KB891711 -- Any resolution yet?

Archived from groups: microsoft.public.win98.gen_discussion (More info?)

Well, it's been over a month since Microsoft unleashed this t*rd of an
update. After 20+ years of using computers (but still a novice at how
they work at the system level) this is the worst computer disaster I
have ever encountered. It is a classic case of “the operation
succeeded, but the patient died,” complete with blue screens. Before I
went out of town for three weeks, I spent more than 50 hours trying to
figure out what was wrong. While out of town I discovered this
newsgroup, and spent more hours pouring over more than 5,000 posts. I
definitely feel sorry for users, like my mom, aged 89, who would not
know a newsgroup from a browser but who might trust that Microsoft's own
Critical Updates would do no harm.

From these posts I learned:
1) The fix is to uninstall KB891711. I did, and everything returned to
normal on the next reboot.

But most questions and suggestions about the cause were never resolved
as far as I could see:
2) The problem seems to affect mostly dial up connections (like mine);
but some cable connections have problems too.
3) The problem may be related to video cards or lack of them (like mine,
I think).
4) The problem may be related to other installed hardware and/or
software not yet identified.
5) The problem is not exclusive to IE, but also affects Netscape and
Firefox machines (like mine).
6) The upgrade may or may not even be needed in Windows 98, depending on
whether you believe what Microsoft initially wrote or what some of its
employees are now saying.
7) Microsoft is aware of the problems and was close to being able to
duplicate them about three weeks ago.

One last thing I have definitely learned from this fiasco is not to
trust Microsoft Updates, no matter how “critical” they are labeled.

My bottom line question is whether there has been any solution yet?

Paul in San Francisco
29 answers Last reply
More about kb891711 resolution
  1. Archived from groups: microsoft.public.win98.gen_discussion (More info?)

    Consider reading some of the ongoing, related threads here, Paul.

    See this recent post here from MS:
    http://groups-beta.google.com/group/microsoft.public.security/msg/399ff690be41f455

    1. Uninstall 891711.

    2. Call 1-866-PCSAFETY and indicate that you are having issues with a
    security update.
    --
    ~Robear Dyer (PA Bear)
    MS MVP-Windows (Shell, IE/OE) & Security

    Mastering Newsgroups in Outlook Express
    http://www.microsoft.com/windows/ie/community/columns/newsgroups.mspx


    Paul M wrote:
    > Well, it's been over a month since Microsoft unleashed this t*rd of an
    > update. After 20+ years of using computers (but still a novice at how
    > they work at the system level) this is the worst computer disaster I
    > have ever encountered. It is a classic case of "the operation
    > succeeded, but the patient died," complete with blue screens. Before I
    > went out of town for three weeks, I spent more than 50 hours trying to
    > figure out what was wrong. While out of town I discovered this
    > newsgroup, and spent more hours pouring over more than 5,000 posts. I
    > definitely feel sorry for users, like my mom, aged 89, who would not
    > know a newsgroup from a browser but who might trust that Microsoft's own
    > Critical Updates would do no harm.
    >
    > From these posts I learned:
    > 1) The fix is to uninstall KB891711. I did, and everything returned to
    > normal on the next reboot.
    >
    > But most questions and suggestions about the cause were never resolved
    > as far as I could see:
    > 2) The problem seems to affect mostly dial up connections (like mine);
    > but some cable connections have problems too.
    > 3) The problem may be related to video cards or lack of them (like mine,
    > I think).
    > 4) The problem may be related to other installed hardware and/or
    > software not yet identified.
    > 5) The problem is not exclusive to IE, but also affects Netscape and
    > Firefox machines (like mine).
    > 6) The upgrade may or may not even be needed in Windows 98, depending on
    > whether you believe what Microsoft initially wrote or what some of its
    > employees are now saying.
    > 7) Microsoft is aware of the problems and was close to being able to
    > duplicate them about three weeks ago.
    >
    > One last thing I have definitely learned from this fiasco is not to
    > trust Microsoft Updates, no matter how "critical" they are labeled.
    >
    > My bottom line question is whether there has been any solution yet?
    >
    > Paul in San Francisco
  2. Archived from groups: microsoft.public.win98.gen_discussion (More info?)

    PA Bear wrote:
    > Consider reading some of the ongoing, related threads here, Paul.

    As I said in my original post, I read 5000+ other posts in this group
    before posting here.

    > See this recent post here from MS:
    > http://groups-beta.google.com/group/microsoft.public.security/msg/399ff690be41f455

    This tells me that as of 3/25/05 Microsoft was still working on it.
    Hence, my question stands: any resolution yet?

    Paul in San Francisco
  3. Archived from groups: microsoft.public.win98.gen_discussion (More info?)

    Have you called 1-866-PCSAFETY?

    We need users having problems with 891711 to contact MS so (1) they can
    figure out in what environment(s) the patch causes problems and (2) then fix
    it. IOW we need /your/ help.
    --
    ~PA Bear

    Paul M wrote:
    > PA Bear wrote:
    > > Consider reading some of the ongoing, related threads here, Paul.
    >
    > As I said in my original post, I read 5000+ other posts in this group
    > before posting here.
    >
    > > See this recent post here from MS:
    > > http://groups-beta.google.com/group/microsoft.public.security/msg/399ff690be41f455
    >
    > This tells me that as of 3/25/05 Microsoft was still working on it.
    > Hence, my question stands: any resolution yet?
    >
    > Paul in San Francisco
  4. Archived from groups: microsoft.public.win98.gen_discussion (More info?)

    "PA Bear" <PABearMVP@gmail.com> wrote in message
    news:OTr2mCkPFHA.2748@TK2MSFTNGP09.phx.gbl...
    > Have you called 1-866-PCSAFETY?
    >
    > We need users having problems with 891711 to contact MS so (1) they can
    > figure out in what environment(s) the patch causes problems and (2) then
    fix
    > it. IOW we need /your/ help.
    > --
    > ~PA Bear
    >

    Just thought I'd throw this out there: in addition to users having problems,
    would there be any benefit to users NOT having problems to call
    1-866-PCSAFETY? At least MS would have a more complete picture of what
    configs DO and DON'T have the 891711 problems. Perhaps that would help them
    narrow down the precise _conditions_ for the 891711 problems: i.e.,
    "everyone who's NOT having problems does NOT have file sharing on"...or
    "everyone who's NOT having problems is NOT on dialup, and/or not running a
    software firewall...". Just a thought.

    I'm not having any problems with it (knocks on wood), and haven't called.


    F
  5. Archived from groups: microsoft.public.win98.gen_discussion (More info?)

