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8800GTX review on Tomshardware: am I missing something...?

Last response: in Graphics & Displays
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November 17, 2006 2:21:23 PM

I watched the two Oblivion-pictures on this page:
http://www.tomshardware.com/2006/11/08/geforce_8800/pag...

The conclusion is:
"This image is far superior in quality compared to that of the ATI."

But... they look the same to me! I can see they are not exactly the same (watch the grass near the horse's ear), but I cannot see any difference in qualityat all. Let alone 'far superior quality'!

Did someone make a mistake by posting two screenshots of the same GPU or do I need new glasses? ;) 
November 17, 2006 3:07:13 PM

Go with contacts actually.....glasses are so yesterday. :lol:  :lol: 
a b U Graphics card
November 17, 2006 3:35:46 PM

Quote:
Go with contacts actually
Contacts are sooooo 1990s. Go Lasik
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November 17, 2006 3:41:48 PM

I think you have it, the grass near the horse's ear is slightly different. Or was that the grass near the horse's rear is slightly different? Even with new glasses, the screen shots look the same to me. If that's the "extra" quality that the 8800 brings to the screen, I'll stay with my present card.
November 17, 2006 3:47:39 PM

I think this review was a bit slanted. Check for some other reviews and they do a far better job of reporting on this card's capabilities without bordering on fanboyism (and btw, I own an nVidia card and love it, I just don't like slanted reviews).

This is a better review IMO:
http://enthusiast.hardocp.com/article.html?art=MTIxOCwx...

In this review they pretty much say that nVidia has caught up to ATI in image quality, which is a fair statement.

Maybe this review + that holiday buyer's guide with a girl traipsing around in an elf suit is a sign of the THG apocalypse? ;) 
November 17, 2006 3:48:56 PM

They were IMO just bad examples. I could'nt see any difference either, but I have seen screens posted here on the forumz that look pretty damn good. Check the link. There aren't any comparisons, but these are some of the best Oblivion screens I've seen.



http://forumz.tomshardware.com/hardware/8800GTX-Oblivio...
November 17, 2006 3:51:41 PM

Damn, the pictures are gone. Sorry, I tried.
November 17, 2006 3:52:43 PM

sorry, don't know what happened.
November 17, 2006 3:55:18 PM

Guys, I have a feeling they simply screwed up and posted the same picture twice. If they say there's a significant difference between the two, then we should be able to see it naked eye; otherwise they look like biased idiots. It's really easy to screw up your web layout, so I'm betting that's what happened.
November 17, 2006 4:03:29 PM

It's evidently not the same picture, since there are many visible differences; the grass is not placed the same way, trees have moved, etc.

The G80 has a slightly better anisotropic filtering than the X1K series, and a much better one than the G7 series. As we were already near perfection with the X1K it's hard to do MUCH better. That TGH review is obviously a little biased in that regard.
November 17, 2006 4:34:36 PM

I see...I honestly only took a cursory glance at the two a few days ago and didn't notice a difference. Well, my bad... :oops: 
November 17, 2006 4:53:06 PM

You can only see what your hardware renders. I see a huge difference in those two pics with my HD monitor.
November 17, 2006 4:55:27 PM

I've got a Samsung 215TW at 1680 x 1050 right now...problem is, I'm also running a 9600XT. That should change in the next few days, though.
November 17, 2006 5:05:37 PM

I don't expect the pictures to look different when you've changed your videocard... Nothing has to be rendered anymore: the pixels are where they are and no card is going to change that. :? Maybe on a HD screen there are differences (???) but that would mean everyone with a middle of the road (or even better) monitor won't see any differences after upgrading to the 8800GTX...? So that 'far superior quality' would only be there for the happy few...
November 17, 2006 5:28:34 PM

Quote:
I don't expect the pictures to look different when you've changed your videocard... Nothing has to be rendered anymore: the pixels are where they are and no card is going to change that.


Not really, different chipsets have different capabilities.

