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Hard drive tempature at 120 degrees F

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July 16, 2006 3:14:53 AM

I have a seagate 7200.8 250gb hard drive. It runs great, and is like a hot plate. In fact it's usually running as hot as my processor does at full load at 120 degrees f.

I know the thermal limit for seagate drives is 140 f. Does anyone know if running it at even 120 is bad? Should I get a cooler for it? also does anyone know whath appends when a drive does over heat?

I do have cooling in my system a fan in front, read and a antec truepower psu with the big fan.

Also any idea what the normal/average running temp is for this drive? Like I said it's the hottest thing in my case at idle, the ambient temp in the case is around 100-110 degrees f. Air temp outsid the case is 75-80 degrees f.

Any help on the topic would be great! Thanks.
a b G Storage
July 16, 2006 3:36:15 AM

49C is hot for a hard drive..... if you have any spots in your case to mount front panel fans (preferably a 120mm) then get one, and have it blowing into the case.

Edit: Your ambient case temp is pretty warm too.... if you have an 80mm fan at the back, replace it with a 120mm if possible.
July 16, 2006 4:24:07 AM

Quote:
I have a seagate 7200.8 250gb hard drive. It runs great, and is like a hot plate. In fact it's usually running as hot as my processor does at full load at 120 degrees f.

I know the thermal limit for seagate drives is 140 f. Does anyone know if running it at even 120 is bad? Should I get a cooler for it? also does anyone know whath appends when a drive does over heat?

I do have cooling in my system a fan in front, read and a antec truepower psu with the big fan.

Also any idea what the normal/average running temp is for this drive? Like I said it's the hottest thing in my case at idle, the ambient temp in the case is around 100-110 degrees f. Air temp outsid the case is 75-80 degrees f.

Any help on the topic would be great! Thanks.



Well for one thing your case does not seem to be well vented.
Well vented does NOT involve a bunch of fans...it is about <proper> air flow.

The first thing I would do is remove the rear fan guard on your case. If it is a fixed part of the case then buy a metal nibbler and cut it out so you get 100% exit air flow....most case fan guards block 70% of the air that the fan could move.

Your psu is not a case cooler and you should really never feel "hot" air comeing out of it. Not only will that shorten the lifespan of the psu but it effects the power output and any OC.

Z
Related resources
July 16, 2006 5:09:26 AM

The hard drive is kept on one of those 5 1/2 inch rail mounts by the cd rom. I know there is little or no air circulation up there. My case temp tends to read at 100 degrees even if the side of the case is off. The ambient air temp in the room is around 74-78 f.

I hear what you say about the case fan rear exit. The psu I have which is this one: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E1681...
As you can see has a very large fan drawing air from the cpu area. I am sure that would at least help get some of the hot air out of the case wouldn't it?

That is a good idea about cutting out the metal "grill" covering the rear case fan I have no doubt that will help air move more efficently. Do you think one of those cyclones that sucks air out of the case and mounts ina pci slot would be good?

Also what in your opinnion is good for a case temp? What about a hard drive temp? I think I read somewhere that these seagate drives run hot anyway, guess I will have to see what everyone elses average temp is.

Thank for your responses so far I appreciate it!
July 16, 2006 5:25:23 AM

My system temp is 87 degrees faren (about 31 degrees celsius) and my WD Raptors are not much warmer than that (they hover around 29-32 degrees celsius)
July 16, 2006 5:35:33 AM

So what kind of coolling do you have in your case and what is the room's air temp? Also what is your system specs?

Thanks I appreciate it.
July 16, 2006 5:51:30 AM

My System:

Presler 955 3.46
Abit AW8D
7900 GT
2 gigs DDR2 800
2 WD 34 gig raptors in raid 0
1 Maxtor 300GB
Creative X-Fi Fatality
52-in-1 card reader
Coolermaster Stacker Case
SILVERSTONE SST-ST75ZF 750w PSU
dual cold cathode LED kit


Peltier cooler on the CPU (Swiftech)
Watercooled GPU (Danger Den NV78)
*120mm intake fan in the front at the bottom (from Coolermaster Stacker HDD Cage)
*120mm intake fan on the side (LED from window mod)
*120mm outtake fan at the top (LED from window mod)

