I agree that the response you got wasn't exactly professional, you didn't post your complaint where a professional would receive it. I doubt there's a place on the whole forumZ for such a post. If it were a professional place, would it spell forums with a 'Z'?

Oh, and yes, those user titles are totally worthless. When you're 15 again, you may find it more entertaining.

Mike.
August 24, 2006 5:02:07 PM

Quote:

You worship christ? I pity you for your mistaken belief. I worship God. I follow the teachings of my savior Jesus Christ. If a non-believer wants to take someone who you hold sacred's name in vain, let them - it does you no harm.

Now, If you can reach the owners of THG and maybe bribe/force/whatever them to make changes, go right ahead. But currently, you're not talking to them, you're talking to the customers who like it the way it is - or at least are willing to live with it the way it is. The mods are not the right people to talk to either, as they are the relative equivelant (excuse the corrolary mods, but it is apt) of burger-flippers at McDonald's. Does complaining about the ingredients in a McDonald's Big Mac's special sauce to the person serving you do any good? Nope. Nothing they can do about it.

Sheesh... While I agree that the response you got wasn't exactly professional, you didn't post your complaint where a professional would receive it. I doubt there's a place on the whole forumZ for such a post. If it were a professional place, would it spell forums with a 'Z'?

Oh, and yes, those user titles are totally worthless. When you're 15 again, you may find it more entertaining.

Mike.


8O ....Excuse me ??? I wrote I worship Christ, as in Jesus Christ. Last time I checked (This Morning) the Holy Bible said He (Christ as in Jesus I mean) is God. So where's the problem ? When I refer to Christ I am referring to Jesus, who I worship as "The Christ." i.e. "The Anointed One" So I ask where's the problem again ? You may think I have a mistaken belief, but this is rather judgemental and arrogant on your part Mike ! You don't know me. I don't know you. So don't assume my belief is mistaken in the way you are suggesting ! :twisted: Alright mate ?! :evil:  Shame on you for tolerating people insulting your Lord ! I for one cannot and I'm not interested in being politically correct. Get it ? Good.

.....In other forums, the moderators are the correct folks to talk to, because that's what a moderator of a web forum does - they moderate and manage the forum. The owners of the web site delegate this work to the moderators. But you are right in that these moderators are like foxes in charge of the hen house, so to speak. I did search for the correct people to contact, but could not find anyone other than the moderators. So what am I supposed to do ?
August 24, 2006 5:19:21 PM

I'd have thought by now, with the amount of people who've answered your question time and time again, that you'd have got the message that this place is NOT going to change, and that YOU are the person that needs to change. Everyone else is fine with the Other. You aren't. And secondly...

I'd strongly advise you not to around telling people what they can and can't talk about when it comes to religion. If Mike wants to say lord, god, jesus or christ, he can. and so can I. Giving it attitude large is a one way ticket out the door. Read the Terms of Service sunshine.
August 24, 2006 5:37:42 PM

Quote:
8O ....Excuse me ??? I wrote I worship Christ, as in Jesus Christ. Last time I checked (This Morning) the Holy Bible said He (Christ as in Jesus I mean) is God. So where's the problem ? When I refer to Christ I am referring to Jesus, who I worship as "The Christ." i.e. "The Anointed One" So I ask where's the problem again ? You may think I have a mistaken belief, but this is rather judgemental and arrogant on your part Mike ! You don't know me. I don't know you. So don't assume my belief is mistaken in the way you are suggesting ! :twisted: Alright mate ?! :evil:  Shame on you for tolerating people insulting your Lord ! I for one cannot and I'm not interested in being politically correct. Get it ? Good.

Another lemming for the church... You have this strange perception that God and Jesus are one. I do not. I do not mix them up. Your church taught you wrong. It seems that many churches do. Did I offend you? Shameful... on you. If you are truly a follower of Jesus, that should not offend you. Got it? Didn't think so.

Quote:
.....In other forums, the moderators are the correct folks to talk to, because that's what a moderator of a web forum does - they moderate and manage the forum.
Moderate, not manage. Differences that you apparently are unaware of.
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So what am I supposed to do ?

Go away mad. Or just go away. Doesn't matter to me.

Mike.
August 24, 2006 6:50:22 PM

Quote:
I'd strongly advise you not to around telling people what they can and can't talk about when it comes to religion. If Mike wants to say lord, god, jesus or christ, he can. and so can I. Giving it attitude large is a one way ticket out the door. Read the Terms of Service sunshine.


8O ....Mr. Moderator, with all due respect I think you need to re-read my last post. I have never told anyone in this forum what to write or not to write. I simply disagreed with what Fishmahn was acusing me of. I don't think I have an attitude at all. I simply disagree with him because he hasn't been given enough information to arrive at the conclusion he's arriving at. I think you are at a disadvantage because Fishmahn is opening up a theological can of worms here with me. If he wants to continue, then that's fine. If he wants to say God is a can of peas then that's fine.

......I'm sure by now you are so irritated with me that you would love to find any pretext you can to kick me off of this forum, but that's not going to work because I have not violated any of the forum rules. Sorry to ruin your day. All the same, try to have a good one. :p 
!