Can ATi X1900xtx run crossfire with x1950 crossfire card?

synthetix

Distinguished
Sep 6, 2006
11
0
18,510
Well I have Asus X1900xtx graphics card and looking to add another prized possesion to my PC but i was wondering if I could install a x1950 crossfire instead of X1900 crossfire card?
 

kwalker

Distinguished
May 3, 2006
856
0
18,980
I beleive they will work together.
http://ati.amd.com/technology/crossfire/faq.html#
click on #2
X1950 is still 1900 series
 

synthetix

Distinguished
Sep 6, 2006
11
0
18,510
Thats the thing i wanna know from anyone if this has been done before cause it is quite a bit of money to play guessing games with....
 

Dahak

Distinguished
Mar 26, 2006
1,267
0
19,290
Theoreticaly it's possible,But I've never done it myself.Please let us know the outcome.Goodluck.

Dahak

AMD X2-4400+@2.4 S-939
EVGA NF4 SLI MB
2X7800GT IN SLI
2X1GIG DDR IN DC MODE
WD300GIG HD
EXTREME 19IN.MONITOR 1280X1024
ACE 520WATT PSU
COOLERMASTER MINI R120
 

Dade_0182

Distinguished
Apr 3, 2006
1,102
0
19,280
Nope. In the very sleepy state that I'm in (I might have read wrong due to it), I understood that he tested an X1950XTX and got a new world record with an X1900XTX. He never ran them together though. Was hoping to see that happen though. Could be interresting to see the results.
 

synthetix

Distinguished
Sep 6, 2006
11
0
18,510
Mmm i was hoping the guys at toms hardware could possibly test this setup as they get samples on a regular basis and can afford to test it out without loosing a whole months salary if it doesnt work :p
Well ill be keeping an eye on this thread but until i have a definate answer im gonna wait a bit.
 

sweetpants

Distinguished
Jul 5, 2006
579
0
18,980
Thats the thing i wanna know from anyone if this has been done before cause it is quite a bit of money to play guessing games with....

As far as I understand it.. it is not possible. I assume that it was much like trying to run two different cards in SLI (which I believe is becoming a possibility now?) I believe the problem with SLI is the driver couldn't compensate for a slower + faster card when slower card = frames 1,3,5,7 and the faster card was able to push out images 2,4,6,8 faster. *shrugs*

Although, I do believe that with the release of the X1950 they are redoing Crossfire a bit to make it easier, and more streamlined... kinda like SLI :)

There should be an article about it on Anandtech.com
 

AndyAldrich

Distinguished
Jun 26, 2006
82
0
18,630
Correct, it is impossible. x1950 cards use DDR4, x1900 cards use DDR3. It's not like a pipeline number/GPU clock/memory speed issue issue in which one card is able to disable pipelines or cripple the clock speeds in order to work with the other. The chipsets are the same but it simply won't work. You need an x1950 crossfire master card to work with an x1950 slave card. For now just one x1950 should do you fine, power-wise. Wait for the price of the crossfire card to drop and get it later, when it'll cost you less but still give you a nice boost. You may also have other options by then as DX10 cards will be arriving in e-stores and you know how ATi and nVidia like to keep chucking out rehashes of old cards.

Ciao 4 niao
 

sweetpants

Distinguished
Jul 5, 2006
579
0
18,980
Correct, it is impossible. x1950 cards use DDR4, x1900 cards use DDR3. It's not like a pipeline number/GPU clock/memory speed issue issue in which one card is able to disable pipelines or cripple the clock speeds in order to work with the other. The chipsets are the same but it simply won't work. You need an x1950 crossfire master card to work with an x1950 slave card. For now just one x1950 should do you fine, power-wise. Wait for the price of the crossfire card to drop and get it later, when it'll cost you less but still give you a nice boost. You may also have other options by then as DX10 cards will be arriving in e-stores and you know how ATi and nVidia like to keep chucking out rehashes of old cards.

