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i9900 and Pixma8500 - opinions please

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Anonymous
June 3, 2005 9:48:54 PM

Archived from groups: comp.periphs.printers (More info?)

The vendors' websites aren't very helpful - they all reprint Canon's
bumf. My question comes down to this:

Is the Pixma 8500 basically a smaller version of the i9900? They both
have 8 tanks, both are 4800x2400 dpi, etc. Main difference sesm to be
that i9900 can print 13'x19' images.

Any information and reports of experience with these printer gratefully
received. Use this forum, please.

Thanks in advance,
Anonymous
June 4, 2005 2:43:03 AM

Archived from groups: comp.periphs.printers (More info?)

Wolf Kirchmeir wrote:

> The vendors' websites aren't very helpful - they all reprint Canon's
> bumf. My question comes down to this:
>
> Is the Pixma 8500 basically a smaller version of the i9900?


Sort of. They have the same basic print engine. The speed is close but
not identical.

The i9900 is not a PIXMA IP model. It is an i Series which have been
discontinued except for this wide format printer. The i9900 is the best
value in a wide format print bar none.

The IP8500, like all of the PIXMA models, has twin paper feeds and can
print full duplex. It is a great printer. I wish that Canon updates
the i9900 to a PIXMA model. I also would like to see it do 16x20
borderless and have Canon make Photo Paper Pro in that size.

> They both have 8 tanks, both are 4800x2400 dpi, etc. Main difference
> sesm to be that i9900 can print 13'x19' images.
>
> Any information and reports of experience with these printer
> gratefully received. Use this forum, please.
>
> Thanks in advance,
>
June 4, 2005 6:13:30 AM

Archived from groups: comp.periphs.printers (More info?)

In reality: many of the Pixma printers use the same inks as i9x printers.
Therefore they are simply repackaging of the old technology as the color
gamut of the ink does not change.

Canon printers work with Canon printer drivers and contain profiles only for
Canon papers: essentially three surface types. The color profiles, using
Canon color management protocols do not provide even mediocre color matching
to one's calibrated monitor in a color managed environment: my disappointing
personal experience leads me to this conclusion.

I do not think anyone serious about color printing should buy a Canon
printer unless they are prepared to generate individual printer/paper
profiles for Canon and non-Canon papers. I do not think the problem is in
the printers but in the Canon software. The more Canon equipment I use the
more amazed I am at how absolutely lousy Canon operating software is for
most of their equipment. It is no surprise that the new D20 is already on
its second or third firmware upgrade: these are not improvements, they are
bug fixes.
Related resources
Anonymous
June 4, 2005 6:49:14 AM

Archived from groups: comp.periphs.printers (More info?)

birdman wrote:

>In reality: many of the Pixma printers use the same inks as i9x printers.
>Therefore they are simply repackaging of the old technology as the color
>gamut of the ink does not change.
>
>

Only in so far as the ink. The speed of the printer is different. The
driver, having a large part of the responsibility in producing the
result, is different as well as the package and features. It is a
definate improvement.

>Canon printers work with Canon printer drivers and contain profiles only for
>Canon papers: essentially three surface types.
>

The Photo Paper Pro works great with Costco Kirkland Glossy Paper and
Epson matte also works great with the Canon matte setting.

>The color profiles, using
>Canon color management protocols do not provide even mediocre color matching
>to one's calibrated monitor in a color managed environment: my disappointing
>personal experience leads me to this conclusion.
>
>I do not think anyone serious about color printing should buy a Canon
>printer unless they are prepared to generate individual printer/paper
>profiles for Canon and non-Canon papers.
>

Many of the 1st rate paper companies have profiles for all the printers
that their paper is recommended for.

>I do not think the problem is in
>the printers but in the Canon software. The more Canon equipment I use the
>more amazed I am at how absolutely lousy Canon operating software is for
>most of their equipment. It is no surprise that the new D20 is already on
>its second or third firmware upgrade: these are not improvements, they are
>bug fixes.
>
>

That is the nature of software. Epson scanner software (outsourced of
course) is also shitty.

>
>
>
Anonymous
June 4, 2005 2:15:09 PM

Archived from groups: comp.periphs.printers (More info?)

birdman wrote:
> In reality: many of the Pixma printers use the same inks as i9x
> printers. Therefore they are simply repackaging of the old technology
> as the color gamut of the ink does not change.
>
> Canon printers work with Canon printer drivers and contain profiles
> only for Canon papers: essentially three surface types. The color
> profiles, using Canon color management protocols do not provide even
> mediocre color matching to one's calibrated monitor in a color
> managed environment: my disappointing personal experience leads me to
> this conclusion.
> I do not think anyone serious about color printing should buy a Canon
> printer unless they are prepared to generate individual printer/paper
> profiles for Canon and non-Canon papers.

I use quite happily Canon Photo paper pro and plus glossy with default
settings and get great results.
Each printer has it's default and preffered papers and thus built-in
profiles, if not you can always get them on the web (as measekite said). If
not, don't use such shitty paper.
But, i must agree that Canon is very louzy regarding updating it's printer
software. Correct me if i'm wrong, but CDLabelPrint is still in phase 1.0.2.
A bit better is easy photo print, while printer driver is in 1.80 for ages,
so either is so great that requires no improvement, or... But, to be honest,
i see nothing wrong in this driver, so why changing it?
Also i have Canon S1 IS camera from their first firmware, it did have low
light focusing problems, but it way solved with second firmware very fast,
while third (last) was just minor improvement for some stuff (regarding
flash...) and that was it. Some companies have even over 10 firmwares, so 3
is just OK. Thank god it'spossible to do this....imagine having analog
camera with such focusing problem...soluton is either service or buying a
new one...
Anonymous
June 5, 2005 3:56:36 AM

Archived from groups: comp.periphs.printers (More info?)

