Tell me again how AM2 will compete with Conroe?

yeah that's what makes me wonder about all these AMD fanboys that think AMD is gonna be the best forever :roll: no company is the best,.. only products with the best performance are the best.

AMD will have something, but I don't think it's going to be too soon.

even when intel first discussed the core architecture, before they showed anything working, AMD was there standing their ground saying they're confident with the architecture they have now.

and now that intel has shown their new architecture off, and results are starting to leak out from a few people that have chips available to them (like the XS forums), I think performance is better than they anticipated. even anylists and review sites predicted core would catch intel up to AMD, not pass them by 20%. AMD talks evolution, not revolution, so their next cpus may have been being designed to take performance where A64 left off, but with better temperatures, more features, etc. which of course they will now have to change, if true.

another thing to note, I think it was the inquirer that had an article up stating that TDP ratings for the turon X2 line are at 35w, which is great for 90nm. but they also had TDP rating for furure 65nm from AMD, which sounds like is coming sooner than expected, and they were also only 35w. maybe 65nm isn't going to give the huge edge all the bleeding heart AMD fans are hoping for.

what makes me wonder more is why is pushing the AM2 platyform so much like it's a new architecture or super upgrade.

to me this is similar to intel's move from 478 to LGA775

there was virtually no reason for it other than an attempt to move people over.


the question will be does the Am2 socket provide a greater upgrade path in the future?

will a new architecture be around the corner? for now all the AMD chips going into the AM2 socket will be existing K8 chips with the new memory manager. if this is the case.. what was the prupose of upgrading to the AM2?

even with DDR2 support. regardless of the benefits of that. was changing sockets necessary? going from a 939 pin layout to a 940 pin layout could hardly be worth an entire platform change. there's got to be more. I hardly believe that AMD couldnt' get the DDR2 memory manager on the existing 939. the addition of ONE pin just doesn't make sense.

I dont think AM@ purpose is to blow intel out of the water

Ohio.

I dont think AM2 is not any revolution for AMD. they're just updating their platform (=socket, not processor) for DDR2. They could have done the transition to DDR2 with socket 939, but to make things easier to most users, they launched a new socket for DDR2. Changing 939 to DDR2 would cause a bit of confusion, as there would be 939 DDR and 939 DDR2. Remember: the great majority of users dont know sh*t about sockets and other stuff.
"Current" AM2 products will be just a market update for DDR2, as they dont feature any difference to their 939 counterparts, except for the memory controller

i think a new AMD core will come when K8L arrives.

it doesn't make sense,... AMD is not acting very smart with that. But, the AM2 platform will pave the way for future upgrades, I believe, and it will improve performance slightly.

the move from 478 to LGA775 paved the way for new technology and better performance, and is far more logical than a move from 939 to 940.

I think something positive in the hole story of amd is that we will be able to put quad core into an am2 socket mobos

At last! someone with a functional brain!

AM2 isn't supposed to compete against conroe, and I think AM2 had no reason to be released so soon, they should have let their tech grow a little bit, but as you say, they possibly did it for the average joe.

K8L or K10 or wutever they are going to do next @ 65nm, second gen will be worth to see.

Conroe will win the battle, but not the war

Conroe is already beated with K8L.
Conroe will NEVER beat K8L's floating point power.

Conroe is already beated with K8L.
Conroe will NEVER beat K8L's floating point power.
Wow....I am impressed how some people are proving their stupidity having no idea what are they and what others are talking about without having any clue or argument talking about things that does not exist and no one knows if they will....

From my point of view i think Conroe is going to be a little bit faster than FX62 but i am not very sure about that because amd have a big advantage which is called integrated memory controller and hyper transport.

The sure thing is that AMD will be very strong in 2007

dude, my comments are based on how the conroe will "be" (IF it really is as benchmarked)....

Conroe will beat the first AM2 socket processor because, what I've read so far (anadndtech lol and other site...too bad) AMD hasnt developed fully AM2, is much more like "939 goes AM2: the same ol stuff with brand new prices!"

