Sign in with
Sign up | Sign in
Your question

Network Integration of Cingular/ATTWS

Last response: in Network Providers
Share
Anonymous
October 29, 2004 1:55:19 AM

Archived from groups: alt.cellular.cingular,alt.cellular.attws (More info?)

Does anyone have any "real" information on how quickly Cingular and AT&T
are going to merge their calling networks/towers. I understand the
billing and backend office systems could take up to a year or so.
However, I am curious as to when the current networks will be combined
so that all current and new customers have new towers to operate from in
their home territory?

I know Cingular is busting their hump to get new plans, new branding,
new website, import of numbers, etc.. by the middle of November. So
please don't tell me something I already know from the remainder of the
posts.

However, do they plan to have most or all of the towers integrated by
the mid-November timeline? This would certainly help with capacity
issues on combining current customers, new customers, and for the
holiday season. I would think mid-Nov integration would be a lofty goal
for them, if it is so. However, I guess it would also be reasonbly
possible considering in most areas I would think it is nothing more than
an electronic reassigning of the Tower Identification.

Sorry for the long winded post...

Jeremy Thornton
Anonymous
October 29, 2004 12:15:46 PM

Archived from groups: alt.cellular.cingular,alt.cellular.attws (More info?)

[POSTED TO alt.cellular.attws - REPLY ON USENET PLEASE]

In <tphgd.1452$936.568@bignews4.bellsouth.net> on Thu, 28 Oct 2004 21:55:19
-0400, Jeremy Thornton <thornjbr@yahoo.removeme.com> wrote:

>Does anyone have any "real" information on how quickly Cingular and AT&T
>are going to merge their calling networks/towers. I understand the
>billing and backend office systems could take up to a year or so.
>However, I am curious as to when the current networks will be combined
>so that all current and new customers have new towers to operate from in
>their home territory?

That's quite easy to do, since it only takes OTA (over the air) reprogramming
of SIMs to permit roaming.

--
Best regards,
John Navas <http://navasgrp.home.att.net/&gt;
Anonymous
October 29, 2004 2:11:01 PM

Archived from groups: alt.cellular.cingular,alt.cellular.attws (More info?)

In article <S_mgd.2043$_3.27057@typhoon.sonic.net>,
John Navas <spamfilter0@navasgroup.com> wrote:

> [POSTED TO alt.cellular.attws - REPLY ON USENET PLEASE]
>
> In <tphgd.1452$936.568@bignews4.bellsouth.net> on Thu, 28 Oct 2004 21:55:19
> -0400, Jeremy Thornton <thornjbr@yahoo.removeme.com> wrote:
>
> >Does anyone have any "real" information on how quickly Cingular and AT&T
> >are going to merge their calling networks/towers. I understand the
> >billing and backend office systems could take up to a year or so.
> >However, I am curious as to when the current networks will be combined
> >so that all current and new customers have new towers to operate from in
> >their home territory?
>
> That's quite easy to do, since it only takes OTA (over the air) reprogramming
> of SIMs to permit roaming.

The back office could be many years. After 4 years Cingular has yet to
fully merge back office from all the pieces that 4 years ago created
Cingular:

SNET
Bell South
Ameritech
SWB
Houston Cellular
PacBell, etc.

If you're in one piece away from home and call 611, it CAN ONLY be
handled by the 611 piece you live in. And if the time zones are
different, you can lose out because your call may be rejected if
it's too late or early in the time zone you call from, regardless if 611
is manned in the piece you would be connected to.
Related resources
Anonymous
October 29, 2004 7:34:54 PM

Archived from groups: alt.cellular.cingular,alt.cellular.attws (More info?)

[POSTED TO alt.cellular.attws - REPLY ON USENET PLEASE]

In <jzwick3-8955B2.05104329102004@news1.west.earthlink.net> on Fri, 29 Oct
2004 10:11:01 GMT, Jack Zwick <jzwick3@mindspring.com> wrote:

>The back office could be many years. After 4 years Cingular has yet to
>fully merge back office from all the pieces that 4 years ago created
>Cingular:

The integration of the single ATTWS piece is an easier job, particularly
because of compatible networks and back office systems.

>If you're in one piece away from home and call 611, it CAN ONLY be
>handled by the 611 piece you live in.

611 calls can be and often are routed to call centers in other regions.

>And if the time zones are
>different, you can lose out because your call may be rejected if
>it's too late or early in the time zone you call from, regardless if 611
>is manned in the piece you would be connected to.

