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SilenX fans....do they really work?

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September 8, 2006 12:01:35 AM

I've seen the numbers but they just seem too good to be true. Anyone have any experience with SilenX fans? Are they reallythat quiet (and still move air?)

Thx

More about : silenx fans work

September 10, 2006 3:12:49 AM

I would also like to know, because I am seriously considering buying them.
September 10, 2006 3:25:25 AM

Ha, I wish I knew about these fans, if they really are that quiet and efficient. My comp (until it died about two weeks ago) made so much noise at one point my sister thought it was going to blow up.
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September 10, 2006 3:47:35 AM

Quote:
I've seen the numbers but they just seem too good to be true. Anyone have any experience with SilenX fans? Are they reallythat quiet (and still move air?)

Thx


Can you provide a link for them? Thanks.
September 10, 2006 3:55:57 AM

Check SilentPCReview's fan forum here:
http://forums.silentpcreview.com/viewforum.php?f=9

I've never used those fans, but looking at the numbers alone I'm more skeptical than anything. They probably could be pretty quiet, but I don't think they're as quiet as they say.

It's accepted almost everywhere that just breathing is 10dba, going by airflow alone I would venture a guess that their fans are pushing more air than my nasal passages. So 46cfm@11dba@1200rpm doesn't sound right at all.

There are fans that are tested a lot more and hold up to their specs and at considerably less cost (I believe a 120mm silenx is around $24?). Fans like Yate Loon, Nexus and Global Win are ones I'd consider before the Silenx fans. Those 3 fans a great fans, the Global Win and Yate Loons can be had for under $10 (usually around $5-$8) and the Nexus being the most expensive around $16.

From their site you'll also notice they mention nothing of their testing/recording methods. Most valid reviews/tests I've seen measure dba at 1m, so they could very well be recording at 2 or 3m and getting their numbers.
September 10, 2006 4:36:29 AM

Quote:
I've seen the numbers but they just seem too good to be true. Anyone have any experience with SilenX fans? Are they reallythat quiet (and still move air?)


I've put SilenX fans into four cases. In each one, the SilenX fan had lower flow specs than the fan it replaced. In just one of the cases, swapping an inlet and an outlet 12cm fan resulted in a 2C rise in case and CPU temps. I added another 12cm inlet fan and the temps returned to their earlier readings. I did get SPL reductions by using the SilenX fans, but don't expect to be able to subtract the SilenX noise level spec from that of the fan you're replacing and get that much drop, even if your CPU and GPU are water cooled.

On a Thermaltake Armor, I used three 12cm and two 9.2 cm fans in place of TT fans and saw a reduction of about 5dB at a distance one meter from the front of the case. That's quite a bit, but it's not a silent rig by any means. The loudest two noise sources are now the CPU and GPU HSFs.

The problem with SilenX fans is the cost. I bought in bulk and got a price break and they were still pretty angry on the bank account. I have limited experience with other quiet fans, having used some of the Scythe and Panaflo units. They all measure very quiet but the SilenX fans - to my ears - have a less obnoxious tone.
September 11, 2006 3:43:37 AM

Do you honestly think just because the brand name is silent X their products are silent?

My yate loons are quiter and push 2x as much air...
September 11, 2006 4:02:05 AM

Geez....you really tore the OP a new one! He/she just wanted some experience from those that have experienced those fans. Please have some compassion for the novice.

Scythe has some low db fans made buy/manufactured by Sony.
September 11, 2006 4:09:02 AM

Quote:
Do you honestly think just because the brand name is silent X their products are silent?

My yate loons are quiter and push 2x as much air...


Have you personally made measurements to confirm this claim? The quietest 12cm YL fan I can find info on runs at 1200rpm, delivers 45cfm and is listed at 24dB. SilenX has a 12cm fan running at 1400rpm that delivers 90cfm at 18dB. SilenX also has a 12cm fan that delivers 46cfm at 11dB.

Looks like SilenX pwns Yate Loon. All you have to do is pay 2 to 3X the YL price to either get greater cfm at a little less dB or the same cfm at a much lower dB. But your claim looks like total BS.
September 11, 2006 5:46:35 AM

Quote:
look at this article about enermax magnetic/enlobal bearings (17DB)
http://www.bigbruin.com/2006/enlobal_1


From that review:

"A quick search on NewEgg.com shows that other than the Enermax UC-12EB, there isn't another 120mm case fan with more than 37.5CFM at 15-20dBA."

That's because Newegg doesn't sell SilenX... Again, 46cfm, 11dB. SilenX pwns Enermax.
a b K Overclocking
September 11, 2006 9:06:14 PM

Quote:
Do you honestly think just because the brand name is silent X their products are silent?

My yate loons are quiter and push 2x as much air...


Have you personally made measurements to confirm this claim? The quietest 12cm YL fan I can find info on runs at 1200rpm, delivers 45cfm and is listed at 24dB. SilenX has a 12cm fan running at 1400rpm that delivers 90cfm at 18dB. SilenX also has a 12cm fan that delivers 46cfm at 11dB.

Looks like SilenX pwns Yate Loon. All you have to do is pay 2 to 3X the YL price to either get greater cfm at a little less dB or the same cfm at a much lower dB. But your claim looks like total BS.

But those are just specs. Any company can lie or mislead people with fake specs. Until a site like www.silentpcreview.com or www.madshrimps.be does a review of SilenX fans I prefer to use fans that have been tested to be quiet. I'll choose Yate Loons or Nexus over SilenX any day of the week.
September 11, 2006 9:27:52 PM

Quote:
Do you honestly think just because the brand name is silent X their products are silent?

My yate loons are quiter and push 2x as much air...


Have you personally made measurements to confirm this claim? The quietest 12cm YL fan I can find info on runs at 1200rpm, delivers 45cfm and is listed at 24dB. SilenX has a 12cm fan running at 1400rpm that delivers 90cfm at 18dB. SilenX also has a 12cm fan that delivers 46cfm at 11dB.

Looks like SilenX pwns Yate Loon. All you have to do is pay 2 to 3X the YL price to either get greater cfm at a little less dB or the same cfm at a much lower dB. But your claim looks like total BS.

But those are just specs. Any company can lie or mislead people with fake specs. Until a site like www.silentpcreview.com or www.madshrimps.be does a review of SilenX fans I prefer to use fans that have been tested to be quiet. I'll choose Yate Loons or Nexus over SilenX any day of the week.

So you haven't made any measurements - you're just making baseless claims about CFM and dB?

Edit: I thought you were wun911 replying. Still, you then claim that SilenX is faking their specs... What are you basing that claim on? Suspicion? I've been making many measurements over the last 8 months and will try to finish off all of my testing and post the results. You may end up eating your fan controller...
a b K Overclocking
September 11, 2006 10:32:31 PM

Quote:


So you haven't made any measurements - you're just making baseless claims about CFM and dB?

Edit: I thought you were wun911 replying. Still, you then claim that SilenX is faking their specs... What are you basing that claim on? Suspicion? I've been making many measurements over the last 8 months and will try to finish off all of my testing and post the results. You may end up eating your fan controller...


No. I'm saying that it is possible that they may be embelishing thier specs to make their product seem better than it actually is. Unless a hardware review site actually tests these SilenX fans in a controlled environment along with other fans, it is impossible to say how well or poorly thier fans stacks up to the competition.

All advertising should be taken with a grain of salt.
September 12, 2006 1:52:59 AM

Quote:
No. I'm saying that it is possible that they may be embelishing thier specs to make their product seem better than it actually is. Unless a hardware review site actually tests these SilenX fans in a controlled environment along with other fans, it is impossible to say how well or poorly thier fans stacks up to the competition.

All advertising should be taken with a grain of salt.


So if the Enquirer says Yate Loon is the best, then we should all open up and swallow? It's always good to look at a variety of opinions, but I don't automatically assume that advertising is a lie.

So tell me, is this review credible?

Is this one credible?

Is this one credible?

How about this review?

Don't like that one either? Then check out this one.

Those were just the first five hits I got on Google when searching "SilenX fan review". I didn't edit out any reviews. What I've been doing in my own lab is looking at the frequency distribution of fan noise and also the kind of microphonics fans generate in PC cases. I'm guessing that the better fan makers do all this and more because the good fans like SilenX have a less obnoxious flavor of sound. The reviewer that characterized it as "whoosh" was pretty accurate.
a b K Overclocking
September 13, 2006 1:12:58 AM

Quote:

So if the Enquirer says Yate Loon is the best, then we should all open up and swallow? It's always good to look at a variety of opinions, but I don't automatically assume that advertising is a lie.


The Enquirer is not a hardware review site.

Companies tends to shed the best light possible on their products. That's not lying (generally), but it is embelishment. For example take LCD monitors, many manufactures have LCDs with response times of 2ms, 5ms or 8ms. Okay, that nice to know, but to the best of my knowledge there is no standardized method used by all the manufacturers to determine response times.

Quote:

So tell me, is this review credible?


I read that review last year when I was doing research on 120mm fans. Obviously the fan is only 80mm but I decided to read back then. Unfortunately, this is a subjective review because there are no instruments used to determine what the actual dBA level. Okay, the reviewer said it is very quiet, but does that mean the fan only produces 11.8/14.4 dBA per the specifications?

Quote:

Is this one credible?


This is another review that I've read last year and again it is a subjective review since no instruments were used to measure the actual dBA level of the fan. Here's a quote from the reveiwer:

Quote:

I also determined that the sound (not noise) level of the iXs appeared to be the same as the 1500RPM Nexus. This _was_ a surprise; in fact, it makes no sense since the 1800RPM iX indisputably pushes more air. I'm saying that subjectively, the sound levels were the same.

But the Nexus is speced at 19dBA and the iX at 14dBA! Wha? In my opinion, SilenX is using a 3D spatial average to determine that 14dBA figure. Fans produce almost all their sound and noise on-axis, with very little of either off-axis.


The reviewer is says that subjectively, both Nexus and the SilenX iX emits
the same level of sound. He is surprised because the Nexus is rated at 19dBA and the SilenX iX is rated at 14dBA. He speculates that SilenX uses a 3D spatial average to determine that 14dBA figure.Fans produce almost all their sound and noise on-axis, with very little of either off-axis.

Quote:

Is this one credible?