    Yeah, call them. Maybe after enough calls, they will get a better picture. The
    last info I have heard re: the issue was that those testing at MS had been able to
    reproduce the problem. I do not know if they have enough input yet to determine
    *which* factors are cauing the problem, though.
    --
    Glen Ventura, MS MVP Shell/User, A+
    http://dts-l.org/goodpost.htm
    http://www.microsoft.com/communities/conduct/default.mspx

    "Fr@nk" <fr@apaNOSP@AMwizard.net> wrote in message
    news:_Yl6e.4230$d43.4029@lakeread03...
    >
    > "PA Bear" <PABearMVP@gmail.com> wrote in message
    > news:OTr2mCkPFHA.2748@TK2MSFTNGP09.phx.gbl...
    > > Have you called 1-866-PCSAFETY?
    > >
    > > We need users having problems with 891711 to contact MS so (1) they can
    > > figure out in what environment(s) the patch causes problems and (2) then
    > fix
    > > it. IOW we need /your/ help.
    > > --
    > > ~PA Bear
    > >
    >
    > Just thought I'd throw this out there: in addition to users having problems,
    > would there be any benefit to users NOT having problems to call
    > 1-866-PCSAFETY? At least MS would have a more complete picture of what
    > configs DO and DON'T have the 891711 problems. Perhaps that would help them
    > narrow down the precise _conditions_ for the 891711 problems: i.e.,
    > "everyone who's NOT having problems does NOT have file sharing on"...or
    > "everyone who's NOT having problems is NOT on dialup, and/or not running a
    > software firewall...". Just a thought.
    >
    > I'm not having any problems with it (knocks on wood), and haven't called.
    >
    >
    > F
    >
    >
    >
    >
  6. Archived from groups: microsoft.public.win98.gen_discussion (More info?)

    "Paul M" <pmr921@yahoo.com> wrote in message
    news:etICJzgPFHA.904@tk2msftngp13.phx.gbl...
    > > My bottom line question is whether there has been any solution yet?
    >
    > Paul in San Francisco

    I downloaded that update. It shows in msconfig startup. I have not had
    any problems with it, whatsoever.

    Regards,
    Emrys Davies.
  7. Archived from groups: microsoft.public.win98.gen_discussion (More info?)

    Emrys Davies wrote:
    > "Paul M" <pmr921@yahoo.com> wrote in message
    > news:etICJzgPFHA.904@tk2msftngp13.phx.gbl...
    >
    >>>My bottom line question is whether there has been any solution yet?
    >>
    >>Paul in San Francisco
    >
    >
    > I downloaded that update. It shows in msconfig startup. I have not had
    > any problems with it, whatsoever.
    >
    > Regards,
    > Emrys Davies.
    >
    >
    Well, you are obviously one of the lucky ones. But many others who have
    posted here in the past month are still looking for a way to keep our
    computers secure AND running at the same time.
    Paul in San Francisco
  8. Archived from groups: microsoft.public.win98.gen_discussion (More info?)

    "Emrys Davies" <me@privacy.net> wrote in message news:3btp7pF6k3iv3U1@individual.net...
    >
    > "Paul M" <pmr921@yahoo.com> wrote in message
    > news:etICJzgPFHA.904@tk2msftngp13.phx.gbl...
    > > > My bottom line question is whether there has been any solution yet?
    > >
    > > Paul in San Francisco
    >
    > I downloaded that update. It shows in msconfig startup. I have not had
    > any problems with it, whatsoever.
    >

    Well, I've had a few problems with kb891711.exe conflicting
    with other software:-.

    With Etrust Firewall 3.7x - the ZoneAlarm Pro version, the PC would
    hang when the firewall's User Interface loaded. Removing the kb891711
    start-up entry and running after Etrust (ZAP) had fully loaded got around
    this and didn't cause any subsequent problem. I've since switched to the
    latest ZoneAlarm Free which works fine with kb891711 running at
    start-up.

    I still get problems with A-squared anti-trojan www.emsisoft.com :
    After running the online update program and checking for updates,
    running IE causes a BSOD (Fatal Error 06 0000:0000FA00 )
    killing kb891711 (or rebooting) allows IE to run without an error.


    Also I've noticed that when I log off Windows then kb891711.exe
    terminates and doesn't restart when I log back on.(I often have to
    do this to unfreeze the desktop after deleting files -an old problem).
  9. Archived from groups: microsoft.public.win98.gen_discussion (More info?)

    One last thing I have definitely learned from this fiasco is not to
    trust Microsoft Updates, no matter how “critical” they are labeled.

    > My bottom line question is whether there has been any solution yet?
    >
    > Paul in San Francisco

    Paul in cisco.......
    I Agree with you 110%.
    I dont trust them at all.
    I have minimal "so called Updates" on my comp', and my comp'
    runs better than any ppls here.
    Every time I read a post in this group regarding someone who went
    and did an update from m/s, their post is always filled with the
    problems that followed........ never a perfect transition, always
    a problem.

    janey
  10. Archived from groups: microsoft.public.win98.gen_discussion (More info?)

    The fact is that a very small minority of people have trouble with updates, and that
    is often due to interference from background apps during installation. The vast
    majority of users who update have no problem whatsoever, and you simply don't see
    any reports in the newsgroups saying "I updated and I had no problem". Why would
    anyone post to report "nothing"? People only report problems, not successes. I
    have done countless updates on innumerable systems and have yet to have a problem
    with almost any of them.
    --
    Glen Ventura, MS MVP Shell/User, A+
    http://dts-l.org/goodpost.htm
    http://www.microsoft.com/communities/conduct/default.mspx


    "jane" <jane@internet.com> wrote in message
    news:Owzt%23eqPFHA.248@TK2MSFTNGP15.phx.gbl...
    > One last thing I have definitely learned from this fiasco is not to
    > trust Microsoft Updates, no matter how "critical" they are labeled.
    >
    > > My bottom line question is whether there has been any solution yet?
    > >
    > > Paul in San Francisco
    >
    > Paul in cisco.......
    > I Agree with you 110%.
    > I dont trust them at all.
    > I have minimal "so called Updates" on my comp', and my comp'
    > runs better than any ppls here.
    > Every time I read a post in this group regarding someone who went
    > and did an update from m/s, their post is always filled with the
    > problems that followed........ never a perfect transition, always
    > a problem.
    >
    > janey
    >
    >
  11. Archived from groups: microsoft.public.win98.gen_discussion (More info?)

    I have never had a problem with any Windows Updates.
    If you go to that group, you will see the problems some people experience after each is released. After awhile you will be able to determine the most common causes of failures for yourself.
    --
    mae

    "jane" <jane@internet.com> wrote in message news:Owzt%23eqPFHA.248@TK2MSFTNGP15.phx.gbl...
    | One last thing I have definitely learned from this fiasco is not to
    | trust Microsoft Updates, no matter how “critical” they are labeled.
    |
    | > My bottom line question is whether there has been any solution yet?
    | >
    | > Paul in San Francisco
    |
    | Paul in cisco.......
    | I Agree with you 110%.
    | I dont trust them at all.
    | I have minimal "so called Updates" on my comp', and my comp'
    | runs better than any ppls here.
    | Every time I read a post in this group regarding someone who went
    | and did an update from m/s, their post is always filled with the
    | problems that followed........ never a perfect transition, always
    | a problem.
    |
    | janey
    |
    |
  12. Archived from groups: microsoft.public.win98.gen_discussion (More info?)

