Scenes From the Surface Pro Launch at the Microsoft Store

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PUPPLESAN

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I am a die-hard Windows lover and a "real" windows tablet sounds very appealing to me. Why? Because I like tablets as toys and I like tablets as ultra-portable computers but I dislike the feeling of futility that comes whenever and inevitably I try to use a tablet to do work. Sure I can do basic word-processing on an iPad and then transfer it to my PC but I can't, for example, show a customer my latest MS Access project or run SQL Server. And of course the idea of a tablet running SQL Server might sound like a Prius towing a freight train, but then again it might only sound that way because all of us have come to understand tablets as devices of very limited power. What is exciting to me about the Surface Pro is that it just might be the first big step towards radically altering our understanding of what a tablet device can do.
 

nonoitall

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I watched the video, and take away the brand names/logos and I'd swear this was an Apple event. :-D

Interviewer: Why did you go with the Surface Pro?
Person 1: The pen!
Person 2: The kickstand!
Person 3: It's pretty!
 

The_Trutherizer

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Well it's definitely a nice device. And what has recently caught my attention is the security concerns around other brands. At least with Windows it should be fairly secure.. Even if most malware targets windows they do have the experience to deal with it.
 

belardo

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Hey... didn't Apple patent the "Apple Store"? Other than the cheesy MS Logo and different color shirts... its an Apple store without Apple stuff.

60 people?! BWahahaha.... only one in the whole country... and it sells out?! LAME!
There are about 30 stores in the USA... any lines there? (doubt it).

Apple sells millions of units in 2-3 days... then sell out. MS sells a few thousand?

Win8 = fail
Win8 phone = warmish fail
Win8 RT = fail
Win8 Pro tablet = will fail
Windows logo = fail
Office 2013 = failing

microsoft = fail.
 
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Gosh, belardo...pretty harsh. I'm sure the Surface is another craptastic product from Windoze!
 

supr

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looks like a decent option as a fast tablet/mid range laptop, will eagerly await the incoming flood of reviews
 

PUPPLESAN

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Surface kicks the rotting core right out of Apple and onto Steve Jobs' grave! In fact it knocks all the fruit off of every tree in the orchard and then infects the denuded shrubbery with aphids and burns the whole farm to the ground!

Anyone who buys an Apple product is terrorist untermensch deserving of a slow and horrible death. Right next to my Steve Balmer portrait I have a score card of Apple's epic failz and every time another one happens I squeeze a facial pustule to celebrate.

My "mother" bough an Apple product once in 1986 and I have never talked to her since. I think she's living on the street in Buffalo these days. A lot of good that Macintosh is doing you now, huh mom! Keeps youu nice and warn don't it?

Ha! ha! ha! ha!

And by the way, I hope that with this, my latest post, I have finally lived up to the maturity level of the average troll posting here. I certainly hope so anyway.
 

killerclick

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[citation][nom]supr[/nom]looks like a decent option as a fast tablet/mid range laptop, will eagerly await the incoming flood of reviews[/citation]

Reviews are already out and they're not good (mostly complaints about poor battery life, weight and the inability to use the kickstand on your lap comfortably).

 

damianrobertjones

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@killerclick
- I was under the impression that the reviews were mainly positive
- Poor battery life? 6 hours web surfing is possible and more if the power profile is tweaked?
- Don't people carry their laptops? This things isn't heavy unless you're very weak
- Can you use a normal tablet on your lap? Yes, you can. Just like the Pro. The kickstand is for using on a desk.
 

belardo

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I saw something else in these pictures...
The 60 guys are perhaps not only the ONLY people in Canada that actually bought a microsoft tablet, they are all virgins. Okay, there is a woman in 1 pic - but she drove the customer there.
 

belardo

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[citation][nom]nunya124[/nom]Gosh, belardo...pretty harsh. I'm sure the Surface is another craptastic product from Windoze![/citation]
I don't like win8, its but-ugly 80's retread, no talent garbage. What a waste of good programming from UI dept who made this shit and the middle & upper management retards who signed off on it.