G'day Wolf. I have the canon pixma 8500 printer and it prints superb photo
prints, in fact better than many photo labs. It prints up to A4 size. The
print head on the pixma 8500 is the same that is used in the i9900. Prior to
purchasing my pixma 8500 I had a canon 6 cartridge S900. It would be an
insult to compare the results between the printers. I am in to photography
big time, and the pixma has already saved me a small fortune in printing
photos from 4" x 6" up to many A4 size prints. All of my daughter's recent
wedding photos, taken by various relatives and friends were printed on my
pixma 8500 and they were absolutely superb in quality.

Printing word documents, in draft quality, mode on the pixma 8500 are
lightning fast.

Go for the pixma 8500 you will not regret purchasing it.

Let me know if you have anymore questions etc.

Cheers

Ron from Downunder

P.S. Be very careful of aftermarket non canon inks, as I had a lot of
problems with true quality colour reproductions until I found a supplier
here in Australia who sold very high quality bulk ink for me to refill my
own cartridges.


"Wolf Kirchmeir" <wwolfkir@sympatico.ca> wrote in message
news:yd4oe.13006$yG4.1047163@news20.bellglobal.com...
> The vendors' websites aren't very helpful - they all reprint Canon's
> bumf. My question comes down to this:
>
> Is the Pixma 8500 basically a smaller version of the i9900? They both
> have 8 tanks, both are 4800x2400 dpi, etc. Main difference sesm to be
> that i9900 can print 13'x19' images.
>
> Any information and reports of experience with these printer gratefully
> received. Use this forum, please.
>
> Thanks in advance,
>
Anonymous
June 5, 2005 3:56:37 AM

Archived from groups: comp.periphs.printers (More info?)

wazzad wrote:

>G'day Wolf. I have the canon pixma 8500 printer and it prints superb photo
>prints, in fact better than many photo labs. It prints up to A4 size. The
>print head on the pixma 8500 is the same that is used in the i9900. Prior to
>purchasing my pixma 8500 I had a canon 6 cartridge S900. It would be an
>insult to compare the results between the printers. I am in to photography
>big time, and the pixma has already saved me a small fortune in printing
>photos from 4" x 6" up to many A4 size prints. All of my daughter's recent
>wedding photos, taken by various relatives and friends were printed on my
>pixma 8500 and they were absolutely superb in quality.
>
>Printing word documents, in draft quality, mode on the pixma 8500 are
>lightning fast.
>
>Go for the pixma 8500 you will not regret purchasing it.
>
>Let me know if you have anymore questions etc.
>
>Cheers
>
>Ron from Downunder
>
>*P.S. Be very careful of aftermarket non canon inks,* as I had a lot of
>problems with true quality colour reproductions until I found a supplier
>here in Australia who sold very high quality bulk ink for me to refill my
>own cartridges.
>
>
>"Wolf Kirchmeir" <wwolfkir@sympatico.ca> wrote in message
>news:yd4oe.13006$yG4.1047163@news20.bellglobal.com...
>
>
>>The vendors' websites aren't very helpful - they all reprint Canon's
>>bumf. My question comes down to this:
>>
>>Is the Pixma 8500 basically a smaller version of the i9900? They both
>>have 8 tanks, both are 4800x2400 dpi, etc. Main difference sesm to be
>>that i9900 can print 13'x19' images.
>>
>>Any information and reports of experience with these printer gratefully
>>received. Use this forum, please.
>>
>>Thanks in advance,
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>
>
June 5, 2005 3:56:37 AM

Archived from groups: comp.periphs.printers (More info?)

wazzad wrote:

> Ron from Downunder
>
> P.S. Be very careful of aftermarket non canon inks, as I had a lot of
> problems with true quality colour reproductions until I found a supplier
> here in Australia who sold very high quality bulk ink for me to refill my
> own cartridges.

Let me speak from the stand point of my personal user experience about
3rd party inks and the Canon i9900. After the initial use of the
supplied OEM carts, I now use ONLY 3rd party carts in my i9900 and have
never had any problems of head clogging or color difference as compared
to the OEM inks.
Frank
Anonymous
June 5, 2005 3:56:37 AM

Archived from groups: comp.periphs.printers (More info?)

wazzad wrote:
[...]
> P.S. Be very careful of aftermarket non canon inks, as I had a lot of
> problems with true quality colour reproductions until I found a supplier
> here in Australia who sold very high quality bulk ink for me to refill my
> own cartridges.
>
[...]

Thanks for your comments. Nothing like the horse's mouth. :-)

Can you supply URL for that source of OEM quality inks?

'Ta muchly.
June 5, 2005 3:56:38 AM

Archived from groups: comp.periphs.printers (More info?)

Wolf Kirchmeir wrote:
> wazzad wrote:
> [...]
>
>> P.S. Be very careful of aftermarket non canon inks, as I had a lot of
>> problems with true quality colour reproductions until I found a supplier
>> here in Australia who sold very high quality bulk ink for me to refill my
>> own cartridges.
>>
> [...]
>
> Thanks for your comments. Nothing like the horse's mouth. :-)
>
> Can you supply URL for that source of OEM quality inks?
>
> 'Ta muchly.

Sure...here's one that has both OEM carts, MIS filled carts and empty
carts that you can refill with MIS ink. If you have an Epson and do a
lot of printing you can go with one of their CFS packages.

www.inksupply.com

Frank
Anonymous
June 5, 2005 5:28:09 AM

Archived from groups: comp.periphs.printers (More info?)