That's actually handled by the call routing system.

The real question is what will happen to the 24x7 service by ATTWS, since
Cingular has more limited service.

--
Best regards,
John Navas <http://navasgrp.home.att.net/&gt;
Anonymous
October 29, 2004 7:50:55 PM

Archived from groups: alt.cellular.cingular,alt.cellular.attws (More info?)

In article <yqtgd.2062$_3.27482@typhoon.sonic.net>,
John Navas <spamfilter0@navasgroup.com> wrote:

> [POSTED TO alt.cellular.attws - REPLY ON USENET PLEASE]
>
> In <jzwick3-8955B2.05104329102004@news1.west.earthlink.net> on Fri, 29 Oct
> 2004 10:11:01 GMT, Jack Zwick <jzwick3@mindspring.com> wrote:
>
> >The back office could be many years. After 4 years Cingular has yet to
> >fully merge back office from all the pieces that 4 years ago created
> >Cingular:
>
> The integration of the single ATTWS piece is an easier job, particularly
> because of compatible networks and back office systems.

Tower GSM integration yes; billing integration, not likely. TDMA
billing is not integrated with GSM.

>
> >If you're in one piece away from home and call 611, it CAN ONLY be
> >handled by the 611 piece you live in.
>
> 611 calls can be and often are routed to call centers in other regions.

No, they are routed to the "piece" of Cingular your account exists in.


>
> >And if the time zones are
> >different, you can lose out because your call may be rejected if
> >it's too late or early in the time zone you call from, regardless if 611
> >is manned in the piece you would be connected to.
>
> That's actually handled by the call routing system.

Mishandled, since it goes by local time not the time of the call center
you are going to.


>
> The real question is what will happen to the 24x7 service by ATTWS, since
> Cingular has more limited service.

It most likely will go away since its more costly.
Anonymous
October 29, 2004 8:01:10 PM

Archived from groups: alt.cellular.cingular,alt.cellular.attws (More info?)

[POSTED TO alt.cellular.attws - REPLY ON USENET PLEASE]

In <jzwick3-1A30DD.10503729102004@news1.west.earthlink.net> on Fri, 29 Oct
2004 15:50:55 GMT, Jack Zwick <jzwick3@mindspring.com> wrote:

>In article <yqtgd.2062$_3.27482@typhoon.sonic.net>,
> John Navas <spamfilter0@navasgroup.com> wrote:

>> The integration of the single ATTWS piece is an easier job, particularly
>> because of compatible networks and back office systems.
>
>Tower GSM integration yes; billing integration, not likely. TDMA
>billing is not integrated with GSM.

Both carriers had similar TDMA and GSM, back office systems are compatible,
and there is only one piece to integrate, so integration should be easier than
in the past.

>> >If you're in one piece away from home and call 611, it CAN ONLY be
>> >handled by the 611 piece you live in.
>>
>> 611 calls can be and often are routed to call centers in other regions.
>
>No, they are routed to the "piece" of Cingular your account exists in.

Not necessarily. As a subscriber in California, my 611 calls are routed to
different call centers in other areas.

>> >And if the time zones are
>> >different, you can lose out because your call may be rejected if
>> >it's too late or early in the time zone you call from, regardless if 611
>> >is manned in the piece you would be connected to.
>>
>> That's actually handled by the call routing system.
>
>Mishandled, since it goes by local time not the time of the call center
>you are going to.

The system actually retains the time zone of the caller.

>> The real question is what will happen to the 24x7 service by ATTWS, since
>> Cingular has more limited service.
>
>It most likely will go away since its more costly.

That remains to be seen. I personally doubt Cingular will do anything that
would tend to increase churn.

--
Best regards,
John Navas <http://navasgrp.home.att.net/&gt;
Anonymous
October 29, 2004 8:53:36 PM

Archived from groups: alt.cellular.cingular,alt.cellular.attws (More info?)

In article <aPtgd.2072$_3.27365@typhoon.sonic.net>,
John Navas <spamfilter0@navasgroup.com> wrote:

> [POSTED TO alt.cellular.attws - REPLY ON USENET PLEASE]
>
> In <jzwick3-1A30DD.10503729102004@news1.west.earthlink.net> on Fri, 29 Oct
> 2004 15:50:55 GMT, Jack Zwick <jzwick3@mindspring.com> wrote:
>
> >In article <yqtgd.2062$_3.27482@typhoon.sonic.net>,
> > John Navas <spamfilter0@navasgroup.com> wrote:
>
> >> The integration of the single ATTWS piece is an easier job, particularly
> >> because of compatible networks and back office systems.
> >
> >Tower GSM integration yes; billing integration, not likely. TDMA
> >billing is not integrated with GSM.
>
> Both carriers had similar TDMA and GSM, back office systems are compatible,
> and there is only one piece to integrate, so integration should be easier than
> in the past.

