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OMG! AMD socket 1207 Opterons delayed!

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June 5, 2006 9:08:05 PM

So says the inquirer.

Link.

Discuss!

More about : omg amd socket 1207 opterons delayed

June 5, 2006 9:20:12 PM

Quote:
So says the inquirer.

Link.

Discuss!
Action_Man.....You trying to steal 9 INCH'S thunder? :p 
June 5, 2006 9:22:50 PM

Nah just annoy him. Plus it is interesting with woodcrest coming out this month.
Related resources
June 5, 2006 9:47:38 PM

Did you color that T-Rex pic. Since most of the computer news suckz today I am moving on to more important matters. Coloring.
June 5, 2006 10:01:39 PM

For someone who dont beleave the-inquirer. You are just making your self look Real dumb now.
June 5, 2006 10:04:48 PM

Quote:
For someone who dont beleave the-inquirer. You are just making your self look Real dumb now.
Since you didn't realize that it is intended as satire, your making yourself look pretty dumb right now.
June 5, 2006 10:16:51 PM

Quote:
For someone who dont beleave the-inquirer. You are just making your self look Real dumb now.


When did I ever say that? Thats what I thought.
June 5, 2006 10:46:49 PM

i do my own thing for ppl who start threads with OMG, so here u go

June 5, 2006 11:41:42 PM

thank you for wasting 2 seconds of my time for realizing that your spam is a repost.
June 6, 2006 12:18:19 AM

OMG!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! not again......................

You do know you sound like a 12 year old girl right?
June 6, 2006 12:41:04 AM

Quote:
i do my own thing for ppl who start threads with OMG, so here u go




that bunny is really cute
June 6, 2006 12:43:30 AM

Quote:
OMG!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! not again......................

You do know you sound like a 12 year old girl right?


OMG! That is sooooooo true! :D 

Delay could only mean one thing and it is tweaking or improving the socket design. Things are heating up between the two major semiconductor manufacturer and Intel want to get the crown as AMD own it for the last 3 years. So don't OMG about it! :) 
June 6, 2006 12:44:49 AM



Grrrrrrr ! i will eat your face

srry i thought it would be funny :roll:
June 6, 2006 12:52:23 AM

Hey Action Man what happen to your cool avatar?
June 6, 2006 12:59:22 AM

What's with everyone asking me about changing my avatar?
June 6, 2006 1:00:49 AM

Quote:
What's with everyone asking me about changing my avatar?


I think its clever... Word.
June 6, 2006 1:02:43 AM

Nothing personal, I just always thought your old avatar was pretty cool. Don't take this wrong but seemed to match your personality.
June 6, 2006 1:04:00 AM

Quote:


Grrrrrrr ! i will eat your face

srry i thought it would be funny :roll:


lol, I think it'd be something more like this:

June 6, 2006 1:05:09 AM

I was pretty wasted when I picked my old one.
June 6, 2006 1:08:09 AM

Quote:


Grrrrrrr ! i will eat your face

srry i thought it would be funny :roll:


lol, I think it'd be something more like this:




F'n ROFL ! :lol: 
June 6, 2006 1:39:45 AM

Quote:
OMG! AMD socket 1207 Opterons delayed

Darn and just when we were all ready to place our orders. Such a shame. :roll:
a b à CPUs
June 6, 2006 2:00:51 AM

You forgot to make the subject line all in CAPS...at least give someone else the chance to post kb pix... :D 
June 6, 2006 2:22:39 AM

IS it really going to have 1207 pins? Jeez that'a a lot!!!

Hmm...I just might change my avatar too....
June 6, 2006 3:02:34 AM

Quote:
After long meetings of casting chicken bones and reading tea leaves AMD has announced they are going to make the best EVER processor. "We will accomplish this by just offering everything in the world that sounds like it could be a feature into the new products. we will also bring up every old idea and say we are gonna do those too. We dont have the capital to accomplish any of this but we can try vodoo and witchcraft and see what happens." we will plan mergers with all companies and build fabs around the planet. we will make chips that float in the air and plan on making light sabers real by 2008. we are going to only make blue light sabers though red ones would just be too much


Oh come ON, they totally wouldn't make blue ones, they'd only make green ones, duh!
June 6, 2006 3:06:04 AM

Quote:
After long meetings of casting chicken bones and reading tea leaves AMD has announced they are going to make the best EVER processor. "We will accomplish this by just offering everything in the world that sounds like it could be a feature into the new products. we will also bring up every old idea and say we are gonna do those too. We dont have the capital to accomplish any of this but we can try vodoo and witchcraft and see what happens." we will plan mergers with all companies and build fabs around the planet. we will make chips that float in the air and plan on making light sabers real by 2008. we are going to only make blue light sabers though red ones would just be too much


Oh come ON, they totally wouldn't make blue ones, they'd only make green ones, duh! lIEK ,bloo si noly NiTEL ,durrrr!!!!!~11`1111`11
June 6, 2006 6:50:30 AM

Copy exact is relatively expensive with the brunt of the cost front load into the project by nature. JumpingJack, as you've stated, it takes lot's of long term planning, practice and training before a FAB is opened using this method. Since AMD doesn't have money like Intel, it may find it necessary to cut corners where possible to make ends meet. However, after the FAB is up and running using this method, the long term savings associated with a new FAB are realized through reduced thrash and technicians being able to step right into a familiar environment.