Frank wrote:

> Wolf Kirchmeir wrote:
>
>> wazzad wrote:
>> [...]
>>
>>> P.S. Be very careful of aftermarket non canon inks, as I had a lot of
>>> problems with true quality colour reproductions until I found a
>>> supplier
>>> here in Australia who sold very high quality bulk ink for me to
>>> refill my
>>> own cartridges.
>>>
>> [...]
>>
>> Thanks for your comments. Nothing like the horse's mouth. :-)
>>
>> Can you supply URL for that source of OEM quality inks?
>>
>> 'Ta muchly.
>
>
> Sure...here's one that has both OEM carts, MIS filled carts and empty
> carts that you can refill with MIS ink.


MIS DOES *****NOT***** MANUFACTURER OR FORMULATE INK. THEY SELL
RELABELED INK. THEY WILL NOT TELL YOU WHO MAKES THIS INK EVEN AFTER A
REQUEST.

I am not saying it is no good. I am saying you do not know what you are
getting. I have read posts that the ink works fine in a Canin i960 and
for some reason clogged printers in the PIXMA line. I do not know why.
This is what I read a few weeks ago. I am not sure if I read it on this
NG, nifty stuff or somewhere else.

The word is CAVEAT EMPTOR in this industry.

> If you have an Epson and do a lot of printing you can go with one of
> their CFS packages.
>
> www.inksupply.com
>
> Frank
June 5, 2005 10:54:42 AM

Archived from groups: comp.periphs.printers (More info?)

I don't know about your particular printer, but I use MIS inks to refill OEM
cartridges and MIS empty cartridges for my Canon i960. Great color match and
no problems so far with almost a year of use. A few posters on this
newsgroup uses Formulabs inks from Alotofthings and have found this vendor
to be very reliable and their inks excellent for his Canon printers. Look up
all the posts you can find from Ron Cohen for this information. Also check
out Taliesyn's posts as he uses aftermarket inks successfully. I have read
that they won't ship to Canada, but I don't know if they would ship to you
in OZ. You can email them to check it out. Two other vendors that have
told me they use Formulabs inks in their prefilled carts are Wiredbeans (on
ebay) and Weink (their CRU carts.) You can email them to verify that the
carts you may want to buy are filled with Formulabs inks. Measekite, the
person who responded to you, has never done business with these firms, nor
has he used aftermarket inks. He mistrusts the vendors and their products
and has an especial dislike for Alotofthings. Every time aftermarket inks
are mentioned he responds with his concerns that the products are not
manufactured by the firms selling them and they are relabeled so you don't
know what is in them. Unfortuantely, his responses are filled with
invective about the companies and usually filled with obscenities, both of
which tend to make his point of view appear less than valid. Others on this
NG have purchased from them for several years and found them to be reliable
and their products good.

Check out Neil Slade's web site at
http://www.neilslade.com/papers/inkjetstuff.html and check out the forum at
http://www.nifty-stuff.com/forum/ . Both are almost entirely about Canon
printers, aftermarket inks, papers, and tips on maintaining your printer.
You can sign on to the Nifty-stuff forum and ask about inks available for
your printer in OZ as there may be people from OZ participating. You will
also see what products have given people problems.

"Wolf Kirchmeir" <wwolfkir@sympatico.ca> wrote in message
news:Vvqoe.23951$yG4.1175469@news20.bellglobal.com...
> wazzad wrote:
> [...]
>> P.S. Be very careful of aftermarket non canon inks, as I had a lot of
>> problems with true quality colour reproductions until I found a supplier
>> here in Australia who sold very high quality bulk ink for me to refill my
>> own cartridges.
>>
> [...]
>
> Thanks for your comments. Nothing like the horse's mouth. :-)
>
> Can you supply URL for that source of OEM quality inks?
>
> 'Ta muchly.
Anonymous
June 5, 2005 7:54:14 PM

Archived from groups: comp.periphs.printers (More info?)

Burt wrote:

>I don't know about your particular printer, but I use MIS inks to refill OEM
>cartridges and MIS empty cartridges for my Canon i960.
>

I read a report from some poster in one of the news venues that while
some luck is had using MIS inks in a Canon i960 there have been clogging
issues with the IP Pixma series of printers. I do not know the accuracy
of that statement. It might have been just one persons experience just
like this writer is one person's experience.

>Great color match and
>no problems so far with almost a year of use. A few posters on this
>newsgroup uses Formulabs inks from Alotofthings and have found this vendor
>to be very reliable and their inks excellent for his Canon printers.
>

My experience with them was poor. I would not recommend that source.

>Look up
>all the posts you can find from Ron Cohen for this information. Also check
>out Taliesyn's posts as he uses aftermarket inks successfully. I have read
>that they won't ship to Canada, but I don't know if they would ship to you
>in OZ.
>


These are part of the religious congregation known as the AFTERMARKET
CLUB. About a dozen members who are hobbyists and tinkers that just
love the pain in the ass and mess of refilling carts. Of course they
all have a very high printload so due to the expense of the high quality
OEM choice it is cost justifiable to risk their printer and spend their
time. If my printload was that high I would have to investigate a 3rd
party source. I would try to find one not mentioned here.

>You can email them to check it out. Two other vendors that have
>told me they use Formulabs inks in their prefilled carts are Wiredbeans (on
>ebay) and Weink (their CRU carts.)
>

WeStink charges $2.00 less than you can get a Canon OEM cart. I do not
know about the Epson prices. They used to provide advice on this NG
without disclosing that there true motive was to make sales. I do not
like this practice.

