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PD805 vs E6300

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September 10, 2006 11:46:23 PM

ok, i think im going insane, i have looked at what seems like billions of possible ways to build myself a new computer.

i eventually decided to go on the cheap, but good enough side of things with
PD805
2GB ram
X800XL
Case with 450W PS
lowish end mobo, HD
for about $690 CDN

but then i was looking around, and Calced out the E6300 at about $250 more, now i know everybody is probably going to give me the whole, go with the E6300, money grows on trees routine, and i really do want too.
unfortunatley i cant find enough evidence to justify it to myself.

so can anybody give me some good quantitative data, which proves i will be getting my money's worth, particularly their overclocking potential with stock HSF.

More about : pd805 e6300

September 10, 2006 11:56:23 PM

there is no e6300 on the charts though :( 
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September 11, 2006 12:05:21 AM

He means your current setup. Assuming you will be OCing the 805D, it will take all of Quebec Hydro to power it. Pick a good PS in the 550w range.
September 11, 2006 12:28:52 AM

I will say it depends on what you want to do, and how? are you using it mostly for gaming? or for encoding? are you planning to overclock? if you are not planning to oc then the d805 is a bad deal, if you are using it for games the d805 oc'd is a good deal and i'd say go with that and try a for a better video card, or how about a D915 those cant be much more then a d805 keep in mind if you are planning to oc mobo selection is important as well.
my one question is your ram what are you looking at and again what are you using the system for and on a budget 1gb should be good free's u money for other things
regardless other people are right if you go with a d805 will need a better psu.
September 11, 2006 12:40:16 AM

Fry's electronics this week has E6300+MB combo for $199.00. It's an agp board but they've got the 7600GS for $199 or something. They usually have the 805+Mobo for $99.00 here. Good luck. I just went from the 805->945->E6300. So far this core duo gave me the smoothest (sp?) Oblivion experience yet. Keeps the FPS around 20-30 in my setup. Both the 805 and 945 would experience an nagging drop to 10-11 FPS, hence the change.

Good luck buddy..
September 11, 2006 12:54:46 AM

Whats the link for that deal ?
September 11, 2006 1:14:48 AM

alas, i cannot purchase from frys

and in general use, did you notice a difference between the 805/945 vs E6300 ?

i guess i can go with 1 GB of ram, and upgrade after, what does 2T command rate mean?

and the X800 XL is $130 CDN so i figure it is a good deal

how is kingwin for a powersupply, im looking for cheap, and will i need the power supply if i dont overclock to 4 GHz, im looking at more like 3.33 GHz
September 11, 2006 1:28:35 AM

Quote:


and the X800 XL is $130 CDN so i figure it is a good deal


oh god, let me guess, canada computers.......i bought my x800xl there also, runs oblivion ok with my setup.
September 11, 2006 1:57:19 AM

Quote:
alas, i cannot purchase from frys

and in general use, did you notice a difference between the 805/945 vs E6300 ?


Honestly, I would have to say that the 805 and 945 seemed to perform the same. the Reinstall of Windows on the three systems all went about the same rate. I have noticed that program installs are faster. I also like the speed now. I usually click on something and wait. Now I click on something and BAM it's already up or just about up. The 805 didn't seem to have that even when it was freshly installed. I just figured it was slow cause i had a 3.2E P4 w/HT. That was screaming processor.... Ah i miss her... This new one is something else. I wish i had the $379.00 to get the E6400 w/ Gigabyte MOBO combo. That was sweet too. Maybe Next year when the Quad Core things come out I can move up. Also those other processors did seem to run hotter than this C2D. If you're totally on the fence I go forward and say get the C2D.
September 11, 2006 2:17:08 AM

Quote:
ok, i think im going insane, i have looked at what seems like billions of possible ways to build myself a new computer.

i eventually decided to go on the cheap, but good enough side of things with
PD805
2GB ram
X800XL
Case with 450W PS
lowish end mobo, HD
for about $690 CDN

but then i was looking around, and Calced out the E6300 at about $250 more, now i know everybody is probably going to give me the whole, go with the E6300, money grows on trees routine, and i really do want too.
unfortunatley i cant find enough evidence to justify it to myself.

so can anybody give me some good quantitative data, which proves i will be getting my money's worth, particularly their overclocking potential with stock HSF.