My ex-GF totally hates win8, about several times more so. She gave it 5 minutes. My GF could care less as she mostly uses her Android phone and a few sites on my desktop. *sigh* So young women can like or hate Win8 too (both in their late 20s) but very few people are wetting their panties for Win8.

I tried to like it, I tried to use it for months... without thinking "What moron came up with this crap?"
 

blakbird24

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[citation][nom]killerclick[/nom]Reviews are already out and they're not good (mostly complaints about poor battery life, weight and the inability to use the kickstand on your lap comfortably).[/citation]

Yeah what reviews are you reading? I guess iPad users might have those complaints since they wouldn't even know what to with the thing.

...but those of us for whom the Surface Pro is exactly what we've been waiting for, none of the items you mentioned are even on our radar. 4-6 hours battery is a beautiful thing when you are able to actually DO STUFF (I couldn't for the life of me figure out what to do with an iPad for its 8 hours of battery). Weight and kickstand? Really? These are not the concerns of real men.
 

belardo

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An update and counter post against the MS-hired marketing drones:

60 people?! BWahahaha.... only one in the whole country... and it sells out?! LAME!
There are about 30 stores in the USA... any lines there? (doubt it).

Apple sells millions of units in 2-3 days... then sell out. MS sells a few thousand?

Win8 = fail
Win8 phone = warmish fail
Win8 RT = fail
Win8 Pro tablet = will fail
Windows logo = fail
Office 2013 = failing
Micirosoft stores = Clone store, the biggest Apple copy-cat in the world.

microsoft = fail.

Monkey Man Ballmer needs to step down... as a real chimpanzee could do a better job.

MS has lost so much market share... they have become irrelevant. As more and more people notice, its going to get worse and worse for that company. No, MS will and should not DIE... they should be a much smaller company... maybe they'll learn to innovate someday.
 

belardo

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[citation][nom]damianrobertjones[/nom]@killerclick- I was under the impression that the reviews were mainly positive- Poor battery life? 6 hours web surfing is possible and more if the power profile is tweaked?- Don't people carry their laptops? This things isn't heavy unless you're very weak- Can you use a normal tablet on your lap? Yes, you can. Just like the Pro. The kickstand is for using on a desk.[/citation]

I've done some tradeshows with out ipad-1, and it was a life-saver compared to using any of our ThinkPads. Easier to show clients and other business people information / presentation. And yes... when YOU ARE on your feet for 7~9 hours... every pound is noticeable. So 6 hours on a low-lit screen is supposed to impress anyone? I don't get the kick-stand complaint thing either... but hey, you can't expect much from an idiot, eh?

So for many peoples needs.... the Slate devices are (1) expensive at $800~1200 (2) heavy (3) hotter (4) short battery life (5) Noisier... hell, people from the PC world have been bitching about the high price of the iPad at $500... WTF?! But $1000 is cool?!

Perhaps in 2-3 years, tablets DO replace the Desktop as the main computer... who knows? But for the typical human being... a basic tablet with iOS and Android does everything thing need.... email/ facebook and porn.
 

blakbird24

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[citation][nom]belardo[/nom]I've done some tradeshows with out ipad-1, and it was a life-saver compared to using any of our ThinkPads. Easier to show clients and other business people information / presentation. And yes... when YOU ARE on your feet for 7~9 hours... every pound is noticeable. So 6 hours on a low-lit screen is supposed to impress anyone? I don't get the kick-stand complaint thing either... but hey, you can't expect much from an idiot, eh?So for many peoples needs.... the Slate devices are (1) expensive at $800~1200 (2) heavy (3) hotter (4) short battery life (5) Noisier... hell, people from the PC world have been bitching about the high price of the iPad at $500... WTF?! But $1000 is cool?!Perhaps in 2-3 years, tablets DO replace the Desktop as the main computer... who knows? But for the typical human being... a basic tablet with iOS and Android does everything thing need.... email/ facebook and porn.[/citation]

More comparisons to the iPad.