Ciao 4 niao

I wouldn't say that is completel true

"The New Face of CrossFire

There haven't been any changes to the way CrossFire works from an internal technical standpoint, but a handful of changes have totally revolutionized the way end users see CrossFire. NVIDIA's SLI approach has always been fundamentally better from an end user standpoint. Internal connectors are cleaner and easier to use than ATI's external dongle, and the ability to use any X1950 Pro in combination with any other X1950 Pro is absolutely more desirable than the dedicated master card approach. ATI has finally done it right and followed in NVIDIA's footsteps.

At the heart of the changes to CrossFire is the movement of ATI's compositing engine from the card onto the GPU itself. This does add cost to every GPU and thus every graphics card, but the added benefits far out weigh any negatives. In early versions of CrossFire, digital pixel information was sent between cards using TMDS transmitters (the same transmitters used to send display information over DVI and HDMI). While this format is fine for displays, it isn't as well suited for chip to chip communication.

With the compositing engine built into every GPU, ATI is now able to send pixel data through an over-the-top NVIDIA style bridge directly to another GPU. This also eliminates the necessity of a TMDS link for use in transmitting pixel data. ATI hasn't talked about what type of communication protocol is used between the compositing engines on each chip, but we suspect that it is a little lower speed than NVIDIA's 1GHz connection. ATI is using a higher bit-width connection split into 2 12-bit parallel channels. At full capacity, ATI states that these connections can support resolutions of up to 2560x2048, but that communication doesn't happen any faster than the old style TMDS method.

ATI did make it clear that even though this incarnation of CrossFire supports a higher resolution than we are currently able to test, it won't necessarily run well. Of course, we'd much rather see a situation where we aren't limited by some technical aspect of the hardware. The first incarnation of CrossFire was quite disappointing due to its low maximum resolution of 1600x1200.

One of the oddities of this multi-GPU implementation is the splitting up of the connector that links the GPUs. Both are required for the driver to enable CrossFire, but only one is technically necessary. As bridges will be bundled with graphics cards, everyone who purchases 2 X1950 Pro cards will have two bridges. This eliminates the need for end users to buy bridges separately or rely on them shipping with their multi-GPU motherboard. When pressed further about why two connectors were used, ATI asked us to envision a system with 3 or 4 graphics cards installed. With 2 channels, cards can be easily chained together. This does offer ATI a little more flexibility than NVIDIA in scaling multi-GPU configurations, but it is also a little more cumbersome and offers more small parts to lose. Overall, though, the 2 channel configuration is a good thing.

Now that we have a chip built specifically for the $200 price point with a robust, full featured, CrossFire implementation, we are very interested in seeing what type of performance ATI is offering."
-anandtech
 

Slobogob

Distinguished
Aug 10, 2006
1,431
0
19,280
Well I have Asus X1900xtx graphics card and looking to add another prized possesion to my PC but i was wondering if I could install a x1950 crossfire instead of X1900 crossfire card?

I wouldn´t even think about it. I doubt that you will gain performance with a 1900XTX and a 1950 Pro in crossfire. The Xtx would be cut back to 1950 Pro level and crossfire adds 50% performance (roughly). It´s not worth it. If you really want crossfire, get another 1900xtx. I´d wait though, the dx10 cards are on the horizon and buying one of those might be a better option.
 

sweetpants

Distinguished
Jul 5, 2006
579
0
18,980
Well I have Asus X1900xtx graphics card and looking to add another prized possesion to my PC but i was wondering if I could install a x1950 crossfire instead of X1900 crossfire card?

I wouldn´t even think about it. I doubt that you will gain performance with a 1900XTX and a 1950 Pro in crossfire. The Xtx would be cut back to 1950 Pro level and crossfire adds 50% performance (roughly). It´s not worth it. If you really want crossfire, get another 1900xtx. I´d wait though, the dx10 cards are on the horizon and buying one of those might be a better option.