There's a quote from the review:

Quote:

I tested the old fashioned way by relying on my sense of hearing to determine which fan generated the most noise. My ear was equally helpful in determining which fan generated the most air flow :) 


Again, there is no way to determine the actual dBA level of fans by merely using ears. But I don't dispute the fact that he is saying the fan is quite.

Quote:

How about this review?


Sigh... Subjective. No instriments have been used to measure dBA levels.

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Don't like that one either? Then check out this one.


Double sigh.... Subjective.

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Once all the fans were running, I noticed the difference in noise immediately. The two 80mm SilenX iXtrema Quiet LED Fans in the back and the 120mm SilenX iXtrema in the front were definitely quieter than the stock Cooler Masters and the slight buzzing sound I used to hear once in awhile near the intake area of the case has disappeared since I installed the SilenX iXtrema Quiet LED Fan with the dampening mounts.


All the above reviews are subjective. No instruments were used to actually determine if the 11dBA or 14dBA ratings SilenX places on their product is accurate.

To reiterate the reviewer's speculation over at Techgage.com:

Quote:

In my opinion, SilenX is using a 3D spatial average to determine that 14dBA figure. Fans produce almost all their sound and noise on-axis, with very little of either off-axis.


I'm not disputing they are quiet fans, but I do wonder if their noise level is accurate to thier printed specs.

--------------------------------------------------------

I am a numbers person. I like to see data. For example, how would you like if CPUs and GPUs were rated subjectively with no numbers and test methodology to back it up.

Is it okay to say "Well, I'm going to buy the Athlon 64 X2 3800+ instead of the Core 2 Duo E6300 because it feels faster" ?

How about "Yeah, I'm gonna buy the X1900GT instead of the 7900GT because it looks faster"?

Quote:
What I've been doing in my own lab is looking at the frequency distribution of fan noise and also the kind of microphonics fans generate in PC cases.


That's the kind of information I'm am looking for; an objective review. Good hard numbers with a description of the test labs conditions and a brief description of the testing methodology.

It would be awesome if you could measure the dBA level at varing distances from the fan. It would be even more awesome if you can perform 3D spatial average testing to determine if Felger Carbon's suspision is correct regarding the 14dBA rating.
September 13, 2006 2:45:59 AM

Eh? This is a good review on the ethics that the top people at SilenX have:
http://forums.silentpcreview.com/viewtopic.php?t=4504&p...
http://forums.silentpcreview.com/viewtopic.php?t=4551
Pretty shady, if their products are so great, why resort to that? Definitely not a company that's getting my business, don't care how good they claim their products to be.

For their low numbers, most companies take measurements in an anechoic chamber from 1m away (front axis). What silenx does is take 3 measurements in an anechoic chamber on 3 axes (front and sides) and averages those out. As you can read in this pdf:
http://www.silenx.com/ixtremaprofans-brochure.pdf

If a fan is fixed on one axis (which I don't know of any PC case fan that oscillates), you're going to get lower values (for noise) on any axis its not fixed on (the sides). So say you get 30dba measuring from the front and 20dba on each side. You get an average of 23dba for the 3 measurements. Is it dishonest? Not necessarily. But I'd be willing to bet that if you measured other products (from other companies) using their testing method, you'd find a lot of products with equal or better numbers. And their products wouldn't look so "awesome".

Point being, I'll stick with Nexus as I've seen legitimate reviews where they are independantly tested with methods that make more sense and that I trust. If you're a SilenX fanboy (no pun intended) good for you, but for most people theres more established and trusted names to go with than SilenX. Have a good day.
a b K Overclocking
September 13, 2006 3:07:16 AM

Quote:
Eh? This is a good review on the ethics that the top people at SilenX have:
http://forums.silentpcreview.com/viewtopic.php?t=4504&p...
http://forums.silentpcreview.com/viewtopic.php?t=4551
Pretty shady, if their products are so great, why resort to that? Definitely not a company that's getting my business, don't care how good they claim their products to be.


Wow. I forgot about all that controversy over at SPCR. It seems like ages since I was last there.
September 13, 2006 3:20:18 AM

Quote:
The reviewer is says that subjectively, both Nexus and the SilenX iX emits
the same level of sound. He is surprised because the Nexus is rated at 19dBA and the SilenX iX is rated at 14dBA. He speculates that SilenX uses a 3D spatial average to determine that 14dBA figure.Fans produce almost all their sound and noise on-axis, with very little of either off-axis.


He also says that the Silenx moves more air than the Nexus. If I have a choice between equal-SPL fans, I'll take the one with more flow.

Quote:
There's a quote from the review:


I tested the old fashioned way by relying on my sense of hearing to determine which fan generated the most noise. My ear was equally helpful in determining which fan generated the most air flow :) 


Again, there is no way to determine the actual dBA level of fans by merely using ears. But I don't dispute the fact that he is saying the fan is quite.

Numbers are cool. I've spent my entire professional career being a measurements specialist. I've even worked extensively in soundproofing and I can tell you this: SPL measurements can be msleading. There are so many factors involved in determining why a certain sound is bothersome and the SPL is just part of the equation. However, most of a random population agrees relatively well when ordering two or three sounds in terms of loudness or the ability to irritate. Even people that claim to have poor hearing often argee exactly with the majority of the test group.