For God's sake people, get a clue. Comparing Surface Pro to ANY iPad is like comparing a 50ft offshore race boat to an inflatable raft. They both float...and that's where the similarities end. The Pro opens up an entire UNIVERSE that until now was completely inaccessible to tablets.
 

amdwilliam1985

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[citation][nom]belardo[/nom]An update and counter post against the MS-hired marketing drones:60 people?! BWahahaha.... only one in the whole country... and it sells out?! LAME!There are about 30 stores in the USA... any lines there? (doubt it).Apple sells millions of units in 2-3 days... then sell out. MS sells a few thousand?Win8 = failWin8 phone = warmish failWin8 RT = failWin8 Pro tablet = will failWindows logo = failOffice 2013 = failingMicirosoft stores = Clone store, the biggest Apple copy-cat in the world.microsoft = fail.Monkey Man Ballmer needs to step down... as a real chimpanzee could do a better job.MS has lost so much market share... they have become irrelevant. As more and more people notice, its going to get worse and worse for that company. No, MS will and should not DIE... they should be a much smaller company... maybe they'll learn to innovate someday.[/citation]

haha, nice story.
For some reason I felt Apple is dying faster. Most of my friends are switching to Samsung Galaxy phones, either S3 or Note 2. As far as tablet goes, when they see what Surface Pro can do(with office and windows 7 applications), they will dump their iPads faster than Apple can drop from $750/share to $450/share, haha, lol, haha.

The world can easily move on without apple and facebook, the world can't survive without Microsoft and/or Google.
 
[citation][nom]belardo[/nom]I've done some tradeshows with out ipad-1, and it was a life-saver compared to using any of our ThinkPads. Easier to show clients and other business people information / presentation. And yes... when YOU ARE on your feet for 7~9 hours... every pound is noticeable. So 6 hours on a low-lit screen is supposed to impress anyone? I don't get the kick-stand complaint thing either... but hey, you can't expect much from an idiot, eh?So for many peoples needs.... the Slate devices are (1) expensive at $800~1200 (2) heavy (3) hotter (4) short battery life (5) Noisier... hell, people from the PC world have been bitching about the high price of the iPad at $500... WTF?! But $1000 is cool?!Perhaps in 2-3 years, tablets DO replace the Desktop as the main computer... who knows? But for the typical human being... a basic tablet with iOS and Android does everything thing need.... email/ facebook and porn.[/citation]
Everything has a use. Tablets in general are oversized cell phones that can't make phone calls. They are slow and generally not much more useful than the phones they are designed around (save for the added screen size). They are so close to useful that I just find them really frustrating to use. All of my friends have iPads, and you know what happens with them? They are used for 1-2 months, then they hit a wall where it simply does not do enough to replace the use of other machines, so they end up just using the more capable machines (desktop/laptop) rather than switching between devices all the time. Then a new iPad or iOS version comes out, so they buy it hoping it will be better... only to find it does the same stuff faster, but does nothing to replace their existing devices, so it ultimately sits around again. I am not saying that tablets are entirely useless; They are great for movies on the go, or displaying presentations in a coffee shop (why don't laptops have such nice screens!!!), or for a little kid's first computer, but when it comes to doing heavier work where you need to multitask and run older programs along side newer ones, then you simply need heftier hardware and a beefier OS to get everything to work together.

As to your points:
1) Yes, they are expensive, but not expensive for what you are getting (more on that later)

2) They are not too heavy. These are to replace laptops/ultrabooks, not to compete with existing tablets. For the market they are aiming for they are actually quite light weight.

3) Hotter and Hot are two different things. Yes, they run warm, but 'hot' would be stretching things a bit. Running skype or GPS on my cell phone gets hotter than these. It is warm... but not hot, and certainly not 'too hot'

4) For battery life, again, this is not to compete with other tablets, this competes with laptops. 6 hours of use is plenty fine for what it is. I would love to see it hit 10 hours on the Haswell version later this year, but at 6 hours of up time I would not give it a 2nd thought. Most laptops and netbooks that I have used have gotten 2-5 hours of use, so 6 hours is hardly a problem.

