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Anyone have experience and/or recommendations on a relatively cheap
color laser? I'm just looking to print text and color charts -- not
photos or something.

I've owned the black ones in the past. Are the color ones similar or do
they require more tweaking, cleaning and maintenance than the older
black only? With the black one I could pretty much forget about it for
the 5,000 pages or so the toner cartridge could print. As opposed to
ink jets where one seems to spend time cleaning them, etc., to keep them
running well.

Bill
 
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On Mon, 31 Jan 2005 18:11:09 GMT, "Bill Martin -- Remove \"NOSPAM\"
from address" <wylie@earthNOSPAMlink.net> wrote:

>Anyone have experience and/or recommendations on a relatively cheap
>color laser? I'm just looking to print text and color charts -- not
>photos or something.
>
>I've owned the black ones in the past. Are the color ones similar or do
>they require more tweaking, cleaning and maintenance than the older
>black only? With the black one I could pretty much forget about it for
>the 5,000 pages or so the toner cartridge could print. As opposed to
>ink jets where one seems to spend time cleaning them, etc., to keep them
>running well.
>
>Bill


HP has a Color LaserJet for $499 US. I think its the 1500 or the 2500.
Its a disposable printer. To purchase the 4 toner cartridges it takes
will cost you more than $499. You can just buy a new one and junk the
old one.
Is this progress?


Want to Fix Something?

http://www.manuals4you.com
 
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On Mon, 31 Jan 2005 18:34:31 -0500, Yikes!ItsIke
<Yikes!ItsIke@younameit.com> found these unused words floating about:

>On Mon, 31 Jan 2005 18:11:09 GMT, "Bill Martin -- Remove \"NOSPAM\"
>from address" <wylie@earthNOSPAMlink.net> wrote:
>
>>Anyone have experience and/or recommendations on a relatively cheap
>>color laser? I'm just looking to print text and color charts -- not
>>photos or something.
>>
>>I've owned the black ones in the past. Are the color ones similar or do
>>they require more tweaking, cleaning and maintenance than the older
>>black only? With the black one I could pretty much forget about it for
>>the 5,000 pages or so the toner cartridge could print. As opposed to
>>ink jets where one seems to spend time cleaning them, etc., to keep them
>>running well.
>>
>>Bill
>
>
>HP has a Color LaserJet for $499 US. I think its the 1500 or the 2500.
>Its a disposable printer. To purchase the 4 toner cartridges it takes
>will cost you more than $499. You can just buy a new one and junk the
>old one.
>Is this progress?
>
>
It's what the inkjunks have been doing for years ... !
 
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Coup wrote:

> Overall I'm so far quite satisfied with the 3100cn.. hopefully the
> above will help others decide if this printer is of interest to
> them...

Am I correct in assuming that one could relatively easily turn off the
color printing and force it to work monochrome most of the time to get
cheaper pages? Only turn on the color when necessary? I see Dell
claims 1.5c/page black and 12.5c/page color.

And if the color sat unused for a week or two at a time would it still
work or would that cause problems as with an ink jet? I never had
trouble with a monochrome toner caking or something, but have no
experience with color toners.

Thanks...

Bill
 
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Bill,

How many color prints will you be making per month?

Dennis


Bill Martin -- Remove "NOSPAM" from address wrote:
> Anyone have experience and/or recommendations on a relatively cheap
> color laser? I'm just looking to print text and color charts -- not
> photos or something.
>
> I've owned the black ones in the past. Are the color ones similar or
do
> they require more tweaking, cleaning and maintenance than the older
> black only? With the black one I could pretty much forget about it
for
> the 5,000 pages or so the toner cartridge could print. As opposed to

> ink jets where one seems to spend time cleaning them, etc., to keep
them
> running well.
>
> Bill
 
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How many color prints will you need to make each month ?
 

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On Tue, 01 Feb 2005 01:46:17 GMT, "Bill Martin -- Remove \"NOSPAM\"
from address" <wylie@earthNOSPAMlink.net> wrote:

>Coup wrote:
>
>> Overall I'm so far quite satisfied with the 3100cn.. hopefully the
>> above will help others decide if this printer is of interest to
>> them...
>
>Am I correct in assuming that one could relatively easily turn off the
>color printing and force it to work monochrome most of the time to get
>cheaper pages? Only turn on the color when necessary? I see Dell
>claims 1.5c/page black and 12.5c/page color.