If conroe is not what it seems OR AMD comes with a miracle and makes those thingies go bakoom! then conroe will lose the battle.....the first option "seems" more possible



Second part: 100% true....unless a miracle, but a REALLY HOLY miracle happens

agreed i think it slike the new 7900GT from nvidia ther eisnt a big preformance jump but the new architechture helps so DDR2 will be like a stepping stone to AMD's sucess

but i'm not a fan boy, if intel out preforms AMD and sells for cheaper or slightly more i'd buy intel, i care for one thing, my money's worth

From my point of view, I belive that Conroe will be much faster(about 20%) than the dualcore K8s at same clock. The Conre XE 3.33GHz FSB1333 will cut off the Athon FX-62 troath.
HTT gives no advantage for the performance of the single processor systems compared to the FSB used on the older AMD and Intel systems and the new Intel Core chips.
The K8 architecture is not optimized for high latency DDR2, does not need more memory bandwidth for singlecore and dualcore K8 processors and is suffering from the high CAS latency.
Unlike K8, Intel Core architecture is almost CAS latency independend. That means that cheap DDR2 can be used for Conroe systems with almost no performance disadventage, unlike the AM2 K8 systems. Core architecture is quite optimized with the Smart Memory Access technology that schedules the memory access and prevents useless memory operations.

so far, nobody can be sure what AMD will be releasing for their new am2 slot after their current list of CPUs that they SAY they'll release. But one things for sure, nobody has a clue what will happen after that period.

But just like any other time in processor history, (with a few early AMD moments left out) the cpu company with lingering performance will always try to come out on top just like any other business.

a good example would be

ps2 < xbox, in the next-gen consoles xbox360 < ps3, for processors intel > AMD, current situation is AMD < intel

So for now, intel reigns the processor war... for now, till amd thinks up a way to gain the lead. but many factors could make this intel reign last longer then expected, which i doubt due to amds great architecture. Please mistake me if i'm wrong

I heard that Spiderman 3 is going to be badder and meaner than Hulk 3!!
Guess we'll have to wait and see. :roll:

The article explained why they are moving to AM2. Sooner or later processors will need to have what DDR2 offers. Intel made a mistake by going so early, however, now DD2 will be usefull because of Conroe. AMD is moving to DD2 not for this year, or maybe even next years CPUs. They are doing so because sooner or later their
future CPU's will require it. They are not being dumb, just the opposite. Like the article said. Better early than late.

The AM2 is a socket, not a CPU like Conroe.
From what little I know and hear, the next big CPU leap for AMD is the K10.
I still have no idea what the next Intel socket is though.

I dont believe AMD ever designed a DDR2 controller. Their DDR3 controller is just doing a half-assed job @ doing DDR2.

But it is the Socket of AM²D Power, no CPU required it is so bad.  

Face the facts untel both chips are out in the market. It still in the unknwon.

So why not there is not another company producing Cpus as same quality with AMD and INTEL,join in this battle and pull CPU prices down for end users?Why not IBM join in this competition?Arent there any other compnay out there?

Conroe is already beated with K8L.
Conroe will NEVER beat K8L's floating point power.
Wow....I am impressed how some people are proving their stupidity having no idea what are they and what others are talking about without having any clue or argument talking about things that does not exist and no one knows if they will....

Notice how the 2nd quote was from a backwards BullSh*tter...? (BS backwards = rettihSlluB...)

agreed i think it slike the new 7900GT from nvidia ther eisnt a big preformance jump but the new architechture helps so DDR2 will be like a stepping stone to AMD's sucess

but i'm not a fan boy, if intel out preforms AMD and sells for cheaper or slightly more i'd buy intel, i care for one thing, my money's worth
big f*cking WORD!!!

this is what people should worry for, and not blabbering "OHH NOEZ; THE CPU I WILL NEVER HAVE IS POWERFUL THAN THAT OTHER WHO IS STILL NOT RELEASED EITHER!!"

you get awarded 1 internetZ!

IBM was doing the powerPC for macs retard... retard..

Ciryx would be there, but it fell short, too inefective technology, weirdly, I heard some rumors about the rests of Ciryx joining efforts with IBM and other 2 companies to try to release x86 processors..

IBM was doing the powerPC for macs retard... retard..

Ciryx would be there, but it fell short, too inefective technology, weirdly, I heard some rumors about the rests of Ciryx joining efforts with IBM and other 2 companies to try to release x86 processors..

Mac's are now running Intel based machines, as for Ciryx they were purchased by VIA a while back.

IBM was doing the powerPC for macs retard... retard..

Ciryx would be there, but it fell short, too inefective technology, weirdly, I heard some rumors about the rests of Ciryx joining efforts with IBM and other 2 companies to try to release x86 processors..

Mac's are now running Intel based machines, as for Ciryx they were purchased by VIA a while back.
HENCE the "WAS"

Wow this thread went more than 5 posts without a OMGCoRnRow!!11!~one! ... impressive.

I concer with the "AM2 was rushed" sentiment and I think sales will be weak for it since most everyone is waiting for the K8L before swapping the whole system. Nobody really wants to refit a whole rig, then change out the CPU a few months later, especially considering the AM2 intro prices. I do applaud AMD for letting intel build up the market for DDR2 before they stepped into it. Makes the entry price a lot lower for those of us that haven't bought into it yet.

