Printer Ink

Archived from groups: comp.periphs.printers (More info?)

I am new to this group and suspect this topic has been covered many times
but I would appreciate advice.
I bought a small printer about 6 months ago for about $40 Canadian. It
came with colour and black and white cartridges. Yesterday I went to buy
replacement ink cartridges and had to pay over $100 for them. This is
absolutely outrageous and if I had stopped and thought about it I would have
simply purchased a new printer and thrown the old, perfectly serviceable
one, away but this action offends me as being wasteful. My next thought was
that if I buy a better, more expensive, printer I should be able to get much
more printing out of a given cartridge and save money in the long run. I
doubt if I got 200 pages of printing out of the last ones so that looks like
about 50 cents per page. Long ago I tried refilling cartridges on other
printers but never had much success with this.
Please advise me which printer make and model would give me adequate
performance at optimum per page printing cost. TIA. If you want to reply
directly delete the obvious bit and change the first a to "r."

Alan C

acombellack@nspmsympatico.ca
13 answers Last reply
More about printer
  1. Archived from groups: comp.periphs.printers (More info?)

    Exactlly.

    I need to buy around 7 new sets of cartridges for my Epson R200 each
    month. Sometimes, more than 9 sets. That really costs me a lot.
    I am going to try out bulk ink kit for my mass production.
  2. Archived from groups: comp.periphs.printers (More info?)

    In general, the least costly printers on initial acquisition end up the
    most costly for consumables (inks).

    Middle priced inkjet printers tend to have larger cartridges, which
    decrease cost of ink, but you pay more for the printer itself. These
    printers also tend to be more robust and sometimes faster printers as
    well, and may provide better quality output, as well.

    You might wish to consider either 3rd party cartridges or refilled
    cartridges or home refilling, depending upon the brand of printer
    involved, as a way to save money and not dumping your printer when it is
    still totally functional.

    Art


    Alan Combellack wrote:

    > I am new to this group and suspect this topic has been covered many times
    > but I would appreciate advice.
    > I bought a small printer about 6 months ago for about $40 Canadian. It
    > came with colour and black and white cartridges. Yesterday I went to buy
    > replacement ink cartridges and had to pay over $100 for them. This is
    > absolutely outrageous and if I had stopped and thought about it I would have
    > simply purchased a new printer and thrown the old, perfectly serviceable
    > one, away but this action offends me as being wasteful. My next thought was
    > that if I buy a better, more expensive, printer I should be able to get much
    > more printing out of a given cartridge and save money in the long run. I
    > doubt if I got 200 pages of printing out of the last ones so that looks like
    > about 50 cents per page. Long ago I tried refilling cartridges on other
    > printers but never had much success with this.
    > Please advise me which printer make and model would give me adequate
    > performance at optimum per page printing cost. TIA. If you want to reply
    > directly delete the obvious bit and change the first a to "r."
    >
    > Alan C
    >
    > acombellack@nspmsympatico.ca
    >
    >
  3. Archived from groups: comp.periphs.printers (More info?)

    Arthur:

    Do you feel that there's
    less (or more) of a problem
    concerning the use of "compatible"
    inks in a more expensive machine.
    I have an R800 and I'm a bit anxious
    about feeding it cheaper brands of ink.
    Am I too overly concerned about gunking
    up this machine in your opinion?

    Rod
  4. Archived from groups: comp.periphs.printers (More info?)

    I am always amazed when people buy a basically bottom of the line
    printer for heavy and sometimes commercial usage, and then they are
    surprised by the ink use. I suspect the R200 is a fine printer, but if
    I expected to be printing in such quantity, I would go for a more robust
    printer and install a bulk inking system ASAP.

    Art

    Ronald1967 wrote:

    > Exactlly.
    >
    > I need to buy around 7 new sets of cartridges for my Epson R200 each
    > month. Sometimes, more than 9 sets. That really costs me a lot.
    > I am going to try out bulk ink kit for my mass production.
    >
  5. Archived from groups: comp.periphs.printers (More info?)