Yes. There are 2 settings you make in the driver setup to force the
printer to ONLY use the black toner, this not only saves money, the
printer no longer cycles thru the 4 engines and the speed switches
from the nominal 5 ppm to the 21 rated for monochrome. As suggested in
the Dell Support Bulletin Board, many simply create a second instance
of the printer driver with these settings, rename it 3100 Monochrome
and use that when doing simple text runs....
>
>And if the color sat unused for a week or two at a time would it still
>work or would that cause problems as with an ink jet? I never had
>trouble with a monochrome toner caking or something, but have no
>experience with color toners.

Color toner acts the same as black toner, color lasers will act like a
monochrome laser... ignore it for two months, turn it on, use
it...period..... The only real issue with disuse is actually the
paper... over long periods of time (months) depending upon the
environment (temperature/humidity) the characteristics of the paper
will change. Some will dry out, others may even absorb moisture...
this can cause jamming and adherence issues for the toner... similar
to what happens with copiers too. Also, note that inkjet papers
should NEVER be used with a color laser (or copier for that matter).
Inkjet papers are designed to allow controlled absorbtion of liquid
inks... most of these coatings will leave deposits on a color laser
drum that will foul them. In addition they inhibit the fusing of laser
toner to the surface of the paper. You can use plain copy paper
although color/photographic results will be less than optimum or color
laser papers which are deliberately made with super-smooth surfaces
designed to allow optimum fusing of the toner to the surface.
 
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> HP has a Color LaserJet for $499 US. I think its the 1500 or the 2500.
> Its a disposable printer. To purchase the 4 toner cartridges it takes
> will cost you more than $499. You can just buy a new one and junk the
> old one.
> Is this progress?

It's typical of the usual HP ripoff. They've been waving two fingers
at the paying customers for years over the cost of consumables, and
the mugs smile happily at them while they're doing it :(

Takes all sorts I suppose ...


Bloggy
 
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Most color laser printers have a mono mode that just uses the black
toner. I see no reason why there would be a problem in leaving the
color toners unused for several weeks.

In general, from looking at the expendable of several color laser
printers, the black toner is cheaper than the color and often has more
toner in the cartridge, but it often still costs more than a black toner
from a monochrome only printer.

Art

Bill Martin -- Remove "NOSPAM" from address wrote:

> Coup wrote:
>
>> Overall I'm so far quite satisfied with the 3100cn.. hopefully the
>> above will help others decide if this printer is of interest to
>> them...
>
>
> Am I correct in assuming that one could relatively easily turn off the
> color printing and force it to work monochrome most of the time to get
> cheaper pages? Only turn on the color when necessary? I see Dell
> claims 1.5c/page black and 12.5c/page color.
>
> And if the color sat unused for a week or two at a time would it still
> work or would that cause problems as with an ink jet? I never had
> trouble with a monochrome toner caking or something, but have no
> experience with color toners.
>
> Thanks...
>
> Bill
 
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Free Printer Guy wrote:
> Bill,
>
> How many color prints will you be making per month?
>
> Dennis

Not many. A dozen maybe? Simple charts and graphs type stuff, not
photos or anything.

Bill
 
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I've got to admit the Dell looks like quite a nice printer. If they
also sold it in a multifunction model I'd buy it tomorrow I think.

As it is, I'll anguish over it for awhile until the price comes back
down I suppose.

Thanks for the info Coup.

(Curiously, I don't see anyone selling the color laser engines in a
multifunction format yet. I suppose they want to get some field
experience with the color print engine itself first. Surely they're
bolting parts together in the back room even now though.)

Bill
 

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"Bill Martin -- Remove "NOSPAM" from address" <wylie@earthNOSPAMlink.net>
wrote in message news:rZMLd.6426$Ix.5654@newsread3.news.atl.earthlink.net...
> I've got to admit the Dell looks like quite a nice printer. If they
> also sold it in a multifunction model I'd buy it tomorrow I think.
>
> As it is, I'll anguish over it for awhile until the price comes back
> down I suppose.
>
> Thanks for the info Coup.
>
> (Curiously, I don't see anyone selling the color laser engines in a
> multifunction format yet. I suppose they want to get some field
> experience with the color print engine itself first. Surely they're
> bolting parts together in the back room even now though.)
>
> Bill

There are several Multifunction color lasers on the market. You're just
looking in the wrong place. Look under "Networkable Color Copiers". Xerox,
Canon, Minolta, etc.