    Robear see my post as to why KB891711 is critical to security. It also talks
    about the critical vulnerability in the April issue of PC Today. Have a
    great day, Robear.
    <smile>

    "PA Bear" wrote:

    > Consider reading some of the ongoing, related threads here, Paul.
    >
    > See this recent post here from MS:
    > http://groups-beta.google.com/group/microsoft.public.security/msg/399ff690be41f455
    >
    > 1. Uninstall 891711.
    >
    > 2. Call 1-866-PCSAFETY and indicate that you are having issues with a
    > security update.
    > --
    > ~Robear Dyer (PA Bear)
    > MS MVP-Windows (Shell, IE/OE) & Security
    >
    > Mastering Newsgroups in Outlook Express
    > http://www.microsoft.com/windows/ie/community/columns/newsgroups.mspx
    >
    >
    > Paul M wrote:
    > > Well, it's been over a month since Microsoft unleashed this t*rd of an
    > > update. After 20+ years of using computers (but still a novice at how
    > > they work at the system level) this is the worst computer disaster I
    > > have ever encountered. It is a classic case of "the operation
    > > succeeded, but the patient died," complete with blue screens. Before I
    > > went out of town for three weeks, I spent more than 50 hours trying to
    > > figure out what was wrong. While out of town I discovered this
    > > newsgroup, and spent more hours pouring over more than 5,000 posts. I
    > > definitely feel sorry for users, like my mom, aged 89, who would not
    > > know a newsgroup from a browser but who might trust that Microsoft's own
    > > Critical Updates would do no harm.
    > >
    > > From these posts I learned:
    > > 1) The fix is to uninstall KB891711. I did, and everything returned to
    > > normal on the next reboot.
    > >
    > > But most questions and suggestions about the cause were never resolved
    > > as far as I could see:
    > > 2) The problem seems to affect mostly dial up connections (like mine);
    > > but some cable connections have problems too.
    > > 3) The problem may be related to video cards or lack of them (like mine,
    > > I think).
    > > 4) The problem may be related to other installed hardware and/or
    > > software not yet identified.
    > > 5) The problem is not exclusive to IE, but also affects Netscape and
    > > Firefox machines (like mine).
    > > 6) The upgrade may or may not even be needed in Windows 98, depending on
    > > whether you believe what Microsoft initially wrote or what some of its
    > > employees are now saying.
    > > 7) Microsoft is aware of the problems and was close to being able to
    > > duplicate them about three weeks ago.
    > >
    > > One last thing I have definitely learned from this fiasco is not to
    > > trust Microsoft Updates, no matter how "critical" they are labeled.
    > >
    > > My bottom line question is whether there has been any solution yet?
    > >
    > > Paul in San Francisco
    >
    >
  13. Archived from groups: microsoft.public.win98.gen_discussion (More info?)

    Exactly, Glen. I am happy to say KB891711 works great on my machine but it
    still dows seem odd to have it as a running task. :o

    "glee" wrote:

    > The fact is that a very small minority of people have trouble with updates, and that
    > is often due to interference from background apps during installation. The vast
    > majority of users who update have no problem whatsoever, and you simply don't see
    > any reports in the newsgroups saying "I updated and I had no problem". Why would
    > anyone post to report "nothing"? People only report problems, not successes. I
    > have done countless updates on innumerable systems and have yet to have a problem
    > with almost any of them.
    > --
    > Glen Ventura, MS MVP Shell/User, A+
    > http://dts-l.org/goodpost.htm
    > http://www.microsoft.com/communities/conduct/default.mspx
    >
    >
    > "jane" <jane@internet.com> wrote in message
    > news:Owzt%23eqPFHA.248@TK2MSFTNGP15.phx.gbl...
    > > One last thing I have definitely learned from this fiasco is not to
    > > trust Microsoft Updates, no matter how "critical" they are labeled.
    > >
    > > > My bottom line question is whether there has been any solution yet?
    > > >
    > > > Paul in San Francisco
    > >
    > > Paul in cisco.......
    > > I Agree with you 110%.
    > > I dont trust them at all.
    > > I have minimal "so called Updates" on my comp', and my comp'
    > > runs better than any ppls here.
    > > Every time I read a post in this group regarding someone who went
    > > and did an update from m/s, their post is always filled with the
    > > problems that followed........ never a perfect transition, always
    > > a problem.
    > >
    > > janey
    > >
    > >
    >
    >
  14. Archived from groups: microsoft.public.win98.gen_discussion (More info?)

    Mae, in your opinion is a lack of user expertise the most common cause of
    failure of these Microsoft updates? <no offense anyone, I am just curious>
    Thanks mae and have a good day!

    "mae" wrote:

    > I have never had a problem with any Windows Updates.
    > If you go to that group, you will see the problems some people experience after each is released. After awhile you will be able to determine the most common causes of failures for yourself.
    > --
    > mae
    >
    > "jane" <jane@internet.com> wrote in message news:Owzt%23eqPFHA.248@TK2MSFTNGP15.phx.gbl...
    > | One last thing I have definitely learned from this fiasco is not to
    > | trust Microsoft Updates, no matter how “critical� they are labeled.
    > |
    > | > My bottom line question is whether there has been any solution yet?
    > | >
    > | > Paul in San Francisco
    > |
    > | Paul in cisco.......
    > | I Agree with you 110%.
    > | I dont trust them at all.
    > | I have minimal "so called Updates" on my comp', and my comp'
    > | runs better than any ppls here.
    > | Every time I read a post in this group regarding someone who went
    > | and did an update from m/s, their post is always filled with the
    > | problems that followed........ never a perfect transition, always
    > | a problem.
    > |
    > | janey
    > |
    > |
    >
  15. Archived from groups: microsoft.public.win98.gen_discussion (More info?)

    The word I have this morning is that the patch was *just* re-released for Win9x....I
    assume with a fix for the reported problems.
    --
    Glen Ventura, MS MVP Shell/User, A+
    http://dts-l.org/goodpost.htm
    http://www.microsoft.com/communities/conduct/default.mspx


    "Paul M" <pmr921@yahoo.com> wrote in message
    news:eoQ9pojPFHA.3356@TK2MSFTNGP12.phx.gbl...
    > PA Bear wrote:
    > > Consider reading some of the ongoing, related threads here, Paul.
    >
    > As I said in my original post, I read 5000+ other posts in this group
    > before posting here.
    >
    > > See this recent post here from MS:
    > >
    http://groups-beta.google.com/group/microsoft.public.security/msg/399ff690be41f455
    >
    > This tells me that as of 3/25/05 Microsoft was still working on it.
    > Hence, my question stands: any resolution yet?
    >
    > Paul in San Francisco
  16. Archived from groups: microsoft.public.win98.gen_discussion (More info?)

    Yes! See "891711/MS05-002 Updated (fixed) for Win9x" in this newsgroup.
    --
    ~Robear Dyer (PA Bear)
    MS MVP-Windows (Shell, IE/OE) & Security

    Mastering Newsgroups in Outlook Express
    http://www.microsoft.com/windows/ie/community/columns/newsgroups.mspx
  17. Archived from groups: microsoft.public.win98.gen_discussion (More info?)

    "PA Bear" <PABearMVP@gmail.com> wrote in message
    news:%23J7DjK5PFHA.3560@TK2MSFTNGP14.phx.gbl...
    > Yes! See "891711/MS05-002 Updated (fixed) for Win9x" in this newsgroup.
    > --
    > ~Robear Dyer (PA Bear)
    > MS MVP-Windows (Shell, IE/OE) & Security
    >
    > Mastering Newsgroups in Outlook Express
    > http://www.microsoft.com/windows/ie/community/columns/newsgroups.mspx

    thks PA!
  18. Archived from groups: microsoft.public.win98.gen_discussion (More info?)