How did two become one? ATTWS has a totally different CRM system for
TDMA than it has for GWM. You keep coonfusing the Network/Towers (easy
to integrate) with the CRM systems (hard to integrate).


>
> >> >If you're in one piece away from home and call 611, it CAN ONLY be
> >> >handled by the 611 piece you live in.
> >>
> >> 611 calls can be and often are routed to call centers in other regions.
> >
> >No, they are routed to the "piece" of Cingular your account exists in.
>
> Not necessarily. As a subscriber in California, my 611 calls are routed to
> different call centers in other areas.

Mine always go to Tulsa, even if I'm in New York.


>
> >> >And if the time zones are
> >> >different, you can lose out because your call may be rejected if
> >> >it's too late or early in the time zone you call from, regardless if 611
> >> >is manned in the piece you would be connected to.
> >>
> >> That's actually handled by the call routing system.
> >
> >Mishandled, since it goes by local time not the time of the call center
> >you are going to.
>
> The system actually retains the time zone of the caller.

But not the time zone of the Cingular peice with their billing info.
So if you call in at 9:15 in NY, you're automatically told it's too
late, even though your call center in Tulsa is still open another 45
minutes.

>
> >> The real question is what will happen to the 24x7 service by ATTWS, since
> >> Cingular has more limited service.
> >
> >It most likely will go away since its more costly.
>
> That remains to be seen. I personally doubt Cingular will do anything that
> would tend to increase churn.

They already have. The website "MY Accounts" has been fubared the last
month. You can't use that or 611 to quickly track minutes used anymore
as Free Mobile to Mobile Minutes are no longer subtracted out.
Anonymous
October 29, 2004 11:43:46 PM

Archived from groups: alt.cellular.cingular,alt.cellular.attws (More info?)

[POSTED TO alt.cellular.attws - REPLY ON USENET PLEASE]

In <jzwick3-20ECF8.11540529102004@news1.west.earthlink.net> on Fri, 29 Oct
2004 16:53:36 GMT, Jack Zwick <jzwick3@mindspring.com> wrote:

>In article <aPtgd.2072$_3.27365@typhoon.sonic.net>,
> John Navas <spamfilter0@navasgroup.com> wrote:

>> Both carriers had similar TDMA and GSM, back office systems are compatible,
>> and there is only one piece to integrate, so integration should be easier than
>> in the past.
>
>How did two become one? ATTWS has a totally different CRM system for
>TDMA than it has for GWM. You keep coonfusing the Network/Towers (easy
>to integrate) with the CRM systems (hard to integrate).

As I wrote, back office systems are compatible.

>> Not necessarily. As a subscriber in California, my 611 calls are routed to
>> different call centers in other areas.
>
>Mine always go to Tulsa, even if I'm in New York.

Fair enough, but then you can't generalize from that. As I wrote, 611 calls
can be and often are routed to call centers in other regions.

>> The system actually retains the time zone of the caller.
>
>But not the time zone of the Cingular peice with their billing info.

It retains the time zone of the Home region.

>So if you call in at 9:15 in NY, you're automatically told it's too
>late, even though your call center in Tulsa is still open another 45
>minutes.

Again, that must be something specific Tulsa -- it's not the case in other
markets.

>> That remains to be seen. I personally doubt Cingular will do anything that
>> would tend to increase churn.
>
>They already have. The website "MY Accounts" has been fubared the last
>month. You can't use that or 611 to quickly track minutes used anymore
>as Free Mobile to Mobile Minutes are no longer subtracted out.

That's a different issue, and most subscribers don't care in any event -- they
just wait for their monthly bills.

--
Best regards,
John Navas <http://navasgrp.home.att.net/&gt;
Anonymous
October 30, 2004 12:31:52 AM

Archived from groups: alt.cellular.cingular,alt.cellular.attws (More info?)