I suggest you take a calculator and start to get some numbers. Just out of curiousity i´d like to know after how much hours the conroe gets cheaper than a Pentium D 805 running at adequate processing power (probably clocked to nearly 3,4 ghz or so) considering the power costs. I´m certain the 805 is a good in-between for a few months, but if you consider using that computer for extended periods it´s just too expensive - at least that´s what i think. As i said, it would be interesting to know the point in time where both processors are equal in cost.
September 11, 2006 2:27:05 AM

E6300 at stock is at least equally fast or in most cases faster than Pentium D 930 which is already significantly faster than D 805.
Another thing to consider, E6300 is a lot easier to cool and power than overclocked D 805.
So you get a no-brainer situation here, go for E6300.
September 11, 2006 2:31:37 AM

Quote:
E6300 at stock is at least equally fast or in most cases faster than Pentium D 930 which is already significantly faster than D 805.

I'm pretty sure my 805D running at 3.68GHz is faster than a Pentium D 930 running at only 3.0 GHz.
September 11, 2006 2:41:15 AM

OK, assume an OC 805D is using 160w flat-out, and an E6300 80w flat-out (back-of-the-envelope numbers here).
Assume 80% efficient PS, numbers go up to 200w and 100w. Our electricity costs USD 0.04/kwhour, but in other parts of the country it's more like USD 0.08/kwhour; we'll use the bigger number. So 805D costs USD 0.08/5 = USD 0.016 to run per hour flat-out, while E6300 costs USD 0.008 to run per hour flat-out.

Thus, to achieve a USD 100 running cost advantage for the E6300 *even with both running flat-out* would take 12,500 hours, or roughly 4.3 years of 8 hours/day running flat out, no time off for weekends or holidays.

Bottom line: the power-use differences are economically insignificant.
September 11, 2006 2:58:41 AM

Quote:
E6300 at stock is at least equally fast or in most cases faster than Pentium D 930 which is already significantly faster than D 805.
Another thing to consider, E6300 is a lot easier to cool and power than overclocked D 805.
So you get a no-brainer situation here, go for E6300.


from what i can figure on benchmarks to get the same spped of a stock 6300 the D805 has to be overclocked to around 3.7ghz, since the e6300 falls between the x2 4600 and x2 5000.
Still i think a better videocard will have greater upside then a better cpu
September 11, 2006 3:09:49 AM

Quote:
from what i can figure on benchmarks to get the same spped of a stock 6300 the D805 has to be overclocked to around 3.7ghz, since the e6300 falls between the x2 4600 and x2 5000.
Still i think a better videocard will have greater upside then a better cpu


Oh i totally agree w/ you on that. I had a 7900 GT for a few days and it gave me a 10 FPS boost during Oblivion. I still had the hiccup down to 11-15FPS. That was when i had the 945. The 7900 cost me $329.00. Then i saw the E6300 Deal. Back to the store w/ the 7900.

:twisted:
September 11, 2006 3:12:14 AM

Quote:
what does 2T command rate mean?

If you saw that in the RAM specs then ignore it, command rate has nothing to do with the memory itself, only how often the memory controller accesses the memory. 2T means every 2 clocks and 1T means every clock, which is more stressful on the mem controller but not the memory (it also gives a nice performance boost :wink: ). Someone correct me if I'm wrong btw. Ususally with 2 or more sticks of RAM you have to use 2T.

