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Any other than Corsair??

Forum Motherboards & Memory : Memory - Any other than Corsair??

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Ive been looking at the posts in General Homebuilt and it seems that they cant reccomend anything else but Corsair for Asus AM2 mobos.
Then I was looking at the Patriot 2GB (2 x 1GB) DDR2 800 (PC2 6400) CL4 on newegg and even that it does work on Asus boards it has trouble reaching even STOCK speeds.
Then at this OCZ Platinum 2GB (2 x 1GB) DDR2 800 (PC2 6400) CL4 and it was even worst since in many Asus board it wouldnt boot.
Is there any other reliable brand, 6400 or 5400 CL4 (2 x 1GB) that I could use?? as overclockable as Corsairs CL4?? or simply Corsair is the dead end for overclockable memory in Asus AM2 mobos??
Thanks for all your thoughts.

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Hi rwaritsdario,
The specific issue is Voltage - many DDR2 sticks will not POST in dual-channel at the default/stock 1.8v supplied by motherboards.
Cheap (CL5) memory can be found rated @ 1.8v, but CL4 will invariably require ~2.0v and, for example, my OCZ is rated 2.1v @ SPD settings. OCZ actually recommends 2.2v for fastest timings...
But many mobos either will not offer beyond ~1.9v (you're dead right away) or, they will allow increase but come out of the box at only 1.8v default. In this case, you must install only 1 stick of RAM in single-channel (obviously) and hope it POSTS okay @ stock SPD and/or default FSB speed.
My AB9 first started up @ 1.8v (ack!) but was running memory at 1:1 synchronous to FSB, which is only 533DDR - so I was fine :^)
ABit, however, had prominent warnings about this memory business in their 'quickstart' guide...
AMD guys are challenged by the fact that default memory speed is 800DDR on most AM2 rigs, and this initial POST problem is more commonly encountered.
I see people buying inexpensive mobos but they want good fast memory - it doesn't work that way. For any decent memory you must have 2.2v, and this requires a 'real' motherboard. Cheap mobos need cheap memory (they actually require it).
OCZ memory is just fine, I have used lots and never had slightest problem...
But be aware of this Voltage thing, and check your memory out carefully before you invest. If your mobo can't do it, it's semi-useless...
Otherwise, it's easy to get your rig started (with one cheap stick or whatever) and then get into the BIOS and goose the voltage up over 2v.
Note: I am running my OCZ @ 533DDR @ 1.8v @ CL3 dual-channel, not a problem :^)
The ABit AB9 Pro has up to 2.3v available though if req'd, heheh.
I hope this helps...?
Regards

Reply to the_ogs

Just a note to the OP that YMMV. My current Crucial Ballistix DDR2-800 (CL4) works fine at 1.9V on my NI8-SLI MB (but it is Intel, not AMD). My original pair of Ballistix wouldn't POST, but the issue was the SPD and/or the info in it, not voltage, since the DIMMs would work fine if there was also some Crucial RAM in the system to get by the POST.

As a side note the DIMMs from different companies are not the same, even if they all use the Micron D9-derivative chip. This is because:
1) Different companies (and different models within a company) use chips from different quality-testing "bins". The chips may all be of the same design, but because of inhomogeneity in the fab process, some work fine at the highest speeds and lowest voltages, others work fine at higher voltages only, others fail all tests, etc.
2) Different companies have different PC-board designs for their DIMMs.
3) Different companies program their SPDs differently.
4) Different companies/models have different after-assembly specs and testing regimes for their DIMMs.

One reason Corsair seems to be more generally compatible is that many MB manufacturers use it in designing/validating their MBs. To be pretty sure your RAM will work on your MB, check with your MB manufacturer to see if it's on their (limited) "approved" list. Even if not, check with the DIMM manufacturer to see if the model you are getting is appropriate for your MB using their "memory configurator" or equivalent. That way, you know you'll be able to RMA it for a working replacement or refund if it doesn't work on your system.

One final note: the memory business changes from day-to-day, so just because a DIMM sold last week has the same model number as one sold this week, that doesn't mean that there haven't been any changes/improvements to it in the meantime. It's very difficult to find true apple-apple comparisons unless the DIMMs were a matched pair or part of the same lot.

Reply to Mondoman

I know many other brands will work, but from working to working well its a big leap.
Lets take the patriot for example, it boots and everything but its underclocked from what its advertised and sometimes requires you to get a different stick and change the SPD. Also when you try to overclock them the whole thing goes to hell.
And from reading the other reviews from Gskill, OCZ, Crucial, Patriot it comes to the conclusion that some of them will need another stick of lower speeds, and the ones that will boot right up, wont be overclockable at all.
Sadly I dont have any other DRR2 sticks laying around, so in case ild have to get another stick to get it to work, it would be an added cost.

So practically the cheapest and most compatible DDR-800 CAS4 ive found is the Corsair 5400CAS4 wich many reviews say thats is easily overclocked to 6400 and without compatibily issues. Its not stock 6400 but it will clock to the same speeds Patriot or Gskill would (these being stock 6400).

Reply to rwaritsdario

Quote :

...
So practically the cheapest and most compatible DDR-800 CAS4 ive found is the Corsair 5400CAS4 wich many reviews say thats is easily overclocked to 6400 and without compatibily issues. Its not stock 6400 but it will clock to the same speeds Patriot or Gskill would (these being stock 6400).


