Geforce4ti4200 > Atix800XT

wow
i have had some problems with my atix800xt, fps jumping from 125 down to 40 in games like call of duty or enemy territory (with like the worst graphic settings possible!!), tried omega drivers and the ati's, didnt help, formatted, reinstalled windows, still the same

now i just for fun tried my old geforce4ti4200 (which has a broken cooler=P) and it works with steady ~100 fps in both games

its really weird, can some1 help me? maybe some settings in bios are wrong or i have done anything else wrong which i cant think of(and i havent changed anything in bios either)


i would keep the geforce and sell the x800xt if it stays like this and no1 can help me, but for newer games i think it wont be doing too well and id fear it would burn my pc down =P


tnx in advance
46 answers Last reply
More about geforce4ti4200 atix800xt
  1. Driver conflictions possibly. Maybe in insufficient power supply unit.
    Other thing too, unless you manually set your resolution in games along with your details, textures, lighting, etc.... The game does it for you.

    So you might not realize your running @ higher quality settings with your X800XT which would explain why you lose frame rate occasionally.
  2. power supply,drivers or a faulty card, also if im not mistaken the 4000ti is dx8 so it doesnt push itself so hard
  3. Also realize your x800 is going to be drawing far more effects and what not because it supports DX9.0 while the Ti4200 only supports DX8.0.

    So the slowdowns could be when theres a lot of action going on and what not and it has to draw a lot more while your Ti4200 is only drawing a far less complicated scene.
  4. Call of duty... that's probably a DX9 game, not sure about enemy territory though... but 40fps at minimum settings? Which resolution are we talking?

    Not your power supply, insufficient PSU will cause crashing, not frametare slowdowns.
  5. Cleeve: A PSU that has high voltage lux on it can cause frame rate dip.
    For example, Don't plug your external line into a PCI-E GPU, the clock frequencies remain the same, and your machine will post and boot (depending on the system, but most of the time it works) and run a game. Your rates will drop dramatically but it will still keep chugging along.

    I did the exact same thing with my 7800GT and now my X1800XT....

    EDIT: Now that I re-read that, its not a great comparison lol. Anywho.

    Run driver cleaner and reinstall the latest Cat's, Omega's or whatever 3rd party preference you have then get back to us.
  6. Interesting. I'l take your word for it, although I've only personally seen bad PSU's cause crashing.

    So in your experience, how much of a difference did it make when you got a better PSU?
  7. it might be a videocard bios problem.my 5900xt had a bad bios wich kept reporting that insufficient power is reaching the gpu and then it automaticly slowed down the core and memory clocks resulting in slow FPS.
  8. Cleeve, if I recall correctly, COD and Wolfenstein:ET are both OGL games.


    Edit: Yup, and checking a few benchmarks, the X800XT shouldn't even breathe hard in either title.

    http://www.sharkyextreme.com/hardware/videocards/article.php/3211_3459701__3

    http://www.ixbt.com/video2/over2k4-cd-1024.shtml
  9. Oh yeah, shoulda known - wolfenstein: enemy territory would be OGL for sure, based on the Quake 3 engine right?

    Wasn't sure about COD though.

    Well, there you have it. Something is terribly wrong. :)
  10. lol thanks =P
    in bios i set it to 256 mb now, was 128
    uh i didnt get to test it yet
    but i installed sp2 now, and the ati with the newest catalyst drivers
    i just noticed that when i scroll down on websites or in other windows
    it goes down and up "jerky", i dont know how to describe it but i think you guys know what i mean

    u know why this shit happens?
    btw, at first i wanted to start et but there was some directx message, so i reinstalled mobo, sound and gfx drivers again

    and now its what i said above
  11. When it's jerky in 2d, I find that's usually a driver problem...
  12. when you say jerky, do you mean the whole screen or just the stuff on the page. if its just the webpage then its your mouse wheel because it wasent turned fully and it cant decide what you want to it messes up like that.

    if its the whole screen then like others have said, driver problem.
  13. What CPU are you using?
    It could be that you are running into CPU limitations when running dx9 whereas when you had you GF4 in you could only run dx8.1
  14. yea, it was a driver problem, or a driver setting problem

    in PCI settings it was PCI read off, set it to on now its going well, and the games start too, the performance is about as with the geforce now, but if i would disable AA and agp speed from 8 to 4 maybe it would be better, or even normal? :P

    tnx for your help all

    ps: im a noob at this, why did pci read off change anything when i got an agp card :oops:

    EDIT. the jerky window shit wasnt only with scrolling, it was by using the right bar thingie too =p
    EDIT2:P: what means temporal antialiasing


    lol if u answer all these questions im really thankful :D
  15. Temporal AA was ATI's "brilliant" idea too achieve better IQ.