BTW- I just bought a Canon Imagepass 3200. Now that's quite a machine. up
to 11x17, ps3 and a Fiery RIP. Prints, copies, faxes, scans and creates
..pdf files.

Mark
 

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On Tue, 1 Feb 2005 10:28:53 -0500, "Mark" <marklb@bogus.net> wrote:

>

>BTW- I just bought a Canon Imagepass 3200. Now that's quite a machine. up
>to 11x17, ps3 and a Fiery RIP. Prints, copies, faxes, scans and creates
>.pdf files.
>
>Mark
>

LOL aside from the space such a beast would take up here...I'd lust
after one of those too... but somehow I think you've gone over the
$400 budget I set myself ;-)
 
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Mark wrote:

> There are several Multifunction color lasers on the market. You're just
> looking in the wrong place. Look under "Networkable Color Copiers". Xerox,
> Canon, Minolta, etc.
>
> BTW- I just bought a Canon Imagepass 3200. Now that's quite a machine. up
> to 11x17, ps3 and a Fiery RIP. Prints, copies, faxes, scans and creates
> .pdf files.

----------------------

You mean you bought an ImageRunner perhaps? That's the only 3200 model
I see on Canon's web site. Anything in that class is *waaaay* out of my
range. Canon won't even quote a price on it on their web pages -- must
see the dealer. Like they say, "If you have to ask the price, you can't
afford it." Even if I could afford it, the thing won't fit on my desk!

I'm looking for a little desk top color laser copier multifunction.

Bill
 

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"Bill Martin -- Remove "NOSPAM" from address" <wylie@earthNOSPAMlink.net>
wrote in message news:2EOLd.5048$S3.1138@newsread2.news.atl.earthlink.net...
> Mark wrote:
>
> > There are several Multifunction color lasers on the market. You're just
> > looking in the wrong place. Look under "Networkable Color Copiers".
Xerox,
> > Canon, Minolta, etc.
> >
> > BTW- I just bought a Canon Imagepass 3200. Now that's quite a machine.
up
> > to 11x17, ps3 and a Fiery RIP. Prints, copies, faxes, scans and creates
> > .pdf files.
>
> ----------------------
>
> You mean you bought an ImageRunner perhaps? That's the only 3200 model
> I see on Canon's web site. Anything in that class is *waaaay* out of my
> range. Canon won't even quote a price on it on their web pages -- must
> see the dealer. Like they say, "If you have to ask the price, you can't
> afford it." Even if I could afford it, the thing won't fit on my desk!
>
> I'm looking for a little desk top color laser copier multifunction.
>
> Bill

You're right, it is an imageRunner. For some reason though it shows up on
the network as imagePass. And really, as far as copiers go, it's not that
big, but it won't fit on a desktop.

With all the extras (Fiery RIP, scan to network folder, Collater, Fax, etc)
is was about $15k.

Mark
 
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On Tue, 1 Feb 2005 14:07:18 -0500, "Mark" <marklb@bogus.net> wrote:

>You're right, it is an imageRunner. For some reason though it shows up on
>the network as imagePass. And really, as far as copiers go, it's not that
>big, but it won't fit on a desktop.
>
>With all the extras (Fiery RIP, scan to network folder, Collater, Fax, etc)
>is was about $15k.

<http://www.loyal.net/copiers/copiers/iRc3200.htm> has it for
$11,940.00

It appears that ImageRunner is the copier, and ImagePass is the
network interface.

jc
 
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Mark wrote:

> With all the extras (Fiery RIP, scan to network folder, Collater, Fax, etc)
> is was about $15k.

I bought my current Dell computer new for $400. It would probably quit
in indignation if I spent $15K for a printer!

Bill
 

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"Bill Martin -- Remove "NOSPAM" from address" <wylie@earthNOSPAMlink.net>
wrote in message news:CYRLd.5206$S3.2174@newsread2.news.atl.earthlink.net...
> Mark wrote:
>
> > With all the extras (Fiery RIP, scan to network folder, Collater, Fax,
etc)
> > is was about $15k.
>
> I bought my current Dell computer new for $400. It would probably quit
> in indignation if I spent $15K for a printer!
>
> Bill

LOL!!
 
