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"Core 2 Duo May Not Launch Until September"

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June 11, 2006 5:42:29 PM

Well, Intel messed up again with their core2 launch. :wink:
This news didn't surprise me since they've stated that they could only supply 20% of conroes on the remaining of this year due to excess of crappy netburst processors.

Quote:
Intel's eagerly anticipcated Conroe processor may not launch until September if the talk of the town proves to be true.

We have heard many suggestions about when Intel will launch its Core 2 Duo processors, but none of the suggested dates seemed to make sense to us. The only time frame that has been officially confirmed by Intel is when it expects to ship to its OEM customers.

This is expected to happen in July, but the date is not set in stone. At the same time, the company stated that it wanted to make sure its customers had ample time to build high quality machines in readiness for launch. This seems to back up what we've heard on the show floor.

If Intel was to ship its products to system integrators at the end of July, it would give them over a month to make sure that they were happy with, and ready to ship, Core 2 Duo-based systems as soon as Intel waves the green flag.

July also seems too soon for other chipset providers, too. This is because - apart from the reference designs - we have not seen a single motherboard design based on either ATI's RD600 / SB600 combination, or NVIDIA's nForce 590 SLI Intel Edition.

Intel has been very open about how well Conroe performs; in fact, we were given the chance to benchmark a Core 2 Duo E6700 processor in Munich last month. The company was showing how well it performed on the P965 chipset at the 965 Express chipset launch yesterday, too.


http://www.bit-tech.net/news/2006/06/08/core_2_duo_launch/
June 11, 2006 5:48:04 PM

If this is true, than this is good news for you and bad for me. :( 
June 11, 2006 5:49:31 PM

Quote:
If this is true, than this is good news for you and bad for me. :( 


LOL.
Related resources
June 11, 2006 5:50:35 PM

Quote:
Well, Intel messed up again with their core2 launch. :wink:
This news didn't surprise me since they've stated that they could only supply 20% of conroes on the remaining of this year due to excess of crappy netburst processors.

Intel's eagerly anticipcated Conroe processor may not launch until September if the talk of the town proves to be true.

We have heard many suggestions about when Intel will launch its Core 2 Duo processors, but none of the suggested dates seemed to make sense to us. The only time frame that has been officially confirmed by Intel is when it expects to ship to its OEM customers.

This is expected to happen in July, but the date is not set in stone. At the same time, the company stated that it wanted to make sure its customers had ample time to build high quality machines in readiness for launch. This seems to back up what we've heard on the show floor.

If Intel was to ship its products to system integrators at the end of July, it would give them over a month to make sure that they were happy with, and ready to ship, Core 2 Duo-based systems as soon as Intel waves the green flag.

July also seems too soon for other chipset providers, too. This is because - apart from the reference designs - we have not seen a single motherboard design based on either ATI's RD600 / SB600 combination, or NVIDIA's nForce 590 SLI Intel Edition.

Intel has been very open about how well Conroe performs; in fact, we were given the chance to benchmark a Core 2 Duo E6700 processor in Munich last month. The company was showing how well it performed on the P965 chipset at the 965 Express chipset launch yesterday, too.


http://www.bit-tech.net/news/2006/06/08/core_2_duo_launch/

F**K you Intel. You make me wait soo long for something i'll get as a gift and now i end up waiting until next year. July=October for reserves to ship
September= January for reserves to ship
June 11, 2006 6:00:18 PM

It's too bad that their investors have so much control over the company.
June 11, 2006 6:00:25 PM

Owned by the facts.
June 11, 2006 6:10:02 PM

Quote:
Owned by the facts.
Hey 9-inch is crying now.


you are so evil jack. 9nm was happy like little child with big icecream, but for only short time. you have destroyed everything jack.

Sad isn't it. You bastad you hurt his feelings go apoligize now.
June 11, 2006 6:21:24 PM


you are so evil jack. 9nm was happy like little child with big icecream, but for only short time. you have destroyed everything jack.

Sad isn't it.