    Basically, instead of using more AA samples to maintain a better image,
    the temporal switches the AA usage back and forth (like hot potatoe) between
    a high and low sample to make it "look" or simulate a high sample pattern.

    However from my experience, TAA was quite shoddy. Causing frame rate drop when I was still sitting on my X800 GPU's. But I learned later the driver disables TAA after dropping below 60fps in most games and reverts back normal AA samples. --IMO, dont bother and just disable the thing.

    As for 8x to 4x AGP. The difference is not anything noticable, but I wouldnt be the first person to lower it though. If you can say @ 8x AGP. Hense why I said disable TAA---that might help your overall experience. Maybe you should turn fastwrites off as well? (provided their on)


    Go into your BIOS and set your primary video display as AGP.
    There should be an advanced settings tab with either PCI or AGP as your choice. Then make sure your Arpeture size is 256mb as well.....
  16. you got it my friend ........

    i can get more frames with a gf 4 mx 440 ..but ..... in dx8......meaning no shaders .. no details..etc.....

    with a x800xl dx9 setup....max details ...if a remember correctly i got between 50 .. and 70 fps ..which is very good.....a 6800gs performed a liitle worse ..but still very playable


    you can get more with a gf4mx440 or whatever (ti4200) but in dx8 or worse ... but the game looks lokie hell ...
  17. COD is a dx game....
    Wolfenstein is opengl game
  18. GF4MX is Geforce2 based - meaning it supports DX 7 (!).

    A ti4200 in good condition, from a good manufacturer, can chug quite a load in OpenGL and ask for more.

    An Ati with drivers just so-so from an unknown manufacturer on an AGP 8x port will slow down under the level attained by a ti4200.

    I own a MSI ti4200 (DX8); my bro' has a (noname) Radeon 9500 (DX9).

    I installed NFS:Underground 2 on both machines.
    - it ran without too much problems on the ti
    - it had to be set at lowest graphical settings on the Radeon (640x480, no texture filtering, no blur, no AA, low textures, nothing). On top of that, it would often freeze. Until...

    - I reduced its AGP rate from 8x to 4x; I activated fast writes though. Took care of freezes.
    - I cleaned it (dust puppy). A bit more stable yet.
    - new drivers, from Ati's website (Catalyst 6.3 then 6.4, but with CCC 5.9). A good registry cleanup helped.
    - new AGP bus driver (Nforce2).

    The PC was a W2Ksp4 that hadn't been reinstalled for some time, a corrupted registry dating back to a severe virus infection - but a reinstall provided no significant speed boost.

    After that, NFSU2 ran MUCH better on the Radeon 9500 (1024x768, max textures, aniso, blur, HDR, AA when I don't want to go fast).
  19. Unfortunately we really can't compare a 9500 to an X800 bud.

    wierd how you solve your issues though. Driver update makes sense, yes.
    But reducing the AGP rate?....fastwrites though are a given, usually recommended to be enabled 95-9800 series......depending on the system.
  20. well, considering that AGP8X doubles the transfert rate on the same carrier frequency, it would stand to reason that poor quality electronics or just bad luck would introduce interferences that would berelevant at 8X, but not at 4x...

    If a 9500 can get such a boost with what I did, it would be reasonable to think that a X800 would also get some kick to the @$$...

    Updating the AGP driver can also be an help, but so can be a mobo BIOS upgrade - some BIOSes just don't like some pieces of hardware.
  21. what actually is an agp driver and where can i get it?
    tnx again, u guys are a big help
  22. Quote:
    COD is a dx game....
    Wolfenstein is opengl game

