AS5 vs Ceramique

dean7

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I have a question:

What's the difference between AS5 and AS Ceramique? As far as I can tell, the stats on AS5 are better, and Ceramique costs a tiny bit more. So, what's the point of having Ceramique around? Why would you choose Ceramique over AS5?
 
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Something to do with the grit of the surface. PM wusy =) he knows
 

dean7

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Thanks... will do. I've been into PC hardware for a long time, but I've just started getting obsessed with OCing and cooling :D.
 
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Thats one of the bets part IMO!

Pushing the enveloppe, while keeping the hardware happy!
 

kryojenix

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Perhaps I am getting mixed up, but from memory...

(and I'm not going to the Arctic Silver website because I'm on dial-up and I don't have the bandwidth to spare just now)

...isn't Ceramique an actual glue for permanently cementing heatsinks to chips etc., whereas Arctic Silver 5 is just thermal grease for CPU/GPU where you may remove and reapply components quite often?
 

dean7

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No... they have AS Adhesive paste that is glue, but Ceramique is a different product (also built for CPUs as far as I can tell... nearly the same as AS5). I'm PMing Wusy now :D.
 

dean7

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Thats one of the bets part IMO!

Pushing the enveloppe, while keeping the hardware happy!
Yeah... I never wanted to OC before because I didn't want to risk system stability. But, with some of the cooling options these days you can OC and run just as cool as stock w/ stock cooling. So, might as well :D.
 
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stopped being lazy and searched the forum.
quick hint:

ANY liquid based thermal compund is better than the overpriced Arctic Silver 5.

Also surfaces above 1200grit quality is not suitable for AS5. This is where Arctic Ceramique dominates.

He'll give you a more detailed answer though
 

dean7

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stopped being lazy and searched the forum.
In my defense the search engine sucks. I tried searching for "PS3" when I knew that was in the topic of the thread I was looking for, and it got 0 results (and I was searching topic).
 
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i does suck, why cant you search Username AND keyword
:
Please specify either keywords or author for search, and not both.

I mean, how hard is it to do a SQL query on 2 row ARRGGGGHHH
 

I

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AS5 is supposed to be more expensive but a reseller can charge whatever they like, I suppose.

AS5 does have marginally better thermal transfer, but not enough to really matter, particularly on chips with a heat spreader. If you have an open flipchip, it matters the most but even then not enough to even get up and walk across a room to grab the AS5 if you already had the Ceramique in your hand.

AS5 is more trouble to clean up, for asthetic reasons- after wiping off Ceramique you dont' have the dull grey residue so visible as with AS5. AS5 is slightly capacitive but hopefully you won't put so much on that it'd matter. Ceramique is a handy field-polish for 'sinks, if you don't have the time or supplies on hand to lap a 'sink, vigorously rubbing some Ceramique against the sink will polish it and force some compound/metal mixture into the microscopic valleys of the 'sink base which is good.

It would be easy to simply state "AS5 is better" because of it's marginally better performance, but seldom (actually, never) should a part be that close to overheating that it should matter one way or the other, but by the same token, every tiny little benefit in cooling will additively contribute to lower temps, so if you have several sub-optimal things combined, it might be a few degrees higher temp which is most significant to overclockers.
 

dean7

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Well, I think the main difference is: particles in Ceramique are smaller than AS5.

AS5 now uses ceramique in it. The answer is simple: Ceramique particules are smaller than Silver particules so both in a single paste does cover much better holes between particules so there's more contact area/heat transfer. Also note that Ceramique isn't conductive at all and it does remove easily while Silver IS conductive and is recommended to use a special cleaner for it to be perfectly clean (remember that silver jewelry tend to rust so you have to clean) That covers it.

I've been trying to find extra information, and it appears as if Ceramique is the best for smoother surfaces, and AS5 is better suited for not-so-smooth HSF surfaces.
 

dean7

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i does suck, why cant you search Username AND keyword
:
Please specify either keywords or author for search, and not both.

I mean, how hard is it to do a SQL query on 2 row ARRGGGGHHH
Yeah, plus the fact that I've searched for something that I KNEW was the title and it came up w/ 0 records kind of ruins it's credibility. (for that PS3 one I ended up searching for "cell" in body text and for some reason that found it w/ no problems)
 

sirheck

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the thing is there is no super magic thermalpaste.

none that will drop your temps by more than a couple degrees.

ambient temps are the key. well and airflow too.
 

I

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Well, I think the main difference is: particles in Ceramique are smaller than AS5.

AS5 now uses ceramique in it. The answer is simple: Ceramique particules are smaller than Silver particules so both in a single paste does cover much better holes between particules so there's more contact area/heat transfer. Also note that Ceramique isn't conductive at all and it does remove easily while Silver IS conductive and is recommended to use a special cleaner for it to be perfectly clean (remember that silver jewelry tend to rust so you have to clean) That covers it.

I've been trying to find extra information, and it appears as if Ceramique is the best for smoother surfaces, and AS5 is better suited for not-so-smooth HSF surfaces.

The particle size difference is not significant enough to distinguish either as being more suitable for flatter surfaces. No compound you apply will be applied evenly enough and on flat enough surfaces that it's only one particle deep. If there's anything that matters most on flatter surfaces, it's that the compound have a slightly lower viscosity so it flows better, but for practical purposes we may be splitting hairs here, if the surfaces are not as flat as possible the solution is not a choice of thermal compound, it's to fix the surfaces or replace (them).

The overgeneralized idea that "AS5 now uses Ceramique in it", is more untrue than true. While they do have the same basic ingredients, obviously the key is the silver in the latter and different % ingredients. It'd be more accurate to say they're both built on the same base stock (synthetic oil).
 

chuckshissle

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Temperature. The AS5 is good for air cooling and water cooling. The Ceramique would be good for phase change, peltier and other sub-zero cooling methods. That's as far as I have notice, but I haven't tried the Ceramique for myself.
 

dean7

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Ceramique is good down to -150C, while AS5 is good down to -50C. Not many coolers will need to go below -50C.
Coke. Pepsi.
Yeah... I don't think any consumer-level products would need anywhere near -50c. And since Ceramique is a consumer-level product, it seems like this might not be the entire reason for it.
 

wun911

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one conducts one does not

i think the ceramique is used when you dont wait it to conduct. ie chipsets
and the as5 is used for cpu.