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Before takeoff (Runup)

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September 2, 2005 11:53:00 PM

Archived from groups: alt.games.microsoft.flight-sim (More info?)

It seems like every checklist I own waits until the Run-up section of the
checklist before checking and setting radios and avionics. Why do they wait
until you're blocking traffic on a taxiway to go through this sometimes
lengthy process?

It would seem to make more sense to do this before you release the parking
brake to taxi. Besides, if something is broken you wouldn't have to taxi
all the way back.

Question 2: It seems some of my modern add on aircraft lack a red rotation
beacon. Is it not required? Do you turn your strobe on before engine
start?


Dallas

More about : takeoff runup

Anonymous
September 2, 2005 11:53:01 PM

Archived from groups: alt.games.microsoft.flight-sim (More info?)

Hi,

I don't know why they do it now, but back in the 50's and 60's you had
to wait until the radios were warmed up before setting them. Perhaps
it's just a holdover from those days?

Hope this helps,

Tom Gibson

Cal Classic Propliner Page: http://www.calclassic.com

Cal Classic Alco Page: http://www.calclassic.com/alco

Freeflight Design Shop: http://www.freeflightdesign.com



Dallas wrote:
> It seems like every checklist I own waits until the Run-up section of the
> checklist before checking and setting radios and avionics. Why do they wait
> until you're blocking traffic on a taxiway to go through this sometimes
> lengthy process?
>
> It would seem to make more sense to do this before you release the parking
> brake to taxi. Besides, if something is broken you wouldn't have to taxi
> all the way back.
>
> Question 2: It seems some of my modern add on aircraft lack a red rotation
> beacon. Is it not required? Do you turn your strobe on before engine
> start?
>
>
> Dallas
>
>
September 3, 2005 12:28:38 AM

Archived from groups: alt.games.microsoft.flight-sim (More info?)

I'd venture to guess that radios back then weren't as immune to drift.
They could have been of vacuum tube design. Many reference oscillators
were Crystal (xtal) controlled and had `ovens' where the Ref Osc was
located. It would keep critical components at a constant temperature..
but had to warm up first.

-Gregory



On Fri, 02 Sep 2005 16:02:49 -0700, Tom Gibson
<tgibson@removethissunstroke.sdsu.edu> brought the following:
>
>I don't know why they do it now, but back in the 50's and 60's you had
>to wait until the radios were warmed up before setting them. Perhaps
>it's just a holdover from those days?
>
>Hope this helps,
>
>Tom Gibson
>
>
>Dallas wrote:
>> It seems like every checklist I own waits until the Run-up section of the
>> checklist before checking and setting radios and avionics. Why do they wait
>> until you're blocking traffic on a taxiway to go through this sometimes
>> lengthy process?
>>
>> It would seem to make more sense to do this before you release the parking
>> brake to taxi. Besides, if something is broken you wouldn't have to taxi
>> all the way back.
>>
>> Question 2: It seems some of my modern add on aircraft lack a red rotation
>> beacon. Is it not required? Do you turn your strobe on before engine
>> start?
>>
>>
>> Dallas
>>
>>
September 3, 2005 12:56:38 AM

Archived from groups: alt.games.microsoft.flight-sim (More info?)

"Beech45Whiskey"
> The taxiing process itself can result in fouled plugs (carbon surrounding
> the leads of the plugs,

Ah... but you misunderstand, I have no problem with the logic of the run-up
before take off. I have a problem with setting up the radios and navaids in
the run-up section of the checklist.

????


Dallas
September 3, 2005 12:56:39 AM

Archived from groups: alt.games.microsoft.flight-sim (More info?)

Dallas wrote:
>
> Ah... but you misunderstand, I have no problem with the logic of the
> run-up before take off. I have a problem with setting up the radios
> and navaids in the run-up section of the checklist.
>


Hey, do what I do. Hit pause, set things up the way ya want before even
leaving the parking lot, freshen up the ice in the Manhattan (double, 2
cherries, stirred not shaken), and take off! Donna need so steenkin tower
or ATC, just go! Enjoy!!

Cheers'n Beers.. [_])
Don
Anonymous
September 3, 2005 1:56:22 AM

Archived from groups: alt.games.microsoft.flight-sim (More info?)

CRaSH wrote:
> Dallas wrote:
>>
>> Ah... but you misunderstand, I have no problem with the logic of the
>> run-up before take off. I have a problem with setting up the radios
>> and navaids in the run-up section of the checklist.
>>
>
>
> Hey, do what I do. Hit pause, set things up the way ya want before
> even leaving the parking lot, freshen up the ice in the Manhattan
> (double, 2 cherries, stirred not shaken), and take off! Donna need
> so steenkin tower or ATC, just go! Enjoy!

>
> Cheers'n Beers.. [_])
> Don

Ah My hero!

--
Sincerely,
Quilljar
Anonymous
September 3, 2005 2:12:53 AM

Archived from groups: alt.games.microsoft.flight-sim (More info?)

Perfectly right! But to be honest, no one will bar you from setting radios
and navigation just after engine start (in small A/C definitely the better
way inorder to conserve battery power). So take the checklist item just as
it is: to finally CHECK, whether radios and navigation are really set. No
checkpilot would object! (at least I never did.....)
As for rotationg beacons: AFAIK the beacons are still required (in the old
times a Rotating Beacon actually was used to indicate "Hot Magnetos").
However some good old A/C like the J-3 Cub or the Tiger Moth do not feature
any lights at all. So whether it be a legal requirement I just can't tell
you. Maybe someone finds a relevant FAA directive (including the exception
for a J-3... ;-) ).Strobes should not be used during taxi but only when
entering the RWY as they can be pretty irritating. Some modern A/C have
auto-strobes linked to the squat-switch and come on upon liftoff.
--
Oskar Wagner
(retired Captain)

Remember, in the great scheme of things, we're all small potatoes....

