A giant leap forward. Request for comments

[major_error]

I've been considering how best to replace my aging system for a while now, and the list of parts has settled down considerably so I figured I'd ask for informed comments/opinions on what has been chosen.

You can see the compiled list of hardware on NewEgg

In short: mATX form-factor w/
AMD 64 X2 4200+
1GB DDR
GeForce 7600GS
150GB Raptor

Now for the qualifiers:-I'm not much of a PC gamer anymore, so getting top-notch response in the graphics realm is of relatively low importance.
-With the introduction of HyperTransport, I perceive AMD-based systems on the whole to be more responsive than a similarly-specced Intel system.
-A responsive storage device for system files is more desirable than overall capacity.
-I have (roughly) a US$1000 price-point on this particular build.
Here's even more fun:
My current system is a water-cooled Athlon Thunderbird C 1.4 on an Epox 8KTA3+ w/ 1.5Gb RAM (nothing left to upgrade on this board!) in an InWin Q500 full-tower case.
Once I have the new system, I plan on using the aforementioned case for a file server. The heart of the server will be a maxed-out Supermicro P6DBE (dual PIII@1GHz, 1Gb ram) providing access to some sort of SATA RAID arrangement.

Given all this, I'd appreciate any input on the parts chosen, the plan in general, or both.
I'm not in a rush to buy, so there's the possibility I'll adjust processor/memory choices and/or upgrade from my existing Pioneer DVR107d burner...

 

[The_Prophecy]

With the introduction of HyperTransport, I perceive AMD-based systems on the whole to be more responsive than a similarly-specced Intel system.

This used to be the case, back in the days when the Pentium 4 600 Series was the top of the line Intel chip. Since the dual core chips came around (from both Intel and AMD), and now especially with Core 2 just around the next bend, this is no longer the case. For your purposes, an Intel and an AMD system would be equally responsive.

Now to my suggested changes:

CPU: Intel Core 2 Duo E6300 (~ $210)

Motherboard: Abit AB9 Pro

RAM: OCZ Gold 1GB (2 x 512MB) DDR2-800

Power Supply: Antec Truepower 430W

CPU Heatsink: Lose it.... the Core 2 won't need it, especially if you're not going to be overclocking. Since you said you aren't a gamer, i'm betting no on the overclocking question.

Video Card: eVGA Geforce 7600GT <--- This is slightly more expensive, but IMO, a better brand. I had the fan on my Asus 6800GT card die 3 weeks after i bought it. The card was damaged and I had to RMA it. However, the argument could be made that if you're not a gamer, even the 7600GT would be overkill. You could get away with a 7300GS.

Now.... if you're totally against a Core 2 setup (which most people on this forum will agree is superior to anything AMD has out right now), here is what I would suggest for changes to your AMD plan:

CPU: AMD Athlon 64 X2 3800+ <--- These chips (as well as the Core 2's from Intel) overclock very well.

Motherboard: Asus M2N-E

RAM: Corsair XMS2 1GB (2 x 512MB) DDR2-800

Power Supply: Antec Truepower 430W

CPU Heatsink: Again.... lose the aftermarket cooler, it's not needed. However, this time I would suggest picking up some Arctic Silver 5

Socket 939 is pointless now. No new processors will be made for that platform. The socket will be around for some time yet (just look at socket A), but building a new computer on an old platform is (when thinking about it logically) a waste of time and money.

 

[major_error]

With the introduction of HyperTransport, I perceive AMD-based systems on the whole to be more responsive than a similarly-specced Intel system.

This used to be the case, back in the days when the Pentium 4 600 Series was the top of the line Intel chip. Since the dual core chips came around (from both Intel and AMD), and now especially with Core 2 just around the next bend, this is no longer the case. For your purposes, an Intel and an AMD system would be equally responsive.I'll have to keep that in mind. It's been a while since I put together systems for other people...

Motherboard: Abit AB9 Pro

I don't have a problem with this choice, except for the form-factor. I want a SFF system without being tied to a proprietary motherboard, thus the mATX choice...

