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"Elder Scrolls 4 : Oblivion" announced

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Anonymous
September 11, 2004 12:38:48 AM

Archived from groups: alt.games.morrowind (More info?)

Rant following (second time today) :*)

I hope they keep the same team responsible for game design, who managed
to develop such an addictive and deep game like Morrowind. But I
seriously hope they fired their quality assurance team who did an
absolutely loosy job.

I'm not sure if I can stand another superb and addictive game which is
bug ridden and crashes every 10 minutes.


Peter


PS: Don't drink and post to usenet. Oops.
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Anonymous
September 11, 2004 12:38:49 AM

Archived from groups: alt.games.morrowind (More info?)

"Peter Strempel" wrote:
> I'm not sure if I can stand another superb and addictive game which is
> bug ridden and crashes every 10 minutes.

They should add "Fortify Load Saved Game" spells to Oblivion. Right now, I
would guess my success at loading a saved game in Morrowind without crashing
is about 70%. Maybe with that new spell, I could get it up to 90% or more
for Oblivion! :-)

--
Rick Cavalla
rac22@NO.erols.SPAM.com
==========================
"Beyond me, night is total / And through the colonnades I walk..."
Anonymous
September 11, 2004 2:18:54 AM

Archived from groups: alt.games.morrowind (More info?)

Rick Cavalla wrote:

> They should add "Fortify Load Saved Game" spells to Oblivion. Right now, I
> would guess my success at loading a saved game in Morrowind without crashing
> is about 70%. Maybe with that new spell, I could get it up to 90% or more
> for Oblivion! :-)

And I thought I am unlucky. :*)

So far I had no problem with loading games, success rate at 100%. But I
"retired" my last character when suddenly every levitate spell/potion
crashed the game, which is sort of bad if you are Telvanni. It was an
interesting char which I planned to play some more time, so that did
indeed annoy me.

Well, I work in the software industry as well. If I would create
software which is as unstable as Morrowind, I'd lose my job quickly. On
the other hand, I wish I'd be able to produce software with such a rich
content as Morrowind. I'm really biased about this game. It hooked me
more than any other game since several years (only notable exception is
Neverwinter Nights), but I'm constantly cursing when I suddenly see my
desktop. I'd prefer a bad and buggy game (you can uninstall and forget
it quickly) or a good and stable game, but please no good and buggy
game. Daggerfall was just the same, almost unplayable. Bethedsa has a
bad record concerning bugged products, though an excelllent record
concerning content and gameplay.


Peter
Anonymous
September 11, 2004 2:18:55 AM

Archived from groups: alt.games.morrowind (More info?)

Peter Strempel wrote:

> I'm really biased about this game.

Me too.

> It hooked me
> more than any other game since several years

Me too. The only other one that is as addictive is The Sims (IMHO). I
like the way you can customize both of them.
Anonymous
September 11, 2004 3:51:16 AM

Archived from groups: alt.games.morrowind (More info?)

In <2qeavmFv6m78U1@uni-berlin.de> Peter Strempel <peterstrempel@yahoo.com> writes:

>Rant following (second time today) :*)

>I hope they keep the same team responsible for game design, who managed
>to develop such an addictive and deep game like Morrowind. But I
>seriously hope they fired their quality assurance team who did an
>absolutely loosy job.

You are making the assumtion here that QA hadn't found the bugs and
management didn't decide to ship knowing the game was still unfinished.

Of course it's easier to blame QA.

--
Artificial Intelligence stands no chance against Natural Stupidity.
GAT d- -p+(--) c++++ l++ u++ t- m--- W--- !v
b+++ e* s-/+ n-(?) h++ f+g+ w+++ y*
Anonymous
September 11, 2004 9:00:38 AM

Archived from groups: alt.games.morrowind (More info?)

"Rick Cavalla" <rac22@erols.com> wrote:

>"Peter Strempel" wrote:
>> I'm not sure if I can stand another superb and addictive game which is
>> bug ridden and crashes every 10 minutes.
>
>They should add "Fortify Load Saved Game" spells to Oblivion. Right now, I
>would guess my success at loading a saved game in Morrowind without crashing
>is about 70%. Maybe with that new spell, I could get it up to 90% or more
>for Oblivion! :-)


ROFL!!!

And maybe a "slowfall back to desktop" spell. So it might buy you
enough time to save your game when it starts crashing to windows. :) 
Anonymous
September 11, 2004 4:45:18 PM

Archived from groups: alt.games.morrowind (More info?)