I use two dual 120mm rads but they are mounted externally so they don't affect my system temp

ambient temp - mmm-- weather says it is 71 degrees but it's cooler in my apartment. I do live by the beach here in NY so that may have something to do with it.
July 16, 2006 6:14:08 AM

So its safe to say you have pretty good air flow through your case. I like to have a quiet computer, I do have fans 80mm I guess running in the front, and then one in the rear. They are not spinning at full speed though for quiet purposes, they are really loud when running at full rpm, I wonder if I cut out the grill in the front and back of the case if that will cut down on the noise when they do run full speed. I guess all i can do is try it out and see what happends.

thanks for your input, I am sure though a lot of your computer's cool running, has to do with the temperature in your apartment, if its under 70 degrees f then the air going into your computer would be quite a bit cooler then mine, I don't know how much that would help your computers case temp but if you have cool air flow, then you have a low air temp it adds up.

When my processor idles, at the same temp as my case temp and my hard drive is 20 degrees warmer, I guess that doesn't show good things. I will have to get a hdd cooler that mounts under neath the drive I guess that you can get from bb, cc etc for a few bucks. I wonder if one of those front coolers that mount in a 5 1/ 2 inch bay would be a good idea or both even? Have to look at some cost comparisons.

These are my average case temps at idle and full load during gaming etc.

mb temp: 100 idle -110 full load degrees f
cpu temp: 96 idle- 131 full load degrees f
video card: 47c idle 55c full load
northbridge: 79f idle 90f full load
hard drive: 107 idle 115-120 while system at full load.


thanks again.
a b G Storage
July 16, 2006 7:56:07 AM

Mount your hard drive in a regular 3 1/2" bay. Simple physics here..... heat rises. If your drive is mounted near the roof of the case, of course it's going to be warmer, ESPECIALLY if you don't have very good air flow in your case. And more fans does not mean more noise. I have a total of 8 fans in my computer. 5 case fans: 4 - 80mm (1 on the roof blowing up, 2 at the back blowing out, 1 on the side blowing in) and 1 - 120mm (front panel, blowing in over the hard drives), plus the CPU fan (on a stock LGA775 cooler), PSU fan and video card fan (Zalman VF900) . I can just barely hear my case will all of these fans running at full speed.

Find a 120mm fan (80mm if your case doesn't have any spots for 120mm fans) with the highest CFM at the lowest dba level. Anything above 30dba will be noticable.
July 16, 2006 8:13:08 AM

Is there any way that you can create a blowhole in the top of your case to put an exhaust fan in? I am not sure of the arrangment of your fans but if you can draw air in at the lower part of your case (or, at least, midlevel as I do with my side window mod) and exhaust air out the upper part of your case that would improve your conditions. Also, 120mm fans move alot more air than 80mm fans and there are some seriously quiet ones if there is any way you could add them.

Other things to consider would be to add drive bay fan units of some sort if it will help your circulation.

I think you'd experience a drop in overall temps of your components if you could manage better air circulation. The_Prophecy had a good suggestion if it is possible for you - consider mounting the drives in a regular bay (even add, bay fan blowers in front of it if you can).
July 16, 2006 4:33:20 PM

I appreciate the help guys, I don't believe there is enough room though between the psu and the cd rom case for a blow hole. Maybe a very tiny one I suppose but I don't know if it would be worth it.

I am wondering though if the culprite is bad case circulation, or if it is quite simply, a hot running hard drive. I remember reading a review on this drive where it mentioned this drive does run hot in comparison to others. That is why it would be so helpful if I could find other owners of the same drive to compare temps.

I think I am going to cut out the grill in the front and back and see i that helps with airflow, then I am going to let them run at full speed and see how loud it is.

That is amazing that you can have that much airflow/fans with little or no noise. It must be the 120mm size? I guess I will have to ge adapters for my case in order to fit them in, as my mounts are for 80mm


Thanks again all I appreciate it.
July 16, 2006 5:43:48 PM

I cut the grill's off the front and back of the case to let more air through for the fans. After about an hour of testing my case temp doesn't go above 102, the hard drive when being scanned or accessed for a long period of time does still go into the 110-115 range.

I did try to move the rear one up to full speed by plugging it into the motherbaord header, that thing moves a heck of a lot of air and sounds like a cyclone, I guess I will have to get a different one, my case temps did drop to 96 at that time though.