Going back to the Pd 805 vs e6300, for overclocking with stock HS, the e6300 wins. The 805 pumps out the heat like crazy as it needs plenty of voltage and the puny little stock HS cant handle that much. The e6300 uses much less power and doesnt need much more voltage than stock until you really start to push it. So if overclocking with a stock HS is your game then go for the e6300.
September 11, 2006 3:31:04 AM



I'll second that. FSP makes good power supplies and they cost about the same as your average Antec PS.

If you can afford a few more dollars for the D 915 versus the D 805, you'll find that you will be happier with the 915. It runs cooler and faster than the 805 at the same clock speed. I ditched my 805 for a 915, got a conservative extra 300 MHz out of it (4.0 GHz vs. 3.7 GHz) at a lower voltage, using the same HSF that I had before. I don't put a lot of stock in artificial benchmarks but in the latest version of Everest, my 915 gets beaten on just a couple of benchies by the stock C2D X6800 and finishes in the top two or three in every category. It's plenty fast for $170 CDN.
September 11, 2006 3:40:56 AM

Quote:
OK, assume an OC 805D is using 160w flat-out, and an E6300 80w flat-out (back-of-the-envelope numbers here).
Assume 80% efficient PS, numbers go up to 200w and 100w. Our electricity costs USD 0.04/kwhour, but in other parts of the country it's more like USD 0.08/kwhour; we'll use the bigger number. So 805D costs USD 0.08/5 = USD 0.016 to run per hour flat-out, while E6300 costs USD 0.008 to run per hour flat-out.

Thus, to achieve a USD 100 running cost advantage for the E6300 *even with both running flat-out* would take 12,500 hours, or roughly 4.3 years of 8 hours/day running flat out, no time off for weekends or holidays.

Bottom line: the power-use differences are economically insignificant.

Assuming a price of 86 Euro, 0,2 kw/h and a price of 0,13 Euro kw/h for the 805 and a price of 166 Euro, 0,1 kw/h and a price of 0,13 Euro kw/h for the 6300 both processors would´ve to use up ~6154 kw/h to be of equal value. That roughly equals 3,5 years.
I used € insted of $ to make the comparison easier to understand for me, but come to the same conclusion you did. Unless someone intends to buy more than one of those processors power isn´t going to be a problem.

Well, i´ve to say power costs are rising pretty steep, at least in old europe and i know that i tend to use my older computers as file servers or otherwise. That doesn´t put them under heavy load but i still have an old Athlon A 1200 working lightly 24/7. And that things eats more power than god. If someone really intends to use a processor untill it´s unusuable (either it catches fire or it can´t keep up with the simpliest duties anymore) then cost becomes a factor again. If someone buys a single of those chips and uses it for a year or two, then sells it on ebay and gets a new rig (like the majority, i think), then power isn´t a buying point at all.
September 11, 2006 4:09:00 AM

The e6300 is the better CPU by a significant margin, but tbh the Gfx card has MUCH more of an affect on games, and a D805 will be fine paired with an x850.

If I was going to spend the extra $250 somewhere, it would be there, not on the CPU.

I would however get a D915 rather than the D805 (and I say that as a D805 owner).

Just as good an overclocker, less power usage, more cache, more FSB bandwidth.
September 11, 2006 4:28:27 AM

D805 consumes so much power, that it will be like a furnace inside your case. E6300 is definetly the obvious choice. The power consumption justifies the extra money, as u will have to spend money on a cooling system if u decide to OC the D805.
September 11, 2006 4:38:58 AM

Quote:
... The power consumption justifies the extra money, as u will have to spend money on a cooling system if u decide to OC the D805.

My Freezer 7 Pro cost $30. I don't see any E6300s on sale for $125...
September 11, 2006 5:13:13 AM

Quote:
... The power consumption justifies the extra money, as u will have to spend money on a cooling system if u decide to OC the D805.

My Freezer 7 Pro cost $30. I don't see any E6300s on sale for $125...