On Fri, 10 Sep 2004 20:38:48 +0200, Peter Strempel wrote:

> Rant following (second time today) :*)
>
> I hope they keep the same team responsible for game design, who managed to
> develop such an addictive and deep game like Morrowind. But I seriously
> hope they fired their quality assurance team who did an absolutely loosy
> job.
>
> I'm not sure if I can stand another superb and addictive game which is bug
> ridden and crashes every 10 minutes.

Funny, in my machine Morrowind crashed every time on startup, due to copy
protection. However, after applying the crack, it seems completely stable
- can't recall it ever crashing.

Now, if they could get rid of those annoying loading pauses...

Hmm. Maybe they should keep the designers but switch the programmers ?-)
Anonymous
September 12, 2004 7:01:22 AM

Archived from groups: alt.games.morrowind (More info?)

:p hant wrote:

> "Rick Cavalla" <rac22@erols.com> wrote:
>
>
>>"Peter Strempel" wrote:
>>
>>>I'm not sure if I can stand another superb and addictive game which is
>>>bug ridden and crashes every 10 minutes.
>>
>>They should add "Fortify Load Saved Game" spells to Oblivion. Right now, I
>>would guess my success at loading a saved game in Morrowind without crashing
>>is about 70%. Maybe with that new spell, I could get it up to 90% or more
>>for Oblivion! :-)
>
>
>
> ROFL!!!
>
> And maybe a "slowfall back to desktop" spell. So it might buy you
> enough time to save your game when it starts crashing to windows. :) 
>

That already exists if you run afoul of the dreaded Memory Leak feature.
Anonymous
September 17, 2004 9:59:40 AM

Archived from groups: alt.games.morrowind (More info?)

I typically buy and use what we can call "default" hardware in my
personal pcs. Never fringe stuff. I always use typical hardware with
high specs. Let me say that with my 1.7G P4 with 512 MB ram and a
really high-performance OPenGL graphics card (nvidia), the crashes are
really, really rare.
It can be SO hard to recognize these tales of bugs and crashes. I have
applied zero mods, zero cracks, nothing, and it just works and works.
I think someone from bethesda ought to publish a "supported hardware"
list. It should not be too hard for them to do . . . just look at what
machines they use for development and testing, and what graphics
processors they have developed and tested for.

Upgrade your drivers.
Upgrade your directX version to one that is certain to work with the
drivers.

There has to be a way around a situation where the game crashes 7
times out of 10 when loading a game, when this is not the case on
other pc's right?

Yours,
Kilgast


Peter Strempel <peterstrempel@yahoo.com> wrote in message news:<2qegrbFv7hanU1@uni-berlin.de>...
> Rick Cavalla wrote:
>
> > They should add "Fortify Load Saved Game" spells to Oblivion. Right now, I
> > would guess my success at loading a saved game in Morrowind without crashing
> > is about 70%. Maybe with that new spell, I could get it up to 90% or more
> > for Oblivion! :-)
>
> And I thought I am unlucky. :*)
>
> So far I had no problem with loading games, success rate at 100%. But I
> "retired" my last character when suddenly every levitate spell/potion
> crashed the game, which is sort of bad if you are Telvanni. It was an
> interesting char which I planned to play some more time, so that did
> indeed annoy me.
>
> Well, I work in the software industry as well. If I would create
> software which is as unstable as Morrowind, I'd lose my job quickly. On
> the other hand, I wish I'd be able to produce software with such a rich
> content as Morrowind. I'm really biased about this game. It hooked me
> more than any other game since several years (only notable exception is
> Neverwinter Nights), but I'm constantly cursing when I suddenly see my
> desktop. I'd prefer a bad and buggy game (you can uninstall and forget
> it quickly) or a good and stable game, but please no good and buggy
> game.
Anonymous
September 18, 2004 12:26:44 AM

Archived from groups: alt.games.morrowind (More info?)

Kilgast wrote:

> I typically buy and use what we can call "default" hardware in my
> personal pcs. Never fringe stuff. I always use typical hardware with
> high specs. Let me say that with my 1.7G P4 with 512 MB ram and a
> really high-performance OPenGL graphics card (nvidia), the crashes are
> really, really rare.
> It can be SO hard to recognize these tales of bugs and crashes. I have
> applied zero mods, zero cracks, nothing, and it just works and works.
> I think someone from bethesda ought to publish a "supported hardware"
> list. It should not be too hard for them to do . . . just look at what
> machines they use for development and testing, and what graphics
> processors they have developed and tested for.
>

I am running what was a top of the line computer when I built it -- 2
GHz P4, 512 MB RDRAM, ATI Radeon 9700 Pro, ASUS P4T-E motherboard, etc.
I encountered most of my problems with the Massive memory requirements
if you do a lot of "fast" traveling in a short period of time. The
memory usage would go from around 200 MB to over 500 MB and the computer
would slow to a crawl before crashing.
The only real hardware problem I had was when I first got the Radeon as
it got Way too hot playing the game. Installing a slot cooler fixed
that problem.
The combination of the memory leak "bug" and some "broken" quests in
Bloodmoon finally killed my playing of the game. If Bethesda were too
fix these problems I would love to start playing again.