The mian problem though being my hard drive still hasn't really changed so I guess a hard drive cooler and maybe even a bay cooler to bring cool air in over the drive would be good. also I was thinking about doing a blow hole, but I don't know if that will help really and would involve some cutting. There is also a spot for a fan on my side case cover, it has a grill and some screw holes so maybe ill look into getting another fan for that at as well. Ill get this cooling situation under control, although it's really not extremely bad, my system is complete stable and is over clocked pretty heavily.

So we will see, thanks for all your help.
July 16, 2006 6:05:21 PM

What kind of case do you have?
July 16, 2006 6:59:58 PM

Am I correct in assuming that you don't have much (or little) exprience with modding? Your case, if it is similar to the case you pointed out, has alot of modding potential to help create better air circulation.
July 16, 2006 11:18:41 PM

Quote:
Am I correct in assuming that you don't have much (or little) exprience with modding? Your case, if it is similar to the case you pointed out, has a lot of modding potential to help create better air circulation.


Well if your talking about taking a case, then turning it into a work of art, that is correct I have little experience. I typically just buy a case and use it as is.

What did you have in mind? I already cut out the fan grill in the front and rear of the case to help with air flow. That seems to have helped a bit as my case temp is slightly lower at around 100 degrees - 102 at the motherboard temp gage.

I am going to go ahead and buy a hard drive cooler from best buy or circuit city tomorrow, maybe I will take a look at overpriced comp usa even. I know online would be cheaper, but after paying for shipping it will be about the same, at least on stuff that small.

I am going to buy two other case fans as well, some that will push more air but be a bit more quiet, as I said before the one I have now is on the power supply fan plug, that is used for throttling the case fans, I dint mean on the motherboard but antec has a special plug used for case fans which helps to lower the rpm, and make them more friendly on the ear the front fan is on the motherboard header itself and is quiet and does move some pretty good air, so maybe another one like that would be good.

One will be put in the rear hopefully it will be more quiet and push more air at the same time. Also I Will be putting one on the case side door which is located right above the cpu fan. I will also look into getting a dremel tool and cut a circular hole and some screw holes in the top of my case, and create a blow hole to help get rid of the hot air in the top of the case.

I really should just buy a new case and junk this pos. But I am married and well, she will kill me if she knows I am spending money in such a "stupid" way to her. Changing the case would be obvious, where as just making changes in the fans would not be, So we will see.


also anyone have any ideas what would be good to help with keeping dust out? LIke panty hose or screens or dryer sheets or something?
Thanks
a b G Storage
July 16, 2006 11:26:03 PM

don't use dust filters.... they limit airflow into the case, hurting your cooling performance.
July 17, 2006 12:06:18 AM

Cutting a blowhole in the top OR getting a wondow mod and putting a window on top that has a fan mount. By cutting a blowhole (fanmount) on top I mean one for an 80mm or 120mm fan so you could have a fan exhaling air at it's warmest point - at the top.
July 17, 2006 12:24:33 AM

Quote:
Cutting a blowhole in the top OR getting a wondow mod and putting a window on top that has a fan mount. By cutting a blowhole (fanmount) on top I mean one for an 80mm or 120mm fan so you could have a fan exhaling air at it's warmest point - at the top.


I see, yeah there does seem to be enough room in the top of the case for that to happen, There would be enough clearance between the psu and the cd rom mounts, I am sure that would help get rid of some hot air stuck up there with no where to go, it simply will sit there and continue to build up until you turn off the computer.

Any idea just howmuch that may help coool my computer down? Also any tips on how to make the hole? should I use a hole saw, or should I use a dremel tool?
July 17, 2006 12:41:36 AM

A dremel is a modders best friend......

Although, a hole saw would make it faster.

Just make sure that you draw out the fan placing so you dont cut away the area for the fan screws.

As for the benefits, overall it would be good - even excellent. It would benefit the case interior environment which would also benefit all your components and, especially, that hot running hard drive.
July 17, 2006 12:58:33 AM

spare your self and get a 5.25 inch bay cooler that has a fan that will draw air into the case for the top parts including your harddrive or get the hard drive cooler like i posted earlier. If you must cut a hole with a dremal make sure you mask off the surface your cutting to help lower the chance of damaging the areas arround the hole. also remove all parts as cutting though metal spreads a fine metal powder that will get in your componets. When done with the hole make sure you clean the case with a wet rag a few times and visually inspect for bards that might come lose eventually those pose hazzards to the motherboard.
July 17, 2006 1:05:22 AM

Quote:
A dremel is a modders best friend......