    Thanks Robear. That is what I was thinking too but I wanted a confirmation
    from an expert. <smile>

    "PA Bear" wrote:

    > Yes! See "891711/MS05-002 Updated (fixed) for Win9x" in this newsgroup.
    > --
    > ~Robear Dyer (PA Bear)
    > MS MVP-Windows (Shell, IE/OE) & Security
    >
    > Mastering Newsgroups in Outlook Express
    > http://www.microsoft.com/windows/ie/community/columns/newsgroups.mspx
    >
  19. Archived from groups: microsoft.public.win98.gen_discussion (More info?)

    Third party.
    --
    mae

    "Dan" <Dan@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in message
    news:83E00AE9-07F7-4660-BC57-89B72425A3D4@microsoft.com...
    | Mae, in your opinion is a lack of user expertise the most common cause of
    | failure of these Microsoft updates? <no offense anyone, I am just
    curious>
    | Thanks mae and have a good day!
    |
    | "mae" wrote:
    |
    | > I have never had a problem with any Windows Updates.
    | > If you go to that group, you will see the problems some people
    experience after each is released. After awhile you will be able to
    determine the most common causes of failures for yourself.
    | > --
    | > mae
    | >
    | > "jane" <jane@internet.com> wrote in message
    news:Owzt%23eqPFHA.248@TK2MSFTNGP15.phx.gbl...
    | > | One last thing I have definitely learned from this fiasco is not to
    | > | trust Microsoft Updates, no matter how “critical� they are labeled.
    | > |
    | > | > My bottom line question is whether there has been any solution yet?
    | > | >
    | > | > Paul in San Francisco
    | > |
    | > | Paul in cisco.......
    | > | I Agree with you 110%.
    | > | I dont trust them at all.
    | > | I have minimal "so called Updates" on my comp', and my comp'
    | > | runs better than any ppls here.
    | > | Every time I read a post in this group regarding someone who went
    | > | and did an update from m/s, their post is always filled with the
    | > | problems that followed........ never a perfect transition, always
    | > | a problem.
    | > |
    | > | janey
    | > |
    | > |
    | >
  20. Archived from groups: microsoft.public.win98.gen_discussion (More info?)

    Thats rubbish I too had vowed never to do another 'update' again
    however I lapsed for some reason and that update screwed my machine.

    In fact the reason I lapsed is that another fault in windows set my
    homepage to microshit windows update and like a fool I clicked
    auto update.

    The updates prior to that have always introduced some
    detramental effect.

    Think I will go back to my instalation disk and remove all updates.

    The fast majoriy of people don't update their machines for obvious
    reasons ie they like their computer to *work*.


    "glee" <glee29@spamindspring.com> wrote in message
    news:uPlLwIsPFHA.3076@TK2MSFTNGP14.phx.gbl...
    > The fact is that a very small minority of people have trouble with
    updates, and that
    > is often due to interference from background apps during installation.
    The vast
    > majority of users who update have no problem whatsoever, and you simply
    don't see
    > any reports in the newsgroups saying "I updated and I had no problem".
    Why would
    > anyone post to report "nothing"? People only report problems, not
    successes. I
    > have done countless updates on innumerable systems and have yet to have a
    problem
    > with almost any of them.
    > --
    > Glen Ventura, MS MVP Shell/User, A+
    > http://dts-l.org/goodpost.htm
    > http://www.microsoft.com/communities/conduct/default.mspx
    >
    >
    > "jane" <jane@internet.com> wrote in message
    > news:Owzt%23eqPFHA.248@TK2MSFTNGP15.phx.gbl...
    > > One last thing I have definitely learned from this fiasco is not to
    > > trust Microsoft Updates, no matter how "critical" they are labeled.
    > >
    > > > My bottom line question is whether there has been any solution yet?
    > > >
    > > > Paul in San Francisco
    > >
    > > Paul in cisco.......
    > > I Agree with you 110%.
    > > I dont trust them at all.
    > > I have minimal "so called Updates" on my comp', and my comp'
    > > runs better than any ppls here.
    > > Every time I read a post in this group regarding someone who went
    > > and did an update from m/s, their post is always filled with the
    > > problems that followed........ never a perfect transition, always
    > > a problem.
    > >
    > > janey
    > >
    > >
    >
  21. Archived from groups: microsoft.public.win98.gen_discussion (More info?)

    Now THAT'S rubbish!
    Just what these groups need...another Troll.
    --
    Glen Ventura, MS MVP Shell/User, A+
    http://dts-l.org/goodpost.htm
    http://www.microsoft.com/communities/conduct/default.mspx

    "Donald McTrevor" <me@privacy.net> wrote in message
    news:B6Bae.3972$wu2.1309@newsfe1-gui.ntli.net...
    > Thats rubbish I too had vowed never to do another 'update' again
    > however I lapsed for some reason and that update screwed my machine.
    >
    > In fact the reason I lapsed is that another fault in windows set my
    > homepage to microshit windows update and like a fool I clicked
    > auto update.
    >
    > The updates prior to that have always introduced some
    > detramental effect.
    >
    > Think I will go back to my instalation disk and remove all updates.
    >
    > The fast majoriy of people don't update their machines for obvious
    > reasons ie they like their computer to *work*.
    >
    >
    >
    >
    > "glee" <glee29@spamindspring.com> wrote in message
    > news:uPlLwIsPFHA.3076@TK2MSFTNGP14.phx.gbl...
    > > The fact is that a very small minority of people have trouble with
    > updates, and that
    > > is often due to interference from background apps during installation.
    > The vast
    > > majority of users who update have no problem whatsoever, and you simply
    > don't see
    > > any reports in the newsgroups saying "I updated and I had no problem".
    > Why would
    > > anyone post to report "nothing"? People only report problems, not
    > successes. I
    > > have done countless updates on innumerable systems and have yet to have a
    > problem
    > > with almost any of them.
    > > --
    > > Glen Ventura, MS MVP Shell/User, A+
    > > http://dts-l.org/goodpost.htm
    > > http://www.microsoft.com/communities/conduct/default.mspx
    > >
    > >
    > > "jane" <jane@internet.com> wrote in message
    > > news:Owzt%23eqPFHA.248@TK2MSFTNGP15.phx.gbl...
    > > > One last thing I have definitely learned from this fiasco is not to
    > > > trust Microsoft Updates, no matter how "critical" they are labeled.
    > > >
    > > > > My bottom line question is whether there has been any solution yet?
    > > > >
    > > > > Paul in San Francisco
    > > >
    > > > Paul in cisco.......
    > > > I Agree with you 110%.
    > > > I dont trust them at all.
    > > > I have minimal "so called Updates" on my comp', and my comp'
    > > > runs better than any ppls here.
    > > > Every time I read a post in this group regarding someone who went
    > > > and did an update from m/s, their post is always filled with the
    > > > problems that followed........ never a perfect transition, always
    > > > a problem.
    > > >
    > > > janey
    > > >
    > > >
    > >
    >
    >
  22. Archived from groups: microsoft.public.win98.gen_discussion (More info?)

    Rich words coming from the mouth of an arse-licker.

