EIGHT CORE SERVERS: OPTERON 880 vs. XEON MP 3.0 GHZ

Now this is what a call a grand rape from Opteron.
I hope Intel uses vaseline the next time. :wink:

http://www.anandtech.com/IT/showdoc.aspx?i=2745

Quote:
The Opteron leads the way in every test, which isn't surprising. As we've said in the past the current Xeon is hindered by the front-side bus. Trying to shove a giant beach ball into a basket ball hoop - with thirty other people waiting to try the same thing - has a serious impact on scalability. All of the tests are fairly consistent, and the Opteron averages a 36-51% lead over the Paxville system.

LOL. 8)
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  1. Hey Action: Did your mom recovered from her hymenoplasty procedure??
    Could she get it fix?
    I'm kinda concerned since many on the forum got keyboards from her. I imagine the though labor those doctors had to go through. 8)
  2. Quote:
    Hey Action: Did your mom recovered from her hymenoplasty procedure??
    Could she get it fix?
    I'm kinda concerned since many on the forum got keyboards from her. I imagine the though labor those doctors had to go through. 8)


    Hey Action, did your mom recover from her hymanoplasty procedure?
    Could she get it fixed? I'm kinda' concerned since many on the forum got
    keyboards from her. I can imagine the labor those doctors must of had to
    go through.


    Less links, more practice at english.
  3. A Newtonian reflector telescope uses a parabolic mirror instead of a lense to gather and focus light. This light is focused to a point near the front of the telescope tube and is then redirected to the side of the tube with an elliptical diagonal mirror at a 45 degree angle. The focuser is mounted at the front of this tube and holds the eyepiece which further magnifies this focused light from the parabolic primary.

    Newtonian reflectors, aperature per aperature, are far more affordable than a comparable refractor telescope, and are not plagued by the effects of chromatic aberration (false color)
  4. sphincter
  5. Quote:
    9-inch, my pizzle lovin' buddy, great post!!! Wow, dazzling, simply dazzling.

    Say, I was wondering since you have established yourself as an expert in the field of semiconductors if you could solve me a puzzle. It should not be too difficult, one that should whip right off the top of your head (pardon the pun).

    Ok, here it goes --

    I was thumbing through some sites on the internet trying to educate myself to your level. A damn near impossible task, by the way. Anyway, I came across this article that says they expose the wafer to nitrous oxide (I think the formula is N2O, not entirely sure). They expose it after making something called a gate. If I am not mistaken this is laughing gas, why on earth would they do this? Are they trying to make the wafer laugh?

    Hmmmm, puzzling, simpling puzzling...but I have faith, I have faith that our own 9-inch can give us the answer. Butterflies tickle in my stomach as I, no WE, all await your reply.

    Jack


    Nitrous Oxide is used in the semiconductor mfg process? I did not know that! Come on 9-Inch! Bestow upon us this great pearl of wisdom! A response to this question will really help me sleep tonight.
  6. Quote:
    9-inch, my pizzle lovin' buddy, great post!!! Wow, dazzling, simply dazzling.

    Say, I was wondering since you have established yourself as an expert in the field of semiconductors if you could solve me a puzzle. It should not be too difficult, one that should whip right off the top of your head (pardon the pun).

    Ok, here it goes --

    I was thumbing through some sites on the internet trying to educate myself to your level. A damn near impossible task, by the way. Anyway, I came across this article that says they expose the wafer to nitrous oxide (I think the formula is N2O, not entirely sure). They expose it after making something called a gate. If I am not mistaken this is laughing gas, why on earth would they do this? Are they trying to make the wafer laugh?

    Hmmmm, puzzling, simpling puzzling...but I have faith, I have faith that our own 9-inch can give us the answer. Butterflies tickle in my stomach as I, no WE, all await your reply.

    Jack
    Lol, you scrutinize him so 8) .
  7. 9-inch dont listen to action man he's just playing with you :lol:
  8. Quote:
    sphincter
    Paul lol "SPHINCTER" :lol:
  9. Quote:
    Yeah, some companies will use N2O or NH3 or some other nitrogen containing molecule and "nitride" the gate, sometimes called an oxynitride. It has the affect of making a better SiO2 to Si interface.