Maybe, maybe not. It's only guaranteed to run at DDR2-675, and you are unlikely to get the exact same batch of DIMMs that were overclocked in the reviews. Firstly, Corsair may have sent "specially selected" DIMMs to the reviewers; secondly, as it has now been weeks since those review sticks were made, any sticks you would get will be from a different batch.
One key question to ask is "Were the sticks in the review Corsair's fastest products at the time?" If so, they will likely have had more overclock room than now, when Corsair makes a couple of faster-speed DIMMs (now, Corsair likely reserves faster chips for DDR2-800 and DDR2-1066 products, rather than putting them into DDR2-675, which it likely did when DDR2-675 was its fastest-rated product).

Reply to Mondoman

Another part of the problem is the overall maturity of the ram chips. Sure, Micron may be the main supplier for most of the companies, but the finished designs aren't complete. Years ago, there was lots of pc3200 memory that wasn't performing as well as pc2700 memory did. The pc3200 went through development and got faster.

I think the same will happen with the DDR2 memory. As time goes on, the bugs will be worked out and there will be few, if any, problems with memory matching correctly to motherboards or one brand working well while other brands don't work well, or don't work at all. That's one reason why I myself am holding back on rebuilding my computer until next year. I want things to get a bit more stable before I spend a lot of money.

Reply to Sailer

Quote :

...
So practically the cheapest and most compatible DDR-800 CAS4 ive found is the Corsair 5400CAS4 wich many reviews say thats is easily overclocked to 6400 and without compatibily issues. Its not stock 6400 but it will clock to the same speeds Patriot or Gskill would (these being stock 6400).


Maybe, maybe not. It's only guaranteed to run at DDR2-675, and you are unlikely to get the exact same batch of DIMMs that were overclocked in the reviews. Firstly, Corsair may have sent "specially selected" DIMMs to the reviewers; secondly, as it has now been weeks since those review sticks were made, any sticks you would get will be from a different batch.
One key question to ask is "Were the sticks in the review Corsair's fastest products at the time?" If so, they will likely have had more overclock room than now, when Corsair makes a couple of faster-speed DIMMs (now, Corsair likely reserves faster chips for DDR2-800 and DDR2-1066 products, rather than putting them into DDR2-675, which it likely did when DDR2-675 was its fastest-rated product).

The reviews im talking about are the reviews on newegg lol
And im aware of that but I checked the reviews and it seems like from several dates theyre overclockable near 6400 at least at CL5. But again its a risk for the cheaper price, not a warranty.

Reply to rwaritsdario

Yes Sailer is right, these are temporary matters and these products will get better @ 1.8v (and less expensive too).
But these are important matters and I don't see a lot of memory talk in the forums about these new types of memory...
Buncha AMD guys (me too), you can tell, LoL
But the concept of Latency as 'delay' and MHz as 'per second' and the fact they are inversely propotional seems simple, but not maybe for n00bies or my best buddy the bus driver, right? LoL

Quote :

So practically the cheapest and most compatible DDR-800 CAS4 ive found is the Corsair 5400CAS4


Y'know, that stuff is reasonably inexpensive and requires only 1.8v too - that's what I shoulda got (since I'm not using my 800MHz).
Anyway, all you senior members are a wealth of information, they are lucky to have you here...
@ Mondoman
We were discussing old 3.3 and 5v powersupplies right?
I read your info, it made sense.
Regards

Reply to the_ogs

Glad the historical stuff sounded coherent! I never got around to part 2 dealing with the PWMs on modern MBs, oh well.
So far w/DDR2, most of the diffs are matters of a few percent, and if you're patient, you can eventually get incompatibility problems solved (w/major brand DIMMs, at least). It's those weeks w/o the computer while RMAs are in progress that is the really annoying part.

Reply to Mondoman

Quote :

The point of getting DDR2-800 4-4-4-12 is so you can run beyond 500Mhz @5-5-4-12
While getting DDR2-667 4-4-4-12 means you're limited to ~400Mhz @5-5-5-12
That's where the price difference is.

Brand does not matter. Tt's the different IC that lies underneth between DDR2-800 4-4-4-12 and DDR2-667 4-4-4-12 of any brand.
Same Brainpower PCB, relatively close binning quality between companies.



I know, but if you COULD overclock the DDR2 800 near that. But all the reviews (on newegg among others) say that you can barely get it passed 400Mhz...


Ill think about the crucial memory someone brought up in the other forum.

Reply to rwaritsdario

Quote :

The potential lies in the IC it uses and that's mostly determined by the rated timings.

Slack timing, more voltage (~2.2-2.3V) and running 1:1 are all that's needed.



got it lol

Reply to rwaritsdario

What wusy is saying here is most definitely so. To add a little to his e-store review comment, you should put very little stock in those reviews, like on newegg. If you look a little closer, a lot of those reviews are posted the same day or within a few days of that person receiving the product. They pop a stick of memory in and it works, and POOF!, it's great stuff. Or they buy a case and it looks cool, and WOW, what a great case! What about the product that you buy that works flawlessly - for two weeks, then dies. You've already read the stellar review, when in fact the product may be garbage. At least here if someone steers you wrong, which does happen occasionally, there is someone else to steer you back right.

Reply to INeedCache
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