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How long can DVD+R endure?

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September 19, 2006 3:29:50 AM

i have heard that a cd-r can endure exactly only 2 or 3 years at most,that is under the condition of a dry and cool place without direct shine of light.

Mm,such a condition ,and the disc is so short lived. i have some videos ,all from the internet, the postgraduate lessons videos,over 200GB,and i want a very safe and steady plan to bakup these videos,can i use DVD+R? or i should use MO or other products?please give me a help,thanks………………

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September 20, 2006 2:12:40 AM

Quote:
i have heard that a cd-r can endure exactly only 2 or 3 years at most,that is under the condition of a dry and cool place without direct shine of light.


where'd ye hear that?

I bought my first CD burner when i bought my p2-350, January 1999 (cost me $500, a Teac quad-speed SCSI.)
The first CD i ever burnt with it (a backup of Unreal) is still running fine after many a use (unlike the original Unreal CD, left it in a hot car, oops). Pretty much all the numerous others i burnt are fine too, after being treated more or less like crap.

Dunno about DVDRs though, i only bought my first dvdrw drive a week ago and haven't plugged it in yet. Only if you buy the absolute cheapest crappiest dvdr discs will they die soon. go for a good brand and they may even have some kind of warranty on them...
September 20, 2006 2:43:36 AM

thanks for your reply.
i have tried to find some good brands aready,but now the japanese manufactures all exited the market of normal dvd discs ,they ran to the blue-ray or hd-dvd disc for more profit.And now actually the dvdr discs you can find mostly made in Taiwan.
honestly to say, their dvdrs are alse of good quality,but still not better than Japanese brands such as Taiya Yuden, or Mitsubishi(Vertbium).

so , i want to know where i can find the information of testing and evaluation , where can i find them ?

thanks again.
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September 20, 2006 3:22:30 AM

Opticals disc's durability depends on the material it is made of, the way you burn it, and you keep it.Keep it in a cool, dry place (not not your freezer please!).No direct sunlight, no near corrosive materials etc
September 21, 2006 4:01:16 AM

Quote:
(not not your freezer please!


Actually, i heard (from a reputable source) that putting CDs in a freezer can actually help "reform" the silicon where it's been scratched. I tried it, didn't work, but certainly didn't harm it.

anyway, @maz, where are ye in the world?
newegg has these:
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E1681...

i dunno much about brands these days, but verbatim used to be the shiznit for quality circa 1985-2000
September 25, 2006 10:37:08 PM

I cannot recommend a Verbatim disc, I have one myself, it's crappy. I would recommend some TDK or Pioneer discs. I have some TDK CD-R discs, and they work very well indeed.
September 25, 2006 11:05:35 PM

Not sure but my CD-R's ahve lasted years beyond what you heard... I did hear something about them degrading after 10 Years or so though. DVD's are probably around that range also if stored properly. Do not use sharpie markers etc as the ink can eat away at the disc over time...

Although with current flash prices perhaps the best bet for something you want to be sure you don't use is a flash drive (although this may not make sense cost wise depending on how much data youa re talking about. For $15 a GB it may be worth the peace of mind if you only need one or two.
September 26, 2006 12:07:11 AM

I too have heard that DVD-R (or +R) only last a few years - you can do a Google search on DVD+R lifetime and come up with both pros and cons :)  . The only hard data I found (after my attention span of ~2 minutes expired :lol:  ) was at More than 100 years projected lifetime for DVD-R media. I believe -R and +R use the same organic dyes (the part that is most likely to degrade) so they should have similar lifetimes if you believe that article by the manufacturer.

On the other hand, I have some copied movies from about 3 years ago, and some of them have problems being read on a standalone player. My DVD writer can still read them however...

