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Trying to run video Editware

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September 8, 2006 9:34:33 PM

Hello. This is my first post. I'm a filmmaker trying to use a new (for me) app on my 2 yr old PC. I am getting nowhere!

Installed several different video edit apps: Sony Vegas, Cyberlink, Windows movie Maker. Inst. new firewire card (Zonet 2400) on PCI .Have 1.5 Gigs of Ram on a 2.5 Mhz Celeron D. Cannot capture video beyond random frames. Capture for two minutes, plays back 2 seconds. Ive tried 2 cameras, different HDs, inc new, empty WD 250 Gig drive, different cables. No good. Is my CPU wrong for this task? Or could it be a driver issue? My video card is a dual Jaton 198PCI w/ 64MB memory running 2 CRT monitors.

I have tried different tapes, apps (trial versions),cameras, cables, inputs on the card, and destination drives. Everything but the F/W card and the PCU.

I have turned off Norton, and no difference. The capture window goes from still frame to frame, dropping frames by the hundred, CPU perf is at 100%, machine is slow.

Any help or info is much appreciated.

More about : run video editware

September 8, 2006 10:21:14 PM

A few questions need to be answered first:

what operating system do you have loaded?

have you ever been able to capture video from your cameras with this
system?

I've never heard of anyone video editing with a celeron but that doesn't mean it can't be done.
September 8, 2006 10:25:57 PM

your CPU and Vid card are really weak for editing of any kind, do u mind if I ask what sore of motherboard you have, or if your system is custom built because then we can probably help recommend something new for you to get if you are willing to!

Best,

3Ball
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September 8, 2006 10:27:06 PM

Sorry: I'm running XP Home SP2.
I have never tried to run video from a DV camera before, BUT I have successfully edited DVD files on this PC. They are compressed about 5x more than DV, I think, so owuld be easier to handle.
They were cut with another app, which was very primitive, but worked.
September 8, 2006 10:29:21 PM

Don't know what motherboard I have. This is a stock Presario S6010V.
September 8, 2006 11:24:37 PM

You should check the box of the software you are using they will post a recommendation of what the system requirements are.

Sony Vegas is basically an all software editor that doesn't require an expensive hardware card. However, this software needs you equipment to be more towards the upper end to operate properly.

Pretty much any recent cpu in the Athalon series or Pentium4 series should be adequate enough. This does not include lower end cpu's like celeron, sempron etc.

You will most likely have to rebuild your rig to something more up to date.

If you intend to do this I would avoid any VIA chipsets. You can go to VideoGuys [www.videoguys.com] they typically have a good amount of info that you can follow to avoid costly mistakes. Good luck.

However, you never stated what drive you are attempting to capture to. You might be able to pull it off by rearranging your capture disk.

Use C: as your boot disk only + windows page file. Also set windows to never shut down, or hibernate... as this can cause problems when you try to capture for extended periods of time.

Use D: as your capture disk and place this disk on the secondary master channel set to master if you are using ATA disks which I suspect. This would be your best shot. Make sure you are using 80wire conductor cables for your ATA hard drives.

But it's really in your best interest to upgrade... your machine is likely not fast enough to do this.
September 9, 2006 12:09:34 AM

I thought the Celeron Ds were adequate for non-branchy code like video editing applications.
September 9, 2006 1:00:57 AM

Um, before you go all upgrade crazy on your computer I'd suggest investigating whether your firewire card is properly installed and working. I've been using firewire to transfer video into several different computers since 1999 (when I first started with a Celeron 400 + 256 megs of Ram) and the only problems I've had were with bad firewire drivers and, in a couple of cases, flaky firewire cards.
September 9, 2006 11:28:56 AM

editing video on the computer is one of the most demanding things you can do on a computer.

Your computer is only as good as it's weakest link. If it has multiple weak links... all of them will surface when trying to do a demanding a task like video editing.
September 9, 2006 5:14:55 PM

Thanks for all the responses.
Re: the firewire response, I will reseat it and recheck, but I assumed it was OK because the software was controlling the camera, slowlybut adequately, thru the F/W card.

I am capturing to my brand new WD 250 Gig ext drive thru a usb2 cable. i tried a capture to my C drive and got the same problem: random frames and audio, stuttering preview image during capture with no audio monitoring.
Everything except the CPU is new except the CPU, so that's why I suspect it is the culprit.
September 9, 2006 5:35:56 PM

ok being that your computer is so old the USB is probably 1st generation which is too slow for video. IMO.

I would pick up a cheap IDE [ATA] HardDrive and connect it to your IDE port off the Motherboard... set it to master.

Any cheap IDE 7500rpm drive will do pretty much. They are even faster than USB 2.0 spec. You can get one on sale for under $100 typically....

allow 13GB per hour for your project. For me personally I could usually complete a 1.5 HR project easily on a 100GB drive. This would include graphic overlays, effects, transitional segments with multiple layers and various encodes ranging from DVD to mpeg1 and Windows Media... and this is taking into consideration of only using 80% of the drive.

Even if this doesn't work you can always reuse the hard drive in your next rig. Working with video you always need more disk space. You can then use the USB drive you have now for complete works, storage of compressed video. It will handle this much better than Raw DV.
September 9, 2006 5:36:54 PM

I guess maybe I've been lucky so far but I've never experienced dropped frames or buggy capture on the three systems I've built for editing. The first was a P3-933, the second was an Athlon XP2400, the latest is a P4D-805 (don't bug me it was a cheap build with most parts coming from the P3-933).