Perhaps if AMD had something worth copying, this might be a better candidate method. Ok, that was harsh...I'll chill.
June 6, 2006 8:52:40 AM

Quote:

Doesn't sound like flawless execution to me :wink:


Sounds like flawless....wool pulling, over the eyes. :wink:
June 6, 2006 11:51:35 AM

Quote:
So says the inquirer.

Link.

Discuss!


Ya know -- something funny going on in Dresden :)  ....

a) Fab 36 was originally going to startup 65 nm --- pushed out, 65 nm was going to ship in Q2...oops, now Q3...ooops 2H 2006, ooops, Q4...ooops, sample product in Q4 announce in 2007 (this is rumor)....so now it will be late Q4 (12/7/06 as I recall) and they are right on track ---- rrrrrrrrriiiiiiiiiiiight....

b) Fab 36 was suppose to ship revenue 90 nm parts in Q1, a week or so after Q1 ends AMD announce revenue shipment from Fab 36 started in Q1 on plan and with flawless execution, Q1 earnings AMD reiterated this position, then analyst day AMD states Q2 is when 90 nm revenue material shipped. Hmmmmm..... depreciation behavior also suggests they didn't ship in Q1, wwwwwwweeeeeirrrrd.

c) It took at least 4 spins of silicon just to tweak the IMC for DDR2 -- with final release silicon just barely eaking a gain, first sampled material in January generate "massive bug" rumors. Ssssssstttttrrrrrraaaaangggggge.

d) Now rumor has it, and IT IS A RUMOR as it came for Charlie D. that the Socket F will be pushed a month, perhaps longer. As Charlie says "Bad news...."

Doesn't sound like flawless execution to me :wink: I think the analyst/investors are starting to pick up on it.



Fab36 is producing 65nm. I would bet the delay is so Dell can get TONS of em while fulflling OEM contracts. Dell may actually get the first K8Ls ahead of Sun and HP, especially since AMD procs are the top three out of five at Newegg
June 6, 2006 4:27:54 PM

Quote:
Copy exact is relatively expensive with the brunt of the cost front load into the project by nature. JumpingJack, as you've stated, it takes lot's of long term planning, practice and training before a FAB is opened using this method. Since AMD doesn't have money like Intel, it may find it necessary to cut corners where possible to make ends meet. However, after the FAB is up and running using this method, the long term savings associated with a new FAB are realized through reduced thrash and technicians being able to step right into a familiar environment.

Perhaps if AMD had something worth copying, this might be a better candidate method. Ok, that was harsh...I'll chill.


I am being kinda harsh here actually -- but I am also trying to read between the lines.... what AMD says publically and what the data is suggesting are two different things, as I enumerated above -- Fab 36 doesn't appear to be going as well as what I think AMD is leading us to believe, the 4x4 is beginning to look more and more like a last minute scramble, and 65 nm dates are thrown around than a King Kong temper tantrum.

Add on top of that that the leaked 65 nm info is suggesting a lower bin introduction, and AMD has nothing for Conroe until next summer, that is 1 year against a superior product -- in 1 year (2005) AMD went from 16 % to 22% market share, in 1 year they can easily go back.... and if they do this is trouble for them.

Agreed, especially with your statement regarding the ease of going from 22% market share back to 16%. The biggest problem with AMD right now that I see is the fact that they've tasted some success and it's gone to their heads. I understand that they want to monopolize on their current momentum, but they are setting themselves up for failure. Instead of following a more reasonable slow steady growth plan, they are heaping more operating costs upon themselves in the likes of Dresden upgrades, possible ATI purchase, possible Big Apple fab, etc. Granted, some of these moves are speculative, but if they don't materialize, the affect will come in the form of negative perception...and they can't afford too much of that with such a short history of success. Should be interesting to watch though.
June 6, 2006 5:01:11 PM

Quote:
Did you color that T-Rex pic. Since most of the computer news suckz today I am moving on to more important matters. Coloring.


Frickin' hilarious.

Actually, after AM got his 2nd eye clock-poked out, he hasn't been able to see colors. He thinks he still has a Steve Austin avatar and that he's beating Oblivion by feeling the Force. Poor guy, we better take up a collection for him. Glass eye, voice recognition, the works.
June 6, 2006 5:09:44 PM

Quote:
It is a different philosophy no doubt, copy exactly must be very expensive,


I got to go through a CE training session. One of the students made the same observation you did. The Intel instructor kinda went off on him and told how much it costs when things go wrong at fab startups or fab mods. Sorta like, yea it costs alot but it saves big too. And they live and breathe it.
June 6, 2006 5:11:45 PM

Quote:
If AMD could do 65 nm today, we would have it :)  ...


Maybe the yields are just REALLY low...
June 7, 2006 2:17:38 AM

Quote:
So says the inquirer.

Link.

Discuss!