The way Radeons and Geforces handle AF & AA are different, there are other subtle differences as well. In the Geforce 7x00, you would see texture shimmering problems at default settings...
November 17, 2006 5:33:03 PM

Meh? Oh...
November 17, 2006 5:41:47 PM

Quote:
screen shots are difficult to make much use of,mostly what is noticeable in those is differences in AA...


Some would argue that AA is not noticable, and useless... :roll:

Yeah, riiiight.... :twisted:

Couldn't resist.
a b U Graphics card
November 17, 2006 5:53:21 PM

Quote:
You can only see what your hardware renders. I see a huge difference in those two pics with my HD monitor.


What kinda of HD monitor, because my P260 finely tuned isn't showing any massive differences, and if you use a difference calculator which would show a 'HUGE' difference if they were even noticeable, doesn't show much at all.

So while I'd agree TFT vs CRT, but I'm looking at a top CRT and already ran them through Compressonator and Photoshop before. The differences are not big enough to be considered 'huge'.

Anywhoo, the issue was pretty well covered in a previous thread;
http://forumz.tomshardware.com/hardware/quot-superior-q...

The impressive thing is not the differences in the static images, but the performance differences that allow higher settings on the GF8800s, for the review though they were comparing similar resolutions and AA, and really the AF differences don't reflect a great difference, but it has been said the author meant when all factors are added together, HigherRes+AA+AF.
November 17, 2006 6:17:51 PM

Quote:
2x x1950xtx cards can do the best oblivion has to offer.the g80 is overkill for that game.


The g80 is NOT overkill for that game. Hmm...2x x1950xtx's at ~$800, or one 8800gtx at ~$650. And it still only manages about 40 frames in outdoor scenes at standard 17/19" LCD res.

To say that nvidia has caught up to ATi in image quality is pretty fair, but saying the 8800GTX is overkill for a game that it can only manage about 40 frames in isn't.
November 17, 2006 7:44:56 PM

Yeah they do look basically the same in terms of image quality.
There are differences when looking at the rocks and the grass adjacent them on the X1950XTX screenshot. Obviously, if you look hard enough, you'll spot the variances.
There's nothing significant between the two. Certainly while playing the game, it shouldn't even be noticeable.

Oh, and who still rides horses? Fast travel is where it's at. 8O

I was really leaning towards upgrading my X1950XTX to a 8800GTS, but from that review I can see it truly isn't worth it.
November 17, 2006 8:48:58 PM

Quote:
I think you have it, the grass near the horse's ear is slightly different. Or was that the grass near the horse's rear is slightly different? Even with new glasses, the screen shots look the same to me. If that's the "extra" quality that the 8800 brings to the screen, I'll stay with my present card.


When it comes to GPU reviews stay away from tomshardware. :roll: As for everything else its a cool site.


I actually just upgraded from a X1900XT to a 8800 GTX and as good as OB looked on the 1900 it looks that much better on the GTX from the improved levels of AA and AF along with better colors and what seems to be better hdr.

Why tomshardware chose a dark picture for comparison I will never know :roll:

When I get home I will try to post comparisons from my old card to my new card for you as I have both saved on my PC.
November 17, 2006 8:55:47 PM

Quote:
2x x1950xtx cards can do the best oblivion has to offer.the g80 is overkill for that game.


The g80 is NOT overkill for that game. Hmm...2x x1950xtx's at ~$800, or one 8800gtx at ~$650. And it still only manages about 40 frames in outdoor scenes at standard 17/19" LCD res.

To say that nvidia has caught up to ATi in image quality is pretty fair, but saying the 8800GTX is overkill for a game that it can only manage about 40 frames in isn't.

what i am saying is the game wont look any better with the g80.for that you can get one xtx1950 and settle for a moderate amount of jerkiness,my 1900gt is maxxed on that game and the jerkiness is more than on a xtx but its so minimal it doesnt matter.

point is the g80 makes oblivion look old already.the next games will be alot more immersive with graphics.