Quote:
All the above reviews are subjective. No instruments were used to actually determine if the 11dBA or 14dBA ratings SilenX places on their product is accurate.


Like I said, those were just the first five reviews puked out by Google. There is at least one review out there with numbers that I ran into last winter. If I get a chance, I'll try to locate it. My memory is that the tester measured higher levels on all fans tested and that the SilenX fan was the quietest of the group and matched the competition's flow. So, back when I was searching for fan reviews, I bought a Silenx 12cm fan, borrowed a Nexus from one friend, a Yate from another and then bought a few more contenders like the Scythe. Then I took them all and a variable power supply into an anechoic chamber with my trusty SPL meter. I took some measurements, but more than that, I took care to LISTEN. I love to generate numbers but more than that, I enjoy the process of interpretation. What stuck out that day was that there were a few that were close in SPL, but the Silenx stood out as being less offensive. This was a bummer because it cost the most.

I also used a flow meter to approximate the flows and found that the advertised numbers agreed very well with the relative measurements I made.

Quote:
I'm not disputing they are quiet fans, but I do wonder if their noise level is accurate to thier printed specs.


See above. A simple SPL measurment is inadquate.

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I am a numbers person. I like to see data. For example, how would you like if CPUs and GPUs were rated subjectively with no numbers and test methodology to back it up.


This supports my point precisely. A year ago, would you rather have had a dual core Intel CPU rather or an AMD for your game box? Measure the clock, the Intel runs faster and many, many buyers looked only at that one number when deciding what to buy. Look at legit CPU reviews. Do reviewers try to make just one measurement of a CPU's performance? No. Numerous benchmarks are run that isolate different performance aspects. Just measuring a dBA is not sufficiently descriptive. That's one reason why I've been piddling with a variety of ways to measure fan noise.

Over a decade ago, I led a project to quiet over a dozen small labs that housed electron microscopes, surface analysis instrumentaiton, etc. Most of these were high vacuum instruments with loud pumping systems and although none of the rooms had an initial SPL above 78 dBA, many were perceived as very stressful environments. After two years of abatement work, all instrument owners were happy with their labs. The funny thing was that the room that got quieted the most by SPL measurement (9dB drop) was perceived to be the closest to a failure in the entire study. That instrument owner chose to go with a material that absorbed low to lower midrange frequencies very well but did not give much high frequency absorption or dispersion.

Quote:
Is it okay to say "Well, I'm going to buy the Athlon 64 X2 3800+ instead of the Core 2 Duo E6300 because it feels faster" ?


Sound is a sense. "Sounding" quieter in a direct comparison is valid, period. An equivalent CPU comparison would be to measure a CPU intensive task with the 3800+ alongside the 6300 - a drag race if you will. That is a totally valid relative measurement and no stopwatch is required. I sold a large Mac purchase to some very stubborn managers by drag racing some image processing apps in front of their team. No stopwatches are necessary when the advantage is 30 to 50% on a 60 second operation. The dropped jaws when the Macs pwned the IBM PCs was absolutely priceless.

Quote:
What I've been doing in my own lab is looking at the frequency distribution of fan noise and also the kind of microphonics fans generate in PC cases.


Quote:
That's the kind of information I'm am looking for; an objective review. Good hard numbers with a description of the test labs conditions and a brief description of the testing methodology.

It would be awesome if you could measure the dBA level at varing distances from the fan. It would be even more awesome if you can perform 3D spatial average testing to determine if Felger Carbon's suspision is correct regarding the 14dBA rating.


Well, I'm worried more about relative loudness and do admit that making an accurate absolute measurement is well beyond my means. More than that, I'm interested in the frequency distribution, beat frequencies, microphonics, etc. 3D spatial distribution? You bet. Too bad I don't have more time to put into this because I have a bunch of STUFF set up in the basement lab and just need to go finish it off. It's not good to take any segment and break the measurements up over time. So for example, all on-axis measurments need to be made on the same day with reps and controls, etc. I'd just gotten started last spring when that POS Antec power supply bit the big one and that pissed me of so much I couldn't deal with it for a while. Maybe this winter I'll get back into it.

Good discussion - many people don't pay much attention to fan noise except to bitch that they are too loud.
a b K Overclocking
September 13, 2006 3:54:29 AM

Quote:
Here's an example of an objective review of fans:

Madshrimp's 120mm Fan Roundup


Isn't there anything in those results that catch your eye (ear)?

Well I'm no engineer so I'm sure there may be somethings that I've messed or would be a red flag to an engineer. Especially an accoustic enginner.

One thing that did catch my attention when I first read the article last year is the noise level in the test room is 32.5dBA. Not exactly quiet in my opinion, I believe that's about as loud as a whisper.

Regarding the results, it's quite obvious that the Titan TDF was left out of the 7.5v chart. But it was included in the 5v chart. Other than that, my untrained eyes do not notice any other aberations.
September 13, 2006 4:08:10 AM

Quote:
Eh? This is a good review on the ethics that the top people at SilenX have:
http://forums.silentpcreview.com/viewtopic.php?t=4504&p...
http://forums.silentpcreview.com/viewtopic.php?t=4551
Pretty shady, if their products are so great, why resort to that? Definitely not a company that's getting my business, don't care how good they claim their products to be.