I do not know about WiredBeans. THIS LINK WILL PROVIDE THEIR RESELLER
RATING.

http://www.resellerratings.com/seller5041.html

THESE ARE THE COMPANIES THE AFTERMARKET CLUB RECOMMENDS. CAVEAT EMPTOR.


ANOTHER PERSON WITH A PROBLEM

hi-
my i960's nozzles keep getting clogged to the point that i have had to
replace the nozze unit once already, and now one of the nozzles on the
replacement head is clogged already. i just replaced it about 2 months
ago. does anyone know how to clean these nozzles so they will work
again? does using aftermarket off brand ink cause this? i hardly ever
use it, is that a cause?

thanx alot


> You can email them to verify that the
>carts you may want to buy are filled with Formulabs inks. Measekite, the
>person who responded to you, has never done business with these firms, nor
>has he used aftermarket inks. He mistrusts the vendors and their products
>and has an especial dislike for Alotofthings. Every time aftermarket inks
>are mentioned he responds with his concerns that the products are not
>manufactured by the firms selling them and they are relabeled so you don't
>know what is in them.
>


That is true. You can have problems with ink bought at one vendor so
you buy from another vendor thinking you are makeing a change because
the Label is a different name. You than have the same problem. What
really happened is that you bought the same ink mfg and formulated from
the same place sold under different labels. This practice makes thing
difficult to track. Making things worse is you can make 2 purchases
from the same place a few months apart and get inks made by different
sources all sold under the same label with the quality varying a great
deal. Or from batch to batch the quality may be different.

OEM's spend a lot of money to insure quality by placing many quality
control measures in the process. They spend millions developing and
protecting a their brand. That said I do believe they are over priced.

> Unfortuantely, his responses are filled with
>invective about the companies and usually filled with obscenities,
>

traded with the Church of the AfterMarket led by Pope Burtie.

>both of
>which tend to make his point of view appear less than valid. Others on this
>NG have purchased from them for several years and found them to be reliable
>and their products good.
>
>


THEN WHY DO SO MANY POSTER ON THIS NG WHO USE AFTERMARKET INKS HAVE SO
MANY PROBLEMS. MANY MORE PROBLEMS THAN OEM USERS.

>Check out Neil Slade's web site at
>http://www.neilslade.com/papers/inkjetstuff.html and check out the forum at
>http://www.nifty-stuff.com/forum/ .
>

NIFTY AND SLADES SITE HAVE SOME LINKAGE. SLADE DOES HAVE SOME
INTERESTING STUFF BUT YOU MUST REMEMBER THAT ALL OF THESE PLACES CATER
TO AFTERMARKET HOBBYISTS.

> Both are almost entirely about Canon
>printers, aftermarket inks, papers, and tips on maintaining your printer.
>You can sign on to the Nifty-stuff forum and ask about inks available for
>your printer in OZ as there may be people from OZ participating. You will
>also see what products have given people problems.
>
>

And you will get the same answers as here because here you have Burt and
their you have fotofreek. The same thing using two names just like the
AfterMarket ink can be the same thing using multiple Labels.

> "Wolf Kirchmeir" <wwolfkir@sympatico.ca> wrote in message
>news:Vvqoe.23951$yG4.1175469@news20.bellglobal.com...
>
>
>>wazzad wrote:
>>[...]
>>
>>
>>>P.S. Be very careful of aftermarket non canon inks, as I had a lot of
>>>problems with true quality colour reproductions until I found a supplier
>>>here in Australia who sold very high quality bulk ink for me to refill my
>>>own cartridges.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>[...]
>>
>>Thanks for your comments. Nothing like the horse's mouth. :-)
>>
>>Can you supply URL for that source of OEM quality inks?
>>
>>'Ta muchly.
>>
>>
>
>
>
>
June 5, 2005 7:54:15 PM

Archived from groups: comp.periphs.printers (More info?)

measekite wrote:


What's your point shithead? That you can copy and post out of context.
Is that you big claim to fame, cause that's all you're doing.
You have no creditability on the subject of aftermarket inks. You have
no experience with purchasing or using them do you.
Please tell this ng exactly what experience you do have, ok.
We're waiting....
Frank
Anonymous
June 6, 2005 2:22:41 AM

Archived from groups: comp.periphs.printers (More info?)

"Burt" <sfbjgNOSPAM@pacbell.net> wrote in message
news:Skxoe.24706$J12.18336@newssvr14.news.prodigy.com...
>I don't know about your particular printer, but I use MIS inks to refill
>OEM cartridges and MIS empty cartridges for my Canon i960. Great color
>match and no problems so far with almost a year of use. A few posters on
>this newsgroup uses Formulabs inks from Alotofthings and have found this
>vendor to be very reliable and their inks excellent for his Canon printers.
>Look up all the posts you can find from Ron Cohen for this information.
>Also check out Taliesyn's posts as he uses aftermarket inks successfully.
>I have read that they won't ship to Canada, but I don't know if they would
>ship to you in OZ. You can email them to check it out. Two other vendors
>that have told me they use Formulabs inks in their prefilled carts are
>Wiredbeans (on ebay) and Weink (their CRU carts.) You can email them to
>verify that the carts you may want to buy are filled with Formulabs inks.
>Measekite, the person who responded to you, has never done business with
>these firms, nor has he used aftermarket inks. He mistrusts the vendors
>and their products and has an especial dislike for Alotofthings. Every
>time aftermarket inks are mentioned he responds with his concerns that the
>products are not manufactured by the firms selling them and they are
>relabeled so you don't know what is in them. Unfortuantely, his responses
>are filled with invective about the companies and usually filled with
>obscenities, both of which tend to make his point of view appear less than
>valid. Others on this NG have purchased from them for several years and
>found them to be reliable and their products good.
>
> Check out Neil Slade's web site at
> http://www.neilslade.com/papers/inkjetstuff.html and check out the forum
> at
> http://www.nifty-stuff.com/forum/ . Both are almost entirely about Canon
> printers, aftermarket inks, papers, and tips on maintaining your printer.
> You can sign on to the Nifty-stuff forum and ask about inks available for
> your printer in OZ as there may be people from OZ participating. You will
> also see what products have given people problems.
>
> "Wolf Kirchmeir" <wwolfkir@sympatico.ca> wrote in message
> news:Vvqoe.23951$yG4.1175469@news20.bellglobal.com...
>> wazzad wrote:
>> [...]
>>> P.S. Be very careful of aftermarket non canon inks, as I had a lot of
>>> problems with true quality colour reproductions until I found a supplier
>>> here in Australia who sold very high quality bulk ink for me to refill
>>> my
>>> own cartridges.
>>>
>> [...]
>>
>> Thanks for your comments. Nothing like the horse's mouth. :-)
>>
>> Can you supply URL for that source of OEM quality inks?
>>
>> 'Ta muchly.
>
Hi Group,

