Is 7 Better for Gaming?

[gulighs1]

is windows 7 (64bit) better for my high end gaming rig or should i get xp sp3 64bit?

initiall i was going to get 7 but after looking at the scores in this article im not too sure

http://www.firingsquad.com/hardware/windows_7_gaming_performance/page9.asp

my noob mind translates that as meaning xp would be better for me.............. whats your thoughts?

 

[WR2]

You might have a problem getting XP 64bit drivers for newer hardware.
Keep in mind that FiringSquad testing was done with an early version of Win7. It also used much less than 'high end' hardware.

It's a mixed bag. Some games will be faster in XP, some in Vista and others in Win7.
Here is a more recent review: Oct review: XP vs Vista vs Win7

With a new high end system you won't need to worry about any small performance advantage you might have had with XP.
The difference is so small that you can't say a game will run good on XP but will run bad on Win7.

For games released in 2010 and beyond you'll want Win7. If you're the cautious type or want to play some older games set up a dual boot WinXP/Win7 system.

 

[gulighs1]

thanks for the reply.

yea i think ill go for 7 hopefully patches will be release for older games and stuff and your right about the dual boot thing. if i want to play an older game i could always do that.

if ure still there..... would u include a velociraptor as part of a high end gaming setup ? or would u got for spinpoint f3/ wd caviar black

 

[WR2]

Spinpoint F3 or WD Caviar Black. The V-Raptor doesnt give you better gameplay - apart from slightly faster loading of game & game levels.
And use what ever extra money you might have spent on V-Raptor to upgrade the video card choice.

 

[fjc1998]

XP has DX9 and Win7 has DX11. Nuff' said XD

 

[gulighs1]

Yea thats it WR2 my point exactly......... i always had the understanding that games were loaded from HD to RAM then it was between CPU, GPU and ram.

But then u hear about all these guys including Vraptors or SSDs, apart from fast transfer rates for files i couldn't really understand why (and maybe a sec of fast map loads).

I did a bit of googling and got confused. its gets hard to seperate opinions from facts. some ppl seem to think higher price means better on ALL levels.

Anyway thanks A lot for your answers , youve helped me clear that up.

 

[gulighs1]

Im very sorry for the Double Post and straying slightly of topic, but this is the very last thing i need you to observe.

This is the rest of my rig:

Its based around components from novatech uk website. (the current setup is worth £2500) Im using this website because i only have £1000 and they offer a buy it now pay after 12 months no interest.

Intel Core i7 920 (im going to OC to 4 ghz)
Samsung SM2233RZ 3D 120Hz Monitor Nvidia 3D Glasses Bundle (SHOULD I GET A 30 INCH INSTEAD ?)
Asus Rampage II Extreme Intel X58
2 x Western Digital Caviar Green Power 1.5TB (for media storage)
LG CH08LS10 Blu-Ray Reader and DVDRW Drive
Corsair Dominator 6GB (3x2GB) DDR3 PC3-12800C8 1600MHz
Antec Twelve Hundred Ultimate Gamer Case
Razer Mamba Wireless Laser Gaming Mouse
Noctua SE1366 NH-U12P SE1366 Exclusive Dual Fan CPU Cooler
Sony DRU870S 24x DVD /-RW Dual Layer DVD-RAM SATA - Retail
Windows Home Edition 7
EVGA GeForce GTX 295 Co-Op Edition SLI 1792MB (possible sli in the future)
Corsair HX 850W ATX2.2 Modular SLI Compliant Power Supply
Logitech 7.1 Digital Precision Gaming Headset
Razer eXactMat - eXactRest Gaming Surface Bundle
Kaspersky Internet Security 2010 3 User 1 Year DVD - Retail
Logitech G15 Gaming Keyboard (novatech do not have g19, next best thing is Razer Lycosa... which do you think is btter ?)
Akasa Internal Smart Card Reader
Zalman ZM-MFC3 Multi Fan Controller
WD Caviar Black 1 tb

It would be most helpful if you can point the mistakes or improvements with this setup, thanks.
Also since im spending this much, any other advice i could use would be helpful.