Not really. he posted a story he thought was relevant and it turned out he was wrong. Not really a big deal or anything.........
June 11, 2006 6:23:16 PM



We have to wait and see, but I really doubt intel will release conroe this july with full supply of it. They will definately have a hard time delivering these to everyone becasue no one is interested in netburts even if they cost $10. :wink:
The same thing happened with yonah: you couldnt't buy the suckers after 2 months becasue there were not enough of them since the big OEMs were buying them all.
June 11, 2006 6:25:03 PM



We have to wait and see, but I really doubt intel will release conroe this july with full supply of it. They will definately have a hard time delivering these to everyone becasue no one is interested in netburts even if they cost $10. :wink:
and no one is interested in K8, even the FX-62 cost $1200. :wink:
June 11, 2006 6:27:02 PM



We have to wait and see, but I really doubt intel will release conroe this july with full supply of it. They will definately have a hard time delivering these to everyone becasue no one is interested in netburts even if they cost $10. :wink:

Most people don't care :wink: My mum just bought my P4 2.8C off me the other day. Didn't ask whether it was as good as an Athlon 64 or a Conroe..... she just wanted a PC that was a lot faster than her last one :) 

But I agree. You most likely won't be able to go to Newegg or into your local PC shop and buy a Conroe on the day. This is the same with most product launches of this type however.
June 11, 2006 6:27:35 PM



We have to wait and see, but I really doubt intel will release conroe this july with full supply of it. They will definately have a hard time delivering these to everyone becasue no one is interested in netburts even if they cost $10. :wink:
and no one is interested in K8, even the FX-62 cost $1200. :wink:

I don't know where are you coming up with this (I gues is just pernal thoughts) becasue AMD IS selling everyone of them. Even if intel launchs conroe in july it won't hurt AMD's sales of AM2 processors.
June 11, 2006 6:28:30 PM

Quote:
and no one is interested in K8, even the FX-62 cost $1200.


Yeah but as soon as Conroe is released it will drop like a rock, probably to $500.
June 11, 2006 6:28:58 PM



We have to wait and see, but I really doubt intel will release conroe this july with full supply of it. They will definately have a hard time delivering these to everyone becasue no one is interested in netburts even if they cost $10. :wink:
and no one is interested in K8, even the FX-62 cost $1200. :wink:

I don't know where are you coming up with this (I gues is just pernal thoughts) becasue AMD IS selling everyone of them. Even if intel launchs conroe in july it won't hurt AMD's sales of AM2 processors.
yeah right, we are going to use the same drugs like you, so we will became AMD adictive.
June 11, 2006 6:32:19 PM

Quote:



Most people don't care :wink: My mum just bought my P4 2.8C off me the other day..

You SOLD a pc to your MUM ?!? :|

Yes :) 

It's a
P4 2.8C
1Gb of RAM
256mb 6600GT
200 Gb HDD
Antec 1080AMG case
Antec PSU

Kinda thing you don't just give away.

I wanted to sell. She wanted to buy. Both people happy :) 
June 11, 2006 6:33:51 PM



We have to wait and see, but I really doubt intel will release conroe this july with full supply of it. They will definately have a hard time delivering these to everyone becasue no one is interested in netburts even if they cost $10. :wink:
and no one is interested in K8, even the FX-62 cost $1200. :wink:

I don't know where are you coming up with this (I gues is just pernal thoughts) becasue AMD IS selling everyone of them. Even if intel launchs conroe in july it won't hurt AMD's sales of AM2 processors.
yeah right, we are going to use the same drugs like you, so we will became AMD adictive.

I'm not inventing this, just do a search on AMD's increasing market share and earnings. Even AMD's stock is growing higher than intel's. Intel is still below $19. You don't need to have a Ph.D in economics to know this. :wink:
June 11, 2006 6:38:47 PM

Quote:
and no one is interested in K8, even the FX-62 cost $1200.


Yeah but as soon as Conroe is released it will drop like a rock, probably to $500.

As I said before, AMD doesn't have to drop their prices on the FX line of processors. All AMD has to do is rebrand them as X2s or decrease the price a bit for the older ones but keep the same price for the new (higher-clocked) FXs.
June 11, 2006 6:59:47 PM

It's June 11th. You know, I couldn't help but wonder why you decided to post a news article from June 8th when the rebuttal from the same website invalidated it on June 10th. Usually, more recent news stories are at the top for easy access. I guess you just missed it.

Anyways, I'm going to be looking at the Woodcrest launch in a week to give some indication of how Conroe will do. I hope they've finally got that FB-DIMM availability issue cleared up. Good supply of 667MHz memory will be important since Woodcrest reviews up to now have been using 533MHz FB-DIMMs which were for Dempsey.
June 11, 2006 7:16:31 PM

Quote:
The only way things could go back to the way they were is if Intel now cripples AMD to the point of bankruptcy. Based on the pricing, product line-up and it's pricing, it looks like they are trying to do that.


This is not the first time intel have made this (as a desperate decission) butt still AMD succeeded
June 11, 2006 7:20:26 PM

Quote:
It's June 11th. You know, I couldn't help but wonder why you decided to post a news article from June 8th when the rebuttal from the same website invalidated it on June 10th. Usually, more recent news stories are at the top for easy access. I guess you just missed it.