I have two printers, a Canon Pixma 4000 and a Canon i560 and I am using
non-oem inks purchased from www.cartridgedepot.com.au/ whose cartridges
contain Formulabs ink in, I believe, Chinese cartridges with Swiss foam
inserts. Note: I am not employed by Cartridgedepot. I am using Ilford
Galerie Smooth Gloss and Smooth Pearl papers exclusively and I get perfect
results every time. I have not noticed any fading or deterioration of any
kind using these two product, I have never had a clog or any other problem
caused by using these products. Having said that it is also fair to say that
I use both printers on a daily basis and if they are not used daily I run a
colour chart at least once a week. I know that Cartridgedepot freight
quantities to Canada.
Feel free to consider the above or discard as you see fit because I am not
pushing anyone's barrow.

Ben
June 6, 2005 4:01:29 AM

Archived from groups: comp.periphs.printers (More info?)

"measekite" <measekite@juno.com> wrote in message
news:GeFoe.72$Z44.30@newssvr13.news.prodigy.com...
>
>
> Burt wrote:
>
>>I don't know about your particular printer, but I use MIS inks to refill
>>OEM cartridges and MIS empty cartridges for my Canon i960.
>
> I read a report from some poster in one of the news venues that while some
> luck is had using MIS inks in a Canon i960 there have been clogging issues
> with the IP Pixma series of printers. I do not know the accuracy of that
> statement. It might have been just one persons experience just like this
> writer is one person's experience.
>
>>Great color match and no problems so far with almost a year of use. A few
>>posters on this newsgroup uses Formulabs inks from Alotofthings and have
>>found this vendor to be very reliable and their inks excellent for his
>>Canon printers.
>
> My experience with them was poor. I would not recommend that source.

The only "experience" Measekite had with Alotofthings was when he tried to
give them some advice on how to run their business and he didn't like their
response. This statement would be like Measekite telling you he had a poor
experience with a woman when the "experience" was that she told him to get
lost when he tried to proposition her. The implication of his statement
about his experience with Alotofthings is that he did business with them or
used their product and found either their service or product poor. Neither
is true. Simply an attempt to defame them or their product.
>
>>Look up all the posts you can find from Ron Cohen for this information.
>>Also check out Taliesyn's posts as he uses aftermarket inks successfully.
>>I have read that they won't ship to Canada, but I don't know if they would
>>ship to you in OZ.
>
>
> These are part of the religious congregation known as the AFTERMARKET
> CLUB. About a dozen members who are hobbyists and tinkers that just love
> the pain in the ass and mess of refilling carts. Of course they all have
> a very high printload so due to the expense of the high quality OEM choice
> it is cost justifiable to risk their printer and spend their time. If my
> printload was that high I would have to investigate a 3rd party source. I
> would try to find one not mentioned here.
>
>>You can email them to check it out. Two other vendors that have told me
>>they use Formulabs inks in their prefilled carts are Wiredbeans (on ebay)
>>and Weink (their CRU carts.)
>>
>
> WeStink charges $2.00 less than you can get a Canon OEM cart. I do not
> know about the Epson prices. They used to provide advice on this NG
> without disclosing that there true motive was to make sales. I do not
> like this practice.

Measekite has never done business with this firm either. He persists in
paraphrasing their business name in a defamatory manner. He hasln't read
their web site accurately, or he is deliberately lying. The cartridges I
mentioned are the BCI-6 CRU carts which are listed on their website today at
$2.29. I have never used these carts, but the vendor tells me that they
are filled with Formulabs inks, the ink that Measekite claims he would use
if they would put the mfgr name on the box and his print load was higher.
Ron Cohen and Teliesyn have used Formulabs inks in their canon printers for
several years with no problems.
>
> I do not know about WiredBeans. THIS LINK WILL PROVIDE THEIR RESELLER
> RATING.

I did not recommend this firm. I only stated that they told me their carts
had formulabs ink in them. The moderator of the Nifty stuff forum has
purchased carts from them and is now testing them.

>
> http://www.resellerratings.com/seller5041.html
>
> THESE ARE THE COMPANIES THE AFTERMARKET CLUB RECOMMENDS. CAVEAT EMPTOR.
>
>
> ANOTHER PERSON WITH A PROBLEM
>
> hi-
> my i960's nozzles keep getting clogged to the point that i have had to
> replace the nozze unit once already, and now one of the nozzles on the
> replacement head is clogged already. i just replaced it about 2 months
> ago. does anyone know how to clean these nozzles so they will work
> again? does using aftermarket off brand ink cause this? i hardly ever
> use it, is that a cause?