5) Noise is a little bit of a valid concern, but what are you going to do? It is a laptop without the space of a laptop, it is going to make some heat, which needs to get out somehow. But even then it is still quieter than most laptops that it would replace, so it is not a major concern... but to have it silent would be better. Again, Haswell may bring power down to where passive cooling may begin to be possible.

6) And lastly, for price? There is a reason people complain about a $500 iPad; The iPad only has some $250 worth of parts in it. I understand business, and needing to have some markup on a product, but more than 100% markup? That is insane! And when you get to the iPads with more storage space then you are looking at a near 200% markup, which is absolutely incredulous. But the ignorant masses think it is somehow OK, so it sells just fine.
The SurfaceRT is also far too expensive for what it is. RT costs more to build than an iPad (mostly due to volume), but we are still only talking about something that should be a $3-400 product, and considering that MS gets a cut of every program sold on the platform they should be selling it at cost to quickly build their user base. But they cant do that because it would undercut all of their partners who are already mad at them for taking away business.
Then you look at the Surface Pro, which has (and this is an admittedly blind guess) ~$700-800 of hardware inside, which is selling for $1000. That is a much more understandable ~40% markup. Still expensive... but not super expensive for what it is. I would love to see a much cheaper (and passively cooled) $5-600 Atom version running full win8 as I would never pay $1000 for something that can easily walk away, but considering what you are getting I think it is selling for a pretty good price point.


As for the win8 interface: Grow up. Sure, it is not perfect and there is quite a bit of room to grow, but it is hardly awful. If you like the desktop then there are desktop programs for everything, so you can live in desktop all day long and never see the start screen. In fact, if you set your computer to sleep rather than shutting down, then you NEVER have to see metro as it will immediately go to wherever you were last before you hit the sleep button, just pin your programs to the task bar and it is not a problem. As for metro itself, it is admittedly not for everyone, but it is not terrible either. I remember when win95 came out with he start menu... that was a much harder transition, ant it took until win7 for them to get it right. The win8 start screen is at least more along the lines of the win98 start menu, and now with he windows Blue initiative I think we will see it evolve and become useful much sooner than the start menu ever did. Personally I upgraded to win8 for reasons other than metro, and hardly use that part of it, but when I do have to use it I have generally had a pleasant experience... the downfall of the start menu for me is that there are simply no native apps that replace the desktop versions (other than the windows games). If they evolve Xbox to a service rather than a hardware platform with the next Xbox, and they offer real xbox games for the PC then this would entirely change things for me.

As for the future of the desktop, I don't think it will be doomed in 2-3 years, but absolutely within the next 10. And even then the desktop does not simply 'go away' completely. The desktop will slowly transition to a personal cloud device which will provide bulk/shared storage and extra CPU and GPU compute power to smaller devices on the network. These smaller portable devices will then be your front end for your computer, security, HVAC and other systems in your home. And if you need keys and mice, or a monitor/TV then you can have that as well with simple wireless connections. So down the road you will have 1 desktop/server for your typical house (PC gamers and hardware junkies excluded of course), and then 1 portable device per person.
The really interesting thing though is that I think that ultimately you end up with cell phones and desktops, with the occasional tablet. I think that laptops as a general form factor will die out, and I think that tablets will largely be replaced by phones except for individuals who need that larger screen or some more portable horsepower than a phone will be able to deliver in the future. So I think that tablets ultimately become more of a business or industrial piece of equipment, while handheld pocket-sized devices end up ruling the day.
For my own experience, I finally picked up my first smart phone in December and it has completely replaced all of my portable devices, and (other than my netbook and laptop) it is actually better than all of my other portable devices. I know this would not work for everyone (especially on today's hardware), but I have a good desktop at home and in the office, so my phone is just fine for my portable needs, and future phones are only going to get better.
The problem with a tablet (for me at least) is that I need my phone anyways, so a tablet becomes redundant. I think that manufacturers believed people would want a tablet AND a phone, and the reality is that most people want one or the other, or at least one phone per person and then the tablet becomes more of a shared device.