Although, a hole saw would make it faster.

Just make sure that you draw out the fan placing so you dont cut away the area for the fan screws.

As for the benefits, overall it would be good - even excellent. It would benefit the case interior environment which would also benefit all your components and, especially, that hot running hard drive.[/quote

Would you recommend placing the fan inside the case or on top outside the case?

I was thinking of getting this for the hard drive: http://www.bjorn3d.com/read.php?cID=60

or this instead which is cheaper:
http://www.compusa.com/products/product_info.asp?pfp=BR...
July 17, 2006 1:33:48 AM

That a bit warm for a hard drive. The normal or ideal operating temps of a hard drive is 30c-35c or 75f-85f and normal room temperature. Do you have a fan directing cool air to that hard drive? If so then you need to do so and if there's no fan mount in front of that hard drive then you need to creative and mod your case or just place a fan to blow cool air towards that warm hard drive. Like you said the temps does not reach the maximum temp threshold but a cooler hard drive runs better and may have longer lifespan as well.
July 17, 2006 1:45:00 AM

What you do, if it can be done, is put the fan on the inside and a grill on the outside. Place rubber groomets between the fan and where it contacts the case material so that they will act as vibration dampers and help keep the fan quiter. Having a grill on the outside will protect it.

That HDD cooler is actually pretty nice. I had never seen that particular model before but the thing I like the most about it is that is has a heatsink/fan combo and it would probably help your tremendously. It will blow the hot air inside the case though so it is paramount that you have good air circulation and having a blowhole/fanmount at the top would really help here.
July 17, 2006 1:54:48 AM

Quote:
What you do, if it can be done, is put the fan on the inside and a grill on the outside. Place rubber groomets between the fan and where it contacts the case material so that they will act as vibration dampers and help keep the fan quiter. Having a grill on the outside will protect it.

That HDD cooler is actually pretty nice. I had never seen that particular model before but the thing I like the most about it is that is has a heatsink/fan combo and it would probably help your tremendously. It will blow the hot air inside the case though so it is paramount that you have good air circulation and having a blowhole/fanmount at the top would really help here.


Great thank you for the advice, I appreciate it, the only thing I don't like about that thing is that it's expensive and well the temp readout is kind of unnecessary and it is white/baige in color which I have a black case. If it was black then I would be more tempted. Yeah im picky.

that seems like some pretty serious work taking apart my computer, buying a dremel tool cutting out the hole and redoing it all. but we will see how board i am tomorrow haha.

I just recently bought the new hardware listed, like the motherboard and video card etc. so ive been spending alot of time tweaking and playing with my computer in the hardware sense of the word. I have been spending very little time actually using it haha, I got a few minute of hitman blood money and it worked fabulously, much better improvement from my x800xl that I used when the demo first came out. Maxed out settings at 1600x1200 resolution with no jerkyness, the old video card could barely handle it at 1280x1024.
July 17, 2006 3:49:18 AM

Take a look at these hard drive coolers. I found a few that were black.

silverstone $22.99
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E1683...


AOC Evercool $24.99
http://www.tigerdirect.com/applications/SearchTools/ite...


Cooldrive 6 $39.99
http://www.nwca.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=products.showD...
(I use this one for one drive. A bit pricey but feature rich and excellent cooler results. I disconnected some of the cables that came with it but it has temp sensors for up to 4 probes and can acts as a fan controller for up to 4 fans. It also has internal software for these features and can connect to an internal usb port for them but I disconnected the usb cable and the fan controllers and just used the additional temp sensors for other parts of my computer)
July 17, 2006 4:45:13 AM

Quote:
What you do, if it can be done, is put the fan on the inside and a grill on the outside. Place rubber groomets between the fan and where it contacts the case material so that they will act as vibration dampers and help keep the fan quiter. Having a grill on the outside will protect it.

That HDD cooler is actually pretty nice. I had never seen that particular model before but the thing I like the most about it is that is has a heatsink/fan combo and it would probably help your tremendously. It will blow the hot air inside the case though so it is paramount that you have good air circulation and having a blowhole/fanmount at the top would really help here.