> Upgrade your drivers.
> Upgrade your directX version to one that is certain to work with the
> drivers.
>
> There has to be a way around a situation where the game crashes 7
> times out of 10 when loading a game, when this is not the case on
> other pc's right?
>
> Yours,
> Kilgast
>
>
> Peter Strempel <peterstrempel@yahoo.com> wrote in message news:<2qegrbFv7hanU1@uni-berlin.de>...
>
>>Rick Cavalla wrote:
>>
>>
>>>They should add "Fortify Load Saved Game" spells to Oblivion. Right now, I
>>>would guess my success at loading a saved game in Morrowind without crashing
>>>is about 70%. Maybe with that new spell, I could get it up to 90% or more
>>>for Oblivion! :-)
>>
>>And I thought I am unlucky. :*)
>>
>>So far I had no problem with loading games, success rate at 100%. But I
>>"retired" my last character when suddenly every levitate spell/potion
>>crashed the game, which is sort of bad if you are Telvanni. It was an
>>interesting char which I planned to play some more time, so that did
>>indeed annoy me.
>>
>>Well, I work in the software industry as well. If I would create
>>software which is as unstable as Morrowind, I'd lose my job quickly. On
>>the other hand, I wish I'd be able to produce software with such a rich
>>content as Morrowind. I'm really biased about this game. It hooked me
>>more than any other game since several years (only notable exception is
>>Neverwinter Nights), but I'm constantly cursing when I suddenly see my
>>desktop. I'd prefer a bad and buggy game (you can uninstall and forget
>>it quickly) or a good and stable game, but please no good and buggy
>>game.
Anonymous
September 18, 2004 5:41:03 AM

Archived from groups: alt.games.morrowind (More info?)

Kilgast wrote:

> It can be SO hard to recognize these tales of bugs and crashes.

Tales? Not really. I just need to take the silt-strider from Balmora to
Seyda Neen, and upon arrival I instead arrive at my desktop. Happens
around 50% of the time. That's 40% too much for my taste.

The game was running quite stable for me with Tribunal only installed,
but since I added Bloodmoon I get very frequent crashes. I can hardly
run the game longer than 20-30 minutes until it crashes to the desktop,
unless I stay in the same cell.
I do have mods installed. I do understand that badly written mods can
cause bad things. However, the game runs instable for me without mods,
and the ability to run mods is an integral part of Morrowind. If it
doesn't work, it shouldn't have been advertized.

Looking through this newsgroup and some forums, it seems I'm not the
only person with these problems. Hence, I wouldn't call this tales.
Also, Bethedsa has a repuation for technically bad games. Just look at
Daggerfall.
On the other hand, Bethedsa has a reputation for excellent game concent.
If this game wouldn't be so damn good, I'd long deinstalled it and
forgotten about its existance. As I wrote previously, I can stand bad
and buggy games, but not good and buggy games.

For example, I just started playing Neverwinter Nights. Runs absolutely
stable on my box. No crashes, no bugs so far, no problems. But for some
reason it just doesn't thrill me as much as Morrowind. Probably I will
be back to Morrowind soon. :) 

Peter
Anonymous
September 18, 2004 4:08:56 PM

Archived from groups: alt.games.morrowind (More info?)

On Sat, 18 Sep 2004 01:41:03 +0200, Peter Strempel
<peterstrempel@yahoo.com> wrote:

>Kilgast wrote:
>
>> It can be SO hard to recognize these tales of bugs and crashes.
>
>Tales? Not really. I just need to take the silt-strider from Balmora to
>Seyda Neen, and upon arrival I instead arrive at my desktop. Happens
>around 50% of the time. That's 40% too much for my taste.
>
>The game was running quite stable for me with Tribunal only installed,
>but since I added Bloodmoon I get very frequent crashes. I can hardly
>run the game longer than 20-30 minutes until it crashes to the desktop,
>unless I stay in the same cell.
>I do have mods installed. I do understand that badly written mods can
>cause bad things. However, the game runs instable for me without mods,
>and the ability to run mods is an integral part of Morrowind. If it
>doesn't work, it shouldn't have been advertized.