Will they eventually get the crown back? I think so. Will it be in 2k7? possibly. I'm a little skeptical about K8L doing it for them but I assume that they've got a plan to make DDR2 work more for them that it is going to in the near term. At least there'll be a nice progresssion point from K8L+DDR2 to whatever is next, just swap the CPU and go. And hopefully by that time DDR2 latencies will be less of an issue (they've already got CAS3 chips out there).

IBM was doing the powerPC for macs retard... retard..

Ciryx would be there, but it fell short, too inefective technology, weirdly, I heard some rumors about the rests of Ciryx joining efforts with IBM and other 2 companies to try to release x86 processors..

Mac's are now running Intel based machines, as for Ciryx they were purchased by VIA a while back.
HENCE the "WAS"

I don't see what you are talking about but I will apologize in advance to save face.

At last! someone with a functional brain!

Conroe will win the battle, but not the war

Agreed, jap0nes. And, 7H, what makes you think the war will ever end? If a war never ends, how can you determine a winner? Hopefully, the consumer will continue to win and by that I mean that the entry to mid level performance per dollar will continue to climb.

How did they get their hands on a platform that hasn't come out yet, nor are you thinking about K8L. AMD wont be the best forever, but they beat Intel to alot of tech breakthroughts and that shows alot of balls when AMD was and still is much smaller than Intel.

I would like to know the correlation between AMD fans and those who write in leet speak. I bet the findings would be significantly positive! :roll:

Easy, in corporate wars the winner is the customer xD


I assume that this statement agrees with mine ^^


And about my post, I would like to change "will" for "can", why? because until those products hit the streets those benchies are just numbers.

I said that in response to the gazillion ppl that say "oh yeah, AMD's going bankrupt when conroe comes out", they assume that Intel will just simply wipe AMD out of this planet, but that won't happen.

I hope that you can now understand what I was trying to say


Best Wishes-----------------------------7H4_D00D3

Easy, in corporate wars the winner is the customer xD


I assume that this statement agrees with mine ^^

No way! Yours agrees with mine!



For sure. good'un to you too.

IBM was doing the powerPC for macs retard... retard..

Ciryx would be there, but it fell short, too inefective technology, weirdly, I heard some rumors about the rests of Ciryx joining efforts with IBM and other 2 companies to try to release x86 processors..

i think ibm is working with sony and another company with the cell processor

which seems to have what 9 cores on it??

IBM, Toshiba and Sony are the parents of Cell.
Yes it is a 9core CPU, but has unique asymetric architecture. 1 core is accepting the jobs and is delivering to the others. That is called Power Element and is very similar to G5. The other 8 cores are called the Synergistic cores and are doing the job. They are linked with each other with extremly fast link(aprox 300GB/s) have 256kB cache each and are operating at 4GHz-5GHz, threfore doing 192-256Gfloop/s. Cell is a clear example of true multimedia processor, and I hardly belive that its asymertric architecture will be implemented by both Intel and AMD latter.
IBM always were inovators, they are now working on something much more revolutioner, and that is a quantum CPU, which is not binary (not working with 0 and 1). It is processing fuzzy numbers and if this success, than we will be in new era of super computing.

good thinking

you stole my opinion. you should have quoted it  


AM2 = socket
LGA775 = socket

so it shouldbe CONROE vs WINDSOR

Im surprised the first ones that came with AM2 vs Conroe are intel lovers  

well, it wasn't exactly good thinking when I said 939 versus 940 wasn't a good move. It is, because it makes it so that it won't be confused with previous platforms, (since the motherboard has to be made different to support DDR2). LGA775 increased pin count, was better that way, but also paved the way for other changes. I'd say it's about the same kind of thing. Intel just did it first.

Conroe vs. Windsor? Conroe pwns Windsor

I just hope conroe does beat AMD but just for a while so the AMD's cpus drop price, because right now they are just to overpriced compared to the intel processors

you got that right. I'm with ya 100%.

HuH?? You sound so ignorant. You forget Intel is a giant company, AMD is small potatos. Everyone used to say Intel was the best and would be forever. Boy how wrong they were. Now AMD is spanking Intel. Took another 38% market share this quarter alone. Who said it would last forever? Competition is good for the consumer. Just like Nvidia and ATI it goes back and forth, nobody is better, but for a short time.
Secondly theirs too many fanboys that talk about stuff that aint even released yet. Conroe is not out and retail samples have not been tested. Retail AM2 is not out yet and has not been tested. AM2 65nm have not been released or tested. Give me a break and put up or shut up.

As has been previously stated, AM2 is a socket upgrade, not a processor upgrade.

Although there is a bit of a gray area, since the memory controller on AMD processors is on the processor.

It actually makes a lot of sense to make the upgrade now, from a business point of view, given the current memory market.