    N20 is used during tunnel odixation not the gate ox. For the gate step, you actually use good old hydrogen and oxygen gases, trick here is that it has to be reacted in a torch chamber, with the correct ratio of course, by the way when the gases are reacted in the torch, they make a pretty blue flame that flows into a 950C reactor tube. NH3 is ammonia which we use to make a nitride deposition, not an ox, but some other places might use it for ox. Actually we use much more interesting chemicals, such as HCL (a nasty acid we use during one of our dep steps) and DCS (gas ignites when exposed to oxygen). Oxynitride??? never heard of that process, is it a deposition or oxydation???
  10. Alas, I see my job is already done. :lol:

    Newtonian Telescope...is that in comparison to a Galilean Telescope?
  11. Quote:
    Yeah, some companies will use N2O or NH3 or some other nitrogen containing molecule and "nitride" the gate, sometimes called an oxynitride. It has the affect of making a better SiO2 to Si interface.


    N20 is used during tunnel odixation not the gate ox. For the gate step, you actually use good old hydrogen and oxygen gases, trick here is that it has to be reacted in a torch chamber, with the correct ratio of course, by the way when the gases are reacted in the torch, they make a pretty blue flame that flows into a 950C reactor tube. NH3 is ammonia which we use to make a nitride deposition, not an ox, but some other places might use it for ox. Actually we use much more interesting chemicals, such as HCL (a nasty acid we use during one of our dep steps) and DCS (gas ignites when exposed to oxygen). Oxynitride??? never heard of that process, is it a deposition or oxydation???


    Are you refering to an Intel process ? Intel does not use oxynitrides for their gate material, they use plain old SiO2 and do not nitride it. :) ...

    However, forming gate oxynitride is used in the industry. Here is a quick applied phys. lett. reference. Again, it is a subscription site but you can get the jist from the abstract.

    http://scitation.aip.org/getabs/servlet/GetabsServlet?prog=normal&id=APPLAB000066000021002882000001&idtype=cvips&gifs=yes

    The reference I site above is studying Nitric Oxide for a gate material, it does reference N2O for the most common oxynitride producer. I could pull out more references if you wish. This particular reference was published by, dun dun dahhhhh - Motorola. :)

    Hey, look, a 9-inch thread that is actually producing some informative discussion--go figure.

    EDIT: Not that you are incorrect, in fact, you are quite on the money however there are more than just a few uses for N2O :) What the heck, here is another one: http://ieeexplore.ieee.org/xpl/abs_free.jsp?arNumber=237142

    Ahhhh crap, here's another one, this from IBM: http://www.research.ibm.com/journal/rd/433/ellis.html

    Jack

    I will look at those articles as soon as I get a chance......thanks jack, by the way I'm not a process expert, my job is to make sure the equipment is operating correctly at the right temps, gas flows, and pressure, and of course the damn automation system. Anyways back to work.
  12. are there even moderators on this forum?
  13. 9 inch may not have givien us a great post. He has given us a simple reminder.
    In the real world, the best chips available today, for desktop and server aplications, are made by AMD.
    It seems unlikely that Intel will be able to catch 8 way opteron for the forseable future. That is the reality. There is no smoke nor mirrors involved.
  14. Cough *woodcrest* cough

    Quote:
    Now this is what a call a grand rape from Opteron.
    I hope Intel uses vaseline the next time. :wink:

    http://www.anandtech.com/IT/showdoc.aspx?i=2745

    The Opteron leads the way in every test, which isn't surprising. As we've said in the past the current Xeon is hindered by the front-side bus. Trying to shove a giant beach ball into a basket ball hoop - with thirty other people waiting to try the same thing - has a serious impact on scalability. All of the tests are fairly consistent, and the Opteron averages a 36-51% lead over the Paxville system.

    LOL. 8)
  15. Woodcrest isnt out yet and it'll have a hard time in 8 way configs with the aging fsb. :roll:
  16. Quote:
    Cough *woodcrest* cough


    *COUGH* *COUGH*
    THG's Conclusion

    "At present, Opteron has a commanding lead in 8-way configurations. Looking at the prices of the processors we used, AMD has the advantage there as well. The Xeon MP 3.0 GHz processors currently cost upwards of $3000 each, whereas Opteron 880 are about $1000 less. Of course, for enterprise servers price is less of a concern; performance, scalability, and reliability take precedence. Reliability might be a tie, but that's about as close as Intel's Xeon MP currently comes to Opteron."


    Ok I'll give you that it isnt woodcrest but this time next year AMD will have quadcore 4 socket systems with higher HTT 3.0 specs and FB-DIMM's. Not to mention all of the architectural improvements with K8L. AM2 will supposedly give us quad core as well. Think Intel will make you buy a new motherboard for quad core :roll:
    You bet your ass they will.
  17. Didnt so much mean it would ace it but competition would be better - Pentium M's do well with the old FSB and woodcrest with DIB will do ok till ~2008 with CSI or whatever.