I read this hard drive cooler is insanely loud. so I don't plan on getting it. What I am going to do however is get a few more fans and get a standard hard drive coller that you mount under neath the drive that has a heat sink on it as well for about 15 dollars from circuit city, Also get some fans that are alittle less noisy then run them at full speed, add a fan to the side of my case where there is a mount and grill for it aimed at the processor, ill cut the grill out of that as well. I will look into doing the blow hole on top after I see where im at when those things are done.

Thanks for all your help guys its much appreciated.
July 17, 2006 4:50:45 AM

Quote:
Take a look at these hard drive coolers. I found a few that were black.

silverstone $22.99
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E1683...


AOC Evercool $24.99
http://www.tigerdirect.com/applications/SearchTools/ite...


Cooldrive 6 $39.99
http://www.nwca.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=products.showD...
(I use this one for one drive. A bit pricey but feature rich and excellent cooler results. I disconnected some of the cables that came with it but it has temp sensors for up to 4 probes and can acts as a fan controller for up to 4 fans. It also has internal software for these features and can connect to an internal usb port for them but I disconnected the usb cable and the fan controllers and just used the additional temp sensors for other parts of my computer)


Those are very cool I especially like number 1. But I really don't want to buy something like this online espeically if I don't like it. It doesn't cost anything to return something to a local store, and if I don't like this here then I have to ship it back which costs money and then, wait for a return.

Thank you for the suggestions!
July 17, 2006 4:57:21 AM

no problem
July 17, 2006 9:53:12 PM

Well here is where im at, I created a blow hole in the top of my case and attached a fan, I also installed a fan in the door blowing in towards the processor. So I now have a total of 4 case fans. I also replaced my stock hsf with a antec cpu that is here: http://www.antec.com/us/productDetails.php?ProdID=77099...

So I added 2 antec tri cool dual barings fans. I wasn'ta ble to get a hard drive cooler, as circuit city here as well as best buy did not have them. So I will have to take a trip to comp usa which is about 25 miles away from here.

My case temps are as follows now at idle with cool and quiet enabled:
mb probe, 98 degrees f
cpu at idle, 96 degrees
temp 3, I dont know what that is but its 81 degrees
Hard drive is still 113 degrees f at idle.
gpu: 44 degrees c

Temps at full load after 1 hour:
cpu 125 degree f
mb 102 degrees f
hard drive 118 degrees f


So yeah it did make a difference not a huge significant one, previously I was at idle:
idle cpu 100 degrees f
mb idle 100 degrees
gpu 47 degrees c
Hard drive around 107

full load:
cpu 131 degrees f
mb 110 degrees f
hard drive 118 f

The reason my hard drive temp went up is because it is now suspended in rubber bands, so there is no way for the hard drive to tranasfer heat to anything, it is however next tot he fan sucking out the hot air up, however I don't think the hard drive in the 5 1/2 inch bay is in the path of the airflow.

I will get a hard drive cooler tomorrow, and see what kind of results that brings in.

It has been a fun journy so far, the best thing is my case is still fairly quiet. Lets see where we end up.

By the way, the whole rubber band hard drive noise reducing method works beutifully. If anyone is interested in doing it, take my word its nice and not to mention cheap!! I was tierd of finding all these gimicks that say they make your computer quiet and reduce hard drie noise. So here is the solution. Check out the post under here on rubber band hard drive quieting
July 17, 2006 10:08:24 PM

ooooo

take the hard drive off those rubber bands

the only reason that rubber bands maintain their elasticity is because of the ambient moisture in the air. If they are exposed to constant heat they will dry out and one day you will hear a "thud" when the drive drops and if it falls on other components..

It's a novel idea yes, and MaximumPC did an article on that very thing. But, the subsequent issue listed a reader letter that brought up the drying out of the rubber bands.

Be careful with that.....
July 17, 2006 10:35:32 PM

Yeah I have thought about that, I plan on checking on them on a regular basis, like once a week and replace them every so often.

A bag of rubber bands and replacing them is worth it, because this drive is very loud, when reading and writing this works like a charm and is cheap and easy!

Thanks for the concern though and your advice I appreciate it! I don't remember seeing the letter, which issue was it that had the letter about the drying out of the rubber bands, what did it say exactly and what was mpc response to it if youd on't mind telling me?
July 17, 2006 10:54:48 PM

August Issue, page 102, "We tackle tough reader questions on...."