What about power bill ?
September 11, 2006 5:26:56 AM

Quote:
I'm pretty sure my 805D running at 3.68GHz is faster than a Pentium D 930 running at only 3.0 GHz.


Maybe, but I was able to run my D 930 at 3.8GHz and I bet it was cooler than D 805. Checkmate.

Anyway some benchmarks done in Sandra 2007:

Pentium D 930 @ 3.00GHz, DDR2-667, 4-4-4-12, 945 chipset:
13,431.00 MIPS
11,072.00 MFLOPS

Core 2 Duo E6300 @ 1.86GHz, DDR2-667, 4-4-4-12, 975 chipset:
17,196.00 MIPS
11,915.00 MFLOPS

Core 2 Duo E6300 @ 2.33GHz, DDR2-667, 4-4-4-12, 975 chipset:
21,526.00 MIPS
14,924.00 MFLOPS

Core 2 Duo E6300 @ 2.80GHz, DDR2-800, 5-5-5-15, 975 chipset:
25,894.00 MIPS
17,909.00 MFLOPS

Tests on Pentium D 930 were performed by me before taking the board and the CPU out of the case. Tests on Core 2 Duo performed also by me after putting new mainboard and the CPU into the same case and using the same RAM and same Windows XP installation.

Quote:
Someone correct me if I'm wrong btw. Ususally with 2 or more sticks of RAM you have to use 2T.


I am correcting you. I have been using 4 sticks of 512MB RAM (Corsair 5400-C4) and it worked at 1T. This is Intel, not AMD. They usually have to drop to 2T when going to 4 sticks.

Anyway, beware when buying memory these days, I saw an alarming number of memory kits declared at high speeds but using 2T. They also require much more voltage at higher speed and they actually have worse latencies at default voltage.

Quote:
My Freezer 7 Pro cost $30. I don't see any E6300s on sale for $125...


But you had to pay for larger case, stronger PSU, extra fans and you probably have air-conditioned room.
September 11, 2006 5:42:08 AM

Quote:

My Freezer 7 Pro cost $30. I don't see any E6300s on sale for $125...


But you had to pay for larger case, stronger PSU, extra fans and you probably have air-conditioned room.

I dont think Air con is a requirement for a D805.

I dont think many people had to buy a larger case to use a D805.

The TDP of the stock D805 is 90w. The stock e6300 is 65w. Different? yes. Not so different you are likely to need a better PSU (not that I'd want to run any PSU so close to the limit that it was a factor) but it would just mean you couldnt overclock quite as much.

I also think that a similar cooler would be used by most people for either chip. If I were to use a Scythe Ninja on a D805, I'd use it on an e6300 too. I wouldnt try to save cash on a cooler, especially as the Scythe Ninja is dirt cheap anyway.

I'd still recommend the D915 over the D805 @ the same price bracket, (negating alot of the thermal/power issues) but trying to insist someone spends over 50% more on their CPU for negligible benefit in games (as he'll spend more time GPU than CPU limited with an x850 and an e6300) seems ott. A Core 2 is nice, but not everyone NEEDs them. If he is on a budget, then I think the extra $250 he has suggested would be better spent on the GPU.
September 11, 2006 6:18:41 AM

Quote:
... The power consumption justifies the extra money, as u will have to spend money on a cooling system if u decide to OC the D805.

My Freezer 7 Pro cost $30. I don't see any E6300s on sale for $125...


What about power bill ?

what about it are you telling me you are using a 13" crt tv?? because you'll save power not using a lcd or plasma tv or refrigerator
The power bill is a bad argument by the time you make up the difference the cpu's will be outdated, there has been plenty of threads about that. Dont cook 2 stouffers lausanga in the microwave and your set

.
September 11, 2006 6:53:39 AM

Quote:
... The power consumption justifies the extra money, as u will have to spend money on a cooling system if u decide to OC the D805.

My Freezer 7 Pro cost $30. I don't see any E6300s on sale for $125...


What about power bill ?