The thing with the montior is ive heard with really high specs the 3d vision works wonders. That being said
ive never experienced games in full detail on a 30 inch.... im not sure which will be better.

(To Toms Hardware staff, im sorry for straying of topic but i need my answers quick. ill make sure i doesnt happen again)

 

[LePhuronn]

Some changes to your rig:

Kill the GTX295. Kill it with fire. If you're spending this much on a gaming rig you might as well build a little future flexibility into it and prepare yourself for DX11 as you're using Windows 7. Buy a single Radeon 5870 and wait to see what happens with Fermi - if Fermi cards are amazing, sell your Radeon (it'll be less than 6 months old) and get a Fermi SLI and enjoy sick gaming for many years. If Fermi isn't up to scratch, too expensive or you want to stick with ATI, buy another (or 2) 5870s to Crossfire and enjoy sick gaming for many years.

Motherboard and PSU: Are you planning on extreme overclocking and/or Tri/Quad SLI/Crossfire? By extreme overclocking I mean watercooling your i7 to go above 4.5GHz.

If yes, stick with the Rampage II Extreme so you have the minute controls needed for stupid OCs and triple-GPU compatibility (16x/16x/8x on the 3 PCI-E 16x slots)

If no, go with an Asus P6TD Deluxe ("D" is important). You'll still get a 4GHz OC and dual GPUs if you want them.

Stick with the 850HX PSU if you're only planning on 2 graphics cards, get the 1000HX if you want the capacity for 3 of them (or 2 GTX295s if you stick with that option) and some serious OC.

If you're not going VelociRaptor or SSD for boot drive, replace the Caviar Black 1TB with a SpinPoint F3 500GB.

Are you planning on overclocking the RAM or tightening its timings? If not, you can do better than than the Dominator for the same price - OCZ Reaper 1600MHz comes with 7-7-7-20 timings, Patriot Viper 1600MHz at 8-8-8-24 is cheaper than Dominator.

If you want 3D Vision stick with the Samsung. If you want a 30" you'll need to up your GPUs to be able to cope (like GTX285 2GB models in SLI as a minimum) but I'd go with a Dell Ultrasharp 3008W.

And one last piece of advice - Overclockers UK and Scan UK are all cheaper than Novatech and offer finance options.

 

[JackNaylorPE]

if ure still there..... would u include a velociraptor as part of a high end gaming setup ? or would u got for spinpoint f3/ wd caviar black

The WD Black 2 TB model is the only one with the faster 500 GB platters. The Spinpoint F3 has several sizes.

 

[JackNaylorPE]

XP has DX9 and Win7 has DX11. Nuff' said XD

Adding abigger number to something doesn't necessarily make it better. Few would say Windows version 6.0 (Vista) was better than XP (version 5.1). And lest we forget Win95 was 40% slower than W4WGs.

Let's also not forget that Vista had DX10 and it's safe to say the describing Dx10 as a "dud" would be too flattering. I think it's safe to say that we all hope DX11 will bring a better experience to gamers, and there's hints to make us think that it will, but right now it's just too early to tell.

Of course if you're betting a couple of hundred dollars on a GFX card that you will need to satisfy your needs for 3-4 years, best to play it safe and get the DX11 compatibility. Same with the OS ..... however I think the lack of support by hardware folks as well as MS is a much bigger issue than DX whatever/

 

[JackNaylorPE]

Im very sorry for the Double Post and straying slightly of topic, but this is the very last thing i need you to observe.

My son has almost the same box

Intel Core i7 920 (currently at 3.4 ghz .... working on Event Viewer errors b4 getting into serious OC)
Dell U2410 (didn't want a TN panel as he into photography)
Asus Rampage II Extreme
(1) Seagate 7200.12 in box, 4 in an NAS
Plextor 320AS Blu-Ray Reader and DVDRW Drive
Mushkin Redline 6GB (3x2GB) DDR3 1600MHz w. 6-7-6-18 timings
Antec Twelve Hundred Case
Logitech G9 Laser Gaming Mouse
Prolimatech Shadow w/ twin Enermax PWM fans
Windows 7 Ultimate 64 bit
EVGA GeForce GTX 295 FTW Edition SLI 1792MB
Antec SG-850 SLI Compliant Power Supply (Slightly edged Corsair HX by being quieter)
Logitech G19 Gaming Keyboard (LCD slideshow drivers not Win7 64 bit compatible)
ACM Smart Card Reader
Asus OC Station and Multi Fan Controller

My son doesn't keep GFX cards more than 2 years so DX11 compatibility was a nonissue. Given the fact that he wants PhysX, the 295 is also a cheaper option than a 5870 + a dedicated PhysX card.