It would have to be possible first...
 

synthetix

Distinguished
Sep 6, 2006
11
0
18,510
Im glad i asked this question cause it looks like i would have wasted a couple bags of gold :p
Thanx for all the replies.
Has anyone got to links to some inside scoops on the new dx 10 cards?
Also I am very interrested in how the Ati Amd merger might influence their graphics cards.
That would also make for a nice read if someone has some info on that, or even just an opinion of how you think it would affect graphics cards in the future from ATi as im sure with the two companies combined knowledge now , we are in for a drastic change...
Or maybe not. What do u guys think?
 

sweetpants

Distinguished
Jul 5, 2006
579
0
18,980
What I've heard of recently is ATI's plan to produce CPU + GPU on a single peice of silicon.

This was talked about long before the ATI + AMD merger but nothing ever came about. I've also heard good things about being able to a 3rd card for physics... let me give an example...

Let's say I own a single X1900XTX, then I want 2 X1950 Pro's in Crossfire...

I put the 2 cards in Crossfire
then add the X1900XTX with a ATI based chipset motherboard and have it run only for physics processing... kind of a good idea I think, better than having a card you shelled out 400 bucks for collecting dust eh?
 

AACDIRECT

Distinguished
Sep 4, 2006
8
0
18,510
In theory it is possible to run a X1950 Mastercard (not Pro) with a X1900 XTX. They are both r580 core and should work fine together. CF allows like cards with non like speeds to run together at full speed. (Not pipelines as stated earlier in the thread.) So both cards should be even be able to run at full speed too. (Like when pairing a X1900 Master with a X1900 XTX)

With that being said did ATI right the ablity to run a X1950 Master with a X1900 Slave into the driver? .... who knows.
 

sweetpants

Distinguished
Jul 5, 2006
579
0
18,980
What I gathered from that article is that ATI is doing away with the Master/slave cards in Crossfire and now that any brand of X1950 Pro can be used with any other brand of X1950Pro i.e. MSI + Asus
 

AACDIRECT

Distinguished
Sep 4, 2006
8
0
18,510
What I gathered from that article is that ATI is doing away with the Master/slave cards in Crossfire and now that any brand of X1950 Pro can be used with any other brand of X1950Pro i.e. MSI + Asus

I can confirm that is true.
 

BustedSony

Distinguished
Apr 24, 2006
576
0
18,980
What I gathered from that article is that ATI is doing away with the Master/slave cards in Crossfire and now that any brand of X1950 Pro can be used with any other brand of X1950Pro i.e. MSI + Asus

I can confirm that is true.

What bugs me is that I bought the 1900XT for $500 (a bargain at the time) and now because of scarcity the 1900 Crossfire is still over $500, whereas the 1900XT and XTX can be had for less than $300. And I can't use the 1950 Pro which is much cheaper than the 1900 Crossfire. If I had bought a crossfire Master to begin with, then adding a slave would have been much cheaper later on.
 

AACDIRECT

Distinguished
Sep 4, 2006
8
0
18,510
[
What bugs me is that I bought the 1900XT for $500 (a bargain at the time) and now because of scarcity the 1900 Crossfire is still over $500, whereas the 1900XT and XTX can be had for less than $300. And I can't use the 1950 Pro which is much cheaper than the 1900 Crossfire. If I had bought a crossfire Master to begin with, then adding a slave would have been much cheaper later on.

Your complaint is my biggest complaint about any duel card solution. It was sold to many as a way to upgrade to higher performance. The reality is that if you don't do it at the start you have a very short window to upgrade. Try to find a 7800 GTX or GT now. Go back to the 6800 series or X850 series. It gets real tough.

To find a X1900 Master I might try E-bay for a cheap one. As people setup they will become more available.

If it was me I would consider waiting until the new NV and ATI DX10 cards. You will be able to buy a single card that will be as fast as or faster than all current 2 card solutions.
 