Good think.. I was not ready to buy anyway...
June 7, 2006 3:51:54 AM

I have this pocket knife - and if you fold the blades back into the handle in a certain order they all fall into place easily

change the order and the last blade moves into place like something is holding it back a little
wonder why this is
June 7, 2006 4:49:36 AM

Quote:
So says the inquirer.

Link.

Discuss!


Ya know -- something funny going on in Dresden :)  ....

a) Fab 36 was originally going to startup 65 nm --- pushed out, 65 nm was going to ship in Q2...oops, now Q3...ooops 2H 2006, ooops, Q4...ooops, sample product in Q4 announce in 2007 (this is rumor)....so now it will be late Q4 (12/7/06 as I recall) and they are right on track ---- rrrrrrrrriiiiiiiiiiiight....

b) Fab 36 was suppose to ship revenue 90 nm parts in Q1, a week or so after Q1 ends AMD announce revenue shipment from Fab 36 started in Q1 on plan and with flawless execution, Q1 earnings AMD reiterated this position, then analyst day AMD states Q2 is when 90 nm revenue material shipped. Hmmmmm..... depreciation behavior also suggests they didn't ship in Q1, wwwwwwweeeeeirrrrd.

c) It took at least 4 spins of silicon just to tweak the IMC for DDR2 -- with final release silicon just barely eaking a gain, first sampled material in January generate "massive bug" rumors. Ssssssstttttrrrrrraaaaangggggge.

d) Now rumor has it, and IT IS A RUMOR as it came for Charlie D. that the Socket F will be pushed a month, perhaps longer. As Charlie says "Bad news...."

Doesn't sound like flawless execution to me :wink: I think the analyst/investors are starting to pick up on it.



Fab36 is producing 65nm. I would bet the delay is so Dell can get TONS of em while fulflling OEM contracts. Dell may actually get the first K8Ls ahead of Sun and HP, especially since AMD procs are the top three out of five at Newegg

Yeah right....next I bet you have great beach front property in Albuquerque to sell....

If AMD could do 65 nm today, we would have it :)  ...


Look at what rushing DDR2 would have gotten them. Everyone craves perf so why not wait until it's ready.....look at Vista. Intel feel into the "too many" competing chip families trap and obviously AMD doesn't want to do that. Intel's ASP (average selling price) is in the crapper (Google --- Intel ASP) and AMD knows that if they have a chip that's too fast iyt will make it hard to get rid of current inventory so an evolutionary path is better in a volatile market. Intel of course has the advantage of being able to lose 7 billion dollars - not that that's a good thing - and AMD is not so they have to introduce products carefully IMO.

As you and others have said FABs cost 2-3 billion - masks for new chips cost millions - so it's not like you can just call your local banker for a small loan to change over to new transistor sizes in one quarter while still getting rid of your "older" inventory.

AMD is now probably doing what the Inquirer said they were doing months ago - piling up chips for Dell. You don't think they will b pushing low end out of Chartered/FAB 38 and high end out of FAB 36 but want to pile up a little of the new stock before discontinuing old stock?
June 7, 2006 6:19:13 AM

Quote:
AMD is now probably doing what the Inquirer said they were doing months ago - piling up chips for Dell. You don't think they will b pushing low end out of Chartered/FAB 38 and high end out of FAB 36 but want to pile up a little of the new stock before discontinuing old stock?


Ok, what ever you say.... I don't have the energy to argue

I'm feeling argumentative (shocked, aren't you?) so I'll make this quick comment: If AMD is stockpiling 65nm, then I'd expect them to have released engineering samples to reviewers already. They wouldn't want to give up a bunch of sales to Conroe. And don't doubt for a nanosecond that if a 65nm AM2 product rumored to be competitive with Conroe was available at about the same time, it would hurt Conroe sales. The engineering sample benchmarks would only need to be in the ballpark.
June 7, 2006 6:34:18 AM

Quote:
Copy exact is relatively expensive with the brunt of the cost front load into the project by nature. JumpingJack, as you've stated, it takes lot's of long term planning, practice and training before a FAB is opened using this method. Since AMD doesn't have money like Intel, it may find it necessary to cut corners where possible to make ends meet. However, after the FAB is up and running using this method, the long term savings associated with a new FAB are realized through reduced thrash and technicians being able to step right into a familiar environment.

Perhaps if AMD had something worth copying, this might be a better candidate method. Ok, that was harsh...I'll chill.


I am being kinda harsh here actually -- but I am also trying to read between the lines.... what AMD says publically and what the data is suggesting are two different things, as I enumerated above -- Fab 36 doesn't appear to be going as well as what I think AMD is leading us to believe, the 4x4 is beginning to look more and more like a last minute scramble, and 65 nm dates are thrown around than a King Kong temper tantrum.

Add on top of that that the leaked 65 nm info is suggesting a lower bin introduction, and AMD has nothing for Conroe until next summer, that is 1 year against a superior product -- in 1 year (2005) AMD went from 16 % to 22% market share, in 1 year they can easily go back.... and if they do this is trouble for them.