Becasue it seems unlikely that intel will have enough room to supply these chips to everyone. August-September is a good timeframe for full conroe availability, not july.
June 11, 2006 7:25:22 PM

Quote:
Owned by the facts.
Hey 9-inch is crying now.


you are so evil jack. 9nm was happy like little child with big icecream, but for only short time. you have destroyed everything jack.

Sad isn't it. You bastad you hurt his feelings go apoligize now.
:lol:  :lol:  :lol: 

I'm sorry that the truth got in the way.... no hard feelings :)  Ya but sometimes it's better to be ignorant and happy then well informed and sad.
June 11, 2006 7:32:11 PM

Such hostility!!! Just tell your mommy and daddy to buy you another
AMD then. It's very frustrating seeing these pre-release benchmarks, and not being part of it.
June 11, 2006 7:36:28 PM

Quote:
Ya but sometimes it's better to be ignorant and happy then well informed and sad.


You see, now THIS I can appreciate.... honesty. Sometime is it good for the state of mind just not to know :)  Thanks man like if i did'nt know about the other me's i would've been alot happier.
June 11, 2006 7:40:19 PM

Quote:
If this is true, than this is good news for you and bad for me. :( 


LOL.

Laughing at you, when conroe ever gets released. If conroe is for real,
Then... 9-inch, get in touch with your feelings, and come to the dark side.

If you buy AMD, because it's an AMD. :lol:  :lol:  :lol: 

If you buy INtel, because it's better. I'm still :lol:  :lol:  :lol: 
June 11, 2006 7:43:27 PM

Quote:
Becasue it seems unlikely that intel will have enough room to supply these chips to everyone. August-September is a good timeframe for full conroe availability, not july.

Yes, well launch and availability have always been different things. As JumpingJack has pointed out, even AMD is not immune to supply difficulties with their launch products.

However, what is significantly different is that you were indicating in your title a September launch. In that case, Intel would be targeting Christmas season with full availability. With the launch planned in July, with availability as you say in August and September, the target is then back-to school season. Those are quite different and will mean a revenue comes in a quarter earlier. What we will be looking for in the Christmas season is a new 2.93GHz E6800 65W part and a 3.2GHz X6900 Extreme Edition. (Again, why Intel allowed the E6800/X6800 overlap is beyond me).

Personally, I'm looking for a notebook in the back to school season so I'm hoping Merom hard launches. The fact that Merom is a drop in replacement for Yonah parts should make the transition a lot quicker than Conroe in the desktop market.
June 11, 2006 7:48:28 PM

Quote:
It's June 11th. You know, I couldn't help but wonder why you decided to post a news article from June 8th when the rebuttal from the same website invalidated it on June 10th. Usually, more recent news stories are at the top for easy access. I guess you just missed it.


Becasue it seems unlikely that intel will have enough room to supply these chips to everyone. August-September is a good timeframe for full conroe availability, not july.

Hey 9-inch, have we seen a huge supply of AM2's, energy efficient AM2's, or even Turion X2's sinch launch?

You happen to be correct, but you should call it both ways :wink:

The problem with the energy-efficient X2s is that they're been bought by OEMs for them to build SFF. This is also the case with the Turion X2. As I said before, OEMs are first, retail later.

Anyhow, there's a good availability of AM2 processors:
http://www.zipzoomfly.com
www.newegg.com
June 11, 2006 8:26:06 PM

Jack if u google the part number ADD3800IAT5CU, ADD3800CUBOX, you'll finda few sites which supposedly have these chips available. Nothing like Newegg or NCIX seems to have them yet.
June 11, 2006 8:28:49 PM

You got owned.
June 11, 2006 8:28:49 PM

Quote:
Anyhow, there's a good availability of AM2 processors:
http://www.zipzoomfly.com
www.newegg.com

That is good availability, but it's hardly full availability. We're still not seeing the whole AM2 product line. Certainly the X2 4000+ and X2 4800+ are missing. ZipZoomFly is also missing the X2 4400+ while Newegg seems to have just added it, but it's very overpriced. Something like $70 above MSRP and almost as much as the X2 4600+. Good availability also doesn't explain why the FX62 is retailing for $1220 at Newegg which is $189 above MSRP. Even the 965EE is only selling for $1045 or $46 above MSRP.
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June 11, 2006 8:44:49 PM

Quote:
Well, Intel messed up again with their core2 launch. :wink:
This news didn't surprise me since they've stated that they could only supply 20% of conroes on the remaining of this year due to excess of crappy netburst processors.