    Digit-life's charts say it's OGL. http://www.ixbt.com/video2/over2k4-cd-1024.shtml
  23. Its Because That Its An ATI No Just Kidding. As The Guy Said Below You Possibly A Conflict, Not Enuff Power Or Even Possible Overheating, Causing Throttling
  24. in your case, it used to be called Via 4-in-1 - I don't remember what it's called now. But considering you have a socket A mobo, I'd say the 4-in-1 4.35 would work nice anyway.
  25. thats a call of duty 1 benchmark not a call of duty 2 benchmark
  26. Yes, it is COD1 which I take it the OP is refering to as he pairs COD with Enemy Territory. Both old games.
  27. hmm slowly im believing im doing something wrong with my installation maybe. i still got those fps problems

    can some1 of u tell me your way like- lets say- when u just formatted windows and what u all install and what u set your driver settings too
    maybe i made a mistake somewhere
  28. What I usually do is this:
    1- Format
    2- Windows
    3- Updated DirectX
    4- Mobo drivers
    5- Video drivers
    6- Audio drivers (if you have an audio card, like a SoundBlaster)
    7- Any other driver (like for a printer, or something)
    8- And then, well, everything else ;)

    You should do a disk defragmentation after everything is installed. Good luck! 8)
  29. are you installing the system from a Windows XP CD, or from your computer's restoration CDs? Most softwares forced upon you by the likes of HP/Dell/etc. have such an impact on your system's performance that they make a high-end system seem slower than a well tuned p233 under Win98...
    If it's he latter, try this:
    - if at all possible, cut your disk into 2 partitions: one for the system, one for the apps. The system partition at least should be using NTFS
    - uninstall all softwares (Norton is top of the list to remove), keep only the essential (install a free antivirus; Grisoft is my recommendation, but there are others. Anything else is 'extra' for now)
    - deactivate unneeded services (you don't need Server if you don't share directories, or IR if it's a desktop systems etc. Also, disable Themes service, Terminal service: you're back under Win2000, but much faster and stable)
    - deactivate system restore on all drives (you may keep a 200MB recovery space on the main drive, but disable the others)
    - manually set the paging file to a minimum eqaul to your RAM amount, and double that for the max
    - lock down IE (high security settings, very low cache, higher cookies security settings). Replace IE+ Outlook with Firefox+Thunderbird or Opera.
    - disable most GUI visual improvements (transparencies eat up resources)
    - disable system sounds
    - install latest service pack and fixes, reboot, and remove the hidden backup directories containing the updated files
    - remove most already installed drivers to replace them with the latest versions from the chip manufacturers: chipset, graphics and sound
    - defragment the drive
    - defragment the drive's system files using Sysinternal's pagedefrag

    The system tray should hold only 3-4 icons at most.

    Personally that's what I call a clean system. If you still get FPS variations, then it's hardware-related.
  30. Quote:
    are you installing the system from a Windows XP CD, or from your computer's restoration CDs? Most softwares forced upon you by the likes of HP/Dell/etc. have such an impact on your system's performance that they make a high-end system seem slower than a well tuned p233 under Win98...
    If it's he latter, try this:
    - if at all possible, cut your disk into 2 partitions: one for the system, one for the apps. The system partition at least should be using NTFS
    - uninstall all softwares (Norton is top of the list to remove), keep only the essential (install a free antivirus; Grisoft is my recommendation, but there are others. Anything else is 'extra' for now)
    - deactivate unneeded services (you don't need Server if you don't share directories, or IR if it's a desktop systems etc. Also, disable Themes service, Terminal service: you're back under Win2000, but much faster and stable)
    - deactivate system restore on all drives (you may keep a 200MB recovery space on the main drive, but disable the others)
    - manually set the paging file to a minimum eqaul to your RAM amount, and double that for the max
    - lock down IE (high security settings, very low cache, higher cookies security settings). Replace IE+ Outlook with Firefox+Thunderbird or Opera.
    - disable most GUI visual improvements (transparencies eat up resources)
    - disable system sounds
    - install latest service pack and fixes, reboot, and remove the hidden backup directories containing the updated files
    - remove most already installed drivers to replace them with the latest versions from the chip manufacturers: chipset, graphics and sound
    - defragment the drive
    - defragment the drive's system files using Sysinternal's pagedefrag

    The system tray should hold only 3-4 icons at most.

    Personally that's what I call a clean system. If you still get FPS variations, then it's hardware-related.


    tnx :)

    yes the pc is from medion, and its a restoration cd
    i will try some of the things u said

    btw. i got 3 partitions already, it was like this
    one is where windows installed and all the other stuff, one is where my backups are, and the other one was called "recover", there are some files called factory.002 and .003 etc, and factory.pqi, dunno what that is
    4gb is full 3 is still left, how much gb should there for the windows? then i would install it there/and remove those weird files or are they important for something? =p
  31. the 'recover' partition normally holds the same stuff your recovery CDs contains - you can get rid of it if your recovery CDs work correctly.