Agreed, especially with your statement regarding the ease of going from 22% market share back to 16%. The biggest problem with AMD right now that I see is the fact that they've tasted some success and it's gone to their heads. I understand that they want to monopolize on their current momentum, but they are setting themselves up for failure. Instead of following a more reasonable slow steady growth plan, they are heaping more operating costs upon themselves in the likes of Dresden upgrades, possible ATI purchase, possible Big Apple fab, etc. Granted, some of these moves are speculative, but if they don't materialize, the affect will come in the form of negative perception...and they can't afford too much of that with such a short history of success. Should be interesting to watch though.


In short APM (Automated Process Management) - AMDs brand of FAB control is worth the time. It beat Intel for 2-3 years.
June 7, 2006 4:26:50 PM

Quote:
AMD is now probably doing what the Inquirer said they were doing months ago - piling up chips for Dell. You don't think they will b pushing low end out of Chartered/FAB 38 and high end out of FAB 36 but want to pile up a little of the new stock before discontinuing old stock?


Ok, what ever you say.... I don't have the energy to argue

I'm feeling argumentative (shocked, aren't you?) so I'll make this quick comment: If AMD is stockpiling 65nm, then I'd expect them to have released engineering samples to reviewers already. They wouldn't want to give up a bunch of sales to Conroe. And don't doubt for a nanosecond that if a 65nm AM2 product rumored to be competitive with Conroe was available at about the same time, it would hurt Conroe sales. The engineering sample benchmarks would only need to be in the ballpark.

It is simply really, going 65 nm automatically doubles your output and improves your performance, and lowers your costs. AMD would but utterly stupid not to be selling 65 nm if they did in fact have it running. The finanical incentive alone is simply too much.

We know this is not the case, because Hector himself said in the April 5 announcement paraphrased of course, "We are targetting Q2 2006 to install fab kits to BEGIN printing 65 nm die...", that's likely happening right now...then there is debug, yield, etc.

Add on top of this that AMD still needs to squeeze another 10-15% in performance to meet ITRS based on IEDM 2005 and they still have some work to do.

Jack

Word.
June 7, 2006 5:09:19 PM

Quote:
AMD is now probably doing what the Inquirer said they were doing months ago - piling up chips for Dell. You don't think they will b pushing low end out of Chartered/FAB 38 and high end out of FAB 36 but want to pile up a little of the new stock before discontinuing old stock?


Ok, what ever you say.... I don't have the energy to argue

I'm feeling argumentative (shocked, aren't you?) so I'll make this quick comment: If AMD is stockpiling 65nm, then I'd expect them to have released engineering samples to reviewers already. They wouldn't want to give up a bunch of sales to Conroe. And don't doubt for a nanosecond that if a 65nm AM2 product rumored to be competitive with Conroe was available at about the same time, it would hurt Conroe sales. The engineering sample benchmarks would only need to be in the ballpark.

It is simply really, going 65 nm automatically doubles your output and improves your performance, and lowers your costs. AMD would but utterly stupid not to be selling 65 nm if they did in fact have it running. The finanical incentive alone is simply too much.

We know this is not the case, because Hector himself said in the April 5 announcement paraphrased of course, "We are targetting Q2 2006 to install fab kits to BEGIN printing 65 nm die...", that's likely happening right now...then there is debug, yield, etc.

Add on top of this that AMD still needs to squeeze another 10-15% in performance to meet ITRS based on IEDM 2005 and they still have some work to do.

Jack

Word.


Look at what will happen when COnroe comes out. Intel won't be able to give away P4/PD systems. AMD is taking an evolutionary approach. It takes 3-6 months to qualify and engineer systems. If they want K8L out to OEMs in Dec, they have to be at least at the first spin.

SInce when has AMD EVER been forthcoming with info on unreleased products. I figure we'll start hearing about 65nm AND K8L samples within the next 2 months.

I mean no one believed when I said their may be a socket added for coProcs or extra procs for high end desktops/workstations then a few weeks later AMD intros 4X4. And now ATi has the opportunity to make X1600s to fit in a coProc socket or HTX slot for physics. nVidia ought to make some noise about it soon too. They already have flip chips.

Anyway, we'll all see soon enough. I'm not being paid for this so it doesn't matter THAT much but obviously you don't understand current stock vs. new stock(SKUs). AMD should not REACT to Intel they should act on the momentum Opteron/X2 has given them. That means stick to the schedule. That maybe why they have delayed shipments of high end AM2, so that a new rev could be in place. Besides the current Opteron is still owning the server market in perf/watt so they can afford to be "late." I'm actually surprised that they haven't qualified for 1066 DDR2. That could be the delay also. Again we'll all see soon enough.

Thx for listening
June 7, 2006 5:22:05 PM

Quote:
AMD is now probably doing what the Inquirer said they were doing months ago - piling up chips for Dell. You don't think they will b pushing low end out of Chartered/FAB 38 and high end out of FAB 36 but want to pile up a little of the new stock before discontinuing old stock?


If they want K8L out to OEMs in Dec, they have to be at least at the first spin.

SInce when has AMD EVER been forthcoming with info on unreleased products. I figure we'll start hearing about 65nm AND K8L samples within the next 2 months.

Waitaminute! Which is it? Are they stockpiling CPUs for Dell or are they trying to get the process to commercial yield? You seem to be speculating all over the map.
June 7, 2006 5:32:16 PM

Quote:
AMD is now probably doing what the Inquirer said they were doing months ago - piling up chips for Dell. You don't think they will b pushing low end out of Chartered/FAB 38 and high end out of FAB 36 but want to pile up a little of the new stock before discontinuing old stock?


