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Pentium D 940 Heat Issue

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June 22, 2006 1:40:23 AM

Greetings,

I've just finished assembling a computer around a Pentium D 940. I haven't even installed Windows yet, but while poking about in the BIOS settings I noticed that the CPU was running hot. VERY hot. According to the motherboard's (an Asus P5WD2 Premium) temperature sensors, the CPU was running at 52 C, and the motherboard at 39 C.

Given that the Newegg reviews all said this CPU idles at around 16-18 C, and maxes out at 26-28 C, I'm a bit concerned.

I have a Zalman CNPS 9500 CPU cooler, and four fans (one 120 mm intake, two rear 80 mm output, one top 80 mm output) on my CoolerMaster Praetorian 730 case. Cords are all pulled as far out of the way as possible, airflow should be acceptable, and there was a definite hot breeze coming out the back.

Any suggestions? I'm almost afraid to turn the dratted thing on again lest it burst into flames.

More about : pentium 940 heat issue

June 22, 2006 2:25:56 AM

I used Arctic Silver 5 thermal paste, it did say to expect higher temperatures at first, but double the Newegg review's number startled me. :) 

The 52 C was during BIOS setup, so I'm not sure whether that's considered maximum load or not. I've noticed everything runs hotter in setup, though.

Thanks for the quick answer! :) 
June 22, 2006 4:13:03 PM

Ive heard that Bios temp readings are in-accurate.....

Maybe your CPU is actually 30 deg but bios reports it 20 deg more to deter people from ocing the CPU....
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June 22, 2006 4:24:44 PM

the temps in the BIOS are at about (might be off on this figure) 70% load. I would try reseating the heatsink and make sure you didn't use too much AS 5. If you look at the base of the HSF edge-on, you should not be able to actually see the thermal paste.
June 25, 2006 1:37:10 AM

I definitely didn't use too much thermal paste, but thanks for the warning nonetheless. I'm somewhat concerned I may have used too little; the instructions were to use a dab half the size of a BB, and that seems a minuscule amount and insufficient to the task.

I'm currently running CPU Burn-In to see just how hot it gets (I'm running two instances, as it's a dual-core system). Both CPU cores are running at 100% load, and the temperature is now up to 58 C (43 C for the motherboard).

The Arctic Silver instructions suggest sixteen hours or thereabouts at heavy load to give it time to set properly; after that, if there's no improvement, I'll try reapplying it. Unless anyone knows a reason I should do that immediately?

Thanks again. :) 
June 25, 2006 2:32:22 AM

Update: After two and a half hours, the CPU temp hit 60 C and the motherboard 45 C, which set off warnings on the Asus temp/usage monitor, so I shut everything down.

Not sure what to make of that... too little thermal paste? Too high a load with too little time for it to set?
a b à CPUs
June 25, 2006 8:21:13 AM

here's how to easily determine if you used too much or too little paste.

1. Put a small dab of paste on to the base of the heatsink. Spread it around until it covers the entire base.
2. Look at the base face on. If you can't see any copper (or aluminum depending on what heatsink you have), continue on. If you can still see parts of the base, apply a little bit more until you cover the entire base.
3. Look at the base of the heatsink edge on. If you can't see the layer of spread out paste you just applied, you have used enough. If you can, then you've applied too much. Remove the necessary amount and repeat until you can't see the paste when looking at the base edge on.
4. Attach the heatsink. Once it's securely mounted, gently wiggle the heatsink a bit to ensure good contact between the heatsink and CPU.
June 25, 2006 2:32:53 PM

Thanks, I'll have to try that. The Arctic Silver instructions were to put a small dab of the paste in the center of the CPU's heat spreader, then put the heatsink on top of that and give it a few two-degree turns to spread the paste around.

One concern: this seems to conflict with statements that I should not be able to see any thermal paste pushed out between the heatsink and CPU.

In any case, I've obviously messed up somewhere, as when I ran CPU Burn-In this morning, within ten minutes the motherboard was at 45 C (which it considers dangerous).
a b à CPUs
June 25, 2006 5:11:26 PM

the instructions at Arctic Silver's website work too, but personally i've found that applying the thermal paste to the heatsink gives better results than when applying it to the CPU.
June 25, 2006 5:35:30 PM

I'm not one to give advice on the Intel chip, but the mobo temps dont seem out of line based on the mobo I use. The A8n32 I've got running usually temps between 45-50 deg C. Mine has the heatpipe solution, so I'm not going to mess with it. If you really want to lower those mobo temps, you could try an aftermarket NorthBridge HS. Zalman just came out with a flower shaped one that might be better than the stock ASUS one (around 2000 cm squared surface area). Not sure though, that stock HS looks pretty good...maybe reseat the NB HS with AS5?