Personally I'd like to see some sort of cheap, multi-terabyte online storage system with auto-error-checking & correction, able to store 2000+ complete HDDVD movies, networked to play back to multiple HD TV's simultaneously at 1080p, selection software complete with reviews and searchable as to title, year, cast, etc and with short samples or snippets. Then I'd never have to leave my sofa except for beer, pretzels and bathroom breaks :D 
September 26, 2006 12:55:52 AM

Not if your lazy boy is a built in toilet and mini fridge! As for pretzels...1 outing: go to costco and get 100 large bags and put them beside and in front of your lazy boy...you won't have to get up for a long time
September 26, 2006 12:57:36 AM

As some have stated, it can largely depend on a number of factors - environment, dye, burning process, etc etc etc.

I have CDs that are 7 years old now and they work fine. I have CDs that are 3 months old that don't.

One factor that I've found is the quality of the media you're buying. I tend to avoid imation, office store brands, and anything that is horrendously cheap and a lesser known brand.
The brands I can recommend are verbatim and tdk. sony's and hp's are alright, but i usually opt for verbatim or tdk. Especially verbatim for dual layers. I've probably run through 150 DVD's (+ and -). imations had alot of burning issues and longevity issues. i've never had a problem with verbatims and thats with about 80+ DVDs.

However the DVD's longevity I've only had them for about 2-3 years so I can't really say anything beyond those.

fazers_on_stun, you have a great name screenname :lol: 
September 26, 2006 2:04:01 AM

Quote:
Not if your lazy boy is a built in toilet and mini fridge!


:lol:  Not to mention a really huge Glade plug-in air freshener...

I think the Japanese are clearly in the lead in toilet technology - I have seen some imported toilets at an upscale Home Depot that feature computer-controlled perfume-scented cleansing jets temperature-tailored for your individual tastes (guess it uses butt-recognition software :D  ), plays music and videos and has a phone and ethernet terminal. Price around $3500 as I recall.
September 26, 2006 2:09:51 AM

I agree - I usually buy blank media from Meritline.com but stick mainly to branded Ridata DVD-R or +R discs. They are generally pretty good but I found a bad disc this weekend - copied a movie and when it skipped and then froze about 40% into the movie, I examined the disc closely and found a pinhole with no dye and a small area around it with very little dye. So from now on I'm gonna turn on data verification in Nero :lol: 
September 27, 2006 2:57:21 AM

yeah i have heard the brand Ridata,made in Taiwan whose Chinese name is 铼德。
And some Hongkong brand :CNC(Chinese name 中环,is is a famous street in Hongkong) and ProDisc(Chinese name 精碟,means well designed disc).They OEM a lot of brands, including Sony,TDK ,etc

Have you ever heard Taiya Yuden?
It is said to have the best quality of DVDs in the world, has anyone used it?
September 27, 2006 3:29:57 AM

I'm not sure if someone posted this, but IMHO This is one of the best sites for dvd/cd info (burners, media, players, ect...) Link

HTH
September 27, 2006 3:50:30 AM

I have a CD from 1988 that works fine. Just stay away from the cheap crap from the $2 shop.

If there's one thing that everyone on this thread (perhaps forum) that everyone can agree on is TDK's deserved good reputation; yeah they cost a bit more but they're well worth it.
September 27, 2006 1:28:26 PM

Quote:
yeah i have heard the brand Ridata,made in Taiwan whose Chinese name is 铼德。
And some Hongkong brand :CNC(Chinese name 中环,is is a famous street in Hongkong) and ProDisc(Chinese name 精碟,means well designed disc).They OEM a lot of brands, including Sony,TDK ,etc

Have you ever heard Taiya Yuden?
It is said to have the best quality of DVDs in the world, has anyone used it?


Yeah, I've heard a few good things about Taiyo Yuden media - I think they supply a number of the big brands. However, see the below post from MeritLine User Forums:

Quote:
I personally reccomend nicw's DVDInfo which can also be downloaded here. For more information on the program, read the sticky on this site titled DVDInfo DICUSSION APP." A quick summary of DVDInfo is that it has many options which ADVDINFO does not offer. To name a few, you can test both DVD+R/RW disks, as well as the ability to read disks from a DVD-ROM.