    "glee" <glee29@spamindspring.com> wrote in message
    news:%23iNf5zISFHA.204@TK2MSFTNGP15.phx.gbl...
    > Now THAT'S rubbish!
    > Just what these groups need...another Troll.
    > --
    > Glen Ventura, MS MVP Shell/User, A+
    > http://dts-l.org/goodpost.htm
    > http://www.microsoft.com/communities/conduct/default.mspx
    >
    > "Donald McTrevor" <me@privacy.net> wrote in message
    > news:B6Bae.3972$wu2.1309@newsfe1-gui.ntli.net...
    > > Thats rubbish I too had vowed never to do another 'update' again
    > > however I lapsed for some reason and that update screwed my machine.
    > >
    > > In fact the reason I lapsed is that another fault in windows set my
    > > homepage to microshit windows update and like a fool I clicked
    > > auto update.
    > >
    > > The updates prior to that have always introduced some
    > > detramental effect.
    > >
    > > Think I will go back to my instalation disk and remove all updates.
    > >
    > > The fast majoriy of people don't update their machines for obvious
    > > reasons ie they like their computer to *work*.
    > >
    > >
    > >
    > >
    > > "glee" <glee29@spamindspring.com> wrote in message
    > > news:uPlLwIsPFHA.3076@TK2MSFTNGP14.phx.gbl...
    > > > The fact is that a very small minority of people have trouble with
    > > updates, and that
    > > > is often due to interference from background apps during installation.
    > > The vast
    > > > majority of users who update have no problem whatsoever, and you
    simply
    > > don't see
    > > > any reports in the newsgroups saying "I updated and I had no problem".
    > > Why would
    > > > anyone post to report "nothing"? People only report problems, not
    > > successes. I
    > > > have done countless updates on innumerable systems and have yet to
    have a
    > > problem
    > > > with almost any of them.
    > > > --
    > > > Glen Ventura, MS MVP Shell/User, A+
    > > > http://dts-l.org/goodpost.htm
    > > > http://www.microsoft.com/communities/conduct/default.mspx
    > > >
    > > >
    > > > "jane" <jane@internet.com> wrote in message
    > > > news:Owzt%23eqPFHA.248@TK2MSFTNGP15.phx.gbl...
    > > > > One last thing I have definitely learned from this fiasco is not to
    > > > > trust Microsoft Updates, no matter how "critical" they are labeled.
    > > > >
    > > > > > My bottom line question is whether there has been any solution
    yet?
    > > > > >
    > > > > > Paul in San Francisco
    > > > >
    > > > > Paul in cisco.......
    > > > > I Agree with you 110%.
    > > > > I dont trust them at all.
    > > > > I have minimal "so called Updates" on my comp', and my comp'
    > > > > runs better than any ppls here.
    > > > > Every time I read a post in this group regarding someone who went
    > > > > and did an update from m/s, their post is always filled with the
    > > > > problems that followed........ never a perfect transition,
    always
    > > > > a problem.
    > > > >
    > > > > janey
    > > > >
    > > > >
    > > >
    > >
    > >
    >
  23. Archived from groups: microsoft.public.win98.gen_discussion (More info?)

    I beg your pardon? I QUOTE Glee in many a Master Post, even against his
    own objections! Some day soon you 'n Colorado surely will slip on a
    banana peel & go sliding off Mt. Vesuvius!


    --
    Thanks or Good Luck,
    There may be humor in this post, and,
    Naturally, you will not sue,
    should things get worse after this,
    PCR
    pcrrcp@netzero.net
    "Donald McTrevor" <me@privacy.net> wrote in message
    news:DzPae.5008$Y46.3212@newsfe1-win.ntli.net...
    | Rich words coming from the mouth of an arse-licker.
    |
    | "glee" <glee29@spamindspring.com> wrote in message
    | news:%23iNf5zISFHA.204@TK2MSFTNGP15.phx.gbl...
    | > Now THAT'S rubbish!
    | > Just what these groups need...another Troll.
    | > --
    | > Glen Ventura, MS MVP Shell/User, A+
    | > http://dts-l.org/goodpost.htm
    | > http://www.microsoft.com/communities/conduct/default.mspx
    | >
    | > "Donald McTrevor" <me@privacy.net> wrote in message
    | > news:B6Bae.3972$wu2.1309@newsfe1-gui.ntli.net...
    | > > Thats rubbish I too had vowed never to do another 'update' again
    | > > however I lapsed for some reason and that update screwed my
    machine.
    | > >
    | > > In fact the reason I lapsed is that another fault in windows set
    my
    | > > homepage to microshit windows update and like a fool I clicked
    | > > auto update.
    | > >
    | > > The updates prior to that have always introduced some
    | > > detramental effect.
    | > >
    | > > Think I will go back to my instalation disk and remove all
    updates.
    | > >
    | > > The fast majoriy of people don't update their machines for obvious
    | > > reasons ie they like their computer to *work*.
    | > >
    | > >
    | > >
    | > >
    | > > "glee" <glee29@spamindspring.com> wrote in message
    | > > news:uPlLwIsPFHA.3076@TK2MSFTNGP14.phx.gbl...
    | > > > The fact is that a very small minority of people have trouble
    with
    | > > updates, and that
    | > > > is often due to interference from background apps during
    installation.
    | > > The vast
    | > > > majority of users who update have no problem whatsoever, and you
    | simply
    | > > don't see
    | > > > any reports in the newsgroups saying "I updated and I had no
    problem".
    | > > Why would
    | > > > anyone post to report "nothing"? People only report problems,
    not
    | > > successes. I
    | > > > have done countless updates on innumerable systems and have yet
    to
    | have a
    | > > problem
    | > > > with almost any of them.
    | > > > --
    | > > > Glen Ventura, MS MVP Shell/User, A+
    | > > > http://dts-l.org/goodpost.htm
    | > > > http://www.microsoft.com/communities/conduct/default.mspx
    | > > >
    | > > >
    | > > > "jane" <jane@internet.com> wrote in message
    | > > > news:Owzt%23eqPFHA.248@TK2MSFTNGP15.phx.gbl...
    | > > > > One last thing I have definitely learned from this fiasco is
    not to
    | > > > > trust Microsoft Updates, no matter how "critical" they are
    labeled.
    | > > > >
    | > > > > > My bottom line question is whether there has been any
    solution
    | yet?
    | > > > > >
    | > > > > > Paul in San Francisco
    | > > > >
    | > > > > Paul in cisco.......
    | > > > > I Agree with you 110%.
    | > > > > I dont trust them at all.
    | > > > > I have minimal "so called Updates" on my comp', and my comp'
    | > > > > runs better than any ppls here.
    | > > > > Every time I read a post in this group regarding someone who
    went
    | > > > > and did an update from m/s, their post is always filled with
    the
    | > > > > problems that followed........ never a perfect
    transition,
    | always
    | > > > > a problem.
    | > > > >
    | > > > > janey
    | > > > >
    | > > > >
    | > > >
    | > >
    | > >
    | >
    |
    |
  24. Archived from groups: microsoft.public.win98.gen_discussion (More info?)