This post is the "poster child" for Measekite in attempting to draw a causal
relationship between non-OEM inks and head damage. It is somewhat confusing
in that we don't know if the poster has used OEM or aftermaket inks, what
brand he might have used, or whether his reference to "I hardly ever use it"
means that he hardly uses the printer, in which case that is the prodominant
cause of head clogs, or if he hardly uses aftermarket inks. This post was
thoroughly discussed in a previous thread and no conclusion could be drawn
because no additional information was provided.
>
> thanx alot
>
>
>> You can email them to verify that the carts you may want to buy are
>> filled with Formulabs inks. Measekite, the person who responded to you,
>> has never done business with these firms, nor has he used aftermarket
>> inks. He mistrusts the vendors and their products and has an especial
>> dislike for Alotofthings. Every time aftermarket inks are mentioned he
>> responds with his concerns that the products are not manufactured by the
>> firms selling them and they are relabeled so you don't know what is in
>> them.
>
>
> That is true. You can have problems with ink bought at one vendor so you
> buy from another vendor thinking you are makeing a change because the
> Label is a different name. You than have the same problem. What really
> happened is that you bought the same ink mfg and formulated from the same
> place sold under different labels. This practice makes thing difficult to
> track. Making things worse is you can make 2 purchases from the same
> place a few months apart and get inks made by different sources all sold
> under the same label with the quality varying a great deal. Or from batch
> to batch the quality may be different.
>
> OEM's spend a lot of money to insure quality by placing many quality
> control measures in the process. They spend millions developing and
> protecting a their brand. That said I do believe they are over priced.
>
>> Unfortuantely, his responses are filled with invective about the
>> companies and usually filled with obscenities,
>
> traded with the Church of the AfterMarket led by Pope Burtie.
>
>>both of which tend to make his point of view appear less than valid.
>>Others on this NG have purchased from them for several years and found
>>them to be reliable and their products good.
>>
>
>
> THEN WHY DO SO MANY POSTER ON THIS NG WHO USE AFTERMARKET INKS HAVE SO
> MANY PROBLEMS. MANY MORE PROBLEMS THAN OEM USERS.
>
>>Check out Neil Slade's web site at
>>http://www.neilslade.com/papers/inkjetstuff.html and check out the forum
>>at
>>http://www.nifty-stuff.com/forum/ .
>
> NIFTY AND SLADES SITE HAVE SOME LINKAGE. SLADE DOES HAVE SOME INTERESTING
> STUFF BUT YOU MUST REMEMBER THAT ALL OF THESE PLACES CATER TO AFTERMARKET
> HOBBYISTS.
>
>> Both are almost entirely about Canon printers, aftermarket inks, papers,
>> and tips on maintaining your printer. You can sign on to the Nifty-stuff
>> forum and ask about inks available for your printer in OZ as there may be
>> people from OZ participating. You will also see what products have given
>> people problems.
>>
>
> And you will get the same answers as here because here you have Burt and
> their you have fotofreek. The same thing using two names just like the
> AfterMarket ink can be the same thing using multiple Labels.
>
>> "Wolf Kirchmeir" <wwolfkir@sympatico.ca> wrote in message
>> news:Vvqoe.23951$yG4.1175469@news20.bellglobal.com...
>>
>>>wazzad wrote:
>>>[...]
>>>
>>>>P.S. Be very careful of aftermarket non canon inks, as I had a lot of
>>>>problems with true quality colour reproductions until I found a supplier
>>>>here in Australia who sold very high quality bulk ink for me to refill
>>>>my
>>>>own cartridges.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>[...]
>>>
>>>Thanks for your comments. Nothing like the horse's mouth. :-)
>>>
>>>Can you supply URL for that source of OEM quality inks?
>>>
>>>'Ta muchly.
>>
>>
>>
Anonymous
June 6, 2005 6:15:39 AM

Archived from groups: comp.periphs.printers (More info?)

Burt wrote:

>"measekite" <measekite@juno.com> wrote in message
>news:GeFoe.72$Z44.30@newssvr13.news.prodigy.com...
>
>
>>Burt wrote:
>>
>>
>>
>>>I don't know about your particular printer, but I use MIS inks to refill
>>>OEM cartridges and MIS empty cartridges for my Canon i960.
>>>
>>>
>>I read a report from some poster in one of the news venues that while some
>>luck is had using MIS inks in a Canon i960 there have been clogging issues
>>with the IP Pixma series of printers. I do not know the accuracy of that
>>statement. It might have been just one persons experience just like this
>>writer is one person's experience.
>>
>>
>>
>>>Great color match and no problems so far with almost a year of use. A few
>>>posters on this newsgroup uses Formulabs inks from Alotofthings and have
>>>found this vendor to be very reliable and their inks excellent for his
>>>Canon printers.
>>>
>>>
>>My experience with them was poor. I would not recommend that source.
>>
>>
>
>The only "experience" Measekite had with Alotofthings was when he tried to
>give them some advice on how to run their business and he didn't like their
>response.
>

You are a real shmuck with ears. Even Costco has a suggestion box and
want to hear from their customers so they can improve on what they are
doing. This is a professional approach.

>This statement would be like Measekite telling you he had a poor
>experience with a woman when the "experience" was that she told him to get
>lost when he tried to proposition her. The implication of his statement
>about his experience with Alotofthings is that he did business with them
>

I never said I did business with alotofcrap.

>or
>used their product and found either their service or product poor. Neither
>is true. Simply an attempt to defame them or their product.
>
>

The do not disclose on their website that I can see what they refill the
carts they are selling. If they do provide me with the link. They do
say they sell Sensinent inks in bulk. I have heard Sensinent is about
the only company that formulates decent ink but I have only hear that
from a few members of the AfterMarket Church; two of those members are
singled out by you below.