Note: Some DVD Burners may NOT be able to read the media id's of "BLANK" DVD Media. Therefore, in some instances, you will need to burn your project onto the media, and then check the media ID. Two burners which will read blank media id's with the latest firmware are the Ricoh and Sony burners. (see the -jsl- post below.) Thanks -jsl-


What's the Best media out there? Again, there is no such thing as Best media. No two people's computers are exactly alike, and different hardware as well as different software make this question impossible to answer. There are other reasons as to why you can't assume a BEST when it comes to DVD MEDIA as I will explain later.


Now for the Biggest Miconceptions and Fallacies of DVD MEDIA.

Just like with everything else in the world, I ALWAYS get what I pay for. If I pay extra money for expensive DVD MEDIA then i'm surely going to get the best quality, right? This is the ABSOLUTE BIGGEST FALLACY regarding DVD MEDIA. I have seen many posts where people think that they are getting the best quality media simply because they spent a few extra dollars. This couldn't be more false. Yes, MANY times in the real world, you get what you pay for. You won't get filet mignon for the price of salsbury steak, and you won't get a Ferrari for the price of a Ford. In many cases you do get what you pay for. But in the world of DVD MEDIA, you absolutely can NOT associate price with quality.

I will give two strong examples. It was assumed for a long time that companies like Verbatim make some of the best media in the world. If you spend extra money for name brand "VERBATIM" disks...you were getting what you paid for, right? Wrong! Recently, Verbatim has been known to have allowed the production of countless inferior Verbatim disks from a variety of different production plants and manufacturers. CMC is the company primarily responsible for producing the MAJORITY OF Verbatim's crappy media, but other companies have been known to produce faulty, error-plagued Verbatim disks as well. A Verbatim search on this forum will give you more information.

The point though is that you must first understand that the MAJORITY OF THE TIMES you are purchasing "name brand" media, the name on the top side of the disk, is not the name of the company that actually manufactured the disks. You also have to understand the DVD Production process a little. You can't just assume things. You can't just say for example, that because TDK is making excellent disks now that they will always continue to make excellent quality disks. Most of these DVD manufacturers have a wide erray of production plants around the WORLD. Companies like Verbatim have at least 7 different manufacturer's of their media! They also have manufacturing plants in different States as well as different countries!

For one reason or another, not only can one "brand" of disks be better manufactured then another..such as TAIYO YUDEN Verbatim disks being higher quality then say CMC...but in addition, the quality of the disks that come from a plant in Singapore, may be superior in quality to a plant in North Carolina. Quality control can also be more leniant at one plant then it is at another. It can also certainly be more stringent for a company like Taiyo Yuden, then it is for a company like CMC. For this reasons as well as many others, you can't just ASSUME because a disk is more expensive, it is absolutely better.

The reverse can also be said. Just because a disk is inexpensive, does not make it cheap or of inferior quality. As a matter of fact, there are NUMEROUS unbranded "generic" media being sold at many online sites which is superior in quality to alot of more expensive "NAME BRAND" disks such as Verbatim, Memorex, Fuji, etc.

Just to name some of the highest quality disks I know the majority of people have had the most success with success with are as follows:
Ritek, (mainly G03 & G04), Ricoh, Lead Data/ Primarily sold under the name ACCU, DUPEZ, AND PIODATA. Prime disks - Manufacutred by Gigastorage. Samsung BeALL DVD-R (Not +R) Optodisks - The highest quality appears to be the Gold-Topped 4x disks from the majority of the people who have used them. This is a list of the most compatibile and highest quality inexpensive media which can in many cases be far superior in both quality AND compatibility to more expensive name brands. Which certainly is better for all of us.
a b G Storage
September 27, 2006 2:09:25 PM

The brand/material that is being burned too makes a big difference. Gold and blue colored disks last quite a bit longer. Search for my post regaurding the details on the material names and what to look for. The disks can last 2 years, or 400 years, just dont use DVDrw disks.
September 27, 2006 2:19:23 PM

I found an article that states a lifetime (for a particular brand) at 100 years for a DVD+R. Of course, not all DVDs are built equally. Also frustrating is that this article supposes that the DVD will never get scratched and always left in the case. Because you know that's just how the majority of people in this world treat their DVDs.