I remember that thread. Weird sh!t, no doubt. I didn't let it make my purchase decision - I let me ears decide. You can get involved in all that holier than thou crap if you want - I just want a cool and quiet PC.

Quote:
For their low numbers, most companies take measurements in an anechoic chamber from 1m away (front axis). What silenx does is take 3 measurements in an anechoic chamber on 3 axes (front and sides) and averages those out. As you can read in this pdf:
http://www.silenx.com/ixtremaprofans-brochure.pdf

If a fan is fixed on one axis (which I don't know of any PC case fan that oscillates), you're going to get lower values (for noise) on any axis its not fixed on (the sides). So say you get 30dba measuring from the front and 20dba on each side. You get an average of 23dba for the 3 measurements. Is it dishonest? Not necessarily. But I'd be willing to bet that if you measured other products (from other companies) using their testing method, you'd find a lot of products with equal or better numbers. And their products wouldn't look so "awesome".


This is hilarious - you talk about measurements then you make a wager without data. Absofukinlutley hilarious.

Oh, the thing is, there are often 3 or 4 directions of fan noise propogation on a single PC. Measuring off-axis has some validity, especially when it's common knowledge how SilenX gets its numbers. I guess that doesn't matter - you already have your conclusion without requiring real data nor an understanding of what matters WRT noise. Have you personally studied off axis propogation, resonance, etc?

Quote:
Point being, I'll stick with Nexus as I've seen legitimate reviews where they are independantly tested with methods that make more sense and that I trust. If you're a SilenX fanboy (no pun intended) good for you, but for most people theres more established and trusted names to go with than SilenX. Have a good day.


I'm a fan of quiet fans and loud music. If the Turdball Fan Company begins making the best stuff out of compressed cowpies, I'll probably at least check them out. Regarding "trusted names", I'm not taking my PC fan into a bar fight needing it to watch my back side. Even the best fans can die during the lifetime of a PC, so the intelligent user keeps tabs on fan performance. I set up my boxes such that the failure of a single fan will not cook the goose. I've unplugged my CPU HSF to watch the CPU temps and was happy to see that it is a survivable event.
September 14, 2006 5:22:46 AM

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I remember that thread. Weird sh!t, no doubt. I didn't let it make my purchase decision - I let me ears decide. You can get involved in all that holier than thou crap if you want - I just want a cool and quiet PC.
Yeah, I mean it would have nothing to do with credibility of the person, nah not at all. :roll:
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This is hilarious - you talk about measurements then you make a wager without data. Absofukinlutley hilarious.
How so? I made a statement based on what I had in front of me. Sorry I don't believe SilenX has some "super secrect" formula in their fan designs. Then again, I don't recall you backing up anything with hard facts in this thread unless ofcourse "SilenX pwns YL ROFL!!!one" is fact. Oh, but I forgot about the reviews of the guys testing out the 80mm fans and summing it up by; yep, feels like there is more air coming from the Silenx, but they have no LEDs. Great reviews for someone who seems so insistent on having data to back up any and every statement.

What I find hilarious is you have done nothing but quote SilenX's own numbers and post a few lacking reviews to backup your claims, but everyone else's statements are BS. While anything you've said should be taken as fact. Hilarious indeed.
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Oh, the thing is, there are often 3 or 4 directions of fan noise propogation on a single PC. Measuring off-axis has some validity, especially when it's common knowledge how SilenX gets its numbers. I guess that doesn't matter - you already have your conclusion without requiring real data nor an understanding of what matters WRT noise. Have you personally studied off axis propogation, resonance, etc?
Actually no I don't, I've done some reading in the past, but it's not something I've been interested in to look deeper into. Eventually I will most likely have to for school. Gasp, I'm not a science guru. Woes me! I don't think it takes a Ph.D to know when someone is trying to embellish the facts.
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Regarding "trusted names", I'm not taking my PC fan into a bar fight needing it to watch my back side. Even the best fans can die during the lifetime of a PC, so the intelligent user keeps tabs on fan performance.
Oh, you must have misread what I wrote:
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legitimate reviews where they are independantly tested with methods that make more sense and that I trust.
Seems pretty clear that I was referring to reviews I've seen of said fans, not the fans themselves. But hey what do I know.
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I've unplugged my CPU HSF to watch the CPU temps and was happy to see that it is a survivable event.
Well good job. But somehow (with my very limited mental capacity) I've managed to run my cpu fanless as can be seen here:
I can stop all fans and it never overheats. Not sure what fans dying out have to do with anything.
September 14, 2006 6:28:40 AM

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I remember that thread. Weird sh!t, no doubt. I didn't let it make my purchase decision - I let me ears decide. You can get involved in all that holier than thou crap if you want - I just want a cool and quiet PC.
Yeah, I mean it would have nothing to do with credibility of the person, nah not at all. :roll:
If they are really such bad people, I suspect reality will do a number on them. But I just want a quiet fan - I don't want them to come into my home and install them. I worry more about performance than I do about the credibility issues that have you stressed out.