If you want the fastest card, can't wait till fermi or the 5870x 2 shows up and aren't doing to keep the card more than 2 years, the 295 remains a viable option:

http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/best-graphics-card,2464-7.html

"Despite ATI's new Radeon HD 5800-series, Nvidia's GeForce GTX 295 (with SLI-on-a-board) is the most powerful single graphics card on the planet. Essentially two conjoined GeForce GTX 275s, the GeForce GTX 295 offers very notable gains over the Radeon HD 5870 in the great majority of game titles"

Given your budget, a SSD should be considered .... my son opted out cause we both figure that SSD's will get some issues ironed out, increase in size and drop in price by Spring.

 

[gulighs1]

Thanks for the replies guys , i just got back from researching the new topics u guys had faced me with (dx11)

so this is the thing from what i can gather we arent going to see dx 11 being used in games properly till maybe more then a year later. ( as with what happend with dx10) so i think im going to go to stick with the 295.

see with this setup i wont have to upgrade the rest of my comp just the graphics card and i think when it comes to it ill have the cash for just a graphics card.

lephuron ,thanks a lot for the overclockers site , ure right there slightly cheaper and have more stuff.

i was considering the g19, im sure they will come up with a patch to fix that. Windows 7 is still newish.

how would you justify getting a velociraptor or SSD ? apart from slight improved game loads and boot times im struggling to justify the cost for so little extra gaming performance. what else does having a fast HDD improve ?

http://www.bit-tech.net/hardware/storage/2009/10/06/samsung-spinpoint-f3-1tb-review/1
jump to page 9 and take a look at the table

I will get an SSD in the future maybe in a years time when there cheaper.

The reason i want that mobo is because it will stand up to the test of time for a while (or am i wrong)

 

[LePhuronn]

how would you justify getting a velociraptor or SSD ? apart from slight improved game loads and boot times im struggling to justify the cost for so little extra gaming performance. what else does having a fast HDD improve ?

Yes, it's hard to justify the cost of a VelociRaptor, but you'd see more than a "slight" improvement in loading times.

A SSD however will blow everything out of the water. They're not just a little bit faster, they're SERIOUSLY faster at everything they do. You don't have to go mad in terms of size, but granted even a 64GB SSD is still expensive compared to a regular HDD, but honestly they are worth it.

I've used Overclockers religiously for a long time, but then I do live 15 minutes away from them so I just walk in. If you're getting stuff delivered I'd probably go with Scan as they're usually a bit cheaper again.

As for your mobo, yes the Rampage II Extreme is a serious piece of kit and it is designed to last, but honestly it's overpowered if you're not doing mental OCs or running triple GPUs. The P6TD Deluxe is a solid board and uses Asus' Xtreme Design technology to make it just as rugged as the top-end boards out there.

I was torn between the two boards myself. The two deciding factors were:

triple GPU vs twin GPU: are you going to use 3 cards?
P6TD Deluxe + decent soundcard costs the same or a touch more as the Rampage II Extreme with bundled X-Fi, however the bundled X-FI is a little outdated now (not EAX 5 for instance).

 

[rasmasyean]

Statistics...


As of mid-2008, benchmarks suggest that Vista SP1 is on par with (or better than) Windows XP in terms of game performance.[92] At the release of Windows 7 (October 2009) a survey by Valve Corporation indicated that 40.41% of gamers were running DirectX 10 systems. The survey also indicated that DirectX 10 was supported on 83.21% of DirectX10 capable OS’s (Windows Vista, Windows 7 beta and Windows 7 represented 48.56% of the survey) and that 42.27% of these OS’s were 64-bit.[93]
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Windows_Vista#Reception

According to related references, Vista had a small frame-rate decrease when running DX9 games upon release. Then SP1 made it better than XP.