Bit-tech.net followup article:

Conroe isn't late after all

DO'H !!!!!
June 11, 2006 8:57:19 PM

So the recap AM2 seems to be available but may require more effort than say finding a P4 to get what you want. AM2 EE chips are around but good luck finding one. Conroe will launch on the 23rd of july and may dent AMD's sales but they have the momentum right now to keep them selling at least as fast as they can make them. IMO Conroe will WOW everyone with it's performance but will underwelm people with it's availability. Intel will sit on their P4 stock and let it trickle out before really ramping up conroe to full capacity in Q1 07. Sound about right? As far as LV chips go I'd say AMD has no worries because although they will lose to conroe(initially) with performance and performance/watt, they will still be competing with netburst for volume sales this year.
June 11, 2006 8:59:43 PM

Quote:
You got owned.
No he did'nt.
June 11, 2006 9:13:53 PM

5 cents, thats pricy, especially if its in US. I'll give you 5 cents AUD.
June 11, 2006 9:17:08 PM

Quote:
You got owned.
No he did'nt.

:lol:  :lol:  Being owned is in the eye of the beholder ... which, if one is owned does that not mean he can be sold ... Ok, I shall start the bidding...

I shall sell 9-inch for $ 0.05, going once.... 1$!
June 11, 2006 9:28:54 PM

$1.00? He isn't even worth that much. Not by far. As said before 5 cents most for his effort in trying to put down Intel. But Failed. Next time research the place you found your 'source'. Too Bad.. :( 

I'll be having a good time with my conroe when he has his little AMD

like he said before 'owned'.
June 11, 2006 9:31:46 PM

Quote:
So the recap AM2 seems to be available but may require more effort than say finding a P4 to get what you want. AM2 EE chips are around but good luck finding one. Conroe will launch on the 23rd of july and may dent AMD's sales but they have the momentum right now to keep them selling at least as fast as they can make them. IMO Conroe will WOW everyone with it's performance but will underwelm people with it's availability. Intel will sit on their P4 stock and let it trickle out before really ramping up conroe to full capacity in Q1 07. Sound about right? As far as LV chips go I'd say AMD has no worries because although they will lose to conroe(initially) with performance and performance/watt, they will still be competing with netburst for volume sales this year.


Good rebuttal, this is really the key isn't it -- anything we discuss about it is purely speculation. Intel has given guidance to the % of sales they expect Core2 to consume over the next few quarters, and historically for a major product shift is actually the most aggressive.

I don't know honestly how it will pan out, we should come back to the topic in mid Sept and reassess. This is not like the prescott launch, prescott came out on 90 nm at it's infancy, in fact, I postulated that the tardiness of 90 nm was more a fault of crappy design and debug work than process (see Endyen and I's heated exchange several weeks ago). No, the 65 nm fabs have had Yonah, Cedarmill, and Presler running, yielding, and on the market for > 7 months now -- bringing volume Core 2 to market will be a peice of cake. Any fab related excursions, targeting issues, etc. have all been worked out by now. This is a wise strategy by intel -- do the shrinks as the first product introductions on the new process, then ramp up new architectures after the process has matured.

It is quite clear, since at least March 7th, they have litho masks in fab, a booted and debugged CPU functioning and 3 65 nm capacity. This gives us roughly 4-6 months of production to build inventory. So I expect the availability curve to follow or slightly exceed that of Yonah as a good guideline.

Jack
Oh I know Intel can probably make more than enough Core 2 based chips as their 65nm manufacturing has reached maturity already but they have alot to unload before they can start selling more. Any idea of Intel's plans for 45nm and how many fabs they plan to ramp next year with it? It is fascinating that AMD has survived so long with a single 200mm fab and now have finally started to accelerate their manufactering capability as we approach the end of silicone process shrinks. It seems to me that by the time we get down to 32nm Intel and AMD could be on equal ground in terms of manufacturing capacity on the most advanced process. Intel will of course have more fabs in total but how many of them will still be on the older processes producing chipset's and other non-leading-edge products while everything that AMD has will be top-of-the-line without the legacy support. As always good debate Mr Jack :) 
June 11, 2006 9:32:42 PM

Quote:
$1.00? He isn't even worth that much. Not by far. As said before 5 cents most for his effort in trying to put down Intel. But Failed. Next time research the place you found your 'source'. Too Bad.. :( 

I'll be having a good time with my conroe when he has his little AMD

like he said before 'owned'.
I know but not entirely owned you know.
June 11, 2006 10:21:08 PM

Quote:
My mum just bought my P4 2.8C off me the other day.