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I smell a Xerox deal hatching ;-)

Art

Free Printer Guy wrote:

> Bill,
>
> How many color prints will you be making per month?
>
> Dennis
>
>
> Bill Martin -- Remove "NOSPAM" from address wrote:
>
>>Anyone have experience and/or recommendations on a relatively cheap
>>color laser? I'm just looking to print text and color charts -- not
>>photos or something.
>>
>>I've owned the black ones in the past. Are the color ones similar or
>
> do
>
>>they require more tweaking, cleaning and maintenance than the older
>>black only? With the black one I could pretty much forget about it
>
> for
>
>>the 5,000 pages or so the toner cartridge could print. As opposed to
>
>
>>ink jets where one seems to spend time cleaning them, etc., to keep
>
> them
>
>>running well.
>>
>>Bill
>
>
 
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Well, I think they are called color photocopiers, and they are big and
costly to make, not to mention they don't want to cut into that market,
which is probably were most of the money is.

In general, color photocopiers have less costly toner cartridges, but
the initial cost of the units are considerably higher.

Art

Bill Martin -- Remove "NOSPAM" from address wrote:

> I've got to admit the Dell looks like quite a nice printer. If they
> also sold it in a multifunction model I'd buy it tomorrow I think.
>
> As it is, I'll anguish over it for awhile until the price comes back
> down I suppose.
>
> Thanks for the info Coup.
>
> (Curiously, I don't see anyone selling the color laser engines in a
> multifunction format yet. I suppose they want to get some field
> experience with the color print engine itself first. Surely they're
> bolting parts together in the back room even now though.)
>
> Bill
 
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Arthur Entlich wrote:
> Well, I think they are called color photocopiers, and they are big and
> costly to make, not to mention they don't want to cut into that market,
> which is probably were most of the money is.
>
> In general, color photocopiers have less costly toner cartridges, but
> the initial cost of the units are considerably higher.
>
> Art

----------------

A few years back I could have said the same about mono photocopiers.
Big expensive production machines you'd never have on your desk. Now
you do, and given the cheap print engine it's fairly trivial to add a
scanner and fax interface at very moderate extra expense. Which they've
been doing for some time now.

Do you see any reason at all that color laser printers won't follow
exactly the same trajectory? They've already cost/size reduced the
print engine to sit on your desk. Integrating a scanner/fax is
technologically trivial at this point if they see a market for it.

I've got to believe it's on their product road maps. They just need to
get the simple color laser printer out the door first.

Frankly I'd be surprised if color laser multifunctions don't come out
soon and drive the monos off the market.

Bill
 

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On Wed, 02 Feb 2005 14:26:08 GMT, Arthur Entlich <artistic@telus.net>
wrote:

>
>
>Coup wrote:
>
>> On Tue, 01 Feb 2005 12:35:02 GMT, Arthur Entlich <artistic@telus.net>
>> wrote:
>>
>>
>>>Any idea who is making it for Dell?
>>>
>>
>>
>> Art .. you're getting bleary-eyed...lol Reread my #1 below that you
>> quoted in your question ;-)
>>
>
>I am indeed bleary-eyed... I was up for about 36 hours at that point...
>and you are right, I missed it. I read everything but that last
>sentence, where you went into them not being Lexmarks.
>
>The Fuji-Xerox printers have received some interest as perhaps a good
>association between the two companies and their technologies.
>
>I'm going to have to ask around for some print samples, as good as your
>description is, it is hard to qualify an image production device without
>seeing output.
>
>I'll have to research it... however, why the heck is it so large? 17" x
>17" x 30" high? wow.
>
>Art

Actually, I was exaggerating it turns out, the 3100cn is 17' x 17" x
22" high. The 3100cn adds the extra paper tray underneath that adds 4"
to it. Adding the available duplexer to it probably creates something
approaching the 30" tower.

Other weirdness (you have to wonder about the though processes that
results in some of this):

The 3000cn is 4" lower, missing the 250 sheet paper tray, but the
3100cn CANNOT BE OPERATED WITHOUT THE TRAY.