In article <S3xgd.2099$_3.27883@typhoon.sonic.net>,
John Navas <spamfilter0@navasgroup.com> wrote:

> [POSTED TO alt.cellular.attws - REPLY ON USENET PLEASE]
>
> In <jzwick3-20ECF8.11540529102004@news1.west.earthlink.net> on Fri, 29 Oct
> 2004 16:53:36 GMT, Jack Zwick <jzwick3@mindspring.com> wrote:
>
> >In article <aPtgd.2072$_3.27365@typhoon.sonic.net>,
> > John Navas <spamfilter0@navasgroup.com> wrote:
>
> >> Both carriers had similar TDMA and GSM, back office systems are
> >> compatible,
> >> and there is only one piece to integrate, so integration should be easier
> >> than
> >> in the past.
> >
> >How did two become one? ATTWS has a totally different CRM system for
> >TDMA than it has for GWM. You keep coonfusing the Network/Towers (easy
> >to integrate) with the CRM systems (hard to integrate).
>
> As I wrote, back office systems are compatible.

Easy to say. Prove it.

>
> >> Not necessarily. As a subscriber in California, my 611 calls are routed
> >> to
> >> different call centers in other areas.
> >
> >Mine always go to Tulsa, even if I'm in New York.
>
> Fair enough, but then you can't generalize from that. As I wrote, 611 calls
> can be and often are routed to call centers in other regions.
>
> >> The system actually retains the time zone of the caller.
> >
> >But not the time zone of the Cingular peice with their billing info.
>
> It retains the time zone of the Home region.
>
> >So if you call in at 9:15 in NY, you're automatically told it's too
> >late, even though your call center in Tulsa is still open another 45
> >minutes.
>
> Again, that must be something specific Tulsa -- it's not the case in other
> markets.
>
> >> That remains to be seen. I personally doubt Cingular will do anything
> >> that
> >> would tend to increase churn.
> >
> >They already have. The website "MY Accounts" has been fubared the last
> >month. You can't use that or 611 to quickly track minutes used anymore
> >as Free Mobile to Mobile Minutes are no longer subtracted out.
>
> That's a different issue, and most subscribers don't care in any event --
> they
> just wait for their monthly bills.


Now you speak for most subscribers? you are a megalomaniac.
Anonymous
October 30, 2004 1:29:39 AM

Archived from groups: alt.cellular.cingular,alt.cellular.attws (More info?)

[POSTED TO alt.cellular.attws - REPLY ON USENET PLEASE]

In <jzwick3-B2F790.15322129102004@news1.west.earthlink.net> on Fri, 29 Oct
2004 20:31:52 GMT, Jack Zwick <jzwick3@mindspring.com> wrote:

>In article <S3xgd.2099$_3.27883@typhoon.sonic.net>,
> John Navas <spamfilter0@navasgroup.com> wrote:

>> As I wrote, back office systems are compatible.
>
>Easy to say. Prove it.

Prove your original claim of incompatibility.

>> That's a different issue, and most subscribers don't care in any event --
>> they
>> just wait for their monthly bills.
>
>Now you speak for most subscribers? you are a megalomaniac.

No, I just have a fair amount of information. And you?

--
Best regards,
John Navas <http://navasgrp.home.att.net/&gt;
October 30, 2004 5:38:50 PM

Archived from groups: alt.cellular.cingular,alt.cellular.attws (More info?)

John Navas <spamfilter0@navasgroup.com> wrote in message news:<7Dygd.2132$_3.27971@typhoon.sonic.net>...
> [POSTED TO alt.cellular.attws - REPLY ON USENET PLEASE]
>
> In <jzwick3-B2F790.15322129102004@news1.west.earthlink.net> on Fri, 29 Oct
> 2004 20:31:52 GMT, Jack Zwick <jzwick3@mindspring.com> wrote:
>
> >In article <S3xgd.2099$_3.27883@typhoon.sonic.net>,
> > John Navas <spamfilter0@navasgroup.com> wrote:
>
> >> As I wrote, back office systems are compatible.
> >
> >Easy to say. Prove it.
>
> Prove your original claim of incompatibility.
>
> >> That's a different issue, and most subscribers don't care in any event --
> >> they
> >> just wait for their monthly bills.
> >
> >Now you speak for most subscribers? you are a megalomaniac.
>
> No, I just have a fair amount of information. And you


Even though its one company you will have 2 CRMs. AT&T customers
will stay on siebel and will stay on their existing rate palns. They
will also retain post billing. Cingular customers will stay on their
plans of course and their pre billing. AT&T customers will not be
forced to migrate to cingular plans and will still be able to change
their plans up and down. They will be given discounts to buy a
cingular phone and get a cingular plan. Its not going to be as
difficult as you guys are making it out to be.
Anonymous
October 31, 2004 7:05:07 AM

Archived from groups: alt.cellular.cingular (More info?)