If they want K8L out to OEMs in Dec, they have to be at least at the first spin.

SInce when has AMD EVER been forthcoming with info on unreleased products. I figure we'll start hearing about 65nm AND K8L samples within the next 2 months.

Waitaminute! Which is it? Are they stockpiling CPUs for Dell or are they trying to get the process to commercial yield? You seem to be speculating all over the map.


It sounds like the same thign to me. On the one hand we have X2/FX/Sempron/TurionX2. On the other hand you have Opteron/K8L. SInce the release date for K8L to OEMs is Dec along with the 65nm X2, then they have to have a spin or two in the labs at least. Piling up doesn't mean sending them to Dell.

I don't work for AMD or Intel so ALL I have is speculation based on industry trends, roadmaps, Analyst Day, the importance of OEM support, the deal with Chartered, the relationship wth nVidia, etc.

To the person who said they are due to BEGIN installing masks in Q2 that started in April or about two months ago. AMD is reporting working SRAM -of course they may be lying - and that they are still on track with the roadmap, what more do you want?

Computex showed off several Opteron servers, and with the way people feel about Intel reporters would have heard that there were "inherent" problems with SocketF. The AM2 launch was moved forward almost a month so what does that mean?
June 7, 2006 7:47:05 PM

Quote:
AMD is now probably doing what the Inquirer said they were doing months ago - piling up chips for Dell. You don't think they will b pushing low end out of Chartered/FAB 38 and high end out of FAB 36 but want to pile up a little of the new stock before discontinuing old stock?


Ok, what ever you say.... I don't have the energy to argue

I'm feeling argumentative (shocked, aren't you?) so I'll make this quick comment: If AMD is stockpiling 65nm, then I'd expect them to have released engineering samples to reviewers already. They wouldn't want to give up a bunch of sales to Conroe. And don't doubt for a nanosecond that if a 65nm AM2 product rumored to be competitive with Conroe was available at about the same time, it would hurt Conroe sales. The engineering sample benchmarks would only need to be in the ballpark.

It is simply really, going 65 nm automatically doubles your output and improves your performance, and lowers your costs. AMD would but utterly stupid not to be selling 65 nm if they did in fact have it running. The finanical incentive alone is simply too much.

We know this is not the case, because Hector himself said in the April 5 announcement paraphrased of course, "We are targetting Q2 2006 to install fab kits to BEGIN printing 65 nm die...", that's likely happening right now...then there is debug, yield, etc.

Add on top of this that AMD still needs to squeeze another 10-15% in performance to meet ITRS based on IEDM 2005 and they still have some work to do.

Jack

Word.


Look at what will happen when COnroe comes out. Intel won't be able to give away P4/PD systems. AMD is taking an evolutionary approach. It takes 3-6 months to qualify and engineer systems. If they want K8L out to OEMs in Dec, they have to be at least at the first spin.

SInce when has AMD EVER been forthcoming with info on unreleased products. I figure we'll start hearing about 65nm AND K8L samples within the next 2 months.

I mean no one believed when I said their may be a socket added for coProcs or extra procs for high end desktops/workstations then a few weeks later AMD intros 4X4. And now ATi has the opportunity to make X1600s to fit in a coProc socket or HTX slot for physics. nVidia ought to make some noise about it soon too. They already have flip chips.

Anyway, we'll all see soon enough. I'm not being paid for this so it doesn't matter THAT much but obviously you don't understand current stock vs. new stock(SKUs). AMD should not REACT to Intel they should act on the momentum Opteron/X2 has given them. That means stick to the schedule. That maybe why they have delayed shipments of high end AM2, so that a new rev could be in place. Besides the current Opteron is still owning the server market in perf/watt so they can afford to be "late." I'm actually surprised that they haven't qualified for 1066 DDR2. That could be the delay also. Again we'll all see soon enough.

Thx for listening

Sure they will be able to sell Pentium D based machines, heres a secret... North America isnt the only nation that buys CPU's, even poor people can buy computers and poor people won't know that the Pentium D they have is slow in comparison to the Core 2.

OMG did you just say 3-6 months to quality check the K8L for a December launch? I will say it now IMPOSSIBLE!!! 100% in fact. AMD needs to redesign the entire K8 to meet the K8L promises; normal architecture revamps take 4-7 years. Then lets say for a moment AMD has a working engineering sample of the K8L it will take 12-18 months to just qualify the silicon for production and that’s if everything goes smoothly.

The K8 springs to mind I think I was reading about it back in 1999 even maybe later, and I figure your figure is out to lunch sadly.

AM2 supply issues have to do with AMD's inability to supply them. Yup that’s something AMD needs 1066 DDR2 when they are wasting the current bandwidth that DDR 800 offers.
June 7, 2006 8:19:36 PM

OMG, teh pwnt?
June 7, 2006 8:42:25 PM

Quote:
AMD is now probably doing what the Inquirer said they were doing months ago - piling up chips for Dell. You don't think they will b pushing low end out of Chartered/FAB 38 and high end out of FAB 36 but want to pile up a little of the new stock before discontinuing old stock?