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This is hilarious - you talk about measurements then you make a wager without data. Absofukinlutley hilarious.
How so? I made a statement based on what I had in front of me. Sorry I don't believe SilenX has some "super secrect" formula in their fan designs.
Here's the important point: are your beliefs due to the behavior of some of the employees posting on an Internet forum (gasp! the horror!) or are they based upon measurements and observation? I don't give a sh!t what kinds of fans you buy, but if you want to come here and argue about perceived and measured noise levels, then you should focus on measurements and psychoacoustic observations. Just having a hunch that a fan is no good because an employee posted something you take issue with is not science - it's bias.

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Great reviews for someone who seems so insistent on having data to back up any and every statement.

You have comprehension issues. I'm not the one insisting on having numbers to back up every statement. I'm trying to develop measurements that correlate with what my ears tell me. If you need a dBA number to tell you what you're hearing, then fine. You'll be missing part of the story. Knock yourself out.

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[What I find hilarious is you have done nothing but quote SilenX's own numbers and post a few lacking reviews to backup your claims, but everyone else's statements are BS.

This isn't the first fan thread I've contributed to on Toms. I've posted actual measurement data on a few threads here. If you need real numbers so bad, go look'em up.

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Have you personally studied off axis propogation, resonance, etc?
Actually no I don't, I've done some reading in the past, but it's not something I've been interested in to look deeper into. Eventually I will most likely have to for school. Gasp, I'm not a science guru. Woes me! I don't think it takes a Ph.D to know when someone is trying to embellish the facts.
Last gasp lame flame... Pity you can't come up with something better than that. If you do ever actually study noise abatement and the physics of sound, you'll find that the primary point I've pushed here - that dBA vs CFM data is inadequate - is valid according to experts. Here's a starting point for you and if you pay attention, there are some hints in there that might lead you in the correct direction. Here's another that might help you out. The bottom line really hits some abatement engineers when they make a simple dBA measurement after they have applied an expensive treatment, then the customer complains that one of their other areas that measures louder actually sounds quieter. How can that be? The answer is inthe two links I provided, but since you say it's not something you've been interested to look deeper into, your lack of interest might block your learning ability. That's OK, not everyone is cut out to do experimental acoustics. Maybe you can get a job at the neighborhood burger joint? Report back on if the deep frier measures higher dBA than the shake machine. Overclock the ice maker for extra credit.

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I've unplugged my CPU HSF to watch the CPU temps and was happy to see that it is a survivable event.
Well good job. But somehow (with my very limited mental capacity)
A man's got to know his limitations. Clint would be proud of you.

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I've managed to run my cpu fanless as can be seen here: (snip)I can stop all fans and it never overheats. Not sure what fans dying out have to do with anything.

Overclock it high enough and maybe you'll then understand, but I doubt it. You're doing a good job of proving your lack of knowledge - keep up the good work!
September 14, 2006 7:28:44 PM

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If they are really such bad people, I suspect reality will do a number on them. But I just want a quiet fan - I don't want them to come into my home and install them. I worry more about performance than I do about the credibility issues that have you stressed out.
I apologize, the concept is clearly over your head, forgive me. But it's an observation, don't get your panties all wrinkled over it.
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Here's the important point: are your beliefs due to the behavior of some of the employees posting on an Internet forum (gasp! the horror!) or are they based upon measurements and observation?
Actually I only found that thread a few weeks ago. But I've thought for a while that SilenX's numbers are misleading. Are you by chance a SilenX employee? Or just passionately justifying the price you spend on the fans? I know Mac users defend the prices they pay for gear.
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You have comprehension issues. I'm not the one insisting on having numbers to back up every statement. I'm trying to develop measurements that correlate with what my ears tell me.

No, you're not insisting;
Your response to wun911:
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Have you personally made measurements to confirm this claim? The quietest 12cm YL fan I can find info on runs at 1200rpm, delivers 45cfm and is listed at 24dB. SilenX has a 12cm fan running at 1400rpm that delivers 90cfm at 18dB. SilenX also has a 12cm fan that delivers 46cfm at 11dB.

Looks like SilenX pwns Yate Loon. All you have to do is pay 2 to 3X the YL price to either get greater cfm at a little less dB or the same cfm at a much lower dB. But your claim looks like total BS.

In response to jaguarskx:
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So you haven't made any measurements - you're just making baseless claims about CFM and dB?

In response to me:
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This is hilarious - you talk about measurements then you make a wager without data. Absofukinlutley hilarious.

Nope, you're not insisting at all.

The only time I made a statement about having numbers to back up your claims, was when you called everyone elses statements/opinions BS, then you go on to link reviews that hold no more weight then the statements in this thread.
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This isn't the first fan thread I've contributed to on Toms. I've posted actual measurement data on a few threads here. If you need real numbers so bad, go look'em up.


Never said I needed numbers, I think my response above about me insisting on numbers takes care of this.
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The answer is inthe two links I provided, but since you say it's not something you've been interested to look deeper into, your lack of interest might block your learning ability. That's OK, not everyone is cut out to do experimental acoustics. Maybe you can get a job at the neighborhood burger joint?
Thank you for the links. But yeah because I haven't studied acoustics yet probably means I have no interests in math or physics. Funny how when someone learns something before another person, they think it makes them special. For a highly educated person such as yourself, you make some very bad assumptions. But good try though.
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Overclock it high enough and maybe you'll then understand, but I doubt it. You're doing a good job of proving your lack of knowledge - keep up the good work!
This is probably my favorite statement from you yet. What the hell is overclocking until it fails going to prove? WOW! It doesn't matter how many fans and at what speed their spinning an OC is going to fail at some point. If I had intensions of OCing, my setup would reflect that. But I based my setup on what it would take to cool the system adequately while keeping noise to a minimum. I don't know about you but my cpu has never jumped up in speeds and cause the system to fail. It's like saying I should start a fire in my house to see if the AC can cool the house adequately.
September 14, 2006 7:52:01 PM

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I apologize, the concept is clearly over your head, forgive me. But it's an observation, don't get your panties all wrinkled over it.