Power Supply: Antec Truepower 430W

I chose the Seasonic based on a THG torture test a while back. While they reviewed a 600w model, I have a 330w running my current system with similar results. Based on the review and current experience, I'm not likely to switch...

CPU Heatsink: Lose it.... the Core 2 won't need it, especially if you're not going to be overclocking. Since you said you aren't a gamer, i'm betting no on the overclocking question.

Are the boxed coolers that reliable these days?
Potential space issues aside (mATX, remember?), while I don't plan on overclocking my system, I do tend to leave it running for very long stretches of time crunching on various BOINC projects. This is the main reason my current system is water-cooled.
I don't know how much thermal energy these dual-core chips are going to throw off under a near-constant full load, so I was going to err on the side of caution.

Video Card: eVGA Geforce 7600GT <--- This is slightly more expensive, but IMO, a better brand. I had the fan on my Asus 6800GT card die 3 weeks after i bought it. The card was damaged and I had to RMA it. However, the argument could be made that if you're not a gamer, even the 7600GT would be overkill. You could get away with a 7300GS.

Overkill maybe, but I'm taking a slightly longer view given that my current system started off with a TNT-based card (Diamond Viper v330) and upgraded to a Radeon 9600pro.
I'm figuring on getting a respectable card now and not upgrading for a while. Vista compatability figures into it as well--once it reaches SP1

Now.... if you're totally against a Core 2 setup (which most people on this forum will agree is superior to anything AMD has out right now), here is what I would suggest for changes to your AMD plan:

I appreciate you taking the time to cover both sides....it's the well-intendend response I was looking for, and gave me a few things to consider.
At this time, given what I see available in a quick perusal of NewEgg, and also given my choice of form-factor, a Core2 system isn't even an option. One would think that motherboard manufacturers would've paid more attention to the SFF market given the rapidly growing interest there...

 

[yourmothersanastronaut]

Hows'about:

Ultra Microfly: Much better than the Aspire X-Qpack and a comparable Silverstone - cheaper, too, and comes with a better power supply geared towards smaller spaces. Although, it can use full-length PSUs if needed.

and this stuff

I scrapped the Raptor because it's really not necessary, and having 2GB of RAM is much better than a 10K RPM drive. Two 7200RPM drives in striped RAID cream the transfer rates of a single Raptor. The Raptor does have better seek times due to the faster rotational speed, but it's not really worth it unless you are willing to spend more money. The RAID array will be more effective, I think.

I also added a lightscribe DVD burner and floppy drive, because you'll need the floppy to install RAID drivers for the array during the Windows install and to flash the BIOS to the latest version. I stuck with the 7600GS for now, but I would really recommend an upgrade to a 7600GT if you can afford it.

I also added 2GB of Corsair XMS with a low latency (not the lowest, but close, considering that the lowest latency costs twice as much).

The Gigabyte motherboard looks like the best AM2 SFF board available now, since the Asus should be better but has a high DOA rate. I like Asus (particularly my motherboard...:lol, but I guess people don't like that uATX board.

There aren't really any good SFF boards that can handle a Core 2 well, so I picked out a decent AMD-based build for you.

Enjoy...

 

[major_error]

Hows'about:
Ultra Microfly: Much better than the Aspire X-Qpack and a comparable Silverstone - cheaper, too, and comes with a better power supply geared towards smaller spaces. Although, it can use full-length PSUs if needed.

I'd most likely still load it with a Seasonic PSU. My current rig isn't near as power-hungry as what I want to build, yet in its lifetime it's already killed 4 PSUs of varying wattages (last was 550). The S12 330 in there right now has been the most stable yet.
As for the case, I'd consider it if I could get one w/o the window and PSU. I don't have any modding/lighting/FX aspirations, so having a case with a window would be a dopey idea for me (plus I'd be the only one to see it!)
The removable MB tray is a nice touch.

I scrapped the Raptor because it's really not necessary, and having 2GB of RAM is much better than a 10K RPM drive. Two 7200RPM drives in striped RAID cream the transfer rates of a single Raptor. The Raptor does have better seek times due to the faster rotational speed, but it's not really worth it unless you are willing to spend more money. The RAID array will be more effective, I think.