"Dallas" <Cybnorm@spam_me_not.Hotmail.Com> schrieb im Newsbeitrag
news:w42Se.6608$z2.3316@newsread3.news.pas.earthlink.net...
> It seems like every checklist I own waits until the Run-up section of the
> checklist before checking and setting radios and avionics. Why do they
> wait
> until you're blocking traffic on a taxiway to go through this sometimes
> lengthy process?
>
> It would seem to make more sense to do this before you release the parking
> brake to taxi. Besides, if something is broken you wouldn't have to taxi
> all the way back.
>
> Question 2: It seems some of my modern add on aircraft lack a red
> rotation
> beacon. Is it not required? Do you turn your strobe on before engine
> start?
>
>
> Dallas
>
>
September 3, 2005 3:54:02 AM

Archived from groups: alt.games.microsoft.flight-sim (More info?)

"CRaSH"
> Hey, do what I do. Hit pause, set things up the way ya want before even
> leaving the parking lot, freshen up the ice in the Manhattan

I had to do a double take on the "From:" field as I was sure it should have
read "Quilljar". :-)

Dalli
Anonymous
September 3, 2005 4:29:56 AM

Archived from groups: alt.games.microsoft.flight-sim (More info?)

I can't remember using a checklist either civilian or military that waited
till the runup or line up to set radios. I CAN recall checklists (every one
for that matter :-) that called for a final CHECK of avionics and nav aids
properly set before taking the runway. Final line up military checks also
include an avionics RECHECK before power up.
The usual procedure is to preset frequencies and bugs in order of use, then
recheck them by touch RIGHT AFTER the engine and control checks during the
runup phase. Perhaps this is what was meant. Remember, the runup consists of
MORE than just the engine and control checks. There are items required by
most checklists AFTER the actual engine run up has been made and the engines
are at idle or idle thrust. I think you might be picturing doing the
avionics checks DURING the engine power checks, which of course would not be
logical at all.
Hope this helps a bit.
Dudley
"Dallas" <Cybnorm@spam_me_not.Hotmail.Com> wrote in message
news:w42Se.6608$z2.3316@newsread3.news.pas.earthlink.net...
> It seems like every checklist I own waits until the Run-up section of the
> checklist before checking and setting radios and avionics. Why do they
> wait
> until you're blocking traffic on a taxiway to go through this sometimes
> lengthy process?
>
> It would seem to make more sense to do this before you release the parking
> brake to taxi. Besides, if something is broken you wouldn't have to taxi
> all the way back.
>
> Question 2: It seems some of my modern add on aircraft lack a red
> rotation
> beacon. Is it not required? Do you turn your strobe on before engine
> start?
>
>
> Dallas
>
>
September 3, 2005 8:56:21 AM

Archived from groups: alt.games.microsoft.flight-sim (More info?)

"Dudley Henriques"
> I CAN recall checklists (every one
> for that matter :-) that called for a final CHECK of avionics and nav aids
> properly set before taking the runway.

I can only assume the checklists in question mean "final CHECK of avionics".
But, I've modified most checklists to include "Radios on and set to
appropriate frequency" in the Normal engine starting procedures because it's
not there. And, yes... many of these are real world checklists.

As I search my memory, I seem to recall many pilots setting their radios
while they taxi which seems about as safe as talking on a cell phone while
driving a car. But, I guess if you've done it a million times it's not a
bad thing.

Dallas
Anonymous
September 3, 2005 1:25:01 PM

Archived from groups: alt.games.microsoft.flight-sim (More info?)

"Oskar Wagner" <rengaw@swissonline.ch> wrote in message
news:D fabmi$d6a$1@news.hispeed.ch...

> As for rotationg beacons: AFAIK the beacons are still required (in the old
> times a Rotating Beacon actually was used to indicate "Hot Magnetos").
> However some good old A/C like the J-3 Cub or the Tiger Moth do not
> feature any lights at all. So whether it be a legal requirement I just
> can't tell you. Maybe someone finds a relevant FAA directive (including
> the exception for a J-3... ;-)

Well, here's all I could find in the AIM:

4-3-23 Use of Aircraft Lights
*Position lights required sunset to sunrise
*Landing lights voluntary/encouraged to turn on during takeoff and when
below 10,000 ft.
*Rotating beacons recommended/encouraged to turn on anytime engines in
operation
*All external lights, at pilot's discretion turn on when crossing or holding
on/across any runway, consider limiting use of landing and strobe lights if
affect other aircraft in vicinity
Anonymous
September 3, 2005 3:06:37 PM

Archived from groups: alt.games.microsoft.flight-sim (More info?)

It's fine to "alter" a checklist to reflect ADDITIONAL items, and the
sequencing of a checklist is pilot's discretion. The main thing with
checklists is content vs habit pattern.
Dudley

"Dallas" <Cybnorm@spam_me_not.Hotmail.Com> wrote in message
news:V1aSe.4148$4P5.1508@newsread2.news.pas.earthlink.net...
>
> "Dudley Henriques"
>> I CAN recall checklists (every one
>> for that matter :-) that called for a final CHECK of avionics and nav
>> aids
>> properly set before taking the runway.
>
> I can only assume the checklists in question mean "final CHECK of
> avionics".
> But, I've modified most checklists to include "Radios on and set to
> appropriate frequency" in the Normal engine starting procedures because
> it's
> not there. And, yes... many of these are real world checklists.
>
> As I search my memory, I seem to recall many pilots setting their radios
> while they taxi which seems about as safe as talking on a cell phone while
> driving a car. But, I guess if you've done it a million times it's not a
> bad thing.
>
> Dallas
>
>
!