    Hahahaha! OK, I'll be careful...
    So, this "uncertainty principle"
    takes me to the next variation:
    Do any of you have a favorite
    store (online or off) that offers
    the best price that you've seen
    on ink. Does it all just even out
    if you buy it for a coupla bucks
    cheaper online and then pay a
    shipping and handling price too?

    rod
  6. Archived from groups: comp.periphs.printers (More info?)

    rostasi@yahoo.com wrote:
    > Arthur:
    >
    > Do you feel that there's
    > less (or more) of a problem
    > concerning the use of "compatible"
    > inks in a more expensive machine.
    > I have an R800 and I'm a bit anxious
    > about feeding it cheaper brands of ink.
    > Am I too overly concerned about gunking
    > up this machine in your opinion?

    From this:

    Nozzle Configuration

    * 180 nozzles (per cartridge)

    it seems the printhead is not in the printer, but in the cartridge. So, though
    the original is pigment ink, countrary to Mr Entlich, I don't see were the
    risk lies. And there certainly won't be any dye/pigment mix if you buy cartridges.

    OTOH, Staples.ca offers neither your printer or ink for it and two generics I
    checked don't specify if the ink is pigment or dye. In such a case, I'd bet
    it's a dye. If it is, your printer driver being designed to shoot a different
    sort of ink, I have no idea about the results. You /might/ end up with a
    quality very different from that provided by the original ink.

    But, hell, if you're really pissed off by Epson ink price and grandma will
    certainly be dead in 10 years, you might want to give it a try. I've read
    about cartridges exploding in the printer and the whole house being blown
    apart, but I don't believe this happens too often. Ink companies -- Canon,
    Epson, HP, you name it -- like to play Gasper the Ghost.

    Fortunately, we all know those ink companies have no representatives not
    working for the company on this group. But do beware of top posters :)

    GP
  7. Archived from groups: comp.periphs.printers (More info?)

    It is not so much expense of the printer that's the issue (although
    obviously a really bad ink could mess up a printer head and a more
    expensive printer costs more to repair or replace...)

    But that's not the real issue, in my opinion. The real issue is what
    these compatible pigment inks are like.

    It is relatively easy in terms of ink formulation, to make a dye ink.

    Dye inks are solutions, like mixing sugar and water. The dyes dissolve
    into the liquid base, so unless the company is using really incorrect
    materials, or isn't using basic technical hygiene, you could expect the
    ink to somewhat function, and again, usually they are fairly easy to
    clean out even if a mistake is made.

    Pigment is is another level of sophistication in the formulation and
    manufacturing process, and even in how the cartridges are designed.

    Pigmented inks require not only carefully selected colorant, but the
    grinding process, and the resins used are critical to how bright it will
    be, how well it will adhere to papers, how well the color will cover the
    paper surface (density), if the colors will produce metamerism (were
    they change relative to one another in different lighting sources how
    translucent they will be (the ink dots intersect one another).

    We really don't know what "compatible" means in this case. The inks
    could be dyes but they "work" in a R800, or it could mean that they will
    mix with the pigment inks left in your often cartridges without clotting.

    Or, maybe they are really pigment inks, but how will the heads respond
    to them? With they have similar color gamut, will they have similar
    adhesion on the paper, will they be as scratch resistant (remembering
    pigment inks tend to sit more on the surface of the paper than dye ink)
    will they dry evenly and provide a similar gloss or matte finish? Will
    you find similar papers that will work with them, will you need new
    driver profiles for the ink colors? Will the inks be as archival, will
    they fade evenly, which is important in keeping color balance, even if
    fading does occur, etc, etc.

    It is not that I'm necessarily crazy about the amount of money Epson
    brings in on these inks, but the question may be, why did you spend so
    much on an inkjet printer, if you are going to replace the inks with an
    unknown quantity?

    Pigment ink formulation is much more complex than dye inks, so I have
    more difficulty saying "any old ink will do" with pigment inks.

    Art

    rostasi@yahoo.com wrote:

    > Arthur:
    >
    > Do you feel that there's
    > less (or more) of a problem
    > concerning the use of "compatible"
    > inks in a more expensive machine.
    > I have an R800 and I'm a bit anxious
    > about feeding it cheaper brands of ink.
    > Am I too overly concerned about gunking
    > up this machine in your opinion?
    >
    > Rod
    >
  8. Archived from groups: comp.periphs.printers (More info?)

    Unlike Mr. GP, I am unaware of ANY Epson printer that has the head
    incorporated as part of the cartridge, including the R800... Therefore,
    I stand by my original comments. I'd certainly like to read about it if
    Mr. GP can provide me a reference.

