I Can't Wait Anymore..

[ChrisBond]

O.k. Hello guys first time to the forums, so I don't know where to put this post.
So let me tell you my short story. I'm a high school student soon to graduate but I'm taking graphic design classes. I use Maya and some 3DsMax to do most of my projects. But I run a Dell 8300 @ 3 Ghz with 512 Mb and a Nvidia FX5200 128 Mb AGP graphics card with 120 Gb HDD at home. For some reason the programs run slowly and/or give the blue screen. Also the computer runs slow period and would crash periodically when im not doing anything. So I told to buy an Apple to do the design work and also told to wait for the Intel versions to come out but I seriously don't have that kind of money to spend on those computers. So should I buy spring in and buy an Apple or build one or what do you guys think? I would be thankful if you guys could help me.

Thanks in advance.
-Chris

P.S. I'm also gamer but not extreme like SLI if that helps at all.

 

[1Tanker]

O.k. Hello guys first time to the forums, so I don't know where to put this post.
So let me tell you my short story. I'm a high school student soon to graduate but I'm taking graphic design classes. I use Maya and some 3DsMax to do most of my projects. But I run a Dell 8300 @ 3 Ghz with 512 Mb and a Nvidia FX5200 128 Mb AGP graphics card with 120 Gb HDD at home. For some reason the programs run slowly and/or give the blue screen. Also the computer runs slow period and would crash periodically when im not doing anything. So I told to buy an Apple to do the design work and also told to wait for the Intel versions to come out but I seriously don't have that kind of money to spend on those computers. So should I buy spring in and buy an Apple or build one or what do you guys think? I would be thankful if you guys could help me.

Thanks in advance.
-Chris

P.S. I'm also gamer but not extreme like SLI if that helps at all.

Well, this is a bad time for you to update, as Intel and AMD are in the midst of revamping their lineups. But running 512MB of RAM is a joke, and i would suggest that , using the apps you do, you get 2GB of RAM. 2x1GB sticks would be the best configuration. The problem is, whether you want to spend the money on memory, or just upgrade to a more powerful machine instead. Your best bet, performance-wise would be to wait for a month or so, and get a Conroe setup.

 

[computerburglar]

O.k. Hello guys first time to the forums, so I don't know where to put this post.
So let me tell you my short story. I'm a high school student soon to graduate but I'm taking graphic design classes. I use Maya and some 3DsMax to do most of my projects. But I run a Dell 8300 @ 3 Ghz with 512 Mb and a Nvidia FX5200 128 Mb AGP graphics card with 120 Gb HDD at home. For some reason the programs run slowly and/or give the blue screen. Also the computer runs slow period and would crash periodically when im not doing anything. So I told to buy an Apple to do the design work and also told to wait for the Intel versions to come out but I seriously don't have that kind of money to spend on those computers. So should I buy spring in and buy an Apple or build one or what do you guys think? I would be thankful if you guys could help me.

Thanks in advance.
-Chris

P.S. I'm also gamer but not extreme like SLI if that helps at all.

Well you can do two things:
1. upgrade your video card and add at least another 512mb of ram. Get a mid-range or old highend video card.
2. build a new one. Grab like a Pentium D, mid-range video card, 1gig of ram(min) and other components.

Yes true new processors coming out but often times of hardware the recently "old hardware" is still good and the new ones coming out are a tad "overkill". It would make sense to wait but if you don't play with high res on your games then it won't matter.

BTW i am in the same position(graphic designer) and mine runs fine. I have a xp 2500+, 1 gig ram, radeon 9600 for the moment. No problems. Really your problem was not enough ram and a very weak(crappy) video card.

 

[The_Abyss]

You might be best served as others have said getting a lower end Core 2 Duo system, or an AM2 X2 system both of which will help enormously with your 3D design work, and won't be too bad for games as well.

Look to run 2gb of RAM and get a nice fast HDD.

 

[FeareX]

The HDD is probably 7200rpm right? Because his system isnt that old. Get some more ram and as a video card (don't know for sure on AGP) get something like a x850pro they arent that expensive anymore.

 

[Dade_0182]

Two things we need to know to be able to help is your budget and when exactly do you want this setup. If you can wait a while, i suggest getting a conroe, haven't seen anything bad about them. If you can't at least upgrade your ram and video card.

 

[ChrisBond]

Well Thank you all for helping. And my budget is a little over $1000 to be more exact like no more than $1500. And i would like this setup as soon as possible. Because i tired of the crashes and what knot and laggish performance. But is waiting for the Core 2 worth it as the other guy mention?
Thanks

 

[Dade_0182]

Personally I'm an AMD guy but i don't act like a fanboy like alot of people on this forum. I for one can accept that the Core 2 Duo is WAY better than anything that AMD has to offer in any price range. Until AMD comes up with a new solution I'll suggest to anyone to get Core 2.

 

[Akifuddin]

$1,000 is more than enough man:

E6400
2GB DDR2-800 Corsair XMS or OCZ Gold RAM
X1900XT 512MB
Mobo that will support Kentsfield processors
Case you want
AT least 550W Power supply

It's a very nice system and will do very well for gaming and the designing you do.