Don't listen to all the hold-outs saying the DX10 (11 is too early to tell until more titles) doesn't do anything notable. It does to those people who care about it.

 

[Zoron]

Not many developers programmed for DX10 to begin with and when DX10 first hit, nVidia's cards weren't quite up to the task. So DX10 only looked like a dud.

 

[rasmasyean]

Adding abigger number to something doesn't necessarily make it better. Few would say Windows version 6.0 (Vista) was better than XP (version 5.1). And lest we forget Win95 was 40% slower than W4WGs.

Let's also not forget that Vista had DX10 and it's safe to say the describing Dx10 as a "dud" would be too flattering. I think it's safe to say that we all hope DX11 will bring a better experience to gamers, and there's hints to make us think that it will, but right now it's just too early to tell.

Of course if you're betting a couple of hundred dollars on a GFX card that you will need to satisfy your needs for 3-4 years, best to play it safe and get the DX11 compatibility. Same with the OS ..... however I think the lack of support by hardware folks as well as MS is a much bigger issue than DX whatever/

Reviews about Vista are mixed, but negative reception seems to stem from low-end computers. As hardware improved and perhaps patches applied, most of those problems were old news.

Initially it was thought that the adoption of Vista has been generally low, due to largely poor reviews and harsh criticism, but a later Gartner research report predicted that Vista business adoption in 2008 will actually beat that of XP during the same time frame (21.3% vs. 16.9%)[80] while IDC had indicated that the launch of Windows Server 2008 served as a catalyst for the stronger adoption rates.[81][82] As of January 2009, Forrester Research had indicated that almost one third of North American and European corporations have started deploying Vista.[83] On a May 2009 conference, the Microsoft Vice President said for big businesses, "Adoption and deployment of Windows Vista has been slightly ahead of where we had been with XP".[84][85] In its first year of availability, PC World rated it as the biggest tech disappointment of 2007,[86] and it was rated by InfoWorld as #2 of Tech's all-time 25 flops.[87] The internet-usage market share for Windows Vista after two years of availability (as of January 2009[update]) was 20.61%. This figure combined with World Internet Users and Population Stats yielded a user base of roughly 330 million,[10] which exceeded Microsoft's two-year post launch expectations by 130 million.[9] The present user base is roughly 380 million by the same statistical sources.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Windows_Vista#Reception

 

[rasmasyean]

Here's a running list of titles.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_games_with_DirectX_10_support
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_games_with_DirectX_11_support

 

[gulighs1]

thanks for the replies guys.......


lephurron,

i save 20 quid with the ram change you advised you were right im not going to mess around with the ram. at the most im only OC'ing the CPU.

Im going to do a a bit more research in to the comparisson of those motherboards, if the price difference is significant then ill switch.

 

[LePhuronn]

Here's from my own spec list (Scan UK prices):

Rampage II Extreme: £246.30
P6TD Deluxe: £201.45

The choice therefore comes down to your requirements for sound card: the Rampage II Extreme comes with a SupremeFX X-Fi card supporting EAX 4. The P6TD has 8-channel Asus Crystal Sound onboard. Adding a discrete sound card to the P6TD Deluxe is likely to make the both of them more expensive than the Rampage alone.

Just to point out though, you can use 2 graphics cards in the P6TD Deluxe and still keep a 1x PCI-E slot free for sound card. The Rampage II Extreme loses one 1x PCI-E slot underneath a graphics card, and the other 1x PCI-E slot used for the bundled X-Fi has a heatsink behind it which means you can't put any other card in (unless you bend/remove fins from the heatsink).

 

[rodney_ws]

Starting from scratch, I do not see how ANYONE could be considering XP over Windows 7. It is 2009. I bought Windows 7 the week it was released and my only regret is that I didn't get a student copy from a friend instead of paying $99 for an OEM copy. Windows 7 restored some of my faith in Microsoft to actually provide a product that I enjoy using. Yes, XP is great... but at some point the wheels are going to fall off the cart... and then you're just stuck.