I've also wondered about the StackCool technology that is supposed to transfer heat to the backside of the mobo. I'm not sure how good your case airflow is BEHIND the mobo, but I'm sure mine sucks. Maybe one of these days I'll really take a look at how I might duct some air that direction. If you can figure that out it might help as well.
June 25, 2006 6:07:42 PM

Quote:
Greetings,

I've just finished assembling a computer around a Pentium D 940. I haven't even installed Windows yet, but while poking about in the BIOS settings I noticed that the CPU was running hot. VERY hot. According to the motherboard's (an Asus P5WD2 Premium) temperature sensors, the CPU was running at 52 C, and the motherboard at 39 C.

Given that the Newegg reviews all said this CPU idles at around 16-18 C, and maxes out at 26-28 C, I'm a bit concerned.

I have a Zalman CNPS 9500 CPU cooler, and four fans (one 120 mm intake, two rear 80 mm output, one top 80 mm output) on my CoolerMaster Praetorian 730 case. Cords are all pulled as far out of the way as possible, airflow should be acceptable, and there was a definite hot breeze coming out the back.

Any suggestions? I'm almost afraid to turn the dratted thing on again lest it burst into flames.


First, the review at Newegg should not be taken into account.. No matter what others will say, Intel chip run hot. That's a fact. Running the 940D at 16-18c is impossible with air. AMD chip, which are the coolest modern CPU now don't even reach that, being around 30 some degrees...

BIOS temperature are expected to be higher that idle in Windows. There is no CPU drivers in the BIOS, the the CPU power management is not active, meaning that all parts are running full speed. 52C is not that bad for this CPU thou. I would expect it to be around 60C at full load. So I guess that your CPU is correctly installed.



What if you leave the side panel open to see if motherboard temperature improve? I don't know about this case, but if it don't have a side case fan blowing on the motherboard, then it might be the problem. maybe you could try placing a small fan to cool the chipset. Dont need lot of airflow, as long ast it move away from the HS.
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June 25, 2006 10:36:51 PM

Quote:
...No matter what others will say, Intel chip run hot. That's a fact.

Actually that's not a fact. My dad's Pentium D 930 on stock cooling (OC'ed to 3.4Ghz) at full load doesn't go over 40C, and never idles over 30C

Quote:
AMD chip, which are the coolest modern CPU now don't even reach that, being around 30 some degrees...

Actually that's not true either. Intel's Pentium D chips run just as cool as AMD's X2 chips do.
June 26, 2006 12:00:32 AM

Quote:
...No matter what others will say, Intel chip run hot. That's a fact.

Actually that's not a fact. My dad's Pentium D 930 on stock cooling (OC'ed to 3.4Ghz) at full load doesn't go over 40C, and never idles over 30C

Your dad's cpu either is one good or temp sensor are not accurate. Especially with stock cooling. I don't argue that it is not true, but based on my experience, Intel CPU run hotter than AMD ones.

Quote:

AMD chip, which are the coolest modern CPU now don't even reach that, being around 30 some degrees...

Actually that's not true either. Intel's Pentium D chips run just as cool as AMD's X2 chips do.

Yeah, make me believe that... This table clearly show that Intel consume as little more power than AMD ones..

Seriously, I've worked with both system, and AMD are simply easier and cheaper to run them cooler than Intel counter party. Not to bash Intel here, but it is like that. This is system consumption. All those wattage have to be dissipated somewhere and in is mostly inside the case.


But anyway, just be happy with what you have, I don't care. Since I quit using Prescott CPU and the following ones, my built are much more cool, quiet and reliable. Still have to get one returned to me because of problem. Not that I cannot make an Intel one run cool.. just don't worth the extra time and cooling to me and my customers.
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June 26, 2006 1:14:04 AM

Must be a good chip then, because we had the P4 630 that's currently in my system, in his before he got the 930. The idle and load temps that were being reported were within 2C of their respective temps in the other system

Keep in mind that those System power consumption benchmarks are completely pointless and prove nothing. What THG used in those test systems could be completely different than the systems you have worked on, as well as my dad's system. If you were to put a couple ATI X1900XTX cards into that FX-55 based comp that THG tested.... the power consumption would skyrocket.
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June 26, 2006 2:40:55 AM

Quote:


Given that the Newegg reviews all said this CPU idles at around 16-18 C, and maxes out at 26-28 C, I'm a bit concerned.