    What i really mean is ANYTHING IS BETTER THEN P4.

    Quote:
    Woodcrest isnt out yet and it'll have a hard time in 8 way configs with the aging fsb. :roll:
  18. Quote:
    "At present, Opteron has a commanding lead in 8-way configurations. Looking at the prices of the processors we used, AMD has the advantage there as well. The Xeon MP 3.0 GHz processors currently cost upwards of $3000 each, whereas Opteron 880 are about $1000 less. Of course, for enterprise servers price is less of a concern; performance, scalability, and reliability take precedence. Reliability might be a tie, but that's about as close as Intel's Xeon MP currently comes to Opteron."


    What does that have to do with woodcrest?

    Quote:
    Ok I'll give you that it isnt woodcrest but this time next year AMD will have quadcore 4 socket systems with higher HTT 3.0 specs and FB-DIMM's. Not to mention all of the architectural improvements with K8L. AM2 will supposedly give us quad core as well. Think Intel will make you buy a new motherboard for quad core Rolling Eyes
    You bet your ass they will.


    Intel isn't going to move forward either? :roll:
  19. Quote:
    "At present, Opteron has a commanding lead in 8-way configurations. Looking at the prices of the processors we used, AMD has the advantage there as well. The Xeon MP 3.0 GHz processors currently cost upwards of $3000 each, whereas Opteron 880 are about $1000 less. Of course, for enterprise servers price is less of a concern; performance, scalability, and reliability take precedence. Reliability might be a tie, but that's about as close as Intel's Xeon MP currently comes to Opteron."


    What does that have to do with woodcrest?

    Quote:
    Ok I'll give you that it isnt woodcrest but this time next year AMD will have quadcore 4 socket systems with higher HTT 3.0 specs and FB-DIMM's. Not to mention all of the architectural improvements with K8L. AM2 will supposedly give us quad core as well. Think Intel will make you buy a new motherboard for quad core Rolling Eyes
    You bet your ass they will.


    Intel isn't going to move forward either? :roll:

    You took it the wrong way. This time next year AMD will have a platform that is already 40% ahead + all of those improvements.
    Conroe is the savior of the dual core world yes because its mighty damn fast and better than anything AMD will have for dual core for @ least a year but because it fits into boards already available on the market designed for netburst already tells me that it was never designed for scaling past 1 core. Intel wanted to go IA64 for MC CPU's and all this sharing FSB DC and soon to be MC solution on SCKT 775 is a hack to keep up with something that was designed for 8 core operation from the getgo.

    And the same can be said about anything bearing the name "Xeon"
  20. Quote:
    What i really mean is ANYTHING IS BETTER THEN P4.


    Goes without saying.

    Quote:
    This time next year AMD will have a platform that is already 40% ahead


    ...of?

    Quote:
    but because it fits into boards already available on the market designed for netburst already tells me that it was never designed for scaling past 1 core.


    Netburst? Well yeah.
  21. Quote:
    Xeon MP 3.0 GHz processors currently cost upwards of $3000 each, whereas Opteron 880 are about $1000 less

    You forget, Intel is going to do a major price cut, on April 23rd. (looks at date) Yup the 23rd is the day to wait for. Intel pricing, mmmm, good honest value.
  22. What AMD needs to do is make the z-ram they will be adding as l3 to K8L as efficient in design as Core's L2 as that IMO is the whole secret behind Conroe and the lot. Its a great architecture for sure but just slapping that cache onto Dothan improved superpi times and numerous other benches by gigantic margins.
  23. Quote:
    Core's L2 as that IMO is the whole secret behind Conroe and the lot.


    :roll: :roll: :roll:

    Quote:
    Its a great architecture for sure but just slapping that cache onto Dothan improved superpi times and numerous other benches by gigantic margins.


    Banias was already good and Dothan also got a good 400mhz speed bump over Banias whilst using less power.
  24. Quote:
    Netburst? Well yeah.

    Exactly they are slapsticking this new chip onto the netburst PLATFORM as Intel never wanted to go multicore x86. The P4 was supposed to be a single beast @ 10ghz someday. AMD has had the platform in place for years now. It wouldnt suprise me the least to see AMD realease some lower-end quad-core chips for socket 940 if it will fit into the thermal specs. And with AMD's .065nm chips supposedly only chewing 1.1V compared to Intel's 1.15 Conroe and alleged o/c'es on 3.8ghz on air with dual core........... :wink:
  25. Quote:
    Exactly they are slapsticking this new chip onto the netburst PLATFORM as Intel never wanted to go multicore x86.