    If you took the time to read any of my posts, you would realise that is a false
    statement. However, my statement is true.....look up what trolling is, as it
    relates to posting, and you will see that you are doing exactly that.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Internet_troll

    http://www.catb.org/~esr/jargon/html/T/troll.html
    --
    Glen Ventura, MS MVP Shell/User, A+
    http://dts-l.org/goodpost.htm
    http://www.microsoft.com/communities/conduct/default.mspx


    "Donald McTrevor" <me@privacy.net> wrote in message
    news:DzPae.5008$Y46.3212@newsfe1-win.ntli.net...
    > Rich words coming from the mouth of an arse-licker.
    >
    > "glee" <glee29@spamindspring.com> wrote in message
    > news:%23iNf5zISFHA.204@TK2MSFTNGP15.phx.gbl...
    > > Now THAT'S rubbish!
    > > Just what these groups need...another Troll.
    > > --
    > > Glen Ventura, MS MVP Shell/User, A+
    > > http://dts-l.org/goodpost.htm
    > > http://www.microsoft.com/communities/conduct/default.mspx
    > >
    > > "Donald McTrevor" <me@privacy.net> wrote in message
    > > news:B6Bae.3972$wu2.1309@newsfe1-gui.ntli.net...
    > > > Thats rubbish I too had vowed never to do another 'update' again
    > > > however I lapsed for some reason and that update screwed my machine.
    > > >
    > > > In fact the reason I lapsed is that another fault in windows set my
    > > > homepage to microshit windows update and like a fool I clicked
    > > > auto update.
    > > >
    > > > The updates prior to that have always introduced some
    > > > detramental effect.
    > > >
    > > > Think I will go back to my instalation disk and remove all updates.
    > > >
    > > > The fast majoriy of people don't update their machines for obvious
    > > > reasons ie they like their computer to *work*.
    > > >
    > > >
    > > >
    > > >
    > > > "glee" <glee29@spamindspring.com> wrote in message
    > > > news:uPlLwIsPFHA.3076@TK2MSFTNGP14.phx.gbl...
    > > > > The fact is that a very small minority of people have trouble with
    > > > updates, and that
    > > > > is often due to interference from background apps during installation.
    > > > The vast
    > > > > majority of users who update have no problem whatsoever, and you
    > simply
    > > > don't see
    > > > > any reports in the newsgroups saying "I updated and I had no problem".
    > > > Why would
    > > > > anyone post to report "nothing"? People only report problems, not
    > > > successes. I
    > > > > have done countless updates on innumerable systems and have yet to
    > have a
    > > > problem
    > > > > with almost any of them.
    > > > > --
    > > > > Glen Ventura, MS MVP Shell/User, A+
    > > > > http://dts-l.org/goodpost.htm
    > > > > http://www.microsoft.com/communities/conduct/default.mspx
    > > > >
    > > > >
    > > > > "jane" <jane@internet.com> wrote in message
    > > > > news:Owzt%23eqPFHA.248@TK2MSFTNGP15.phx.gbl...
    > > > > > One last thing I have definitely learned from this fiasco is not to
    > > > > > trust Microsoft Updates, no matter how "critical" they are labeled.
    > > > > >
    > > > > > > My bottom line question is whether there has been any solution
    > yet?
    > > > > > >
    > > > > > > Paul in San Francisco
    > > > > >
    > > > > > Paul in cisco.......
    > > > > > I Agree with you 110%.
    > > > > > I dont trust them at all.
    > > > > > I have minimal "so called Updates" on my comp', and my comp'
    > > > > > runs better than any ppls here.
    > > > > > Every time I read a post in this group regarding someone who went
    > > > > > and did an update from m/s, their post is always filled with the
    > > > > > problems that followed........ never a perfect transition,
    > always
    > > > > > a problem.
    > > > > >
    > > > > > janey
    > > > > >
    > > > > >
    > > > >
    > > >
    > > >
    > >
    >
    >
  25. Archived from groups: microsoft.public.win98.gen_discussion (More info?)

    You sound deranged.

    "PCR" <pcrrcp@netzero.net> wrote in message
    news:%23XASSFPSFHA.3664@TK2MSFTNGP15.phx.gbl...
    > I beg your pardon? I QUOTE Glee in many a Master Post, even against his
    > own objections! Some day soon you 'n Colorado surely will slip on a
    > banana peel & go sliding off Mt. Vesuvius!
    >
    >
    > --
    > Thanks or Good Luck,
    > There may be humor in this post, and,
    > Naturally, you will not sue,
    > should things get worse after this,
    > PCR
    > pcrrcp@netzero.net
    > "Donald McTrevor" <me@privacy.net> wrote in message
    > news:DzPae.5008$Y46.3212@newsfe1-win.ntli.net...
    > | Rich words coming from the mouth of an arse-licker.
    > |
    > | "glee" <glee29@spamindspring.com> wrote in message
    > | news:%23iNf5zISFHA.204@TK2MSFTNGP15.phx.gbl...
    > | > Now THAT'S rubbish!
    > | > Just what these groups need...another Troll.
    > | > --
    > | > Glen Ventura, MS MVP Shell/User, A+
    > | > http://dts-l.org/goodpost.htm
    > | > http://www.microsoft.com/communities/conduct/default.mspx
    > | >
    > | > "Donald McTrevor" <me@privacy.net> wrote in message
    > | > news:B6Bae.3972$wu2.1309@newsfe1-gui.ntli.net...
    > | > > Thats rubbish I too had vowed never to do another 'update' again
    > | > > however I lapsed for some reason and that update screwed my
    > machine.
    > | > >
    > | > > In fact the reason I lapsed is that another fault in windows set
    > my
    > | > > homepage to microshit windows update and like a fool I clicked
    > | > > auto update.
    > | > >
    > | > > The updates prior to that have always introduced some
    > | > > detramental effect.
    > | > >
    > | > > Think I will go back to my instalation disk and remove all
    > updates.
    > | > >
    > | > > The fast majoriy of people don't update their machines for obvious
    > | > > reasons ie they like their computer to *work*.
    > | > >
    > | > >
    > | > >
    > | > >
    > | > > "glee" <glee29@spamindspring.com> wrote in message
    > | > > news:uPlLwIsPFHA.3076@TK2MSFTNGP14.phx.gbl...
    > | > > > The fact is that a very small minority of people have trouble
    > with
    > | > > updates, and that
    > | > > > is often due to interference from background apps during
    > installation.
    > | > > The vast
    > | > > > majority of users who update have no problem whatsoever, and you
    > | simply
    > | > > don't see
    > | > > > any reports in the newsgroups saying "I updated and I had no
    > problem".
    > | > > Why would
    > | > > > anyone post to report "nothing"? People only report problems,
    > not
    > | > > successes. I
    > | > > > have done countless updates on innumerable systems and have yet
    > to
    > | have a
    > | > > problem
    > | > > > with almost any of them.
    > | > > > --
    > | > > > Glen Ventura, MS MVP Shell/User, A+
    > | > > > http://dts-l.org/goodpost.htm
    > | > > > http://www.microsoft.com/communities/conduct/default.mspx
    > | > > >
    > | > > >
    > | > > > "jane" <jane@internet.com> wrote in message
    > | > > > news:Owzt%23eqPFHA.248@TK2MSFTNGP15.phx.gbl...
    > | > > > > One last thing I have definitely learned from this fiasco is
    > not to
    > | > > > > trust Microsoft Updates, no matter how "critical" they are
    > labeled.
    > | > > > >
    > | > > > > > My bottom line question is whether there has been any
    > solution
    > | yet?
    > | > > > > >
    > | > > > > > Paul in San Francisco
    > | > > > >
    > | > > > > Paul in cisco.......
    > | > > > > I Agree with you 110%.
    > | > > > > I dont trust them at all.
    > | > > > > I have minimal "so called Updates" on my comp', and my comp'
    > | > > > > runs better than any ppls here.
    > | > > > > Every time I read a post in this group regarding someone who
    > went
    > | > > > > and did an update from m/s, their post is always filled with
    > the
    > | > > > > problems that followed........ never a perfect
    > transition,
    > | always
    > | > > > > a problem.
    > | > > > >
    > | > > > > janey
    > | > > > >
    > | > > > >
    > | > > >
    > | > >
    > | > >
    > | >
    > |
    > |
    >
    >
  26. Archived from groups: microsoft.public.win98.gen_discussion (More info?)