I really don't want to mess with RAID in a workstation. That's what a fileserver is good for. See my original post for supporting statements.

I also added a lightscribe DVD burner and floppy drive, because you'll need the floppy to install RAID drivers for the array during the Windows install and to flash the BIOS to the latest version. I stuck with the 7600GS for now, but I would really recommend an upgrade to a 7600GT if you can afford it.

The burner isn't necessary since I already have one. I don't plan on upgrading until BD/HD-DVD recording becomes affordable. The floppy drive in my existing system can float between the new system and the fileserver (or I can borrow a USB floppy drive from work.)
I'm not too concerned about the video at this point, but I suspect prices will drop considerably before I'm ready to buy, so I will most likely end up with the GT in the end. (maybe my budget will change too!)

I also added 2GB of Corsair XMS with a low latency (not the lowest, but close, considering that the lowest latency costs twice as much).

The Gigabyte motherboard looks like the best AM2 SFF board available now, since the Asus should be better but has a high DOA rate. I like Asus (particularly my motherboard...:lol, but I guess people don't like that uATX board.

There aren't really any good SFF boards that can handle a Core 2 well, so I picked out a decent AMD-based build for you.

Enjoy...

Much obliged

My requirements for system performance aren't exactly in-line with being on the 'bleeding edge' and buying mostly behind the curve doesn't bother me, which is why I was putting together a 939-based system instead of an AM2. (Although if there's a reasonable Core2 board out between now and purchase-time, I might add it to the list of considerations too...)

Given recent history with my computers, what I buy wil most likely be what I will make do with for the next 5-6 years. There may be a memory addition or video upgrade somewhere along the line, but not much beyond that, i'd imagine.

 

[Newf]

Since you are not in a hurry, I would wait a month or so to see how the conroe story develops.

In any event, since you will be buying memory socket AM2 makes more sense than a 939. Asus makes a nice 6150 based mATX mobo (M2N VM). You may find that the free integrated video is sufficient until dx10 cards become available.

FSP makes an excellent PSU for a lot less $
FSP AX450-PN 450watt 12v:2x18a PSU 20+4pin $52+9 7/06
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16817104954

For closer to the Seasonics $$$, consider this:
PC Power&Cooling Silencer470 12v:26a $99 7/06
http://www.pcpowercooling.com/products/viewproduct.php?show=S47ATX&view=about

 

[Newf]

Quote:
"The Gigabyte motherboard looks like the best AM2 SFF board available now, since the Asus should be better but has a high DOA rate. I like Asus (particularly my motherboard...), but I guess people don't like that uATX board."

Asus sells their VM boards by the boatload. A few bad comments by some can be expected. I have found that at worst a BIOS upgrade is needed to make everything perfect, but usually all works well right out of the box. I use the 939 version of this board and it works great. Lots of features, perfect voltage regulation, and stable operation. 2GB of ram is a good idea though.

 

[major_error]

I appreciate the input on the PSU, but it's one of the items I'm least likely to change my mind on at this point... Since my experience with Seasonic has been overwhelmingly positive to-date, I'm willing to pay the premium.

Taking everything that has been said, if I were to buy right now This would be the most likely configuration.
Not quite bleeding edge, but very near the cutting point...
I cut to the chase on graphics and put in the GT. As for RAM, I used the same philosophy from my older systems in using hardware at the board's maximum rating (DDR2-800 in this case)

One final point I didn't mention before: if at all possible, getting everything from one source is preferred. I used to buy from whichever retailer happened to have the cheapest price on a given part, but in the end, all the savings were lost in shipping.

btw, how are the stock coolers for the GT on noise?

 

[yourmothersanastronaut]

I believe there is a KO edition of the 7600GT. It's the same cooler as on my 7900GT: copper, covers the RAM, very quiet.

There are also heatpipe versions from Gigabyte and Asus, both with fanless cooling. In a well-ventilated case, Gigabyte's silent cooler actually outperformed nVidia's stock reference cooler by double digits.

MSI makes a two-slot fan cooler for the card, like on the 7900GTX.

But it may take some case modifications to get the two-slot coolers into the case securely. Go for a single slot cooler to be safe.