My point is that it is the first single GPU solution to be able to play the most demanding games out there on max settings and not get any lag. For most people, the amount of graphical quality difference (minimal) isn't what they're after, it is framerates.

And for reference, I run a 7900gt and I get jerky gameplay in NWN2 and I hate it. Am I going to buy an 8 series card to fix it? No. But when you're looking at an x1900xtx versus an 8800GTS, which are similarly priced and the gts outperforms it and gives you better image quality, the choice is pretty obvious.

Granted, the next generation of games are probably going to kick its ass, but at least for a while you'll be ahead of the curve ;) 
November 17, 2006 9:43:34 PM

Quote:
sorry, don't know what happened.


Those were my pics :wink: I will post them again for all to see.
November 17, 2006 9:56:35 PM

Thanks, I was disappointed to see them gone.
November 17, 2006 10:10:46 PM

Quote:

saying the 8800GTX is overkill for a game that it can only manage about 40 frames in isn't.


Once again utter and complete bs from tomshardware.com :roll: they are the only morons I know of who recorded that low of a FPS at just 1024X768res:roll:

I am about to post pics of OB running on my new 8800GTX. I have it at 1280X1024 with 8aa-16aa and 16af+hdr and the driver settings on high quality.

The in game options are totally and competely maxed out and as you can see I am shattering 40fps.




Hang on! more to come as I wait on stupid photobucket :roll:
November 17, 2006 10:19:45 PM





This one was with 16XAA the rest are 8XAA :wink:




November 17, 2006 11:03:42 PM

The general consensus on the web is that Toms Hardware reviews fukcing suck ass. Most of it stems from one of the more famous reviews that Toms did of the FX 5800 Ultra.

Brute force attack against the King

Millions were appalled by this review. Toms Hardware crowned the FX5800Ultra graphics King over the ATi 9700Pro, and the review was written by Lars "Wiener" Weinand, Long time nVidiot, and owner of the RivaStation nVidia fan site :roll:

Here's the proof.


It was a shameful time to be associated with Toms, but luckily back then, the forums weren't "Google linked", and we were pretty much a secret society.

Things have changed a lot since then, Lars ran off to join ATi Corporate(go figure :roll: ) and we have good impartial reviewers like Cleeve who is stuck cleaning up the mess, and dealing with the negativity that "Borsti" left in his wake.

While no review site is free from the occasional "grumblings" of enthusiast readers, Toms has come a long way in terms of respect, and seeing Cleeve travel to other forums to get input and deal with the "Toms sucks" bullshit that he receives, makes me feel safe to once again recommend Tom's reviews to people outside our circle, something I never would have foreseen happening.
November 17, 2006 11:04:38 PM

Quote:

When I get home I will try to post comparisons from my old card to my new card for you as I have both saved on my PC.


Now that's what I'd like to see, comparrison shots from an average enthusiast's computer. Then I can see how good the difference might be on my computer. I don't plan of buying a 8800 right now, as I want the R600 to come out so I can see some benchmarks, but with the comparrison shots, I can at least get primed for what waits ahead.
November 17, 2006 11:13:48 PM

*edit*

Fukcing forum lag. Cheap ass site cant afford a server that will keep up.

It's lame waiting 10 min. to post something and have it go through :roll:
November 17, 2006 11:31:58 PM

This particular page in this thread has been giving me problems. It takes almost 5min to load the page.
November 18, 2006 12:05:19 AM

Quote:
This particular page in this thread has been giving me problems. It takes almost 5min to load the page.


Me too. Did my pics Fuk it up? To much for tomshardware pos server to handle?
November 18, 2006 3:21:21 AM

WTH? I see them just fine...........
November 18, 2006 3:57:53 AM

Try deleting cookies.....or Internet Explorer.
a b U Graphics card
November 18, 2006 4:21:14 AM

I think all your NFS carbon pics brought that topic to a crawl. At least that was my theory as Anytime I clicked to view all, it was a given it would be a while.
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