It's in the green shaded box entitled "Are you guys daft?"
July 17, 2006 10:58:09 PM

OH ok I haven't gotten the augest issue yet, im on the cheap third party plan so I get it after every else has read it. NIce huh. Well thanks for the info.

So what did maximum pc say regarding it if you dont mind telling me, you can say briefly what it was, I would appreciate it!

Thanks
July 17, 2006 11:43:31 PM

they said that if you have high quality rubber bands that it shouldn't be an issue.

You'll be getting a HDD cooler soon enough though so it won't be an issue
July 18, 2006 10:48:12 AM

it will be much better if u open your case...........
July 18, 2006 12:39:51 PM

Quote:
I have a seagate 7200.8 250gb hard drive. It runs great, and is like a hot plate. In fact it's usually running as hot as my processor does at full load at 120 degrees f.

I know the thermal limit for seagate drives is 140 f. Does anyone know if running it at even 120 is bad? Should I get a cooler for it? also does anyone know whath appends when a drive does over heat?

I do have cooling in my system a fan in front, read and a antec truepower psu with the big fan.

Also any idea what the normal/average running temp is for this drive? Like I said it's the hottest thing in my case at idle, the ambient temp in the case is around 100-110 degrees f. Air temp outsid the case is 75-80 degrees f.

Any help on the topic would be great! Thanks.



AH, ER. If I may .Would it not be better to just get a small air conditioner..
Just a small thought.At 80F that's what I'd do...:) 
July 18, 2006 1:24:43 PM

Well lets just say my house is already a/c'd its 105 outside today and inside its 77 degrees f. It costs way too much money to keep our house a/c'd down to 72 degrees. LIke several hundred dollars over a few months of summer. So not worth it, ill buy afew extra fans and a hard drive cooler for 50 dollars.

That would be a great idea though if my house wasn't already airconditioned haha.

Thanks for the post on the subject.
July 18, 2006 1:27:21 PM

Actually the funny thing, opening the case doesn't really makea difference. But like I said in all the posts ive made some huge moidifcations in the cooling in my rig there is a difference, but i i would say its better now then having the case open. Besides I don't think leaving the case open would be a good idea, I have a 2 year old that owuld just love to rip out some wires and hand me a fan blade.

Good idea but I needed a solution that is more long term.
July 18, 2006 5:27:42 PM

Well here is the result after the hard drive cooler, my hard drive does not go above ambient temp in my case which is 100 degrees.

I got the comp usa branded hard drive cooler, it is a yellow/brass color. I also bougth a 92mm fan for the rear, that thing is quiet and pushes a heck of a lot of air, its pretty incredible. So I know have 4 fans tota, a 92mm fan in the rear, 80mm on the door blowing at the processor hsf. A blow hole 80mm at the top of the case between the psu and cd rom mount assembly. and one in the front. The hard drive cooler, fits on the bottom of the drive and there are two fans, one blowing and one sucking the air. They run at 4 thousand rpm's and well that was a little bit too loud a it sounded like a turbine/cyclone was running in my case. I plugged it into my antec 2.0 "fan only" headers as they run at lower voltage and that helped bring them to silent mode. It still runs very well as my hard drive under full load doesn't go passed 100 degrees, so a 20 degree impovement was worth it I would say.

So here are my final temps after a 100 dollar investment in cooling including fans, dremel kit new cpu cooler etc.

While using cpu burn in v 1.01 after 20 mins, my temps are as follows:

cpu 126f while at full load
hd 100 degree f at full load
motherboard at full load 98 degrees
geforce 7900 gt 44 degrees
July 18, 2006 5:41:06 PM

it looks like you got the results you wanted - especially with the hdd. All the resulting temps are within decent levels.

Now, when you are ready, you can graduate to water cooling!!
July 18, 2006 5:50:15 PM

Yeah I thought about that, i could of gotten a rig that cools the video card and cpu for about a 100 dollars. then just have that big 92mm fan pushing air out

Although sad to say the loud fan in my computer is the new cpu cool, I think ill bring that back. It doesn't do much and I thinkt he cooling levels were mainly the air circulation improvement. Plus it was 30 bucks and the fan blades broke when i touched it, so I am using the fan from the stock cpu cooler amd branded fan. It is a little bit quieter with it. My replacement north bridge fan is also pretty loud I think I am going to replace it with one of those tall fanless heat sinks.

Thanks for your help guys.
!