I'll also mention that the lifetime is a THEORETICAL lifetime. Nobody actually waited 100 years for a DVD to turn........
..........
.........
......"there it goes...."

Lifetime
a b G Storage
September 27, 2006 4:54:39 PM

Did you read my link? What the DVD/CD is made from makes a difference that can add or take away 300 years to its lifetime.
September 27, 2006 6:48:43 PM

So who's gonna wait 300 years to see if that's true?
a b G Storage
September 27, 2006 7:14:19 PM

They dont need to wait. Tests can show the rate of Degradation.
September 27, 2006 9:52:18 PM

Do they show 300 years worth of scratches, too? I mean, they should be realistic.
September 28, 2006 2:25:36 AM

OK
SUre I know there is little featherbility that I live to 300 years old or so :) 

the question is : big brands with good raputation can not always promise a very steady qulity or a long lifetime.

So I think , in the case of purchasing DVDs ,there's only luck :D  :D 
a b G Storage
September 28, 2006 1:55:53 PM

NO, there is more to it then luck. read my post and you will find out which materials to use when writting to DVDs.

As for Holden McGroin
"Do they show 300 years worth of scratches, too?"

The number of scratches is not directly related to the lenght of time you own the disk. If you cant keep from scratching the disk, repetitivly, untill it breaks, then you should just get the 1c disks and dont worry about it.

But you tell me, what is 300 years worth of scratches? According to whom? Is there a scratch vs time formula you are using? Does it look like this?

T/D = S where S = the number of scratches developed over the first second of ownership.

For you, lets say S = 5 (which means u scratched the disk 5 times in the first second you opend the disk).

1/D = 5. D (damage), = 1/5 or 20% damage to the disk. Congradulations, you have destroyed 20% of the DVD the first second of ownership.
November 1, 2006 11:23:47 PM

Mm
For a long time we got a false image that the DVDR is very weak.
but i doubt it .
even not a TDK superdisc(anounced to be safe within 100 years),it can endure a long time ?
what caused dye deteroprates besides the X-ray?
November 2, 2006 12:13:52 AM

Quote:
I cannot recommend a Verbatim disc, I have one myself, it's crappy. I would recommend some TDK or Pioneer discs. I have some TDK CD-R discs, and they work very well indeed.


TDK indeed.
I have old TDK discs that work. They are at least 5 years old too.
November 2, 2006 12:32:55 AM

To OP: a simple solution is to buy two external 300 GB drives, copy the data to both and whenever you add/remove new files, swap the two. Keep the spare in a safe place. I can almost guarantee you that the spare external drive will last longer then a DVD. Plus, they don't take up as much (physical) space as ~40 DVDs of data.

Off course, you don't have to resort to this. It's just a sure fire way to protect the data. I have an old (4-5 years?) drive that's performing the same as it was when I first got it. Plus, if the data on one of the drives ever becomes corrupt, you can simply pop in the backup and copy it over to a new one.
a b G Storage
November 2, 2006 12:47:16 PM

really? You didnt read my post then? I dont think you will be around to find out if your hard drive lasts longer the 200 years. (if you use the DVDrs correctly.


2 hard drives works ... but remember, one burglery, fire, .... willl destroy everything anyways...
November 2, 2006 8:24:47 PM

Think this is going a bit over top. I mean the world could explode and then what would we do? :) 
a b G Storage
November 2, 2006 8:51:45 PM

right..... cause buildings never burn down... and nobody robs stuff.


Good LUck.
November 2, 2006 10:18:29 PM

If my house burnt down, the last thing i'd care about is some videos i got from the internet.
November 16, 2006 5:35:26 AM

for me
The last thing i consider is my text book ^_^
a b G Storage
November 21, 2006 8:17:45 PM

Quote:
If my house burnt down, the last thing i'd care about is some videos i got from the internet.


Probly not, but why not protect that too?
!