digityzed

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i re-built my computer over two years ago and I believe it's maxed out (Asus P4B533-E (AGP 8x, 5 PCI, 2 x ATA100), 3.06 GHz 533 MHz FSB Socket 478 Pentium 4 CPU, 1 GB PC2100 DDR RAM). I've been thinking about re-building it again obviously with a new mobo, cpu and such, but i have absolutely no clue as to what's what with the new technology. I understand Serial ATA, but that's about it...

i'm totally lost on the new CPUs and their differences, like Intel Duo Core 2, Pentium D 840 and Pentium 4 830 (where's pentium 4 or 5 4.7 GHz chips?) and AMD64 and AM2 and sempron and opteron. and what about PC2-8000 DDR2 or PC5400 DDR memory. and finally PCI express x16 and PCI express x1... what am I looking at with these technologies compared to what I currently have?

i just want to get a handle on what's out there before upgrading/re-building my personal home workstation again

layman terms please

TIA
 

endyen

Splendid
To start, lets look at PCI-express 16X. It is the new graphics interface. Agp just isn't available for new motherboards. Even though it's 16X, it's not much faster than AGP 8X. It is however full duplex speed (it can transfer data bothe ways at the same speed) It doesn't help much with 3D cad, or games, but if you are using an All in wonder card to record video, it has potential.
Many chips today are made with two cores on each chip. Not quite two processors for the price of one, but getting there. You really do need to be using the right software, or run a lot of programs at the same time, to take real advantage of this.
Today's Intel chips are not quite up to snuff. Not only do they underperform, but they also tend to give off more heat than thier AMD counterparts.
That is about to change. The new core 2 chips will use a lot less power, and may have a performance advantage over the AMD equivalents. They are also rumoured to be quite economical.
Their only shortfall is the demand they will see at release. It's not likely that you will be able to buy a processor in a box much before July 1. Still, your P4 should do you till then.
It will also give you a chance to see what the early reviews say, some time next month.
For memory, everybody has now switched to DDR2. For Intel systems, DDR2-667 is fine, since the technology is new. It is not expected to have much time to mature, as DDR3 is expected some time next year.
 

Atolsammeek

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Here a few ideas to look at.

Right now there a new chip out Am2 and in a few weeks Conroe. What will happen in this time prices will drop for both companys.

You really Need to use the Forum to get ideas on What out and such.

Questions like this What do you use for your computer. Games, Internet, video editing and a ton more stuff. Give us what you want your computer to do.
 

digityzed

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well honestly I don't do much with my computer. i web develop, so photoshop is the most demanding app for me. i do some video conversion too (dvd to divx/xvid) and play with cool new and various apps sometimes. i don't do games at all.

but from ya reponses it doesn't seem like i really need to re-build. i went from 866 MHz PIII to 2.26 GHz P4 so that made sense, but i then went from that 2.26 GHz to 3.06 GHz (i simply wanted to max out mobo) and i kinda regret that. i'd rather follow that 18 month law/rule and wait until the chips double in speed (though it hasn't happened yet).

just a couple of mo' questions:

- what's the difference between Athlon 64, the FX and X2 Dual-core?
- Sempron is like Celeron, Athlon 64/FX/X2 Dual-Core is like Pentium 4/D/Core, AMD AM2 is like Intel Core 2 and Opteron is like Xeon??
- If PCI-e x16 is the new AGP port, what is PCI-e x1 for?

TIA
 

YO_KID37

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well honestly I don't do much with my computer. i web develop, so photoshop is the most demanding app for me. i do some video conversion too (dvd to divx/xvid) and play with cool new and various apps sometimes. i don't do games at all.

but from ya reponses it doesn't seem like i really need to re-build. i went from 866 MHz PIII to 2.26 GHz P4 so that made sense, but i then went from that 2.26 GHz to 3.06 GHz (i simply wanted to max out mobo) and i kinda regret that. i'd rather follow that 18 month law/rule and wait until the chips double in speed (though it hasn't happened yet).

just a couple of mo' questions:

- what's the difference between Athlon 64, the FX and X2 Dual-core?
- Sempron is like Celeron, Athlon 64/FX/X2 Dual-Core is like Pentium 4/D/Core, AMD AM2 is like Intel Core 2 and Opteron is like Xeon??
- If PCI-e x16 is the new AGP port, what is PCI-e x1 for?