What I gathered from that article is that ATI is doing away with the Master/slave cards in Crossfire and now that any brand of X1950 Pro can be used with any other brand of X1950Pro i.e. MSI + Asus

The reason that that's the case is because they have the dual internal connector on every card;

1950pxfirepy0.jpg


So it's not BUS Xfire like the GTs and GTOs but still hardware support, but now each card has that ability.

Also it has nothing really to do with the OP's question, but it's the right way to go with hardware connected Xfire IMO.

As for the OP's question, the X1950CF cards do work with the X1900 cards in Xfire, check out DH's review;

http://www.driverheaven.net/reviews/x1900x1950/index.htm

Still a little quirky overall as is the entire Xfire/SLi solution.

Seriously guys stop giving people advice based on your guesses, you cost people time and money and just look st00pid!

The first thing to remember is that Xfire doesn't have the same limitations as SLi, unbalanced cards is built into the setup, what you can't do however is match completely different chips designs (like the X1800 with an X1900 or X1600 card). Dont' think speeds or pipes (both can be off) think architecture.

And whomever said GDDR4 mattered needs to rethink that statement, it's abot as wise as saying you can't put a sapphire card in your rig because it's blue not red. :roll:

To the OP, I'm not a fan of XFire or SLi, and would suggest waiting for newer cards to come out, but if you got money to burn (which later comments seem to say you don't) then Xfire will show a boost, just not a huge one.

EDITed to clarify the CF+X1900 portion, not talking about using the X1950P for Xfire with X1900. Although technically it could still work since it's a question of disabled functional units (similar to pipelines) not a completely different implementation the way the X1800 and X1900 are.
 

Slobogob

Distinguished
Aug 10, 2006
1,431
0
19,280
The reason that that's the case is because they have the dual internal connector on every card;

1950pxfirebk0.jpg


So it's not BUS Xfire like the GTs and GTOs but still hardware support, but now each card has that ability.

Also it has nothing really to do with the OP's question, but it's the right way to go with hardware connected Xfire IMO.

As for the OP's question, the X1950 cards do work with the X1900 cards in Xfire, check out DH's review;

http://www.driverheaven.net/reviews/x1900x1950/index.htm

Still a little quirky overall as is the entire Xfire/SLi solution.

Seriously guys stop giving people advice based on your guesses, you cost people time and money and just look st00pid!

The first thing to remember is that Xfire doesn't have the same limitations as SLi, unbalanced cards is built into the setup, what you can't do however is match completely different chips designs (like the X1800 with an X1900 or X1600 card). Dont' think speeds or pipes (both can be off) think architecture.

And whomever said GDDR4 mattered needs to rethink that statement, it's abot as wise as saying you can't put a sapphire card in your rig because it's blue not red. :roll:

To the OP, I'm not a fan of XFire or SLi, and would suggest waiting for newer cards to come out, but if you got money to burn (which later comments seem to say you don't) then Xfire will show a boost, just not a huge one.
First you say they can go crossfire and then you say different chip designs can´t. The 1950 Pro is a RV 570 while the 1900XTX is a RV580. So the OPs proposal shouldn´t work, right?
 
First you say they can go crossfire and then you say different chip designs can´t. The 1950 Pro is a RV 570 while the 1900XTX is a RV580. So the OPs proposal shouldn´t work, right?

He's not Asking about X1900XTX + X1950Pro , but an X1900XTX + X1950 CROSSFIRE EDITION, as . Re-read first post (just use the scroll bar), or you could just look at the title of every post.

The 1950 Pro is a RV 570 while the 1900XTX is a RV580.

NO, the X1950Pro is an RV570, and the X1900XTX is an R580, mr Nitpicker. BTW, they still have the same underlying architcture just different amounts of functional units (like making an X850XT and X850 Pro).

If you would like me to refine my statement to help those of you who can't figure out the configuration of the chips that's fine, but it's up to each user to do their own research, and as to the question at hand it is possible, and should work, albeit just a buggy and funky as other Xfire and SLi.

BTW, why quote the whole thing including picture for your one sentence? :roll: