Archived from groups: comp.periphs.printers (
More info?)
Tony wrote:
>measekite <measekite@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
>
>>When asked who the manufacturer/formulator of what they sells is and the
>>BRAND that they sell this is the typical response from the majority of
>>the hawkers. That is why it is a whores business that needs to be
>>cleaned up. Oh yet it is compatible and if your printhead clogs we will
>>take care of it. Try and collect.
>>
>>Typical answer:
>>
>>
>>We sell the ink bottles individually, the price is $3.95 for 60 ml plus
>>$6.50 shipping and handling. Unfortunately, I cannot give you the other
>>information you are asking. Please call in for sales. 888-304-6125
>>
>>
>>
><snip>
>
>I have been pondering this post and some others from the same person and would
>like to offer some thoughts.
>
>Firstly there are legitimate reasons why vendors may not advise who their
>supplier is -
>1. They may believe they have an edge in quality and/or cost of material and
>don't want their competitors to know.
>
>
So they expect you to purchase an unknown because they do not want you
to know or be able to track the real quality of what they are selling.
>2. They may change suppliers from time to time after careful research into
>quality and compatibility.
>
>
That is one of the reasons that the OEMs have an advantage - Consistency.
>3. They may be annoyed by the way some people demand confidential information!
>
>
Bullshit. Go ask Toyota who makes the engine in their cars. In the
80's General Motors tried bullshit like this by putting Chevrolet
Engines in some Oldsmobile without disclosing this to the buyer. When
caught they were sued and lost.
>The business is not a whores business, it is a legitimate extremely large
>industry that has been in existence for more than 2 decades, many of todays
>compatible cartridge manufacturers/remanufacturers have been in business all of
>that time and have tens of thousands of satisfied customers otherwise they
>would no longer exist, the margins are very small indeed.
>
Many exist because of the turnover of people. There are a couple of ink
formulators that may be OK. Unfortunately this ink is sold under a
bunch of labels and not adequately disclosed. Some of the hawkers will
tell you if you call and ask because they do not want to loose a
potential customer but they do not disclose this on their website. All
they do is say buy buy buy and here is the price and say how compatible
it is but they do not adequately describe what you are getting. I
resent this unprofessional sales tactics and that is why I think of then
as whores.
>The logic is
>inescapable, at least to somebody with more than one brain cell.
>
And I take it you think you are above an amoeba.
>I don't know
>many in this business that make guarantees about head clogging that are in any
>way superior to the OEM guarantees (which don't really exist) - think about it!
>There is no evidence at all other than the tenuous bits and pieces in this and
>similar forums that non OEM ink causes more problems than OEM ink;
>
Do the math. More people who report head clogs admit they use non OEM
inks. Sure some use the OEM inks and get clogged heads but the vast
majority on this NG say they are using after market inks. Also when
asked they do not know the
BRAND they are using. The best they can say is either the label or the
source.
>these forums
>are in no way a measure of the quality of inks OEM or otherwise, to understand
>this needs three brain cells. Actual comparisons are done by manufacturers of
>all persuasions who in most cases do detailed and scientific research into the
>quality of their products, this includes listening to their customers some of
>whom are giant corporations who are careful about the way they spend their
>money (believe me they are!).
>
>
PCWORLD did a review on after market inks and concluded that they caused
more problems than OEM and recommended not to use them. Yes, I know
they take advertising from Canon, HP, and Epson.
>The word brand properly applies to anybody who makes something and sells it
>under their own name,
>
That is the definition of a private label or label. It is not a BRAND.
>whether they be a large or small company and ink is by no
>means the only constituent in a properly made or refilled cartridge, there are
>many other factors including the container design, the filling process, the
>sealing of the head/nozzle and the packaging (not the marketing, but the way
>the cartridge is protected during its shelf life - this is absolutely critical
>and difficult to achieve with some cartridges). I have seen more failed
>cartridges from one particular OEM than from all of their refilling competitors
>combined and they have a massive chunk of the market, so even they struggle!
>Two other OEM's have struggled to achieve quality, one has made it and another
>has a way to go. It is a hard industry but no complaints after all most of the
>easy businesses are illegal!!!
>
>The other thought I had is that it is oh so easy to be anonymously rude and
>discourteous in news groups, clearly it needs someone of huge intellect to blag
>an entire industry about which they know almost nothing. Printheads fail
>sometimes, mostly they are recoverable. The causes are very well understood and
>rarely have anything to do with ink quality unless the customer buys at the
>bottom of the market (true of just about all industries right? Sorry that needs
>five brain cells to understand!) - that is based on years of experience not
>just an opinion based on one or two printer problems.
>
>
Most of the head clogs involve the drying of ink in the print head.
Most of the instances of this occurs when the person was not using OEM
ink. I said most of the instances not all. And sure some of them use
bottom of the barrel cheap o inks but not all. And their may be one or
two formulators that produce a reasonable product but unfortunately they
do not package and brand their stuff and sell them through all marketing
channels. That is a shame.
>Most of the OEM's talk to each other in an attempt to keep the industry fair,
>clearly they do not share all information with their competitors but these are
>often formal meetings to set cross company standards (this is normal in many
>industries).
>
This borders against anti trust laws.
> The same processes occur with compatible suppliers who have
>objectives that include standardisation of quality (at least as good as OEM's),
> fairness to customers, intelligent disposal of waste (ie zero dumping and no
>polution) and other non-confidential common goals. Whores industry - I don't
>think so.
>
>It is my fervent wish that we can keep this ng available to those who want help
>and for those who are willing to freely give it rather than a forum for the
>opinionated few.
>
>Have you notced that the people who offer answers to others requests for help
>rarely if ever push their own company (assuming they have one), could it be
>that they are honest, courteous and fair minded? (Brain cell number six needed
>here).
>
>
I am not asking for any renumeration for setting you straight. Think
about it.
>Tony
>
>
>
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