Which OS are you running? Morrowind works fine on 98SE and XP, but has
severe problems with Windows 2000. When I tried to play it on 2000, it
crashed pretty much whenever I went between cells, but it works very
well under XP.
--
Greg Johnson
Give your child mental blocks for Christmas.
Anonymous
September 18, 2004 4:08:57 PM

Archived from groups: alt.games.morrowind (More info?)

Greg Johnson wrote:

> On Sat, 18 Sep 2004 01:41:03 +0200, Peter Strempel
> <peterstrempel@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
>
>>Kilgast wrote:
>>
>>
>>>It can be SO hard to recognize these tales of bugs and crashes.
>>
>>Tales? Not really. I just need to take the silt-strider from Balmora to
>>Seyda Neen, and upon arrival I instead arrive at my desktop. Happens
>>around 50% of the time. That's 40% too much for my taste.
>>
>>The game was running quite stable for me with Tribunal only installed,
>>but since I added Bloodmoon I get very frequent crashes. I can hardly
>>run the game longer than 20-30 minutes until it crashes to the desktop,
>>unless I stay in the same cell.
>>I do have mods installed. I do understand that badly written mods can
>>cause bad things. However, the game runs instable for me without mods,
>>and the ability to run mods is an integral part of Morrowind. If it
>>doesn't work, it shouldn't have been advertized.
>
>
> Which OS are you running? Morrowind works fine on 98SE and XP, but has
> severe problems with Windows 2000. When I tried to play it on 2000, it
> crashed pretty much whenever I went between cells, but it works very
> well under XP.

I am running under Windows XP Pro and have the "memory leak" bug. If
you look at past posts this has been discussed several times.
I keep buying their products as they are better than the competition but
then running into a bug is more annoying because it ruins the flow of
the game.
Anonymous
October 4, 2004 6:24:08 AM

Archived from groups: alt.games.morrowind (More info?)

"Peter Strempel" <peterstrempel@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:2qegrbFv7hanU1@uni-berlin.de...
> Rick Cavalla wrote:
>
> > They should add "Fortify Load Saved Game" spells to Oblivion. Right
now, I
> > would guess my success at loading a saved game in Morrowind without
crashing
> > is about 70%. Maybe with that new spell, I could get it up to 90% or
more
> > for Oblivion! :-)
>
> And I thought I am unlucky. :*)
>
> So far I had no problem with loading games, success rate at 100%. But I
> "retired" my last character when suddenly every levitate spell/potion
> crashed the game, which is sort of bad if you are Telvanni. It was an
> interesting char which I planned to play some more time, so that did
> indeed annoy me.
>
> Well, I work in the software industry as well. If I would create
> software which is as unstable as Morrowind, I'd lose my job quickly. On
> the other hand, I wish I'd be able to produce software with such a rich
> content as Morrowind. I'm really biased about this game. It hooked me
> more than any other game since several years (only notable exception is
> Neverwinter Nights), but I'm constantly cursing when I suddenly see my
> desktop. I'd prefer a bad and buggy game (you can uninstall and forget
> it quickly) or a good and stable game, but please no good and buggy
> game. Daggerfall was just the same, almost unplayable. Bethedsa has a
> bad record concerning bugged products, though an excelllent record
> concerning content and gameplay.
>
>
> Peter

Now here is an opinion I agree with. So---is this (and other games), a
classic example of the imagination traveling too far ahead of technology?
Seems Bethesda has great and even genius imagination, while the product, the
result, is on the one hand mind boggling and on the other clumsy and sticky,
crashes, and frustrates. I don't know. I'm no programmer, although I wish I
were sometimes. I have never played a 100% smooth, seamless, faultless game.
Anonymous
October 5, 2004 2:24:16 AM

Archived from groups: alt.games.morrowind (More info?)

Dennis Curtis wrote:

> So---is this (and other games), a classic example of the imagination
> traveling too far ahead of technology?

I definately had the impression back then when I first played Daggerfall
it was way ahead of its time. I'd say Daggerfall was genius imagination
stumbling over restricted technology at that time.
I'm not sure if the same applies to Morrowind. Certainly Morrowind also
has superior gameplay and excellent content, but a seamingless 3D world
wasn't anything unseen in the year 2002 when Morrowind was released.

In my opinion, the most genius aspect of Morrowind is the ability to mod
the game. Without mods I'd probably long stopped playing it. The modding
community is very alive and active, what's remarkable considering the
game is now 2 years old. Only some rare games survive the initial hype.


> I have never played a 100% smooth, seamless, faultless game.