And when all the tdma contracts are up, they will not be renewed and
the customer will have to switch to gsm.


Steve wrote:
> John Navas <spamfilter0@navasgroup.com> wrote in message news:<7Dygd.2132$_3.27971@typhoon.sonic.net>...
>
>>[POSTED TO alt.cellular.attws - REPLY ON USENET PLEASE]
>>
>>In <jzwick3-B2F790.15322129102004@news1.west.earthlink.net> on Fri, 29 Oct
>>2004 20:31:52 GMT, Jack Zwick <jzwick3@mindspring.com> wrote:
>>
>>
>>>In article <S3xgd.2099$_3.27883@typhoon.sonic.net>,
>>>John Navas <spamfilter0@navasgroup.com> wrote:
>>
>>
>>
>>>>As I wrote, back office systems are compatible.
>>>
>>>Easy to say. Prove it.
>>
>>Prove your original claim of incompatibility.
>>
>>
>>>>That's a different issue, and most subscribers don't care in any event --
>>>>they
>>>>just wait for their monthly bills.
>>>
>>>Now you speak for most subscribers? you are a megalomaniac.
>>
>>No, I just have a fair amount of information. And you
>
>
>
> Even though its one company you will have 2 CRMs. AT&T customers
> will stay on siebel and will stay on their existing rate palns. They
> will also retain post billing. Cingular customers will stay on their
> plans of course and their pre billing. AT&T customers will not be
> forced to migrate to cingular plans and will still be able to change
> their plans up and down. They will be given discounts to buy a
> cingular phone and get a cingular plan. Its not going to be as
> difficult as you guys are making it out to be.
Anonymous
October 31, 2004 3:47:16 PM

Archived from groups: alt.cellular.cingular (More info?)

> And when all the tdma contracts are up, they will not be renewed and
>the customer will have to switch to gsm.
>

Customers will NOT have to switch until TDMA is turned off if they do not want
to! Both companies have had a policy of continuing month to month whatever
contract conditions you have.

I expect that TDMA will be around for 7 to 10 years (this is a guess on my part
but a lot of experience behind the guess).

--
John S.
e-mail responses to - john at kiana dot net
Anonymous
October 31, 2004 5:18:06 PM

Archived from groups: alt.cellular.cingular (More info?)

[POSTED TO alt.cellular.cingular - REPLY ON USENET PLEASE]

In <20041031074716.24246.00003207@mb-m02.aol.com> on 31 Oct 2004 12:47:16 GMT,
sexyexotiche@aol.comspamfree (John S.) wrote:

>> And when all the tdma contracts are up, they will not be renewed and
>>the customer will have to switch to gsm.
>
>Customers will NOT have to switch until TDMA is turned off if they do not want
>to! Both companies have had a policy of continuing month to month whatever
>contract conditions you have.

I think that's a pretty good bet for the next few years.

>I expect that TDMA will be around for 7 to 10 years (this is a guess on my part
>but a lot of experience behind the guess).

My guess is less than half of that. Worse, TDMA service can be expected to
degrade as Cingular converts more and more of it to GSM, and the supply of
replacement handsets is likely to dry up.

--
Best regards, HELP FOR CINGULAR GSM & SONY ERICSSON PHONES:
John Navas <http://navasgrp.home.att.net/#Cingular&gt;
October 31, 2004 5:18:07 PM

Archived from groups: alt.cellular.cingular (More info?)

John Navas wrote:

> [POSTED TO alt.cellular.cingular - REPLY ON USENET PLEASE]
>
> In <20041031074716.24246.00003207@mb-m02.aol.com> on 31 Oct 2004 12:47:16 GMT,
> sexyexotiche@aol.comspamfree (John S.) wrote:
>
>
>>> And when all the tdma contracts are up, they will not be renewed and
>>>the customer will have to switch to gsm.
>>
>>Customers will NOT have to switch until TDMA is turned off if they do not want
>>to! Both companies have had a policy of continuing month to month whatever
>>contract conditions you have.
>
>
> I think that's a pretty good bet for the next few years.
>
>
>>I expect that TDMA will be around for 7 to 10 years (this is a guess on my part
>>but a lot of experience behind the guess).
>
>
> My guess is less than half of that. Worse, TDMA service can be expected to
> degrade as Cingular converts more and more of it to GSM, and the supply of
> replacement handsets is likely to dry up.
>


Personally, I expect TDMA serice availability to dry up faster than
analog, because only analog is required until the sunset date. Nobody
is required to continue TDMA for any particular time line. However, if
I'm wrong about that, I'm certain someone will jump in here.