Lemmie get this straight... You SOLD your P4 to your MOM??? When you were an infant hanging on the nipple, did she make you pay?

No repect...
June 11, 2006 10:24:03 PM

Quote:
My mum just bought my P4 2.8C off me the other day.


Lemmie get this straight... You SOLD your P4 to your MOM??? When you were an infant hanging on the nipple, did she make you pay?
You never know.
June 11, 2006 10:24:19 PM

Quote:
My mum just bought my P4 2.8C off me the other day.


Lemmie get this straight... You SOLD your P4 to your MOM??? When you were an infant hanging on the nipple, did she make you pay?

No repect... :lol:  I think she did what other way could he learn to be like that.
June 11, 2006 10:29:26 PM

JumpingJack quotes 3 65nm Fabs, but there's actually a 4th coming online, and a 5th one for cellular devices.

http://www.intel.com/pressroom/kits/manufacturing/manuf...

For 90nm there are:
Logic Development D1C
Logic Fab 11X, Fab 18, Fab 24
Flash/Cellular, etc D2

For 65nm there are:
Logic Development D1D, D1C (late 2006)
Logic: Fab 12, Fab 24-2 (early 2006)
Flash/Cellular, etc D2 (end of 2006)

For 45nm there are:
Logic Development D1D (2007)
Logic Fab 32 (2007), Fab 28 (2008)

Fab 32, and Fab 28 are actually brand new Fabs being built to support 45nm. We'll probably see more conversions to 45nm as time progresses. Fab 20 and Fab 22 come to mind since they are on 130nm and the other fabs on those sites have transitioned to 65nm. The other 130nm logic Fab 17 just completed a capacity increase enhancement this year so additional investment is unlikely for a whle.

Obviously this list is a bit dated since Fab 24-2 is still listed as early 2006. I'm unclear whether Fab24-2 is in production yet since there was no major announcement. In any case, by the end of the year Intel should have 4 65nm production facilities in operation. D1C will come online just in time to supply capacity needed for the Cloverton and Kentsfield quad cores. I believe Logic Development facilities do contribute revenue production since all of the original 65nm chips sold in January and February would have been from D1C since Fab 12 was still ramping.

For interest, Sharikou's listing of Intel only having 2 65nm fabs, and 2 90nm fabs is obviously wrong.

http://sharikou.blogspot.com/2006/03/amd-poised-to-exit...
June 11, 2006 10:30:48 PM

I will always say this. Each companys has good years and bad years. Which will help us in the long run. Which brings in Lower prices for us. I dont care if it Amd or Intel winning.
June 12, 2006 7:56:35 AM

Not to mention that D1D is still half empty. It's output should almost triple in the next couple of years as new tools are brought online and the automation gets better.
June 12, 2006 8:01:45 AM

Quote:
My mum just bought my P4 2.8C off me the other day.


Lemmie get this straight... You SOLD your P4 to your MOM??? When you were an infant hanging on the nipple, did she make you pay?

No repect...

Hey! It wasn't a prescott at least. I also threw in my wireless LAN card and modem. She bought it off my because it was a good machine and I'm going overseas. Don't know why that's such a crime.
June 12, 2006 8:09:01 AM

Quote:
My mum just bought my P4 2.8C off me the other day.


Lemmie get this straight... You SOLD your P4 to your MOM??? When you were an infant hanging on the nipple, did she make you pay?

No repect...

Hey! It wasn't a prescott at least. I also threw in my wireless LAN card and modem. She bought it off my because it was a good machine and I'm going overseas. Don't know why that's such a crime.

Because you CHARGED THE WOMAN THAT GAVE YOU LIFE for a computer you arent going to use anyways. If you can't grasp that, then wow.
June 12, 2006 8:09:16 AM

Quote:
Not to mention that D1D is still half empty. It's output should almost triple in the next couple of years as new tools are brought online and the automation gets better.


D1D will not be adding any capacity to 65nm (from my understanding). The remaining space will be to give a solid 45nm line and on down the line. Don't expect any increase in capacity though.

Does anyone have anymore info on those new fabs that someone mentioned earlier? I have not heard of where/when any new fabs will be opening. I have heard rumors about fab 20's future, but nothing on any new fab's going up.
June 12, 2006 8:13:58 AM

Most of the tools that run 65nm will also be used in the 45nm process. Hmmm. . . more tools, smaller die, more workers. You're right, why would you think there will be more capacity?

:lol: 
June 12, 2006 8:16:48 AM

D1E will be built once D1D hits its full stride. That fab is huuuuge on the inside. Since there isn't bays/chases anymore it gives you alot of room to play with.
!