100% bugfree software does not exist. Nowhere. Not in the games
industry, not in commercial applications. Programs are written by human,
and we make mistakes. But the question is, how bad and how noticable are
the problems.
When I compare Morrowind with Neverwinter Nights, I have zero crashes
and remarkably few in-game problems with NWN. Cannot say the same about
Morrowind. Technically NWN is a superior piece of software. Concerning
gameplay, I prefer Morrowind. :) 


Peter
Anonymous
October 11, 2004 8:18:59 AM

Archived from groups: alt.games.morrowind (More info?)

On Mon, 11 Oct 2004 06:09:52 GMT, Dennis Curtis <curtisd1@verizon.net> wrote:

> I was told by several 'sperts, that any OS other than Win XP will not
> handle a gig of RAM effectively. Sooooo, if you don't have XP, and try to
> play the game with a gig of RAM, you will still have problems.

I'd like to know where you heard that one, although I'm fairly certain that
you misinterpreted a statement saying that Windows 9x/ME couldn't manage such
large amounts of memory effectively. It would make no sense whatsoever for
Windows NT -- especially Windows 2000, which is so like Windows XP that both
operating systems are classified as NT5 -- or any number of the great deal of
server-capable operating systems made relevant by WineX to not be comfortable
around a gigabyte of memory.
Anonymous
October 11, 2004 10:25:46 AM

Archived from groups: alt.games.morrowind (More info?)

"Peter Strempel" <peterstrempel@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:2sdpu2F1k42soU1@uni-berlin.de...
> Dennis Curtis wrote:
>
> > So---is this (and other games), a classic example of the imagination
> > traveling too far ahead of technology?
>
> I definately had the impression back then when I first played Daggerfall
> it was way ahead of its time. I'd say Daggerfall was genius imagination
> stumbling over restricted technology at that time.
> I'm not sure if the same applies to Morrowind. Certainly Morrowind also
> has superior gameplay and excellent content, but a seamingless 3D world
> wasn't anything unseen in the year 2002 when Morrowind was released.
>
> In my opinion, the most genius aspect of Morrowind is the ability to mod
> the game. Without mods I'd probably long stopped playing it. The modding
> community is very alive and active, what's remarkable considering the
> game is now 2 years old. Only some rare games survive the initial hype.
>
>
> > I have never played a 100% smooth, seamless, faultless game.
>
> 100% bugfree software does not exist. Nowhere. Not in the games
> industry, not in commercial applications. Programs are written by human,
> and we make mistakes. But the question is, how bad and how noticable are
> the problems.
> When I compare Morrowind with Neverwinter Nights, I have zero crashes
> and remarkably few in-game problems with NWN. Cannot say the same about
> Morrowind. Technically NWN is a superior piece of software. Concerning
> gameplay, I prefer Morrowind. :) 
>
>
> Peter

It was only partly a rhetorical question. On one hand, it was not fair
to ask the question, cause I know the perfect game doesn't exist. On the
other, the Beach Boys song comes to mind...."wouldn't it be nice?"
There are some games that come close, Morrowind, with all its flaws of
flow, is one of them. "Torment" is another.
One of the more interesting aspects of a good game is how widely it is
copied, or plagerized. The BG series inspired over a dozen other games. The
Myst series and so on. I can't count the number of games that knocked off
Doom.
Lots of people like NWN. I have the game and to me, it is another
spinoff of the BG series, although I like the scenery much better than BG1.
But you are right, in that it did play very smoothly, up until the end
scene, which on my computer at the time slowed down so much I felt like
shooting the bad guys with a real gun. I am an artist and visuals are the
main reason to play. Story lines are usually one of the " seven main plots"
which all tales have. It is very rare to find an original story anywhere.
"Torment" comes close, but it relates closely to the epic of Gilgamesh. So
to me, graphics are crucial. Ease of gameplay is a close second.---dennis
Anonymous
October 11, 2004 2:26:05 PM

Archived from groups: alt.games.morrowind (More info?)

Michael Hughes wrote:

> It would make no sense whatsoever for
> Windows NT -- especially Windows 2000, which is so like Windows XP

Yup. Win2000 definately can handle > 1 GB RAM. Not sure about the
original NT 4. When NT was released, 1 GB RAM did hardly exist for the
hardware NT was targeted for. Back then, if you could afford such a
powerhorse, you'd be running Solaris on it. NT was meant for x86
servers, and 1 GB RAM wasn't usual at that time.

Win95/98 have a limit for RAM and HD space. ME probably, too, but I
never used ME myself. The whole Win95/98/ME series is based on good old
DOS and basically a piece of junk. <rant> When Win95 was released, it
was technically the worst available system at that time. But it got the
best marketing, and unfortunately that's what makes people buy stuff.
</rant>


Peter
!