--
jer email reply - I am not a 'ten'
Anonymous
November 1, 2004 5:59:20 AM

Archived from groups: alt.cellular.cingular (More info?)

>the supply of
>replacement handsets is likely to dry up.
>

It pretty much looks like there aren't any TDMA handsets right now. Looking at
the Cingular web site and the Cingular local store - there are only GSM
handsets. I haven't been to an AT&T store recently but suspect that that is the
same situation there as well.

E-Bay might be the only source soon!

--
John S.
e-mail responses to - john at kiana dot net
Anonymous
November 1, 2004 6:00:21 AM

Archived from groups: alt.cellular.cingular (More info?)

>Nobody
>is required to continue TDMA for any particular time line. However, if
>I'm wrong about that, I'm certain someone will jump in here.

There is no requirement to continue TDMA service like there is for AMPS.

I jumped in!

--
John S.
e-mail responses to - john at kiana dot net
November 2, 2004 4:51:41 PM

Archived from groups: alt.cellular.cingular (More info?)

"John S." <sexyexotiche@aol.comspamfree> wrote in message
news:20041031215920.02596.00002939@mb-m13.aol.com...
> >the supply of
> >replacement handsets is likely to dry up.
> >
>
> It pretty much looks like there aren't any TDMA handsets right now.
Looking at
> the Cingular web site and the Cingular local store - there are only GSM
> handsets. I haven't been to an AT&T store recently but suspect that that
is the
> same situation there as well.
>
> E-Bay might be the only source soon!
>
> --
> John S.
> e-mail responses to - john at kiana dot net

I have two Sony-Ericcson t62u (GAIT) phones that I am holding onto. Cingular
will re-activate them for me for free. I'll need them when I travel to
certain areas of the country.
Anonymous
November 2, 2004 10:37:51 PM

Archived from groups: alt.cellular.cingular (More info?)

[POSTED TO alt.cellular.cingular - REPLY ON USENET PLEASE]

In <2uq39uF2dh4hcU1@uni-berlin.de> on Tue, 2 Nov 2004 13:51:41 -0500, "Alan"
<alan@erols.com> wrote:

>I have two Sony-Ericcson t62u (GAIT) phones that I am holding onto. Cingular
>will re-activate them for me for free. I'll need them when I travel to
>certain areas of the country.

I personally don't see much need for GAIT phones anymore, now that GSM overlay
is pretty much done and there will soon be integration of ATTWS and Cingular
GSM networks. Even for emergency use in rural areas, I would simply use an
old AMPS phone and long-life battery, since even unactivated phones can always
connect to 911, and old AMPS phones tend to have higher power (and thus better
range) than GAIT phones.

--
Best regards, HELP FOR CINGULAR GSM & SONY ERICSSON PHONES:
John Navas <http://navasgrp.home.att.net/#Cingular&gt;
Anonymous
November 3, 2004 2:20:38 AM

Archived from groups: alt.cellular.cingular (More info?)

>I personally don't see much need for GAIT phones anymore, now that GSM
>overlay
>is pretty much done and there will soon be integration of ATTWS and Cingular
>GSM networks.

I am seriously thinking of taking my TDMA DOR plan and becoming a GSM only type
of service.

I am still resisting but I haven't been anyplace in the past year that isn't
also covered by GSM. oops.... there was one place but it also wasn't covered by
TDMA or AMPS - but SPRINT PCS had wall to wall coverage.

--
John S.
e-mail responses to - john at kiana dot net
Anonymous
November 3, 2004 2:46:03 AM

Archived from groups: alt.cellular.cingular (More info?)

[POSTED TO alt.cellular.cingular - REPLY ON USENET PLEASE]

In <20041102182038.06251.00000012@mb-m16.aol.com> on 02 Nov 2004 23:20:38 GMT,
sexyexotiche@aol.comspamfree (John S.) wrote:

>... I haven't been anyplace in the past year that isn't
>also covered by GSM. oops.... there was one place but it also wasn't covered by
>TDMA or AMPS - but SPRINT PCS had wall to wall coverage.

Instead it has holes where you'd think service is a given. Go figure.
The reason I dropped SprintPCS.

--
Best regards, HELP FOR CINGULAR GSM & SONY ERICSSON PHONES:
John Navas <http://navasgrp.home.att.net/#Cingular&gt;
Anonymous
November 3, 2004 3:21:55 AM

Archived from groups: alt.cellular.cingular (More info?)