I have a Zalman CNPS 9500 CPU cooler...


Concerned? More like stupid. You can't have the CPU idle at 16C when your room temperature is greater than 16C. You can't even have the CPU below 16C with the system turned off if your room is higher than 16C.

Normal room temperatures are anywhere from 18C (mid 60's F) to around 35C (summer without AC). Now just tell me how the hell you're going to cool the CPU below ambient with an air cooler?

If you think that a fan does that because a fan make YOU feel cool, I got news for you, it's called "evaporation". Sweat. Computer's don't sweat (though refrigerated coolers can have condensation).

Wherever you're getting your info from, I think it's time you stood back and THOUGHT about the impossibility of your system running below ambient.

52C? That's freaking GREAT for air cooling. If you'd said you thought it should run "18C above ambient", well, that would be 40C in a 22C room, idle. And 28C above ambient would be 5OC in a 22C room. Now THOSE are believable numbers, even if they do sound a little "optimized".
a b à CPUs
June 26, 2006 5:58:45 AM

Quote:
AMD chip, which are the coolest modern CPU now don't even reach that, being around 30 some degrees...

Actually that's not true either. Intel's Pentium D chips run just as cool as AMD's X2 chips do.

Sure they run just as cool when you provide them 50% more cooling. And a Pentium 233 runs even hotter than a PD940...when the 233 doesn't have a sink.

But let's be realistic here, Intel uses a bigger, badder cooler than AMD...to get similar temps. And that's because its CPU produces around 50% more heat. That's a great improvement, previous models produced around 100% more heat!

But you don't have to take my word for it. Take Intel's. Whoops, they rate their "maximum" power consumption at what, 70% CPU usage? And AMD rates theirs at 100%? Given that little deception, I think we'd be "less partial" to take AMD's word for it!
a b à CPUs
June 26, 2006 9:07:40 AM

Quote:

Sure they run just as cool when you provide them 50% more cooling. And a Pentium 233 runs even hotter than a PD940...when the 233 doesn't have a sink.

Lets not go comparing obselete processors to modern processors to try (and fail miserably) at proving a point.

Quote:

But let's be realistic here, Intel uses a bigger, badder cooler than AMD...to get similar temps. And that's because its CPU produces around 50% more heat. That's a great improvement, previous models produced around 100% more heat!

I don't care if the stock HS is bigger on an Intel or an AMD boxed processor.... it's a stock HS... that's all that matters. And I don't care about previous models either.... I'm comparing Intel's Pentium D's to AMD's X2's

Quote:

But you don't have to take my word for it. Take Intel's. Whoops, they rate their "maximum" power consumption at what, 70% CPU usage? And AMD rates theirs at 100%? Given that little deception, I think we'd be "less partial" to take AMD's word for it!

Show me where Intel says this.....
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a b à CPUs
June 26, 2006 10:22:42 AM

Quote:


Given that the Newegg reviews all said this CPU idles at around 16-18 C, and maxes out at 26-28 C, I'm a bit concerned.

I have a Zalman CNPS 9500 CPU cooler...


Concerned? More like stupid. You can't have the CPU idle at 16C when your room temperature is greater than 16C. You can't even have the CPU below 16C with the system turned off if your room is higher than 16C.

Normal room temperatures are anywhere from 18C (mid 60's F) to around 35C (summer without AC). Now just tell me how the hell you're going to cool the CPU below ambient with an air cooler?

If you think that a fan does that because a fan make YOU feel cool, I got news for you, it's called "evaporation". Sweat. Computer's don't sweat (though refrigerated coolers can have condensation).

Wherever you're getting your info from, I think it's time you stood back and THOUGHT about the impossibility of your system running below ambient.

52C? That's freaking GREAT for air cooling. If you'd said you thought it should run "18C above ambient", well, that would be 40C in a 22C room, idle. And 28C above ambient would be 5OC in a 22C room. Now THOSE are believable numbers, even if they do sound a little "optimized".