Ok, what ever you say.... I don't have the energy to argue

I'm feeling argumentative (shocked, aren't you?) so I'll make this quick comment: If AMD is stockpiling 65nm, then I'd expect them to have released engineering samples to reviewers already. They wouldn't want to give up a bunch of sales to Conroe. And don't doubt for a nanosecond that if a 65nm AM2 product rumored to be competitive with Conroe was available at about the same time, it would hurt Conroe sales. The engineering sample benchmarks would only need to be in the ballpark.

It is simply really, going 65 nm automatically doubles your output and improves your performance, and lowers your costs. AMD would but utterly stupid not to be selling 65 nm if they did in fact have it running. The finanical incentive alone is simply too much.

We know this is not the case, because Hector himself said in the April 5 announcement paraphrased of course, "We are targetting Q2 2006 to install fab kits to BEGIN printing 65 nm die...", that's likely happening right now...then there is debug, yield, etc.

Add on top of this that AMD still needs to squeeze another 10-15% in performance to meet ITRS based on IEDM 2005 and they still have some work to do.

Jack

Word.


Look at what will happen when COnroe comes out. Intel won't be able to give away P4/PD systems. AMD is taking an evolutionary approach. It takes 3-6 months to qualify and engineer systems. If they want K8L out to OEMs in Dec, they have to be at least at the first spin.

SInce when has AMD EVER been forthcoming with info on unreleased products. I figure we'll start hearing about 65nm AND K8L samples within the next 2 months.

I mean no one believed when I said their may be a socket added for coProcs or extra procs for high end desktops/workstations then a few weeks later AMD intros 4X4. And now ATi has the opportunity to make X1600s to fit in a coProc socket or HTX slot for physics. nVidia ought to make some noise about it soon too. They already have flip chips.

Anyway, we'll all see soon enough. I'm not being paid for this so it doesn't matter THAT much but obviously you don't understand current stock vs. new stock(SKUs). AMD should not REACT to Intel they should act on the momentum Opteron/X2 has given them. That means stick to the schedule. That maybe why they have delayed shipments of high end AM2, so that a new rev could be in place. Besides the current Opteron is still owning the server market in perf/watt so they can afford to be "late." I'm actually surprised that they haven't qualified for 1066 DDR2. That could be the delay also. Again we'll all see soon enough.

Thx for listening

Sure they will be able to sell Pentium D based machines, heres a secret... North America isnt the only nation that buys CPU's, even poor people can buy computers and poor people won't know that the Pentium D they have is slow in comparison to the Core 2.

OMG did you just say 3-6 months to quality check the K8L for a December launch? I will say it now IMPOSSIBLE!!! 100% in fact. AMD needs to redesign the entire K8 to meet the K8L promises; normal architecture revamps take 4-7 years. Then lets say for a moment AMD has a working engineering sample of the K8L it will take 12-18 months to just qualify the silicon for production and that’s if everything goes smoothly.

The K8 springs to mind I think I was reading about it back in 1999 even maybe later, and I figure your figure is out to lunch sadly.

AM2 supply issues have to do with AMD's inability to supply them. Yup that’s something AMD needs 1066 DDR2 when they are wasting the current bandwidth that DDR 800 offers.


Still you listen not. When did people get Conroes for qualification? Or AM2 or K8 or Prescott? Usually 3-6 months before the proposed launch. AMD reported that FAB36 was producing revenue in Apr on 300mm. Another of the butt boy crew posted that they were scheduled to install 65nm masks in Apr, hmmmmm. Several news stories have them moving things to FAB 36 for more room in FAB38.


Wait you mean, Intel started working on Core 2 in 2002-1999 (4-7 years)? Oh no you mean that AMD takes that long so they were working on K8 in 1996-1999.

Oh no you mean they are making things up whenthey say that they expect K8L and 65nm X2s in Dec of this year for OEMs?

The point is that even if they can get rid of them they will take a bath or Conroe will be EXPENSIVE due to lack of supply. The roadmap at Anandtech shows the 965EE and Core 2 Extreme to be THE SAME PRICE in Dec ($995). How the heck will that work? Core 2 Extreme will more than kill 965EE and MAYBE the same mobo.
June 7, 2006 8:56:29 PM

Quote:
AMD is now probably doing what the Inquirer said they were doing months ago - piling up chips for Dell. You don't think they will b pushing low end out of Chartered/FAB 38 and high end out of FAB 36 but want to pile up a little of the new stock before discontinuing old stock?


Ok, what ever you say.... I don't have the energy to argue

I'm feeling argumentative (shocked, aren't you?) so I'll make this quick comment: If AMD is stockpiling 65nm, then I'd expect them to have released engineering samples to reviewers already. They wouldn't want to give up a bunch of sales to Conroe. And don't doubt for a nanosecond that if a 65nm AM2 product rumored to be competitive with Conroe was available at about the same time, it would hurt Conroe sales. The engineering sample benchmarks would only need to be in the ballpark.

It is simply really, going 65 nm automatically doubles your output and improves your performance, and lowers your costs. AMD would but utterly stupid not to be selling 65 nm if they did in fact have it running. The finanical incentive alone is simply too much.

