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mb with onboard video and pci-e - which is best ?

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June 18, 2006 9:25:58 AM

I want to upgrade my mb/cpu with onboard graphics and pci-express slot with the intention of in a few month's buying a pci-express video card as I cannot afford to do both at this time(At least a decent video card at this time).
I have a 1gb ddr400 dual channel kit so im looking at socket 939 with an x2(When the prices drop)

I would welcome any information for either a specific mb(And why this one is best) OR a chipset with onboard video to look for, IE nvidia 6100 vs x300.

I currently play games such as morrowind, call of duty(With expansion), thief DS and some older games.

My agp card(radeon 9600pro 128mb) is not up to snuff anymore(Want to play oblivion ) and I cant see investing in a new agp card.

TIA

More about : onboard video pci

a b V Motherboard
June 18, 2006 12:18:10 PM

I currently use this mobo with an X2 3800+:

Asus A8N-VM CSM 939 microATX nF6150/430 $81+7 6/18/06
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16813131570

Asus A8N-VM CSM review 12/05
http://www.anandtech.com/mb/showdoc.aspx?i=2626

The 6150 graphics speed is similar to ATI's integrated systems.
My mobo came with BIOS rev 0303, but needs v.0506 or later to run either X2 or E4/6 stepping procs. v.1.000 is now available.
This is a solid mobo with all the features of a nF4 board without the noisy northbridge fan. It is microATX though. Since NewEgg is out of these boards until the 26th it's likely that the next batch will have an updated BIOS. The price is reasonable for the features you get. There are cheaper options out there, but it sounds like you are not trying to build an econobox stripper. This board makes a fine foundation for a solid machine.

AMD X2 procs have not dropped much in price yet, but the single cores have. This applies both to skt939 and AM2.

AMD A64 3500+ Skt939 2.2GHz 512 $114+0 6/18/06
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16819103603
A week or so ago this proc was over $200.
a b V Motherboard
June 18, 2006 12:27:21 PM

One thing I forgot:

You did not mention overclocking.
The Asus integrated video boards will not overclock well. You can change the FSB speed but not any voltages. Consider an nF4 board if you want to overclock your system.
Related resources
June 18, 2006 8:30:19 PM

Yes overclocking is definately a must, been overclocking since my 486 days and not about to stop now :) 

You pointed me in the right direction however thank you.

This board is more highly rated, provides the features I need including OC
http://forums.anandtech.com/messageview.cfm?catid=29&th...
http://www.logiccircle.com/xcart4016/product.php?produc...

The X2's will probably drop about the time conroe comes out. I will not be purchasing a conroe. While I would not call myself a fan boy I do despise intel for its many reccurring sins and have not bought an intel(for personal use that is) since my 8088.
I do reccomend intel to people for which it makes sense however.

Thanks again
a b V Motherboard
June 18, 2006 9:19:24 PM

Yup, it looks like the MSI board would be a better choice for you. Be aware that even it does not allow CPU voltage changes for overclocking. The MSI does look less like a business/office board though.
June 18, 2006 11:46:58 PM

the 2 best overclocking integrated video boards supposedly are the Biostar Tforce & the DFI RS482
June 19, 2006 4:15:47 AM

Both of those boards look very nice.
My only question left is what kind of video performance will I get with the IGP compared to my 128mb 9600 pro ? I see the nvidia is supposed to be faster then the ati but I cant seem to find anything to compare with.
June 20, 2006 2:19:50 AM

I believe that the 482 is supposed to be 9600 level but I'm not sure.
June 20, 2006 4:04:29 AM

Ok thanks for the info. So at least I wont be taking a step backwards and a faster dual core should help. I have wanted a dual cpu machine since I first saw a p200 dual cpu machine ages and ages ago but have never been able to afford one before. I have been waiting for the x2s to come down in price and finally they are going to be soon.
Thanks for all the info guys
June 20, 2006 5:45:01 AM

The 9600 pro you own is definitely faster than any onboard graphics to date , the Gforce 6150 will definitely be slower than it .

by slower i mean at least 30 % slower in real world and 50% slower theoritically.

check out this :

http://www.pcstats.com/articleview.cfm?articleID=1898
June 20, 2006 11:15:24 PM

Well that sucks, I was hoping to avoid buying a new videocard at the same time.

Perhaps I should just bite the bullet and get one without onboard video after all. Well I have another month before the x2s come down in price anyway maybe I can squeeze it in then.

Thanks for the info.
June 21, 2006 12:09:20 AM

I was suprised how well the BIOSTAR 6100 T mobo turned out. I helped my girlfriend put together her first system:

Aspire Qpack
BIOSTAR 6100 T
AMD 3700+ San Diego
1 gig Corsair
WD 250 gb
Westinghouse 19" extra-wide

and guess what? games from years ago play decently (Counterstrike 1.6, console emulators like ZSNES, SEGA) work excellent.
Now when she plays newer games like Entropia Universe and Counterstrike: Source... sludge. The onboard graphics with newer games blows. Much much studdering, never smooth.

You would have to wait until you buy a video card before Playing Oblivion, or even Morrowind.
a b V Motherboard
June 21, 2006 1:53:16 AM

True...
The 6150 is roughly equal to the ATI 300 which is roughly a Radeon 8500. For saving cash there's nothing like free video!
However, given the desire to overclock and the NEED for even better than 9xxx graphics power consider this mobo:

EpoX EP-9NPA3Ultra 939 nF4 Ultra $85+7 6/06
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16813123258

Another option is the Asus A8R-MVP which OC's really well. $96+8
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16813131584

Of course, now you have to buy a videocard too...
June 21, 2006 2:34:31 AM

the first one was decent other then some complaints about ram stability.
Even has built in video. I would go with the dfi if it came down to between these two.
The second one does not have spd/dif except coax and I need optical to my reciever(700watt 5.1) but otherwise appears decent.

I will do more research in the meantime, I have a month to wait anyway.
This pci-express has been holding me back for a long time, my current system I skimped on also by getting an agp board so I didnt have to get a new video card but it just cant wait anymore. Socket 754 Sempron 3100+ oc from 1.8 to 2.25(Board max), was supposed to be a 64bit version but its not and they wouldnt take it back sigh.

I WANT to play Oblivion! Morrowind is fun on this system at least but the new one is out :p 
June 21, 2006 11:27:15 AM

I just recently started playing Oblivion in the last few nights (EVERY night, of course), and it runs pretty good on my 7600 GT (which I paid only $175). I play the game with everything turned up, including HDR (though NOT AA), most of the time I am getting a solid 20-30 FPS, it could be a bit smoother but I am not complaining. I am holding out on buying a 2nd card, since 3-6 months from now DX10 cards might be coming out :twisted:
June 21, 2006 12:40:16 PM

I see you have everything turned up but at what resolution ?
And is that 20-30 indoors or outdoors ?

I expect that 2 or 3 years from now I will be able to play it at a nice high resolution, thats how morrowind ended up for me, slow and jerky but 2 years later its smooth. Sucks to be poor. Always behind the curve. I should give up women then I could afford nicer stuff :p  But thats not happening.
June 21, 2006 3:36:45 PM

I use 12x10 res. The 20-30 is Outdoors. Indoors I think it pretty much doubles (I don't recall the exact #s right now, I'm at work)
!