>>>Look up all the posts you can find from Ron Cohen for this information.
>>>Also check out Taliesyn's posts as he uses aftermarket inks successfully.
>>>I have read that they won't ship to Canada, but I don't know if they would
>>>ship to you in OZ.
>>>
>>>
>>These are part of the religious congregation known as the AFTERMARKET
>>CLUB. About a dozen members who are hobbyists and tinkers that just love
>>the pain in the ass and mess of refilling carts. Of course they all have
>>a very high printload so due to the expense of the high quality OEM choice
>>it is cost justifiable to risk their printer and spend their time. If my
>>printload was that high I would have to investigate a 3rd party source. I
>>would try to find one not mentioned here.
>>
>>
>>
>>>You can email them to check it out. Two other vendors that have told me
>>>they use Formulabs inks in their prefilled carts are Wiredbeans (on ebay)
>>>and Weink (their CRU carts.)
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>WeStink charges $2.00 less than you can get a Canon OEM cart. I do not
>>know about the Epson prices. They used to provide advice on this NG
>>without disclosing that there true motive was to make sales. I do not
>>like this practice.
>>
>>
>
>Measekite has never done business with this firm either. He persists in
>paraphrasing their business name in a defamatory manner. He hasln't read
>their web site accurately, or he is deliberately lying. The cartridges I
>mentioned are the BCI-6 CRU carts which are listed on their website today at
>$2.29. I have never used these carts, but the vendor tells me that they
>are filled with Formulabs inks, the ink that Measekite claims he would use
>if they would put the mfgr name on the box and his print load was higher.
>Ron Cohen and Teliesyn have used Formulabs inks in their canon printers for
>several years with no problems.
>
>
>>I do not know about WiredBeans. THIS LINK WILL PROVIDE THEIR RESELLER
>>RATING.
>>
>>
>
>I did not recommend this firm. I only stated that they told me their carts
>had formulabs ink in them. The moderator of the Nifty stuff forum has
>purchased carts from them and is now testing them.
>
>
>
>>http://www.resellerratings.com/seller5041.html
>>
>>THESE ARE THE COMPANIES THE AFTERMARKET CLUB RECOMMENDS. CAVEAT EMPTOR.
>>
>>
>>ANOTHER PERSON WITH A PROBLEM
>>
>>hi-
>>my i960's nozzles keep getting clogged to the point that i have had to
>>replace the nozze unit once already, and now one of the nozzles on the
>>replacement head is clogged already. i just replaced it about 2 months
>>ago. does anyone know how to clean these nozzles so they will work
>>again? does using aftermarket off brand ink cause this? i hardly ever
>>use it, is that a cause?
>>
>>
>
>This post is the "poster child" for Measekite in attempting to draw a causal
>relationship between non-OEM inks and head damage. It is somewhat confusing
>in that we don't know if the poster has used OEM or aftermaket inks, what
>brand he might have used, or whether his reference to "I hardly ever use it"
>means that he hardly uses the printer, in which case that is the prodominant
>cause of head clogs, or if he hardly uses aftermarket inks. This post was
>thoroughly discussed in a previous thread and no conclusion could be drawn
>because no additional information was provided.
>
>
>>thanx alot
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>> You can email them to verify that the carts you may want to buy are
>>>filled with Formulabs inks. Measekite, the person who responded to you,
>>>has never done business with these firms, nor has he used aftermarket
>>>inks. He mistrusts the vendors and their products and has an especial
>>>dislike for Alotofthings. Every time aftermarket inks are mentioned he
>>>responds with his concerns that the products are not manufactured by the
>>>firms selling them and they are relabeled so you don't know what is in
>>>them.
>>>
>>>
>>That is true. You can have problems with ink bought at one vendor so you
>>buy from another vendor thinking you are makeing a change because the
>>Label is a different name. You than have the same problem. What really
>>happened is that you bought the same ink mfg and formulated from the same
>>place sold under different labels. This practice makes thing difficult to
>>track. Making things worse is you can make 2 purchases from the same
>>place a few months apart and get inks made by different sources all sold
>>under the same label with the quality varying a great deal. Or from batch
>>to batch the quality may be different.
>>
>>OEM's spend a lot of money to insure quality by placing many quality
>>control measures in the process. They spend millions developing and
>>protecting a their brand. That said I do believe they are over priced.
>>
>>
>>
>>>Unfortuantely, his responses are filled with invective about the
>>>companies and usually filled with obscenities,
>>>
>>>
>>traded with the Church of the AfterMarket led by Pope Burtie.
>>
>>
>>
>>>both of which tend to make his point of view appear less than valid.
>>>Others on this NG have purchased from them for several years and found
>>>them to be reliable and their products good.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>THEN WHY DO SO MANY POSTER ON THIS NG WHO USE AFTERMARKET INKS HAVE SO
>>MANY PROBLEMS. MANY MORE PROBLEMS THAN OEM USERS.
>>
>>
>>
>>>Check out Neil Slade's web site at
>>>http://www.neilslade.com/papers/inkjetstuff.html and check out the forum
>>>at
>>>http://www.nifty-stuff.com/forum/ .
>>>
>>>
>>NIFTY AND SLADES SITE HAVE SOME LINKAGE. SLADE DOES HAVE SOME INTERESTING
>>STUFF BUT YOU MUST REMEMBER THAT ALL OF THESE PLACES CATER TO AFTERMARKET
>>HOBBYISTS.
>>
>>
>>
>>>Both are almost entirely about Canon printers, aftermarket inks, papers,
>>>and tips on maintaining your printer. You can sign on to the Nifty-stuff
>>>forum and ask about inks available for your printer in OZ as there may be
>>>people from OZ participating. You will also see what products have given
>>>people problems.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>And you will get the same answers as here because here you have Burt and
>>their you have fotofreek. The same thing using two names just like the
>>AfterMarket ink can be the same thing using multiple Labels.
>>
>>
>>
>>>"Wolf Kirchmeir" <wwolfkir@sympatico.ca> wrote in message
>>>news:Vvqoe.23951$yG4.1175469@news20.bellglobal.com...
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>>wazzad wrote:
>>>>[...]
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>P.S. Be very careful of aftermarket non canon inks, as I had a lot of
>>>>>problems with true quality colour reproductions until I found a supplier
>>>>>here in Australia who sold very high quality bulk ink for me to refill
>>>>>my
>>>>>own cartridges.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>[...]
>>>>
>>>>Thanks for your comments. Nothing like the horse's mouth. :-)
>>>>
>>>>Can you supply URL for that source of OEM quality inks?
>>>>
>>>>'Ta muchly.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>
>
>
>
June 6, 2005 6:15:40 AM