We know this is not the case, because Hector himself said in the April 5 announcement paraphrased of course, "We are targetting Q2 2006 to install fab kits to BEGIN printing 65 nm die...", that's likely happening right now...then there is debug, yield, etc.

Add on top of this that AMD still needs to squeeze another 10-15% in performance to meet ITRS based on IEDM 2005 and they still have some work to do.

Jack

Word.


Look at what will happen when COnroe comes out. Intel won't be able to give away P4/PD systems. AMD is taking an evolutionary approach. It takes 3-6 months to qualify and engineer systems. If they want K8L out to OEMs in Dec, they have to be at least at the first spin.

SInce when has AMD EVER been forthcoming with info on unreleased products. I figure we'll start hearing about 65nm AND K8L samples within the next 2 months.

I mean no one believed when I said their may be a socket added for coProcs or extra procs for high end desktops/workstations then a few weeks later AMD intros 4X4. And now ATi has the opportunity to make X1600s to fit in a coProc socket or HTX slot for physics. nVidia ought to make some noise about it soon too. They already have flip chips.

Anyway, we'll all see soon enough. I'm not being paid for this so it doesn't matter THAT much but obviously you don't understand current stock vs. new stock(SKUs). AMD should not REACT to Intel they should act on the momentum Opteron/X2 has given them. That means stick to the schedule. That maybe why they have delayed shipments of high end AM2, so that a new rev could be in place. Besides the current Opteron is still owning the server market in perf/watt so they can afford to be "late." I'm actually surprised that they haven't qualified for 1066 DDR2. That could be the delay also. Again we'll all see soon enough.

Thx for listening

Sure they will be able to sell Pentium D based machines, heres a secret... North America isnt the only nation that buys CPU's, even poor people can buy computers and poor people won't know that the Pentium D they have is slow in comparison to the Core 2.

OMG did you just say 3-6 months to quality check the K8L for a December launch? I will say it now IMPOSSIBLE!!! 100% in fact. AMD needs to redesign the entire K8 to meet the K8L promises; normal architecture revamps take 4-7 years. Then lets say for a moment AMD has a working engineering sample of the K8L it will take 12-18 months to just qualify the silicon for production and that’s if everything goes smoothly.

The K8 springs to mind I think I was reading about it back in 1999 even maybe later, and I figure your figure is out to lunch sadly.

AM2 supply issues have to do with AMD's inability to supply them. Yup that’s something AMD needs 1066 DDR2 when they are wasting the current bandwidth that DDR 800 offers.


Still you listen not. When did people get Conroes for qualification? Or AM2 or K8 or Prescott? Usually 3-6 months before the proposed launch. AMD reported that FAB36 was producing revenue in Apr on 300mm. Another of the butt boy crew posted that they were scheduled to install 65nm masks in Apr, hmmmmm. Several news stories have them moving things to FAB 36 for more room in FAB38.


Wait you mean, Intel started working on Core 2 in 2002-1999 (4-7 years)? Oh no you mean that AMD takes that long so they were working on K8 in 1996-1999.

Oh no you mean they are making things up whenthey say that they expect K8L and 65nm X2s in Dec of this year for OEMs?

The point is that even if they can get rid of them they will take a bath or Conroe will be EXPENSIVE due to lack of supply. The roadmap at Anandtech shows the 965EE and Core 2 Extreme to be THE SAME PRICE in Dec ($995). How the heck will that work? Core 2 Extreme will more than kill 965EE and MAYBE the same mobo.

Ok fine if you honestly believe AMD can get the K8L out this year so be it im tired of the back and forth match.

Now Intel started on the Core 2 in 2002, on a side note the K8 was in development for nearly 9-10 years before AMD finally released it.

Yes that’s what I am getting at I firmly believe AMD needs more time to get 0.65u ramped and with decent yields, more specifically late Q1 07 to early Q3 07, is something I find plausible for AMD.

Not sure I don't price the CPU's so your guess is as good as mine.
June 7, 2006 9:17:38 PM

Quote:
AMD is now probably doing what the Inquirer said they were doing months ago - piling up chips for Dell. You don't think they will b pushing low end out of Chartered/FAB 38 and high end out of FAB 36 but want to pile up a little of the new stock before discontinuing old stock?


Ok, what ever you say.... I don't have the energy to argue

I'm feeling argumentative (shocked, aren't you?) so I'll make this quick comment: If AMD is stockpiling 65nm, then I'd expect them to have released engineering samples to reviewers already. They wouldn't want to give up a bunch of sales to Conroe. And don't doubt for a nanosecond that if a 65nm AM2 product rumored to be competitive with Conroe was available at about the same time, it would hurt Conroe sales. The engineering sample benchmarks would only need to be in the ballpark.

It is simply really, going 65 nm automatically doubles your output and improves your performance, and lowers your costs. AMD would but utterly stupid not to be selling 65 nm if they did in fact have it running. The finanical incentive alone is simply too much.

We know this is not the case, because Hector himself said in the April 5 announcement paraphrased of course, "We are targetting Q2 2006 to install fab kits to BEGIN printing 65 nm die...", that's likely happening right now...then there is debug, yield, etc.