 

[Corasik]

If your computer crashes, the chances are its faulty. I dont care how much people whine about Windows being bad, on a 100% working system, XP rarely if ever crashes.

I've got a 3.2Ghz Pentium IV system that I build myself, its starting to get quite old now, (role on conroe so I can get a nice upgrade), and I can count the number of bluescreens I've had on 1 hand.

My brothers Dell on the other hand often bluescreens. I have some doubt about the quality of dells quality control sometimes.

I'd wait a few more weeks, and then build your own system based on Core 2 Duo. If you want maximum stability and are not interested in overclocking, then Intel's own branded motherboards are normally extremely stable, and reliable.

 

[Heyyou27]

what can you spend? an apple mac mini is 700 - 800 dollars.
also your dell is probably fine do a disk defrag and get more memory and see what happens

He does want to upgrade.

 

[swifty_morgan]

If you don't have alot of money to spend, get a gig of ram and a better video card. One with 512 memory if you can afford it.

 

[NightlySputnik]

Hello Chris, like Computerburglar before, I think it's not so mich your cpu that's the problem here.

Get more memory, at least 1GB total or even better, 2GB total memory. These applications use as much memory as you can give them.

I also think getting a more powerful GPU would help. When you look at the system requirement for 3dsMax, it says: "OpenGL and Direct3D hardware acceleration supported: 3D graphic accelerator 1280*1024*32-bit color with 256MB recommended.". So it become quite obvious that your VPU is most probably slowing you down also. You can easily get a Radeon 9600Pro for less than 80$ these day if money is hard coming for you. Or a Radeon X1600 for less than 150$m which should be better at both 3dsMax and gaming.

Here's the link, go check page 4: http://images.autodesk.com/adsk/files/3dsMax8_techspec_rev.pdf

Start with this, and then think about a new cpu.

 

[sunangel]

Before you buy anymore new components, strip all the Dell installed bloatware off the machine. Anything that is not critical to the functioning of the pc, use add/remove programs from system properties. After that look, up date your drivers through Dell only. Finally do a virus scan and a spyware scan (you may need to download either ad-aware or spybot). Afterwards, you should see a noticeable difference in the performance of your computer. If not, upgrading the amount of memory all ways helps. You only need to upgrade the graphics card if your gonna play games. Otherwise what you have is fine. Also, find out if your motherboard accepts SATA hard drives. If it does, replace your current ones and add two need drives and put them in a RAID 0 configuration. I guarantee with a RAID 0 configuration you will notice the difference.

To sum up: remove bloatware, do virus/spyware scan, upgrade memory to 1GB (always helps), and upgrade hard drives to SATA RAID 0 (highly recommended).

 

[NightlySputnik]

You only need to upgrade the graphics card if your gonna play games.

False, go check my post above to see that at least 3dsMax use hardware 3D acceleration. I have to admit tough that I don't know the performance gain of it, or between different VPU model.

Anybody knows?

 

[chewbenator]

Because he was suggested it does anyone know alot about Macs here that could suggest him one?

But, what I would like to know is, will there be an Imac or newly announced Emac that runs Conroe? With Apple's fairly recent switch to Intel Processors I see it as a possibility.

 

[qwazzy]

If your computer crashes, the chances are its faulty. I dont care how much people whine about Windows being bad, on a 100% working system, XP rarely if ever crashes.

I've got a 3.2Ghz Pentium IV system that I build myself, its starting to get quite old now, (role on conroe so I can get a nice upgrade), and I can count the number of bluescreens I've had on 1 hand.

My brothers Dell on the other hand often bluescreens. I have some doubt about the quality of dells quality control sometimes.

I'd wait a few more weeks, and then build your own system based on Core 2 Duo. If you want maximum stability and are not interested in overclocking, then Intel's own branded motherboards are normally extremely stable, and reliable.

On my Dell, I have had 7 and counting...:lol:

 

[qwazzy]

Boy. Macs? :? Have you seen what kind of Intel processors are in there right now and how much they cost?

 

[Hoppy6698]

I'll start by saying that I am an AMD fan, so here is my current build at Newegg (if you cant wait) -

https://secure.newegg.com/NewVersio...571927&WishListTitle=Gamers+Rig+-+Socket+AM2

I have some things in there you could obviously lose (UV lighting, etc), but the basic components are there and 2GB of RAM with a high end video card (not highest). The AMD chip is very cheap, but the socket will allow future upgrades when your budget allows. Im sure the guys here will let you know where you can trim the fat off of my rig.

The key point of my rig is this - Socket and SLI are upgradeable in the future, as well as two more banks of RAM. Well within the budget you quoted. Mine was built for gaming with future upgrades in mind. Suggest the single core chip over duals atm. Duals will only come down in pricing and not many apps can fully tax the chips properly (until Vista arrives).

hope this helps.

 

[bisaci]

Two floppie drives? Renaissance man.....

 

[jitpublisher]

Man, if you plan on doing anything other than running your 3D apps, don't buy a Mac. Even our die hard Mac fanboys at the office that just had to have new G5's a few years back are now using PC's and the freakin $7000 Macs are sitting around collecting dust. The only reason we even still have them is occasionally, and I mean very occasionally, we get sent a file in Mac format from a client.