But I digress... the original question, which might have been better stated as "Tell me again how the next-generation AM2 socket with a DDR2 memory controller and current AMD core will compete with current Intel Socket with DDR2 memory controller and next-generation core?"

Wheh... what a mouthful.

Well, exactly what is it you want to compare? Price? Speed? Voltage? All three? Speed at price point?

I'm not quite sure what you're question is trying to assert.

But lets just assume that you wish to know what future technology based on the AM2 socket will compete with the future technology based on the intel CORE architecture.

Well, if I had to conjecture, I would say that AMD doesn't have to do any radical changes in order to compete.

AMD forced intel into a technology shift and lower price point in order to compete with them and maintain market share.

And from a technological point of view the AMD Hypertransport will scale much better with the addition of more cores to the processor, just as in the Dempsey vs Opteron.

So my answer to your questions is: as multicore processors are released with 3, 4 or even more cores, the AMD solution will scale better and be competitive, if not faster, without any sort of design changes needing to take place. (Even though we know design changes are taking place)

Of course this is just conjecture on what future technologies might hold, but it is a reasonable conjecture.

Dark Spider

HuH?? You sound so ignorant. You forget Intel is a giant company, AMD is small potatos. Everyone used to say Intel was the best and would be forever. Boy how wrong they were. Now AMD is spanking Intel. Took another 38% market share this quarter alone. Who said it would last forever? Competition is good for the consumer. Just like Nvidia and ATI it goes back and forth, nobody is better, but for a short time.
Secondly theirs too many fanboys that talk about stuff that aint even released yet. Conroe is not out and retail samples have not been tested. Retail AM2 is not out yet and has not been tested. AM2 65nm have not been released or tested. Give me a break and put up or shut up.

well, I'd repeat my above post twice but I'll save my breath. I wouldn't have said it if there weren't some diehard fanboys that didn't think AMD was gonna last forever as the best. And, I never said that competition wasn't good. I'm glad AMD was the best for a little while, although it appears Intel is going to pass and regain it's status as leader, and while who knows the future, I think AMD will respond with a better, one, and then Intel, etc etc... just normal stuff, like Nvidia and ATI.

I never forgot that AMD was small, and I never will. And I'll keep in mind that AMD manufactures small potatoes, too. :roll:

HuH?? You sound so ignorant. You forget Intel is a giant company, AMD is small potatos. Everyone used to say Intel was the best and would be forever. Boy how wrong they were. Now AMD is spanking Intel. Took another 38% market share this quarter alone. Who said it would last forever? Competition is good for the consumer. Just like Nvidia and ATI it goes back and forth, nobody is better, but for a short time.
Secondly theirs too many fanboys that talk about stuff that aint even released yet. Conroe is not out and retail samples have not been tested. Retail AM2 is not out yet and has not been tested. AM2 65nm have not been released or tested. Give me a break and put up or shut up.

Its not that I have something against amd i just think their cpus are too overpriced now, I own an amd athlon 64 computer but if i wanted to get a real good cpu now it will cost me a lot, all I want is for both of them to have competitive prices

HuH?? You sound so ignorant. You forget Intel is a giant company, AMD is small potatos. Everyone used to say Intel was the best and would be forever. Boy how wrong they were. Now AMD is spanking Intel. Took another 38% market share this quarter alone. Who said it would last forever? Competition is good for the consumer. Just like Nvidia and ATI it goes back and forth, nobody is better, but for a short time.
Secondly theirs too many fanboys that talk about stuff that aint even released yet. Conroe is not out and retail samples have not been tested. Retail AM2 is not out yet and has not been tested. AM2 65nm have not been released or tested. Give me a break and put up or shut up.

Its not that I have something against amd i just think their cpus are too overpriced now, I own an amd athlon 64 computer but if i wanted to get a real good cpu now it will cost me a lot, all I want is for both of them to have competitive prices

Why not just wait. I still own a P4 northwood 2.4 at 400mhz and I can play any game out there.



It appears to whom? So once again you "think" it "appears" so. Where did you get this information. OH yeah, your a fanboy, and fanboys believe everything they read from Intel biased sites. Riiiiiiight.
So I bet when they pimped Prescott as the greatest processor ever, you were right there with your wallet. Then you realized how much money you spent on a power hungry space heater. Right?

Just because you can play games on very low detail, doesn't mean it's still a good gaming CPU.

I own a Pentium 4 Northwood C Hyper threading, and that thing is still a great CPU. Overclocked to 3.5GHz and it is able to keep up with any game; only problem is the overclocked 6800GT with it; the card is getting too old to play newer games on higher qualities.

wouldnt it be funny if intel bought AMD. With intels capital they probably can.