TIA

*Athlon64(non X2) are single core processers

*Athlon64X2 are Dual Core Processers

*Athlon64-FX(939-940) are Single core Processers for extreme processer
use

*Athlon64-(FX-60) and above are Dual Core Processers made for excessive use of the processer(basically the best AthlonX2 the factory produces)

*Yup Semptron and Celeron are same type of Lower-price processers (basically crappy pentium or AMD chips)

AM2 is just a AMD switch to a new Socket change for DDR2

While Conroe is a new type of Processer core. It's a transition to 65nm Dual core that supports 64bit and its the final way for Intel to Completely Cut off the Pentium name

And Opteron is made for competition of both Itanium server chip and Xeon servers

The PCI-E AGP replacements is Single graphic card replacement and the other is for SLI and CROSSFIRE support (supports upto 4 Graphic cards in one system) SUPERGRAPHICS
 

jap0nes

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well, for your usage i think your computer is still good. Maybe put some more ram, as photoshop uses plenty. Maybe change/add for PC3200 (DDR400) if your motherboard supports it.
A video card with a lot of memory would be good too, does not need to be any high end.
 

digityzed

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thanks. my mobo is max out, i can't upgrade it anymore.

seems like intel and amd is bullsh1ting and lolly gagging with the current available chips. tryna use marketing gimmicks and brand re-naming to stall... i'll wait until i see at least a 5.0 GHz chip before rebuilding

thanks again everyone
 

rodney_ws

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Although AMD would like you to believe that Opterons are best utilized in servers... a quick look at some signatures on this forum will tell you just how much they're used in gaming rigs as well. I have an X2-4400 and had I known what I know now, I'd have bought an Opteron instead... virtually everyone here agrees that they have more head-room for overclocking if you're into that sort of thing.
 

theboomboomcars

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Photoshop is a multithreaded application, if you have a fairly recent one any how, and loves lots of ram. So going to a dual core processor would help, as would a memory upgrade. But it would probably be benificial to wait for conroe because it looks like the jump in speed we are all looking for.

Don't get hung jup on Mhz, the AMD's and conroes are doing more per cycle, so are faster with less cycles, while using less power, which is nice. I would venture to say that the conroe will be twice as fast as your 3GHz P4 at somewhere less that 3Ghz.

You have selected a good time to start looking at upgrading because good things are happening.
 

the_taker

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Don't get hung jup on Mhz, the AMD's and conroes are doing more per cycle, so are faster with less cycles, while using less power, which is nice. I would venture to say that the conroe will be twice as fast as your 3GHz P4 at somewhere less that 3Ghz.

You have selected a good time to start looking at upgrading because good things are happening.

boomboom is right, Moore's law is sort of on hold for now, meaning I wouldn't expect to see processors hitting an actual 5.0ghz anytime soon. To put it into perspective, AMD has been producing processors in the 1.5-2.8Ghz range for the past 6-7 years, but marketing them with a higher number, like 2600+, 3700+, etc. The reason for this is that AMD was the first to start designing the processor more intelligently, instead of just increasing CPU speed.

In order for these processors to sell (as compared to Intel, who was basically still on the Ghz race for higher and higher speeds) AMD had to use marketing to express that an AMD Athlon 64 3200+ (which actually runs at 2.0Ghz) compares to an Intel Pentium 4 3.2Ghz processor.

As speeds increased beyond 3Ghz, Intel realized they couldn't keep increasing speed because the power requirements were getting outrageous, meaning high electricity bills, and the cooling requirements to keep the proc from melting down would have probably needed liquid cooling or better (read: expensive) just to make it work.

Finally Intel started designing the Core Duo which is modeled after the Pentium mobile (read: centrino) CPU, which is intel's low speed processor (1.8Ghz P-mobile is roughly comparable to a 2.4Ghz P4 for desktop). this redesign increases CPU performance (gaming, applications, etc) while lowering power requirements, cooling requirements and adds a 2nd processor core for the Core Duo.

Now Intel is getting on the better-bang-for-the-buck-at-less-ghz bandwagon with Core 2 Duo, which is basically a processor redesigned from the ground up to be great on energy, cooling and performance for an affordable price (the best of all 4 worlds). Read a few reviews online for the Core Duo...like this oneCore 2 Duo Performance Gains. I personally have been building my recent systems with AMD processors, but my main system for the past few years was a Pentium 4 1.8Ghz. I'll buy whatever processor is right at the time I am buying a computer.


Someone also suggested upgrading your RAM in your existing system from DDR-266 to DDR-400, but you said your system was "Maxed out". What this person was saying is that your current RAM is holding your processor's performance back. The other poster wasn't suggesting that you add RAM to your existing configuration, where some slots are filled with DDR266 (PC2100) and some are filled with DDR400 (PC3200), but rather in order to increase performance in your existing system, you would need to completely replace the DDR266 with the faster RAM. the reason for this is that if you mix fast and slow RAM, the system will slow down the fast RAM to match the speed of the slow RAM.

I also want to make sure you're using the term "re-build" correctly. Rebuilding would imply that something has gone wrong with your current system and you need to install replacement hardware and then reinstall the OS. Upgrading is what you would use to imply replacing existing, working hardware in your computer with something faster, better, etc. If you're looking at purchasing a new computer or component parts to build a new system on your own, this would simply be called a new PC build.
 

SidVicious

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boomboom is right, Moore's law is sort of on hold for now, meaning I wouldn't expect to see processors hitting an actual 5.0ghz anytime soon.

Moore's law is by no means on hold, while it is true that the focus shifted from GHz to IPC, the complexity of CPUs and the processing power per unit cost is still on track thanks to Dual Core CPUs.