Add on top of this that AMD still needs to squeeze another 10-15% in performance to meet ITRS based on IEDM 2005 and they still have some work to do.

Jack

Word.


Look at what will happen when COnroe comes out. Intel won't be able to give away P4/PD systems. AMD is taking an evolutionary approach. It takes 3-6 months to qualify and engineer systems. If they want K8L out to OEMs in Dec, they have to be at least at the first spin.

SInce when has AMD EVER been forthcoming with info on unreleased products. I figure we'll start hearing about 65nm AND K8L samples within the next 2 months.

I mean no one believed when I said their may be a socket added for coProcs or extra procs for high end desktops/workstations then a few weeks later AMD intros 4X4. And now ATi has the opportunity to make X1600s to fit in a coProc socket or HTX slot for physics. nVidia ought to make some noise about it soon too. They already have flip chips.

Anyway, we'll all see soon enough. I'm not being paid for this so it doesn't matter THAT much but obviously you don't understand current stock vs. new stock(SKUs). AMD should not REACT to Intel they should act on the momentum Opteron/X2 has given them. That means stick to the schedule. That maybe why they have delayed shipments of high end AM2, so that a new rev could be in place. Besides the current Opteron is still owning the server market in perf/watt so they can afford to be "late." I'm actually surprised that they haven't qualified for 1066 DDR2. That could be the delay also. Again we'll all see soon enough.

Thx for listening

Sure they will be able to sell Pentium D based machines, heres a secret... North America isnt the only nation that buys CPU's, even poor people can buy computers and poor people won't know that the Pentium D they have is slow in comparison to the Core 2.

OMG did you just say 3-6 months to quality check the K8L for a December launch? I will say it now IMPOSSIBLE!!! 100% in fact. AMD needs to redesign the entire K8 to meet the K8L promises; normal architecture revamps take 4-7 years. Then lets say for a moment AMD has a working engineering sample of the K8L it will take 12-18 months to just qualify the silicon for production and that’s if everything goes smoothly.

The K8 springs to mind I think I was reading about it back in 1999 even maybe later, and I figure your figure is out to lunch sadly.

AM2 supply issues have to do with AMD's inability to supply them. Yup that’s something AMD needs 1066 DDR2 when they are wasting the current bandwidth that DDR 800 offers.


Still you listen not. When did people get Conroes for qualification? Or AM2 or K8 or Prescott? Usually 3-6 months before the proposed launch. AMD reported that FAB36 was producing revenue in Apr on 300mm. Another of the butt boy crew posted that they were scheduled to install 65nm masks in Apr, hmmmmm. Several news stories have them moving things to FAB 36 for more room in FAB38.


Wait you mean, Intel started working on Core 2 in 2002-1999 (4-7 years)? Oh no you mean that AMD takes that long so they were working on K8 in 1996-1999.

Oh no you mean they are making things up whenthey say that they expect K8L and 65nm X2s in Dec of this year for OEMs?

The point is that even if they can get rid of them they will take a bath or Conroe will be EXPENSIVE due to lack of supply. The roadmap at Anandtech shows the 965EE and Core 2 Extreme to be THE SAME PRICE in Dec ($995). How the heck will that work? Core 2 Extreme will more than kill 965EE and MAYBE the same mobo.

Ok fine if you honestly believe AMD can get the K8L out this year so be it im tired of the back and forth match.

Now Intel started on the Core 2 in 2002, on a side note the K8 was in development for nearly 9-10 years before AMD finally released it.

Yes that’s what I am getting at I firmly believe AMD needs more time to get 0.65u ramped and with decent yields, more specifically late Q1 07 to early Q3 07, is something I find plausible for AMD.

Not sure I don't price the CPU's so your guess is as good as mine. Quoting makes your ePenis bigger. So, keep it up (pun intended).
June 7, 2006 10:06:26 PM

Quote:
Ok fine if you honestly believe AMD can get the K8L out this year so be it im tired of the back and forth match.

Now Intel started on the Core 2 in 2002, on a side note the K8 was in development for nearly 9-10 years before AMD finally released it.

Yes that’s what I am getting at I firmly believe AMD needs more time to get 0.65u ramped and with decent yields, more specifically late Q1 07 to early Q3 07, is something I find plausible for AMD.

Not sure I don't price the CPU's so your guess is as good as mine.



OK. Fine. I guess I just don't remeber hearing about this core when they were doing Northwood. 9-10 years before K8 there was no EV6 bus. The K8 was based from the ground up on EV6.


AMD said recently the Taiwanese OEMs should be getting K8L in Dec. They also said on Anandtech that 65nm X2s would be out around the same time (only a few SKUs though). They could be lying or exaggerating. I don't know.
June 7, 2006 11:41:45 PM

Quote:
SInce the release date for K8L to OEMs is Dec

would you like to share some drugs with us, pls? :p 
June 8, 2006 1:51:43 AM

Quote:
SInce the release date for K8L to OEMs is Dec

would you like to share some drugs with us, pls? :p 

I would say that drugs seem to be more your forte. I mean your avatar really looks psychedelic, if you know what I mean?
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