    Yea, that's it. But isn't everyone?

    --
    Thanks or Good Luck,
    There may be humor in this post, and,
    Naturally, you will not sue,
    should things get worse after this,
    PCR
    pcrrcp@netzero.net
    "Donald McTrevor" <me@privacy.net> wrote in message
    news:NsRae.5105$Y46.3068@newsfe1-win.ntli.net...
    | You sound deranged.
    |
    | "PCR" <pcrrcp@netzero.net> wrote in message
    | news:%23XASSFPSFHA.3664@TK2MSFTNGP15.phx.gbl...
    | > I beg your pardon? I QUOTE Glee in many a Master Post, even against
    his
    | > own objections! Some day soon you 'n Colorado surely will slip on a
    | > banana peel & go sliding off Mt. Vesuvius!
    | >
    | >
    | > --
    | > Thanks or Good Luck,
    | > There may be humor in this post, and,
    | > Naturally, you will not sue,
    | > should things get worse after this,
    | > PCR
    | > pcrrcp@netzero.net
    | > "Donald McTrevor" <me@privacy.net> wrote in message
    | > news:DzPae.5008$Y46.3212@newsfe1-win.ntli.net...
    | > | Rich words coming from the mouth of an arse-licker.
    | > |
    | > | "glee" <glee29@spamindspring.com> wrote in message
    | > | news:%23iNf5zISFHA.204@TK2MSFTNGP15.phx.gbl...
    | > | > Now THAT'S rubbish!
    | > | > Just what these groups need...another Troll.
    | > | > --
    | > | > Glen Ventura, MS MVP Shell/User, A+
    | > | > http://dts-l.org/goodpost.htm
    | > | > http://www.microsoft.com/communities/conduct/default.mspx
    | > | >
    | > | > "Donald McTrevor" <me@privacy.net> wrote in message
    | > | > news:B6Bae.3972$wu2.1309@newsfe1-gui.ntli.net...
    | > | > > Thats rubbish I too had vowed never to do another 'update'
    again
    | > | > > however I lapsed for some reason and that update screwed my
    | > machine.
    | > | > >
    | > | > > In fact the reason I lapsed is that another fault in windows
    set
    | > my
    | > | > > homepage to microshit windows update and like a fool I clicked
    | > | > > auto update.
    | > | > >
    | > | > > The updates prior to that have always introduced some
    | > | > > detramental effect.
    | > | > >
    | > | > > Think I will go back to my instalation disk and remove all
    | > updates.
    | > | > >
    | > | > > The fast majoriy of people don't update their machines for
    obvious
    | > | > > reasons ie they like their computer to *work*.
    | > | > >
    | > | > >
    | > | > >
    | > | > >
    | > | > > "glee" <glee29@spamindspring.com> wrote in message
    | > | > > news:uPlLwIsPFHA.3076@TK2MSFTNGP14.phx.gbl...
    | > | > > > The fact is that a very small minority of people have
    trouble
    | > with
    | > | > > updates, and that
    | > | > > > is often due to interference from background apps during
    | > installation.
    | > | > > The vast
    | > | > > > majority of users who update have no problem whatsoever, and
    you
    | > | simply
    | > | > > don't see
    | > | > > > any reports in the newsgroups saying "I updated and I had no
    | > problem".
    | > | > > Why would
    | > | > > > anyone post to report "nothing"? People only report
    problems,
    | > not
    | > | > > successes. I
    | > | > > > have done countless updates on innumerable systems and have
    yet
    | > to
    | > | have a
    | > | > > problem
    | > | > > > with almost any of them.
    | > | > > > --
    | > | > > > Glen Ventura, MS MVP Shell/User, A+
    | > | > > > http://dts-l.org/goodpost.htm
    | > | > > > http://www.microsoft.com/communities/conduct/default.mspx
    | > | > > >
    | > | > > >
    | > | > > > "jane" <jane@internet.com> wrote in message
    | > | > > > news:Owzt%23eqPFHA.248@TK2MSFTNGP15.phx.gbl...
    | > | > > > > One last thing I have definitely learned from this fiasco
    is
    | > not to
    | > | > > > > trust Microsoft Updates, no matter how "critical" they are
    | > labeled.
    | > | > > > >
    | > | > > > > > My bottom line question is whether there has been any
    | > solution
    | > | yet?
    | > | > > > > >
    | > | > > > > > Paul in San Francisco
    | > | > > > >
    | > | > > > > Paul in cisco.......
    | > | > > > > I Agree with you 110%.
    | > | > > > > I dont trust them at all.
    | > | > > > > I have minimal "so called Updates" on my comp', and my
    comp'
    | > | > > > > runs better than any ppls here.
    | > | > > > > Every time I read a post in this group regarding someone
    who
    | > went
    | > | > > > > and did an update from m/s, their post is always filled
    with
    | > the
    | > | > > > > problems that followed........ never a perfect
    | > transition,
    | > | always
    | > | > > > > a problem.
    | > | > > > >
    | > | > > > > janey
    | > | > > > >
    | > | > > > >
    | > | > > >
    | > | > >
    | > | > >
    | > | >
    | > |
    | > |
    | >
    | >
    |
    |
  27. Archived from groups: microsoft.public.win98.gen_discussion (More info?)

    Just want to say what you wrote, well luckily I've figured it out, myself,
    after spending over 13 days of doing sys. restores, virus scans, but the darn
    pc kept freezing...luckily I knew I'd added that darn update, and I keep a
    journal of what I add. So I did a Dr. Watson, w/ my Win'ME". And there it
    was-- "KB891711 has changed your system files". My pc not only froze, but it
    screwed up some of my photo applications. So after 4 yrs of hard work, I have
    to redo them. I have dial up, and I Want to know the answer too!!! Thank you
    for your post. I think MS needs to be more careful, and when they do
    something like this, they need to tell us. I just got off the phone w/ a
    friend, and she had the same exact problem. I'm hopeful she was helped by
    deleting the darned update, thou I don't know yet. Since I don't know what
    has happened. My pc is faster now, but my app's are screwed up . When I did
    the add /remove, I instantly , FINALLY got online, and came here, and read
    your post. Thank you is all I can say. It made me feel better to know I
    wasn't in this horrible mess by myself. And you had allot of good info that I
    didn't know. I hope MS lets us know , soon.