Take you own advice. You've chosen to take a bunch of snippets out of context in an attempt to prove your moot point. I've been very clear in this thread that SPL measurements are just part of the whole. One thing you missed is that I asked people in this thread questions about measurements and about how they come to conclusions. For example, answer this:

Have you ever used, measured or otherwise tested a SilenX fan?

Point being, I bought a whole bunch of different fans to use and measure myself. I took the time and expense to set up a test rig in the basement specifically to measure aspects of fan performance. It's an area I've piddled in for years and have helped other researchers to have comfortable work environments because it improves productivity and attitude. And you've done what? Read a few formuz?

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No, you're not insisting;
Your response to wun911:Have you personally made measurements to confirm this claim?


See, you missed it. I asked him a leading question to see if he simply read numbers or if he actually got down in the trenches and worked with the product.

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In response to jaguarskx:
So you haven't made any measurements - you're just making baseless claims about CFM and dB?


See? That also was a question. Wipe the fog from your glasses, blind boy.

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The only time I made a statement about having numbers to back up your claims, was when you called everyone elses statements/opinions BS, then you go on to link reviews that hold no more weight then the statements in this thread.


I'm trying to see if anyone out there has actually done their own comparisons. In the big picture, fans are pretty cheap - one of the least expensive components in a PC. People tend to buy based on bias - as I suspect you do. I like to measure things and see how they compare to other published data. I also like to invent new ways to measure phenomena, hopefully to find new ways of correlating data. And you? You like to read aboud bad fan guys on forumz, right?

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Thank you for the links. But yeah because I haven't studied acoustics yet probably means I have no interests in math or physics.


Then you might want to spend your time gossiping about bad fan guys on the forums rather than saying stupid sh!t about things you have no background in.

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Funny how when someone learns something before another person, they think it makes them special.


Hey, I gave myself the handle because I've had my ego handed to me from a shredder basket too many times. So yer barkin' up the wrong tree, little doggie!

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For a highly educated person such as yourself, you make some very bad assumptions.


Such a claim requires proof. You have none.

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This is probably my favorite statement from you yet. What the hell is overclocking until it fails going to prove?


Please do your homework before urinating on your keyboard like that.

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It's like saying I should start a fire in my house to see if the AC can cool the house adequately.


That's pretty funny. Do you work for Yate Loon?
September 14, 2006 9:24:56 PM

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Point being, I bought a whole bunch of different fans to use and measure myself. I took the time and expense to set up a test rig in the basement specifically to measure aspects of fan performance. It's an area I've piddled in for years and have helped other researchers to have comfortable work environments because it improves productivity and attitude.
So you say. You keep saying that but I have yet to see anything. Should be pretty simple for someone of your capacity to do.
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And you've done what? Read a few formuz?
Yep that's all I do, I've been registered here since 2002 and have a little over 450 posts. You've been here for 6 months and have 2500 posts, hmm.
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See, you missed it. I asked him a leading question to see if he simply read numbers or if he actually got down in the trenches and worked with the product.
And the bottom line is that's all you've been doing in this thread. You're quoting numbers, nothing more.
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And you? You like to read aboud bad fan guys on forumz, right?
Again, 2500 posts in 6 months.
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Then you might want to spend your time gossiping about bad fan guys on the forums rather than saying stupid sh!t about things you have no background in.
Hmm, and I thought I was being sarcastic with this statement:
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Thank you for the links. But yeah because I haven't studied acoustics yet probably means I have no interests in math or physics.
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Such a claim requires proof. You have none.
No, you did a pretty good job of proving it for me. You assume because I have not studied acoustics at your level yet, I have no interest and do not study mathematics or physics. Like I said good job on that assumption.
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Please do your homework before urinating on your keyboard like that.
Well, that's not really the answer I was looking for from someone of your calibre. But there's always hope.
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That's pretty funny. Do you work for Yate Loon?
? My statement about the fire has as much to do with any of this as your statement about OCing until failure.

Just for giggles I took your advice:
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I've posted actual measurement data on a few threads here. If you need real numbers so bad, go look'em up.
Care to show those threads? Because searching I haven't found any where you post your data. Maybe some demented forum mod deleted those threads. And the search only brings up posts from July to the present (must've been before July where you made those profound posts eh?). :roll:

While you make some good posts here and there, I found that usually you like to go on and on about the importance of data and you run all these super secret experiements and your saving the world, etc, etc. I see who I'm dealing with now after going through your posts and while you might have some knowledge you sound like little more than a glorified google whore.
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Hey, I gave myself the handle because I've had my ego handed to me from a shredder basket too many times. So yer barkin' up the wrong tree, little doggie!
Well your past posts (this thread included) would paint a different picture of your ego. I've never claimed to be some great scientist that's out to save the world, unlike yourself. Only thing I've been saying from the start is the numbers are misleading. Sorry if you can't handle that. Anyways I'm done with this, pretty boring. Thank you and take care, I had fun.
September 14, 2006 11:57:12 PM

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Yep that's all I do, I've been registered here since 2002 and have a little over 450 posts. You've been here for 6 months and have 2500 posts, hmm.