Not to sound too harsh, but do you even pay a power bill? C'mon, the choice will NOT make a difference if you know what you are doing.
September 11, 2006 6:58:18 AM

Quote:
Someone correct me if I'm wrong btw. Ususally with 2 or more sticks of RAM you have to use 2T.


I am correcting you. I have been using 4 sticks of 512MB RAM (Corsair 5400-C4) and it worked at 1T. This is Intel, not AMD. They usually have to drop to 2T when going to 4 sticks.
Thanks for that, I knew I would be wrong somewhere since Im not great with RAM and I dont like giving people the wrong info 8)
September 11, 2006 10:00:22 PM

thanks for all the help
unfortunatley i am still very confused

should i go with a AM2 3800+ system, for only $100 more than the PD805, with a higher quality mobo, and perhaps an artic cooling freezer 64 pro

and i am going to keep the video card and upgrade to DX10 in a while

that might be a more solid system, with similar overclocking potential, and an upgrade path to with AM2 to the next gen AMD

and i was just wondering about 2T for its performance difference, as it might be cheaper to get 4*512
September 12, 2006 1:39:47 AM

Quote:
and i was just wondering about 2T for its performance difference, as it might be cheaper to get 4*512

Instead of 2x1gb?

When you say you are keeping the video card do you mean your 9200? If so then you need an agp motherboard which I'm not sure exist for AM2. Anyone know of any?
September 12, 2006 2:24:13 AM

Quote:
...
What about power bill ?

See messages 16 and 21 in this thread.
September 12, 2006 2:35:30 AM

Quote:
...
What about power bill ?

See messages 16 and 21 in this thread.
Oh, snap!
September 12, 2006 2:46:00 AM

Quote:
I'm pretty sure my 805D running at 3.68GHz is faster than a Pentium D 930 running at only 3.0 GHz.


Maybe, but I was able to run my D 930 at 3.8GHz and I bet it was cooler than D 805. Checkmate.
Look, I agree that the E6300 is the fastest. An 805D may or may not be faster than a 930, depending on how much each is overclocked, but given common OCing limits, the two are pretty comparable speedwise (not heat/power-wise, I agree).
My point was that the overall decision is not a slam-dunk one way or the other, because everyone has different tradeoffs between performance, heat/power, and price. An 805D costs around $95; many otherwise high-end LGA775 MBs are now selling for $75 or less because they can't support a C2D, while equally-good C2D MBs cost upwards of $200.
Some people will decide the extra performance of the E6300 isn't worth spending $200 or more extra.

Quote:
But you had to pay for larger case, stronger PSU, extra fans and you probably have air-conditioned room.

No, no, no, no. But I am an excellent bargain-shopper (Antec Super Lanboy for $20 AR - hooyah!).
September 12, 2006 2:55:39 AM

In that case he could just buy a socket 939 board with agp if he really wants a x2 3800.
September 12, 2006 3:33:32 AM

Oh, and another thing i just noticed, this processor compiles my music playlist at a blazing speed. I always had to wait forever for the computer to finish adding the files to my playlist.

I was really considering going AMD Dual Core. It was cheaper, but I'm glad I didn't. I think i'll stay right here for a while......
September 17, 2006 12:22:33 AM

Quote:
An 805D costs around $95; many otherwise high-end LGA775 MBs are now selling for $75 or less because they can't support a C2D, while equally-good C2D MBs cost upwards of $200.
Some people will decide the extra performance of the E6300 isn't worth spending $200 or more extra.


GA-965-S3 for $117:
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E1681...

Core 2 Duo E6300 for $183:
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E1681...

So for $130 more you get latest and very fast hardware.

Also, 2GB kit Corsair 5400-C4 for $245 after mail-in rebate:
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E1682...

Or if 1GB kit is enough for $117 also on rebate:
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E1682...

3800+ x2 is a dead fish.
September 17, 2006 1:41:57 AM

E3600=Best $200 I ever Spent
!