    "Paul M" wrote:

    > Well, it's been over a month since Microsoft unleashed this t*rd of an
    > update. After 20+ years of using computers (but still a novice at how
    > they work at the system level) this is the worst computer disaster I
    > have ever encountered. It is a classic case of “the operation
    > succeeded, but the patient died,� complete with blue screens. Before I
    > went out of town for three weeks, I spent more than 50 hours trying to
    > figure out what was wrong. While out of town I discovered this
    > newsgroup, and spent more hours pouring over more than 5,000 posts. I
    > definitely feel sorry for users, like my mom, aged 89, who would not
    > know a newsgroup from a browser but who might trust that Microsoft's own
    > Critical Updates would do no harm.
    >
    > From these posts I learned:
    > 1) The fix is to uninstall KB891711. I did, and everything returned to
    > normal on the next reboot.
    >
    > But most questions and suggestions about the cause were never resolved
    > as far as I could see:
    > 2) The problem seems to affect mostly dial up connections (like mine);
    > but some cable connections have problems too.
    > 3) The problem may be related to video cards or lack of them (like mine,
    > I think).
    > 4) The problem may be related to other installed hardware and/or
    > software not yet identified.
    > 5) The problem is not exclusive to IE, but also affects Netscape and
    > Firefox machines (like mine).
    > 6) The upgrade may or may not even be needed in Windows 98, depending on
    > whether you believe what Microsoft initially wrote or what some of its
    > employees are now saying.
    > 7) Microsoft is aware of the problems and was close to being able to
    > duplicate them about three weeks ago.
    >
    > One last thing I have definitely learned from this fiasco is not to
    > trust Microsoft Updates, no matter how “critical� they are labeled.
    >
    > My bottom line question is whether there has been any solution yet?
    >
    > Paul in San Francisco
    >
  28. Archived from groups: microsoft.public.win98.gen_discussion (More info?)

    Too bad this CDO poster didn't read the rest of the thread.
    --
    ~PA Bear

    barb3 wrote:
    > Just want to say what you wrote, well luckily I've figured it out, myself,
    > after spending over 13 days of doing sys. restores, virus scans, but the
    > darn pc kept freezing...luckily I knew I'd added that darn update, and I
    > keep a journal of what I add. So I did a Dr. Watson, w/ my Win'ME". And
    > there it was-- "KB891711 has changed your system files". My pc not only
    > froze, but it screwed up some of my photo applications. So after 4 yrs of
    > hard work, I have to redo them. I have dial up, and I Want to know the
    > answer too!!! Thank you for your post. I think MS needs to be more
    > careful,
    > and when they do something like this, they need to tell us. I just got off
    > the phone w/ a friend, and she had the same exact problem. I'm hopeful she
    > was helped by deleting the darned update, thou I don't know yet. Since I
    > don't know what has happened. My pc is faster now, but my app's are
    > screwed
    > up . When I did the add /remove, I instantly , FINALLY got online, and
    > came
    > here, and read your post. Thank you is all I can say. It made me feel
    > better to know I wasn't in this horrible mess by myself. And you had allot
    > of good info that I didn't know. I hope MS lets us know , soon.
    >
    > "Paul M" wrote:
    >
    >> Well, it's been over a month since Microsoft unleashed this t*rd of an
    >> update. After 20+ years of using computers (but still a novice at how
    >> they work at the system level) this is the worst computer disaster I
    >> have ever encountered. It is a classic case of “the operation
    >> succeeded, but the patient died,� complete with blue screens. Before I
    >> went out of town for three weeks, I spent more than 50 hours trying to
    >> figure out what was wrong. While out of town I discovered this
    >> newsgroup, and spent more hours pouring over more than 5,000 posts. I
    >> definitely feel sorry for users, like my mom, aged 89, who would not
    >> know a newsgroup from a browser but who might trust that Microsoft's own
    >> Critical Updates would do no harm.
    >>
    >> From these posts I learned:
    >> 1) The fix is to uninstall KB891711. I did, and everything returned to
    >> normal on the next reboot.
    >>
    >> But most questions and suggestions about the cause were never resolved
    >> as far as I could see:
    >> 2) The problem seems to affect mostly dial up connections (like mine);
    >> but some cable connections have problems too.
    >> 3) The problem may be related to video cards or lack of them (like mine,
    >> I think).
    >> 4) The problem may be related to other installed hardware and/or
    >> software not yet identified.
    >> 5) The problem is not exclusive to IE, but also affects Netscape and
    >> Firefox machines (like mine).
    >> 6) The upgrade may or may not even be needed in Windows 98, depending on
    >> whether you believe what Microsoft initially wrote or what some of its
    >> employees are now saying.
    >> 7) Microsoft is aware of the problems and was close to being able to
    >> duplicate them about three weeks ago.
    >>
    >> One last thing I have definitely learned from this fiasco is not to
    >> trust Microsoft Updates, no matter how “critical� they are labeled.
    >>
    >> My bottom line question is whether there has been any solution yet?
    >>
    >> Paul in San Francisco
  29. Archived from groups: microsoft.public.win98.gen_discussion (More info?)

    Yeah, great, just blame on the other guy again. If they design to MS spec
    and MS makes a change after the fact, who is to blame?
    Many years ago, in pc speak, I bought what was the top of pc's just prior to
    W95b. This was my first pc and it and a printer cost me over $3000. Well
    what a trd. In reality, it was Intel and MS. Sure the case and monitor were
    Sony, but the OS was merely branded. And a couple of other programs thrown
    in as bones, which I never used. In a few days I would start to see all
    sorts of errors and on average around 7-10 days I would get lock-ups and
    registry errors to the point of no boot. The only answer was format and
    reinstall ~every 2 weeks. This was for 6 months!!!! How did it get fixed?
    Only a guess is available. I always downloaded every update MS had available
    and as I added programs to the machine I checked for updates for any of the
    added programs. So whether MS finally got it right or one of the added
    programs replaced a file from MS is only explanation. That pc somewhere
    around the age of 1 year became the most reliable machine I have.
    Unfortunately, with all the added MS bloat for todays apps and other
    requirements of antiviral, anti-spy bot, firewall, etc, etc for security of
    MS's Wholly OS it is just to slow for most of the added load.

    "mae" <agrannie@notemail.msn.com> wrote in message
    news:u5bvKrBQFHA.3880@tk2msftngp13.phx.gbl...
    > Third party.
    > --
    > mae
    >
    > "Dan" <Dan@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in message
    > news:83E00AE9-07F7-4660-BC57-89B72425A3D4@microsoft.com...
    > | Mae, in your opinion is a lack of user expertise the most common cause
    of
    > | failure of these Microsoft updates? <no offense anyone, I am just
    > curious>
    > | Thanks mae and have a good day!
    > |
    > | "mae" wrote:
    > |
    > | > I have never had a problem with any Windows Updates.
    > | > If you go to that group, you will see the problems some people
    > experience after each is released. After awhile you will be able to
    > determine the most common causes of failures for yourself.
    > | > --
    > | > mae
    > | >
    > | > "jane" <jane@internet.com> wrote in message
    > news:Owzt%23eqPFHA.248@TK2MSFTNGP15.phx.gbl...
    > | > | One last thing I have definitely learned from this fiasco is not to
    > | > | trust Microsoft Updates, no matter how "critical" they are labeled.
    > | > |
    > | > | > My bottom line question is whether there has been any solution
    yet?
    > | > | >
    > | > | > Paul in San Francisco
    > | > |
    > | > | Paul in cisco.......
    > | > | I Agree with you 110%.
    > | > | I dont trust them at all.
    > | > | I have minimal "so called Updates" on my comp', and my comp'
    > | > | runs better than any ppls here.
    > | > | Every time I read a post in this group regarding someone who went
    > | > | and did an update from m/s, their post is always filled with the
    > | > | problems that followed........ never a perfect transition,
    always
    > | > | a problem.
    > | > |
    > | > | janey
    > | > |
    > | > |
    > | >
    >
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