What's the point of that analysis? Actually, I have many more posts than that when you add in my previous account.

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Just for giggles I took your advice:I've posted actual measurement data on a few threads here. If you need real numbers so bad, go look'em up.
Care to show those threads? Because searching I haven't found any where you post your data.
You're the student - do your homework. But if you'd care to make a wager that would make the searching worth my time, I'll pull up a couple with real data.

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While you make some good posts here and there, I found that usually you like to go on and on about the importance of data and you run all these super secret experiements and your saving the world, etc, etc.

No need for you to lie. I've never claimed to do anything approaching saving the world. But I do tell the truth so you can try to learn from that.

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I've never claimed to be some great scientist that's out to save the world, unlike yourself.

Quit spewing lies. Show one example of where I claimed to be out to save the world.

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Only thing I've been saying from the start is the numbers are misleading. Sorry if you can't handle that. Anyways I'm done with this, pretty boring. Thank you and take care, I had fun.

No wager? Bummer - you wanted to bet earlier and now that you have a chance to make money, you slink away. Are you a chicken? If the numbers are misleading to you, perhaps it's because you can't comprehend that complex phenomena are not so easily described by a couple of simple measurements.

Edit: People that do research in industry are not at liberty to publish results without legal permission from their employer. I can't post most of the noise abatement work I've done because I don't legally own it. As a hobby, I have been doing some work with quiet fans and case interactions at home and have posted some of the peripheral results here. I'm not claiming that the stuff I've posted is any big deal - it's just a few numbers - but they are real measurement data. The real meat and potatoes of my home project haven't been posted here for two reasons. First, the work is incomplete. I like to feel comfortable with conclusions about measurements before I publish and to get there, I take the time to do loads of reps and look at more variables than may be economically prudent. the bottom line here is that I'm patient, especially when there's no reason to rush. I mean, this isn't very exciting stuff and it doesn't have any really important implications - it's just a hobby. Second, if I do get around to finishing the project off (work has been in the way for months) I haven't decided what to do with it. There are contributors here like Function9 that b!tch like a dog yet they really have nothing to contribute so I need to decide if it's worthwhile sharing. F9 admits to not having background yet when someone that does tries to communicate something real, the best he can do is snip to change context and post flat-out lies in an attempt to discredit. I take pride in the science I do and think working in the field is a great way to make a living. The point I've tried to make over and over here is that SPL and CFM measurements are not adequate. If F9 has his head so far up his ass that he can't learn from people that have years of real-world experience, that's his problem.
a b K Overclocking
September 19, 2006 5:57:00 PM

What's your opinion on the relative loudness of regular opaque fans vs. the hard plastic LED fans?

In general, I think opaque fans are quieter because as air pressure builds up on the leading edge of the blades, they are flexible enough to slightly bend to delay/reduce the build up of air turbulance. Therefore, less noise is generated. So, if an "average" opaque fan were to be compared to an "average" LED fan, the LED fan would be louder at the same RPM. That assume all other specs are the same (motor, ballbearing/sleeves, etc.).

Is that assumption within the ballpark or totally out in left field?
September 20, 2006 1:23:09 AM

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What's your opinion on the relative loudness of regular opaque fans vs. the hard plastic LED fans?

In general, I think opaque fans are quieter because as air pressure builds up on the leading edge of the blades, they are flexible enough to slightly bend to delay/reduce the build up of air turbulance. Therefore, less noise is generated. So, if an "average" opaque fan were to be compared to an "average" LED fan, the LED fan would be louder at the same RPM. That assume all other specs are the same (motor, ballbearing/sleeves, etc.).

Is that assumption within the ballpark or totally out in left field?


I've not seen a direct comparison on PC fans. For sure, the frequency vs. energy decay plots look different for materials of different hardness, but the mechanical design also has a huge effect over those plots. I used to have access to engineering data for high end composite abatement materials like glass/polymer mats. When that research group did their initial dev testing, they used rubbery binders made of silicones, polyurethanes and EPDM rubber all the way up through brittle polymers like polystyrene. What was most distinctive was how the glass type (hollow sphere vs. hollow fiber, pore diameter vs. wall thickness, etc) affected the frequency absorption in a broadband way and the binder affected the resonances of the part as energy was dissipated.

To get more directly at your point, I would not be surprised if some of the soft plastic opaque fans have less irritating resonances and thus sound quieter even if they are at the same measured SPL. I emailed SilenX a while back and asked if they had ever made fans out of other plastics but didn't get a reply. Regardless, the physical shape of the fan has to have a major impact on the frequency distribution of the sound the fan generates. So a fan that works well at 1000 RPM might not work as well as a different shape at 3000 RPM (with all other variables held constant) just because of resonances that change with RPM. It would be a fun area to work in because there are so many design aspects that contribute to the net performance.
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