Archived from groups: comp.periphs.printers (More info?)

measekite wrote:


big snip
<------------------------------->


Just what does that drivel you just posted mean?

1) you're not stupid, but just a little slow

2) you're slow and really stupid

3) you can't remember what you just posted

4) you can't remember or even understand what you've just tried to read

5) you took the wrong meds

6) you didn't take your meds

7) all of the above

Now try and learn how to "snip".
Try and learn from others how to respond to others posting by not
quoting each and every single word. I can tell that you're quite easily
confused by everything that appears on your little monitor, but try and
concentrate. I know that can be quite difficult for a person of your
aptitude.
Just try and always remember, even a blind squirrel occasionally finds
an acorn.

Have a nice day. :-)
Frank
Anonymous
June 6, 2005 7:30:18 PM

Archived from groups: comp.periphs.printers (More info?)

measekite wrote:


>
> The word is CAVEAT EMPTOR in this industry.
>



That is a fair comment.

You are correct that the 3rd party ink business has all kinds in it,
including some shady characters who are fly by night (I wonder if that
means they have red eyes)...

However, to be balanced and fairness, you should also mention that some
3rd party companies are, regardless if they indicate the brand of ink
they package or sell or not, long time reliable companies which
accommodate their clients and warrant their inks, and even in some
cases, the printers that use them should an ink related problem occur.
And that, some of these also can provide ink characteristics not
available in OEM inks, or substantial savings.

You have attempted to make this issue into a black and white one, but it
is all about colors and shades of gray. Your warnings don't necessary
help people who are going to buy 3rd party inks for the savings anyway,
or because they wish to use ink types that are not sold for the printer
by the OEM.

People can decide for themselves if they wish to take the gamble on
third party inks for the savings or benefits. Some have poor or
variable color balance, some have poor drying characteristics, and some
fade more rapidly. Most buyers are mainly interested in having a sense
of which companies provide good service, product and support.

This war between the OEM versus 3rd party inks is valueless as it is.
There are no stats to support either side fairly, because they are
confounded by the many brands of inks and design of inkjet printers out
there.

This forum has ended up being taken up by a lot of not that valuable
battles between the two factions each trying to outdo the other, and
then a lot of truly childish name calling that doesn't help the person
who is asking some very legitimate questions "is there a problem with
buying 3rd party inks, or who can I buy them from and get good service
and product and save money?"

The continual bickering doesn't help them, and just makes people turn
away from this forum.

It's also unfair for you to denigrate the name or reputation of a 3rd
party ink vendor just because you happen to not like their website or
how you were personally treated by them, when you asked questions they
were unable or unwilling to answer. When others have legitimate
business dealings with a company, that being they bought product,
received it and used it, that trumps your opinion biassed upon how nice
the website was or how you were treated on the phone, when you likely
were somewhat bombastic toward them, based upon the hostility you have
shown here about the subject.

You certainly have every right to express you POV regarding your
experience with OEM inks. You can speak about the advantages you find
with them, and the peace of mind they supply you, but you cannot speak
about 3rd party inks when you have no personal experience with them.
And people who call you on that don't deserve to be verbally assaulted.

OEM inks work for you because the amount of ink usage over time will
make little difference in your investment overall, and may protect your
printer, if nothing else, you can tell the manufacturer should your
printer ever require servicing, that you used excessively OEM inks.

I do agree that people who use 3rd party inks can't ignore that those
may be the cause or the partial cause to premature failure of some parts
of the printer, or unexpected clogging, and they should not be quite so
quick to blame the manufacturer of the printer. However, clearly, OEM
inks can cause failures in some printers as well, simply due to heads
drying out, or just use over time.

In the end, both schools are correct answers, but for different people
with differing printing habits, use, willing ness to take chances and
financial positions. That's nothing to fight over, and even more
importantly, that's not something that fighting over will resolve into
anything useful.


Art


measekite wrote:


>
> The word is CAVEAT EMPTOR in this industry.
>
k
Anonymous
June 6, 2005 7:31:36 PM

Archived from groups: comp.periphs.printers (More info?)

Frank wrote:

>
>
> big snip
> <------------------------------->
>
>
> Just what does that drivel I just posted mean?
>
> 1) I am stupid, and just a little slow
>
> 2) I am slow and really stupid
>
> 3) you can't remember what you just posted
>
> 4) I can't remember or even understand what I've just tried to read
>
> 5) I took the wrong meds
>
> 6) Ididn't take my meds
>
> 7) all of the above
>
>
>
> Have a nice day. :-)
> Me
!