 

[Weeble]

I can't speak much about Max as I don't use it day to day, but Maya wise your specs are definitely going to struggle.

Some good news is that what version of Maya you are using can assist with specs. If you plan on using all the features of Unlimited (hair, fur, advanced animation features) and to render that out you need a higher basic spec than if you are just working in PLE etc and are not planning on rendering / doing a lot of animation.

Whichever you are working on, your current memory is simply inadequate and will account, almost by itself, for the errors and crashes you are getting.

If you are working seriously a regular 3d card won't cut it and is not supported, you need a workstation level card for advanced work. The main benefit in something like a Quadro card however is in viewport work; they let you work on far more complex scenes. Still, most people are not doing that at home.

Given also that those are some serious cards (and cost some serious cash) and (as they are not designed for it) actually run most games on a multiple use PC like a pile of 4 year old undies, a lot of people run on a hobbyist/learning basis with 'regular' hardware. You can run learning standard Maya perfectly decently on a 7900GT.

Your biggest decision needs to be whether you want to build what is in effect a workstation or build a regular 'all things to all men' PC and compromise on some features in 3d apps. If you are thinking workstation for the purpose of 3D you need to think about multiple core Mobos etc and specialist cards and you can easily burn 6-10k without a second thought (which is a bit pointless for home use). If you go dual dual core on a current Opteron chip I'd recommend Mobos along the lines of the Tyan Tiger K8WE or the Tyan Thunder K8WE (but down that road lies EEC registered RAM and lord knows what else).

As you are currently pre grad (and unless you are loaded with cash in which case send us all some) I'd recommend a multi use spec that satisfies all you want from a PC, with emphasis on memory and CPU grunt and a decent graphics card. You can consider a 64bit O/S as the memory can use it, but it may not suit your home use in other apps. Talking only 939 (which is now being superceded) you can get pretty decent home performance (and some people make some cash from) Maya with a X24800 chip.

Definitely go dual core (dual on a single core) though, whether that be AMD or Intel as, although viewport speed isn't so much subject to it, rendering certainly is.

Whether to get a Mac or not depends on whether you want to live day to day with Macs..I use both at work but I have PC's at home. A Maya level Mac will cost you a lot more than building a PC yourself.

I'd recommend a specialist 3d forum for more advice on 3d apps and specs. You might find CG talk helpful, a lot of industry pros hang out on (and recruit on, speaks the living proof) on those boards.

http://www.cgsociety.org/

I'd also recommend waiting for Conroe / AMD2 price drops before investing in new stuff for 3d...home users already have to stretch to run these apps, may as well see if the cash stretches further than you hoped. Speaking from experience you will end up with a number of machines, and that's after staring at them for 12 hours at work, so bang for buck is always best

Good luck with the 3d.

 

[NightlySputnik]

I'll start by saying that I am an AMD fan, so here is my current build at Newegg (if you cant wait) -

https://secure.newegg.com/NewVersio...571927&WishListTitle=Gamers+Rig+-+Socket+AM2

I have some things in there you could obviously lose (UV lighting, etc), but the basic components are there and 2GB of RAM with a high end video card (not highest). The AMD chip is very cheap, but the socket will allow future upgrades when your budget allows. Im sure the guys here will let you know where you can trim the fat off of my rig.

The key point of my rig is this - Socket and SLI are upgradeable in the future, as well as two more banks of RAM. Well within the budget you quoted. Mine was built for gaming with future upgrades in mind. Suggest the single core chip over duals atm. Duals will only come down in pricing and not many apps can fully tax the chips properly (until Vista arrives).

hope this helps.

I totally disagree.

First, wait 1 more month before upgrading and get a Core2Duo over AMD if it's performances and good price you want. The E6600 (300-350$) will generally outperform the A64FX-62 (1000$) in most application (I'd say around 60% of them, mostly encoding and gaming).

Second, make sure to get a dual-core cpu, if again you want to go that route, because 3dsMax can make good use of it. I guess Maya also can, otherwise it would lag the technology curve in that area. You'll get performances advantage that'll be more than worth the extra cash spent.

My 2 cents!

 

[Hoppy6698]

Two floppie drives? Renaissance man.....

Right, one is only for setup (old school) to flash the bios. The other is a multicomponent so hooks up to a USB2.0 inside, that is better installed after the OS is up and running.

 

[FITCamaro]

what can you spend? an apple mac mini is 700 - 800 dollars.

Uh yeah and you think those can handle programs like Maya? Macs in the 3D design area are no longer on the level they used to be except for the G5 towers that still use PowerPCs. Most of what made Macs so good at that stuff was the 32 MMX registers they have compared to Intel/AMDs 8. Granted dual core gives 16 total plus an extra core to work on. Now when Conroe comes out and they start replacing the G5s in the towers, it'll probably make up for it. But even a $700-800 dollar Mac mini with a PowerPC processor is gonna suck at that stuff since it'd probably have maybe 512MB of RAM and shitty integrated graphics.