    So? Conroe still wins.
  26. But Yonah is what? Dothan with Intel's NGMA Unified cache thrown on. It improved yonah in super pi by something like 6 seconds clock/clock. Yonah is not a 4 issue core as far as i know so what else would make crunching a certain well known figure to 1 million decimals so much faster all of a sudden? I know it wasnt magic.
  27. Quote:
    Exactly they are slapsticking this new chip onto the netburst PLATFORM as Intel never wanted to go multicore x86.


    So? Conroe still wins.
    You obviously read very thoroughly. I already told you conroe will eat anything else alive for the next 6-12 months in dual core as the platform limitations dont start showing up until the bandwidth starts choking with 4core. Conroe is hungry for bandwidth and will be even more so when code is optomised for it.
  28. Quote:
    But Yonah is what? Dothan with Intel's NGMA Unified cache thrown on. It improved yonah in super pi by something like 6 seconds clock/clock. Yonah is not a 4 issue core as far as i know so what else would make crunching a certain well known figure to 1 million decimals so much faster all of a sudden? I know it wasnt magic.


    SSE got a lot of improvements, there's probably other things but details are thin.
  29. Quote:
    You obviously read very thoroughly. I already told you conroe will eat anything else alive for the next 6-12 months in dual core as the platform limitations dont start showing up until the bandwidth starts choking with 4core. Conroe is hungry for bandwidth and will be even more so when code is optomised for it.


    I did but it was mostly boring. The platform will improve and they will get CSI in like 2008. 45nm should help as well to do proper quad core and increase cache sizes.
  30. Intel is gonna have to start using a superscaler pipelined northbridge soon too keep a 16 core conroe system fed beyond the point of near starvation with that ol' northbridge.
  31. Quote:
    You obviously read very thoroughly. I already told you conroe will eat anything else alive for the next 6-12 months in dual core as the platform limitations dont start showing up until the bandwidth starts choking with 4core. Conroe is hungry for bandwidth and will be even more so when code is optomised for it.


    I did but it was mostly boring. The platform will improve and they will get CSI in like 2008. 45nm should help as well to do proper quad core and increase cache sizes.
    So in otherwords they will be using their manufacturing muscle(made possible by years of anticompetative buisness practises as proven already in the japan suit) to make up for their platforms shortcomings?
  32. Seriously dont get me wrong i'm all for conroe as its gonna be killer for DC chips will will tide most people over for @ least another few years. AMD is gonna be very competative in the superhighend quad-core and even more so in the server area even with what they've got right now.
  33. Quote:
    So in otherwords they will be using their manufacturing muscle


    You'd prefer they did nothing instead?

    Quote:
    (made possible by years of anticompetative buisness practises as proven already in the japan suit)


    Yes, that is the sole reason. :roll:

    Quote:
    to make up for their platforms shortcomings?


    Till CSI, yeah. Again you'd prefer they do nothing at all? What would you prefer they do?
  34. Wusy have you seen the performance of MM over @ XS's dual socket dual core opty's o/ced to over 3.2ghz? We'll have that from 1 chip sooner that anyone thinks. And any home user that relly wants to show off something big could simply get a dual socket quad core K8L setup that'll surely spank a conroe box.
  35. Quote:
    Now this is what a call a grand rape from Opteron.
    I hope Intel uses vaseline the next time.


    Intel will finally have something to sue AMD over now... Statutory Rape... I hear it's a good 5-7 years in prison for that shit :lol:
  36. HP is offering woodcrest 4 cores workstation to the first of june. When it arrives you can compare it workstation with the Opteron equivalent.
  37. This is indeed an impressive showing by an 8-way Opteron system. I'm curious why Anandtech choose to do this article now, months and months after these systems have been on the market.

    There were no surprises here. Perhaps they are setting up a follow on article featuring Woodcrest, or a HyperTransport 3.0 enabled Opteron system, now that would be news!
  38. Quote:
    Cough *woodcrest* cough


    As far as I know, dual FSB cannot help Woodcrest against Opteron in 4-way configurations and up. :lol:
  39. Quote:
    Didnt so much mean it would ace it but competition would be better - Pentium M's do well with the old FSB and woodcrest with DIB will do ok till ~2008 with CSI or whatever.