>oops.... there was one place but it also wasn't covered by
>>TDMA or AMPS - but SPRINT PCS had wall to wall coverage.
>
>Instead it has holes where you'd think service is a given. Go figure.
>The reason I dropped SprintPCS.

Well, I still have 3 phones (family type of thing) on Sprint PCS. But I don't
carry one any more!

We (family) have 3 Sprint PCS phones, 3 Cingular phones (one GAIT and 2 TDMA),
and 2 AT&T WS phones, one DOR and one GSM and finally one (for data) T-Mobile
SIM in an AirCard.

--
John S.
e-mail responses to - john at kiana dot net
Anonymous
November 3, 2004 4:02:37 AM

Archived from groups: alt.cellular.cingular (More info?)

In article <%_Uhd.3216$_3.35498@typhoon.sonic.net>,
John Navas <spamfilter0@navasgroup.com> wrote:

> [POSTED TO alt.cellular.cingular - REPLY ON USENET PLEASE]
>
> In <20041102182038.06251.00000012@mb-m16.aol.com> on 02 Nov 2004 23:20:38
> GMT,
> sexyexotiche@aol.comspamfree (John S.) wrote:
>
> >... I haven't been anyplace in the past year that isn't
> >also covered by GSM. oops.... there was one place but it also wasn't covered
> >by
> >TDMA or AMPS - but SPRINT PCS had wall to wall coverage.
>
> Instead it has holes where you'd think service is a given. Go figure.
> The reason I dropped SprintPCS.

Try driving on I-10 from New Orleans to Los Angeles and see how much
native Sprint coverage you have. West of San Antonio, very little.
Anonymous
November 3, 2004 4:21:34 AM

Archived from groups: alt.cellular.cingular (More info?)

In article <jmRhd.3159$_3.35110@typhoon.sonic.net>, spamfilter0
@navasgroup.com says...
>
> I personally don't see much need for GAIT phones anymore, now that GSM overlay
> is pretty much done and there will soon be integration of ATTWS and Cingular
> GSM networks. Even for emergency use in rural areas, I would simply use an
> old AMPS phone and long-life battery, since even unactivated phones can always
> connect to 911, and old AMPS phones tend to have higher power (and thus better
> range) than GAIT phones.

Again, I must point out that this isn't true in all areas. The GSM
overlay is only done for Cingular and ATTWS. Large portions of Texas,
and I suspect other states, are covered by other TDMA/AMPS carriers WHO
HAVE NOT CONVERTED despite what the Cingular GSM map shows. Vast
stretches of rural areas and almost all cities under 20,000 people don't
have GSM and won't for some time. But then maybe you consider a city of
20k rural.

Picking up ATTWS won't make hardly any difference in Texas since they
and Cingular have almost the same coverage (the old A & B carriers).
ATTWS might have a FEW more out-of-the-way spots than Cingular but
Cingular has vastly better quality (and yes I've used both). Since
we're not listed as one of the areas to be divested I guess they're
going for filling a few holes.

Several problems with going with an AMPS phone. First of all there is
no GSM/AMPS (non GAIT) phone so you'd have to get an all-amps one. Will
Cingular even activate it on a GSM plan? Will they activate a TDMA/AMPS
phone on a GSM plan even if you only want the amps--I doubt it. Then
you loose the digital features including SMS and VM indicators (yes they
do work in most roamer areas)--not good for some of us. Also battery
life was horrible when in AMPS mode--if it's a handheld better have
plenty of spare batteries.

I hope the other carriers don't take too long to convert but I've done
quite a bit of roaming across Texas in the last couple of months and so
far I have not seen any evidence of new GSM areas.

--
Jud
Dallas TX USA
Anonymous
November 3, 2004 5:10:37 AM

Archived from groups: alt.cellular.cingular (More info?)