    Epson's technology is based upon vibration of piezo crystals, a bit
    costly to make into a toss away cartridge, and a bit crazy, since the
    heads are good for upwards of billions of dots before failure.

    If others choose to take "Mr. GP's" advice, well, there you go...

    It is beginning to appear Mr. GP is of the mistaken impression that I
    have some Epson association, or that somehow I can profit from Epson
    inks, and therefore I am providing deceptive information to improve my
    financial or other wealth. Pretty insulting, if indeed that is his
    interpretation.

    The thousands of people who know me over the many years I have been on
    these forums, of course, know better...


    GP wrote:

    > rostasi@yahoo.com wrote:
    >
    >> Arthur:
    >>
    >> Do you feel that there's
    >> less (or more) of a problem
    >> concerning the use of "compatible"
    >> inks in a more expensive machine.
    >> I have an R800 and I'm a bit anxious
    >> about feeding it cheaper brands of ink.
    >> Am I too overly concerned about gunking
    >> up this machine in your opinion?
    >
    >
    > From this:
    >
    > Nozzle Configuration
    >
    > * 180 nozzles (per cartridge)
    >
    > it seems the printhead is not in the printer, but in the cartridge. So,
    > though the original is pigment ink, countrary to Mr Entlich, I don't see
    > were the risk lies. And there certainly won't be any dye/pigment mix if
    > you buy cartridges.
    >
    > OTOH, Staples.ca offers neither your printer or ink for it and two
    > generics I checked don't specify if the ink is pigment or dye. In such a
    > case, I'd bet it's a dye. If it is, your printer driver being designed
    > to shoot a different sort of ink, I have no idea about the results. You
    > /might/ end up with a quality very different from that provided by the
    > original ink.
    >
    > But, hell, if you're really pissed off by Epson ink price and grandma
    > will certainly be dead in 10 years, you might want to give it a try.
    > I've read about cartridges exploding in the printer and the whole house
    > being blown apart, but I don't believe this happens too often. Ink
    > companies -- Canon, Epson, HP, you name it -- like to play Gasper the
    > Ghost.
    >
    > Fortunately, we all know those ink companies have no representatives not
    > working for the company on this group. But do beware of top posters :)
    >
    > GP
    >
  9. Archived from groups: comp.periphs.printers (More info?)

    Arthur Entlich wrote:

    > Unlike Mr. GP, I am unaware of ANY Epson printer that has the head
    > incorporated as part of the cartridge, including the R800... Therefore,
    > I stand by my original comments.

    Had you bottom posted, we could have talked.

    GP
  10. Archived from groups: comp.periphs.printers (More info?)

    GP <gilpel@inverse.nretla.org> wrote:

    >Arthur Entlich wrote:
    >
    >> Unlike Mr. GP, I am unaware of ANY Epson printer that has the head
    >> incorporated as part of the cartridge, including the R800... Therefore,
    >> I stand by my original comments.
    >
    >Had you bottom posted, we could have talked.
    >
    >GP

    Ah, the old "I am insulted buy your lack of good form" when you are
    wrong ploy! Arthur is correct in every statement he made and you sir
    were simply wrong. Not to worry, though as misunderstandings and
    misinterpretations abound here on Usenet. ;^)

    Happy New Year!

    Richard
  11. Archived from groups: comp.periphs.printers (More info?)

    I hate bottom posters. I like to see the last comment immediately.

    PJ


    On Sun, 09 Jan 2005 02:18:52 -0500, GP <gilpel@inverse.nretla.org>
    wrote:

    >Arthur Entlich wrote:
    >
    >> Unlike Mr. GP, I am unaware of ANY Epson printer that has the head
    >> incorporated as part of the cartridge, including the R800... Therefore,
    >> I stand by my original comments.
    >
    >Had you bottom posted, we could have talked.
    >
    >GP
  12. Archived from groups: comp.periphs.printers (More info?)

    Agreed.

    PJx wrote:
    > I hate bottom posters. I like to see the last comment immediately.
    >
    > PJ
    >
    >
    >
  13. Archived from groups: comp.periphs.printers (More info?)

    On Sun, 09 Jan 2005 15:49:50 -0600, PJx <me@privacy.com> wrote:

    > I hate bottom posters.

    Just like I don't understand why some people are too lazy or don't
    know how to edit what they are replying to instead of reposting the
    entire thread in their reply.
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