    What i really mean is ANYTHING IS BETTER THEN P4.

    Woodcrest isnt out yet and it'll have a hard time in 8 way configs with the aging fsb. :roll:
    Apache have you forgotten how k8 was beating the p4 and yet you still stood by them telling me it was better? that was 2 months ago and now your dissing the p4 cause of conroe(geez people can change) and ycon why all of a sudden all this gloating? Did'nt you also diss the k8 but had no proof that prescott was better? What i'm trying to say is that intel fanboys have stood by netburst for a long time and now that conroe benchies are out there on the offensive! What if k10 comes out and creams conroe? What if Amd creates k10 as a 5 issue core with Ht 3.0 and ddr3 quad core and it creams conroe at same speed? What if they are even i mean completely even would all this fanboyism stop on the forumz?
  40. How fast will woodcrest be anyway? I know it's mainly being intro'd so intel has something running a bit cooler in the server end.
  41. Quote:

    cookie monster!!!! :D:D
    ok... maybe that's not what you meant XD
  42. WTF 8O

    Quote:
    Didnt so much mean it would ace it but competition would be better - Pentium M's do well with the old FSB and woodcrest with DIB will do ok till ~2008 with CSI or whatever.

    What i really mean is ANYTHING IS BETTER THEN P4.

    Woodcrest isnt out yet and it'll have a hard time in 8 way configs with the aging fsb. :roll:
    Apache have you forgotten how k8 was beating the p4 and yet you still stood by them telling me it was better? that was 2 months ago and now your dissing the p4 cause of conroe(geez people can change) and ycon why all of a sudden all this gloating? Did'nt you also diss the k8 but had no proof that prescott was better? What i'm trying to say is that intel fanboys have stood by netburst for a long time and now that conroe benchies are out there on the offensive! What if k10 comes out and creams conroe? What if Amd creates k10 as a 5 issue core with Ht 3.0 and ddr3 quad core and it creams conroe at same speed? What if they are even i mean completely even would all this fanboyism stop on the forumz?
  43. Quote:
    WTF 8O

    Didnt so much mean it would ace it but competition would be better - Pentium M's do well with the old FSB and woodcrest with DIB will do ok till ~2008 with CSI or whatever.

    What i really mean is ANYTHING IS BETTER THEN P4.

    Woodcrest isnt out yet and it'll have a hard time in 8 way configs with the aging fsb. :roll:
    Apache have you forgotten how k8 was beating the p4 and yet you still stood by them telling me it was better? that was 2 months ago and now your dissing the p4 cause of conroe(geez people can change) and ycon why all of a sudden all this gloating? Did'nt you also diss the k8 but had no proof that prescott was better? What i'm trying to say is that intel fanboys have stood by netburst for a long time and now that conroe benchies are out there on the offensive! What if k10 comes out and creams conroe? What if Amd creates k10 as a 5 issue core with Ht 3.0 and ddr3 quad core and it creams conroe at same speed? What if they are even i mean completely even would all this fanboyism stop on the forumz?
    i think he read the sentence backward... :twisted:
  44. Quote:
    Woodcrest isnt out yet and it'll have a hard time in 8 way configs with the aging fsb. :roll:

    you know what puzzles me?
    intel obviously knew that P-D was not as successful as it may had hoped, due to its "double-core" architecture.

    and intel decided to release quad core kentsfield, with exactly the same setup...

    mind explaining that? :twisted:
  45. Quote:



    Word.
  46. Quote:
    Cough *woodcrest* cough


    *COUGH* *COUGH*
    THG's Conclusion

    "At present, Opteron has a commanding lead in 8-way configurations. Looking at the prices of the processors we used, AMD has the advantage there as well. The Xeon MP 3.0 GHz processors currently cost upwards of $3000 each, whereas Opteron 880 are about $1000 less. Of course, for enterprise servers price is less of a concern; performance, scalability, and reliability take precedence. Reliability might be a tie, but that's about as close as Intel's Xeon MP currently comes to Opteron."


    Ok I'll give you that it isnt woodcrest but this time next year AMD will have quadcore 4 socket systems with higher HTT 3.0 specs and FB-DIMM's. Not to mention all of the architectural improvements with K8L. AM2 will supposedly give us quad core as well. Think Intel will make you buy a new motherboard for quad core :roll:
    You bet your ass they will.

    Kinda like how AMD is makeing you all buy a new boards for DDR2.
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