At any rate, if I was a portable professional, and it came to a choose between an ARM based tablet, an x86 tablet, and a traditional notebook/ultrabook I would choose the x86 tablet any day of the week. It is smaller and lighter than a laptop without sacrificing much performance while costing about the same, but it is more useful than an ARM tablet. As it stands I don't need/want one of any brand, but if I did then the Surface Pro would be right up there as a top choice.
 

belardo

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[citation][nom]blakbird24[/nom]More comparisons to the iPad. For God's sake people, get a clue. Comparing Surface Pro to ANY iPad is like comparing a 50ft offshore race boat to an inflatable raft. They both float...and that's where the similarities end. The Pro opens up an entire UNIVERSE that until now was completely inaccessible to tablets.[/citation] In what way?

As long as you can browse the web, facebook and do office applications of some sort - it works. All tablets can work with a dock or wireless keyboard of some sort. So there is nothing earth-shattering about the microsoft tablet.

I still use my desktop more than anything, I use my almost iPad daily.... its also a great toilet device. There have been Windows7 tablets out for years at the $1000~1400 price point... they never ever sold great numbers. Win8 does not change much. The consumer market will not pay $1000~1400 for a tablet. The PC world is dominated by the low-cost... hence, its the $300~500 notebooks and desktops that sell by the millions. In reality, that is enough for most people.

Will a tablet be THE computer of the future, with data in a cloud? I think its possible. But maybe more so... the phone is the ultimate device, and when you can set it down and it controls your TV or a display (which we have to some extent)... then that will be a game changer....

When the Cellphone has the horse power of an i5-3k CPU, limitless data access, easy control of another device (tablet / desktop / tv).

But the people who are STILL wetting their panties for the surfacePro are computer geeks. All that horse power in a slate just doesn't matter. Battery life does still matter. Many many people use their notebooks with the AC plug-used. Why? because of typical 2~4hr life span (lower for cheaper PCs) and performance as the notebook has to clock down to get more batter life.

MS plan may or maynot work... their incompetence doesn't show success.
 

belardo

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[citation][nom]caedenv[/nom]As for the win8 interface: Grow up. Sure, it is not perfect and there is quite a bit of room to grow, but it is hardly awful. If you like the desktop then there are desktop programs for everything, so you can live in desktop all day long and never see the start screen. In fact, if you set your computer to sleep rather than shutting down, then you NEVER have to see metro ~~~ blah blah[/citation]
We've all already gone over this crap. The $0~5 Start Menu replacements, etc.

People typically DO NOT want to spend money to fix something they already bought. Metro isn't the only problem. The desktop interface is crap. The "windows 8 keyboard" designed to make things easier, shows the design flaws of Win8. is it a touch UI, a mouse UI a keyboard UI? Touch screens for desktop is STUPID.... but sensible for a phone or tablet.

If Win8 was an amazing success that everyone loves - WE would NOT be talking about how much people don't like Windows 8. It doesn't matter how much MS marketing or web-drones hype Win8, in the real world... most people don't like it or simply just deal with it.

Metro is here to stay, simple as that. Its not needed. MS is becoming irrelevant. Other than a life-support system for MS-Office and Quicken, pretty much anything else can be done on ANY computer: MacOS, iOS, Android, Linux and even an Amiga.

A pro who needs a workstation will never be able to use a tablet for video editing/3D Rendering/programming, etc. And there are non Windows computers which already do such things.
 

belardo

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Its still pictures of 60 virgin geeks at a Apple-clone MS store. By line-standards... Microsoft is a joke.

I've notice more and more PCs without the MS-Windows sticker... because who cares?

In 6 months, we'll know exactly HOW good or HOW BAD Microsoft / Windows / surface / phones are doing.
 
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