The only capture card I've used was from Adaptec, the other capture device was built in to the DFI MOBO I used for the XP2400 (which was nicely upgraded to a Sempron3000 for about $50, it had twice the cache as the XP2400).

My first guess would be the Compaq MOBO, since most systems makers like to be proprietary with their hardware, it may not play well with other generic hardware.
September 10, 2006 1:17:27 AM

all the processors you named were toward the higher end during their reign... so that's probably how you pulled it off.

Hell I could capture on a pentiumIII 350 but of course I had the BX440 and that combo was pretty sweet at the time.

It should be possible but everything else needs to be in good shape to pull it off.

This comes down to memory, processsor, Hard drive subsystem, motherboard. If one of these areas struggles the whole system will.
September 10, 2006 1:42:37 AM

I agree with you on this...I use PremierPro and the minimum requirements, system wide, they suggested for ver 6.0 back in 2002 was a P3 800 Megs along with 512 megs of Ram. And, that was not even considering HD specs for editing. Although Varicam is using other non-linear editing systems, the specs come down to basic minimum requirements.

I believe that upgrading the CPU and maybe the mobo as well, might help you resolve your system unresponsiveness when vid editing.
September 10, 2006 3:38:30 PM

I had the box open Looking for an AGP slot (it had none) and saw the MOBO was stamped "MS-6577 Ver 4.1". I have no experience building PC's, and since it seems the consensus is that the heart of this one is just not good enough for video editing, maybe I need another for that purpose.

I don't think I will replace the MOBO and CPU -- too many things I could screw up.
What do you guys reccomend for a good video editing platform for under $700?
September 10, 2006 5:52:43 PM

well there are varying degrees of good. I am more familiar with Adobe Premiere so all my figures are based from that. Premiere Pro requirements are most likely higher.


Adobe Premiere... typically recommends Intel pentium4 3.0 GHZ or greater and 1 GB ram. They don't recommend AMD, but I have been able to do it with AMD cpu as well.

These requirements are just CPU / Memory requirements. If you don't meet these requirements then expect less in terms of what you can / can't do.

Next comes HardDrive setup. This is important and you should think long and hard on how you plan to do this. It is in your best interest to capture to a disk that is seperate from your boot disk. Keep the page file on the boot disk etc. Make sure windows will not hibernate etc. You may even need to adjust the page file as well. Keep in mind what you will do with completed projects because you will obviously need to use your capture disk again.

Think in terms of work flow... there are many options to having a caddy-bay system in which you have removeable drives or fixed drives and you dump your files to USB or FireWire drive and the list goes on.

If you are not computer saavy, there is no time like the present to learn. Otherwise you'll spend countless $$ to have someone do it for you.

Because most of the push right now is to Software based systems... IE. Premiere Pro, Sony Vegas, Cannopus Edius, Pinnacle Liquid motion or whatever it's called...

it is in your best interest to buy the fastest rig you can afford... certain things you will not be able to skimp on and if you don't build the system yourself you take the chance that the system builder will just throw any cheap MotherBoard in there and that "could" be the do or die point that makes your system crawl or fly.

Additionally don't forget a good PSU. When dealing with computers you generally get what you pay for and you can control this much better if you do it yourself. There are many guides on the interenet to help you and the big thing... "don't get in a rush and RTFM before you start!"
September 10, 2006 7:18:04 PM

It sounds like your USB drive is the bottleneck. If you can capture to an interior, non-C harddrive, that would be preferable. If you don't have another interior drive, go out and buy one, and just put it in. Probably one of the easiest upgrades you can do. Open the case, find the IDE ribbon cable, plug it into the drive, find a power adapter, plug that into the drive. Boot up, and go. (you may have to format the drive if it's not already)
September 11, 2006 12:16:58 PM

Well I would have thought that the Celeron D would have enough oomph to pull video over firewire, might take a little extra time to do the rendering afterwards but left to it's thing it should be OK.

Before splashing out on a new system it is certainly worth investigating a bit further. Certainly if you can use a separate hard disc for your video files do so, there's a lot of information to be shifted afterall. I'd rather go with a seperate internal drive rather than an external USB one, I think you have USB2 though so that should suffice (I'm just old fashioned and don't trust USB for that sort of thing).

I'm just wondering if there is a clash with some shared resources. I downloaded a S6000 series manual from HP and what a load of rubbish that is, not much useful information in there regarding which PCI slot shares resources with what. You can go into the system control panel and it may reveal what is sharing. Whilst you are there make sure that your drives are working in DMA mode and not PIO.

It may well be worth trying to move your firewire card to another slot to see if it improves things, just in case it is sharing with your USB controller or videocard. Just as an experiment it may be worth unlugging your dual head PCI video card (to remove that chunk of bandwidth and free up an IRQ) and seeing what happens with the integrated AGP video. I know this isn't what you're after, just trying to locate where the problem could be.

Sorry if this is a bit jumbled, I should have got my thoughts a rather more organised. Still, it's worth exploring the free options first.

Karl
September 11, 2006 3:30:51 PM

Thank you all for your thoughtful replies.

I have cleared the C drive to about 60% od capacity and will try capturing to that. If that doesn't work, I'll install a second internal drive.

I cant determine what is being shared from the system panel, but the drivers are from 2001. should I click to upgrade them or leave them alone? These are for the MOBO and other basic devices. All are listed as working correctly.
!