Heh makes you wonder how intel can sell Prescotts (the box usually says keep case cooler then 38*) when here in Australia some places are hotter then 38 ambient? Hmmmzzz

Most of my machines idle hot in the bios - My 2600c on two boards and good cooling still show 50*c temps when the HSF isnt even warm (pannel fan ducting cold air directly to the cpu and a prescott cooler) - go figure.
June 26, 2006 11:21:09 AM

Take the side off the case for a day or two and monitor how much the cpu temp drops.
If it comes into an acceptable range then you know your case ventilation is the culprit.
June 26, 2006 1:12:25 PM

If it's case ventilation... what can I do to solve the problem? I've already got four fans running in this thing, plus a vent in the side panel (which I'd rather replace with an unvented panel, if only I could; I have a feeling a bloody great hole in the side will do more to mess up airflow than promote it). I've tucked cables out of the way as much as possible.

By the way, what is a reasonable operating range for a Pentium D 940? Given that the temperature probe software tosses out alerts and warnings at 60 C (45 C for the motherboard), I think 52 C is a bit high for an idle temp, and it can't be good that maximum load pushes the CPU above the danger line.
June 26, 2006 1:39:11 PM

You can change the temperature setting in asus probe instead of 60c you can change it to like 70C. I got the same CPU but using a Ninja Scythe to cool it, and my temp is about 58C while I am playing game... not to mention the weather here is like 80-90 degrees F. Your temperature is not really that bad
a b à CPUs
June 26, 2006 1:57:49 PM

Quote:

Sure they run just as cool when you provide them 50% more cooling. And a Pentium 233 runs even hotter than a PD940...when the 233 doesn't have a sink.

Lets not go comparing obselete processors to modern processors to try (and fail miserably) at proving a point.

Actually it's a perfectly valid comparison, you just seem to have a very limitted perception of reality...and history.

Your point, that P-D's are running as cool as X2's on stock cooling, is more irrelavent than what I said. Your point fails miserably because it doesn't take into account that he's using AFTERMARKET cooling, the Zalman 9000. A cooler that fits both P-D's and X2's. A cooler that will show the X2 with around 8C lower temperatures than the P-D.

Since his cooler fits both processor types, let's not go comparing disimilar stock coolers to try (and fail miserably) at proving a point.
a b à CPUs
June 26, 2006 6:34:16 PM

Quote:
Your point, that P-D's are running as cool as X2's on stock cooling, is more irrelavent than what I said. Your point fails miserably because it doesn't take into account that he's using AFTERMARKET cooling, the Zalman 9000. A cooler that fits both P-D's and X2's. A cooler that will show the X2 with around 8C lower temperatures than the P-D.


Remember the other variables that determine temperature than simply the power usage of the chip, and the cooler used.... like ambient air temp, motherboard temp and case air flow.

Quote:
If it's case ventilation... what can I do to solve the problem? I've already got four fans running in this thing, plus a vent in the side panel (which I'd rather replace with an unvented panel, if only I could; I have a feeling a bloody great hole in the side will do more to mess up airflow than promote it). I've tucked cables out of the way as much as possible.


Make sure the fans are blowing the proper directions. Anything at the back of the case should be blowing out. The side panel and front panel should be drawing air in. If you have a fan on the roof of your case like I do, have it blowing up.
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July 2, 2006 12:30:50 AM

Quote:
Your point, that P-D's are running as cool as X2's on stock cooling, is more irrelavent than what I said. Your point fails miserably because it doesn't take into account that he's using AFTERMARKET cooling, the Zalman 9000. A cooler that fits both P-D's and X2's. A cooler that will show the X2 with around 8C lower temperatures than the P-D.


Remember the other variables that determine temperature than simply the power usage of the chip, and the cooler used.... like ambient air temp, motherboard temp and case air flow.

Quote:
If it's case ventilation... what can I do to solve the problem? I've already got four fans running in this thing, plus a vent in the side panel (which I'd rather replace with an unvented panel, if only I could; I have a feeling a bloody great hole in the side will do more to mess up airflow than promote it). I've tucked cables out of the way as much as possible.


Make sure the fans are blowing the proper directions. Anything at the back of the case should be blowing out. The side panel and front panel should be drawing air in. If you have a fan on the roof of your case like I do, have it blowing up.

front fans = in
rear fans = out
pannel fans = in
top fans = out

Pentium D's are hotter, slower and 65nm (what some call "cheating"?) - on the other hand if conroe goes well then what we will see is the oppisite for the next few months atleast.
July 2, 2006 1:38:19 AM

sure are a lot of opinions about the D9XX running hot.
I wont bother with words.
crashman said it the best.
if its hot outside..... that case will be hotter!
higher temps in bios is normal.
the screenshot below is above 80deg ambient temps right after a cpu benchmark.



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