    I would recommend 8 Gb for a WinXP system partition, double that if you don't remove the hotfixes' backups, don't purge IE's cache and don't deactivate system recovery.
  32. btw in hardware manager the intel pentium 4 processor is only shown ONCE

    i remember it was shown twice some time ago, fakes to be 2 proc's as a dual processor or so i heard

    EDIT
    and i noticed today while playing, its going well for about a half hour with around 100 fps, then its going down to 50 fps
  33. Only one CPU: you have hyperthreading disabled in BIOS, and/or 'machine type' is set to 'PC monoprocessor' in Device manager.

    Slowdown after a set time:
    - either a driver problem
    - or an overheat one

    Catalyst 6.6 are out, try them. Clean your card. Check that your CPU and GPU coolers work correctly (Pentium 4 use throttling when overheating, so do modern video cards) - do they spin on boot? Do they still spin on play? Are heatsinks burning hot when the slowdowns occur? Best case, they should be very hot but not unbearably so.
  34. Quote:
    and i noticed today while playing, its going well for about a half hour with around 100 fps, then its going down to 50 fps


    This screams overheating to me. Open your case, use clean air to blow away any visible dust (clean dust filters if you have them), fire up your computer and start playing. If the cooling fans work properly, you shouldn't get any dps loss, even after hours of play.

    If this works, close your case and try to play again, then report back to us.

    Erratic behavior is not necessarily a driver issue!
  35. regarding your problem with the scrolling i had a similar problem once and my music would jump terribly (Winamp) whenever this happened. this led me to beleive a hardware conflict between GPU and Sound card i used POWERSTRIP and fixed it i would try this if your having similar problems this should also fix your issues in game if this is your problem ofc

    EDIT: ofc it could conflict with a number of things not just sound so try removing everything but your gpu, HDD & CDD or turning it off in bios if your using an on board system then see the results and give feedback

    EDIT2: lol just remembered i fixed a friends comp once by moving the pci cards into different slots which must have forced them to be re addressed and therefore removed conflict
  36. Quote:
    Erratic behavior is not necessarily a driver issue!


    That's why I told him to check the temp on both his CPU and GPU coolers.
  37. hmm
    i tried an old ati 9800xl which was with the pc already
    its the same problem with fps

    and yes, the coolers work and yes the cards getting pretty hot :p
    after gaming it was around 60° it said in the catalyst control center


    and one other hardware change-but i got that already since some months now-is 1gb more memory

    512 was installed, now its 1,5gb
  38. try removing the older ram stick (keep 1Gb alone) and try again. RAM can heat up too.
  39. damn damn damn

    my pc almost didnt start anymore
    i formatted
    after it formatted it copied new files, then it got stuck, i restarted my pc, then suddenly the pc turned off, tried it again, and it wouldnt start anymore
    then i got some error message BOOT_edvice or something
    and i read in a book that it has to do with my harddisk, so i plugged in some white cord from the power supply instead of the one which was in ( a green one :p)
    then it worked
    games still dont work better now though
    at the beginning good, and getting worse after a half hour to the half fps

    i switched my gfx card to the 9800xl, was the same
    i put out my 1gb ram, was the same

    wtf else can it be? o_0

    could it realy be something with the harddisk? becuz games also start slower than they used to, a black screen of 5-10 sec is in most games now before it loads

    can i check it somehow? i heard with checkdisk or so =P

    AHHHHHHHH FUCKIN 30 FPS
  40. these problems seem more motherboard related... Try to get a new one and test your components (RAM, CPU, hard disk) independantly.
  41. tnx for the help
    but i got no money :P
  42. borrow one...
  43. ya, but then i see that it WORKS and then i must buy one anway

    ah, mayb i got guarantee still of this mofo pc, then some techniq fool can switch it
  44. ok tnx all
    problem is solved

    there was a ton of dust in the cpu cooler =p
    now im getting 300 fps :p
  45. told you so...

    It is good manners to check your system every 3-4 months to ensure there isn't too much dust in it and to clean it if there is. Not only does it keep it cooler, it reduces the risks of power leakages leading to instability, crashes, reduced component life, noisy fans..

    Oh, and a clean system definitely looks better than a dusty one :P
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