The 3100cn is actually about 73 lbs vs 56 for the 3000, virtually the
whole difference is the paper tray which is one hunk of a piece of
mostly metal....so most everything on this printer is built like a
tank... except

The fold out "support/stop flap" on the output tray at the top
couldn't possibly be any thinner or more flimsy plastic... this seems
to be becoming a 'tradition' with just about ever maker of printers...
is there some 'secret protocol' all printer companies have subscribed
to about this sort of thing? God forbid they add 2 oz. to the weight
and make this part out of stamped metal...
 
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In message <PH7Md.6033$S3.689@newsread2.news.atl.earthlink.net>, "Bill
Martin -- Remove \"NOSPAM\" from address" <wylie@earthNOSPAMlink.net>
writes
>
>Do you see any reason at all that color laser printers won't follow
>exactly the same trajectory? They've already cost/size reduced the
>print engine to sit on your desk. Integrating a scanner/fax is
>technologically trivial at this point if they see a market for it.
>
>I've got to believe it's on their product road maps. They just need to
>get the simple color laser printer out the door first.
>
>Frankly I'd be surprised if color laser multifunctions don't come out
>soon and drive the monos off the market.
>
I've been looking at this sort of thing and currently I reckon its
cheaper to buy a multifunction A3 (approx 11" x 17") mono and an A3
colour laser for less than the equivalent multifunction colour A3.

--
Timothy Lee http://www.wightproperty.com
tlatwightpropertydotcom
 
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Actually, I do see several reasons they will not be here soon.

First off, color inkjet multifunction machines are very inexpensive to
make, are lightweight, and there target market is low volume users.

Color laser printers are big, and expensive to make. To reduce the
size, and add a scanner will require smaller toner cartridges. For low
volume users, it makes no sense. For larger volume users, the market
provides color photocopiers at considerably higher costs.

I see color photocopiers coming down in cost only if the manufacturers
go to a costly refilling system, like color laser printers. To do so,
requires a large enough demand, because the machines are still costly to
make. If they can't sell a LOT of very overpriced color toner
cartridges, simply put, they cannot afford to lower the cost of the copiers.

Since even relatively small toner cartridges provide thousands of copies
at 5% coverage, for small volume users, the manufacturers would end up
selling these machines at near cost, and never sell refill cartridges.

Large volume users will buy them only because they save money on
consumables, which means the price of the machines have to stay up to
pay for the cost of the machines.

I could be wrong. I never expected inkjet color printing to come to
anything more than a short transition to color laser... obviously that
was way off base. Don't bet the farm on my predictions, but for now, at
least, I think you may not be seeing these all in one color laser based
machines at reasonable costs for years to come.

Art

Bill Martin -- Remove "NOSPAM" from address wrote:

> Arthur Entlich wrote:
>
>> Well, I think they are called color photocopiers, and they are big and
>> costly to make, not to mention they don't want to cut into that
>> market, which is probably were most of the money is.
>>
>> In general, color photocopiers have less costly toner cartridges, but
>> the initial cost of the units are considerably higher.
>>
>> Art
>
>
> ----------------
>
> A few years back I could have said the same about mono photocopiers. Big
> expensive production machines you'd never have on your desk. Now you
> do, and given the cheap print engine it's fairly trivial to add a
> scanner and fax interface at very moderate extra expense. Which they've
> been doing for some time now.
>
> Do you see any reason at all that color laser printers won't follow
> exactly the same trajectory? They've already cost/size reduced the
> print engine to sit on your desk. Integrating a scanner/fax is
> technologically trivial at this point if they see a market for it.
>
> I've got to believe it's on their product road maps. They just need to
> get the simple color laser printer out the door first.
>
> Frankly I'd be surprised if color laser multifunctions don't come out
> soon and drive the monos off the market.
>
> Bill
 
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But then you'd never have to buy a new part... those little flaps are
only available from Dell for $300 each! ;-)

Art


Coup wrote:


> The fold out "support/stop flap" on the output tray at the top
> couldn't possibly be any thinner or more flimsy plastic... this seems
> to be becoming a 'tradition' with just about ever maker of printers...
> is there some 'secret protocol' all printer companies have subscribed
> to about this sort of thing? God forbid they add 2 oz. to the weight
> and make this part out of stamped metal...
>
>