[POSTED TO alt.cellular.cingular - REPLY ON USENET PLEASE]

In <MPG.1bf1eea3c080426a9897f7@news.dallas.sbcglobal.net> on Wed, 03 Nov 2004
01:21:34 GMT, Jud Hardcastle <l5i5changethistodash5rbo@xemaps.removethis.com>
wrote:

>In article <jmRhd.3159$_3.35110@typhoon.sonic.net>, spamfilter0
>@navasgroup.com says...
>>
>> I personally don't see much need for GAIT phones anymore, now that GSM overlay
>> is pretty much done and there will soon be integration of ATTWS and Cingular
>> GSM networks. Even for emergency use in rural areas, I would simply use an
>> old AMPS phone and long-life battery, since even unactivated phones can always
>> connect to 911, and old AMPS phones tend to have higher power (and thus better
>> range) than GAIT phones.
>
>Again, I must point out that this isn't true in all areas. The GSM
>overlay is only done for Cingular and ATTWS. Large portions of Texas,
>and I suspect other states, are covered by other TDMA/AMPS carriers WHO
>HAVE NOT CONVERTED despite what the Cingular GSM map shows. Vast
>stretches of rural areas and almost all cities under 20,000 people don't
>have GSM and won't for some time. But then maybe you consider a city of
>20k rural.

I consider most of Texas to be rural (and do my best to avoid it). :) 

>Several problems with going with an AMPS phone. First of all there is
>no GSM/AMPS (non GAIT) phone so you'd have to get an all-amps one.

You can get either a TDMA/AMPS phone or an old AMPS-only phone. Either is
dirt cheap, and as I wrote, old AMPS phones tend to have higher power (and
thus better range) than GAIT phones.

>Will
>Cingular even activate it on a GSM plan? Will they activate a TDMA/AMPS
>phone on a GSM plan even if you only want the amps--I doubt it.

As I wrote, not necessary for emergency calls.

>Then
>you loose the digital features including SMS and VM indicators (yes they
>do work in most roamer areas)--not good for some of us.

For you and some others, yes, but not for many (most?) of the rest of us.

>Also battery
>life was horrible when in AMPS mode--if it's a handheld better have
>plenty of spare batteries.

My big old clunky AMPS phone has excellent battery life.

>I hope the other carriers don't take too long to convert but I've done
>quite a bit of roaming across Texas in the last couple of months and so
>far I have not seen any evidence of new GSM areas.

Now that the ATTWS-Cingular merger is done, I think you'll see GSM conversion
accelerate, and TDMA quickly become unattractive.

--
Best regards, HELP FOR CINGULAR GSM & SONY ERICSSON PHONES:
John Navas <http://navasgrp.home.att.net/#Cingular&gt;
November 3, 2004 5:37:24 PM

Archived from groups: alt.cellular.cingular (More info?)

"John Navas" <spamfilter0@navasgroup.com> wrote in message
news:jmRhd.3159$_3.35110@typhoon.sonic.net...
> [POSTED TO alt.cellular.cingular - REPLY ON USENET PLEASE]
>
> In <2uq39uF2dh4hcU1@uni-berlin.de> on Tue, 2 Nov 2004 13:51:41 -0500,
"Alan"
> <alan@erols.com> wrote:
>
> >I have two Sony-Ericcson t62u (GAIT) phones that I am holding onto.
Cingular
> >will re-activate them for me for free. I'll need them when I travel to
> >certain areas of the country.
>
> I personally don't see much need for GAIT phones anymore, now that GSM
overlay
> is pretty much done and there will soon be integration of ATTWS and
Cingular
> GSM networks. Even for emergency use in rural areas, I would simply use
an
> old AMPS phone and long-life battery, since even unactivated phones can
always
> connect to 911, and old AMPS phones tend to have higher power (and thus
better
> range) than GAIT phones.
>
> --
> Best regards, HELP FOR CINGULAR GSM & SONY ERICSSON PHONES:
> John Navas <http://navasgrp.home.att.net/#Cingular&gt;

Looking at the coverage maps for the area in question, (Adirondaks area of
NY), it looks like TDMA has way more coverage than GSM. At least on the map
:) 
Anonymous
November 4, 2004 5:42:35 AM

Archived from groups: alt.cellular.cingular (More info?)

>Try driving on I-10 from New Orleans to Los Angeles and see how much
>native Sprint coverage you have. West of San Antonio, very little.

Well, although not recently from New Orleans to San Antonio (had excellent
service when I did) but I-10 west to LA for the most part is covered. Not a lot
of issue recently.

--
John S.
e-mail responses to - john at kiana dot net
Anonymous
November 4, 2004 6:31:11 AM

Archived from groups: alt.cellular.cingular (More info?)

On Wed, 3 Nov 2004 14:37:24 -0500, "Alan" <alan@erols.com> said in
alt.cellular.cingular:

>Looking at the coverage maps for the area in question, (Adirondaks area of
>NY), it looks like TDMA has way more coverage than GSM. At least on the map
>:) 

Some of the coverage makes no sense at all. I seem to recall that
Killington is not covered.
!