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Amd person thinking of going Intel

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November 26, 2006 2:53:32 PM

I have build Amd systems since the dx2 33 .. Saying that and my age now :)  i am thinking of going intel with the core2 chip.
Either the Intel Core 2 Duo E6600 Conroe or the e4400.
I am totally lost when it comes to intel chips.
Any help on what is best motherboard for these and vid card and even case and memory.
I am a gamer.. Play alot of WOW and other first person games.. do some video editing etc.
what i have picked so far is this but dont know if it is any good ?
E6600
or
E6400
The motherboard i am lost on.. read alot of reviews but all seam to have there issues in some area or the other.. was looking at a couple
GIGABYTE GA-965G-DS3 Socket T
and
ASUS P5B Socket T
System memory i am not for sure was looking at this ?
OCZ Platinum 2GB (2 x 1GB) 240-Pin DDR2 SDRAM DDR2 800
case i dont really care about looks just want something that will give enough power and be cool (not for sure if cooling is as much a issue like it was with amd) Was looking at this case
Antec PERFORMANCE TX TX1050B Black Steel ATX Mid Tower Computer Case 500W ATX12V v2.0 Power Supply
Video i am not sure about there is so many options for that also. Maybe around the 300-400 range or cheaper
Was going to go with like a 200gig sata i have alot of drives so not really a big issue.
Any help or suggestions would be really great guys/gals
Thx in advace
bob
November 26, 2006 3:01:50 PM

whats the price range? i just put one up for like 3300 and its a rocket
November 26, 2006 3:08:33 PM

was thinking about 1000-2000 range depends on what i can get the wife to agree with :p  i need a system together then talk with wife about it if you know what i mean :) 
And i have monitor etc. so just tower is what i am wanting to build
Related resources
a c 90 B Homebuilt system
a b å Intel
a b À AMD
November 26, 2006 3:12:50 PM

Quote:
Was going to go with like a 200gig sata i have alot of drives so not really a big issue.
What all do you want to move over to your new system?
Nearly all the 965 C2D motherboards have limited support for older IDE drives - as in 2 IDE (1 DVD and 1 HD for example). If you have more IDE drives you want to carry over into the new system you might want to look at 975 motherboards. Some of them have 2 IDE channels (4 devices).
Any idea if you want to overclock your system? It makes a difference in what motherboard, RAM & CPU combo's get recommended.
November 26, 2006 3:13:48 PM

sure do, for the motherboard i would say that Gigabyte, im sick of Asus way over rated in my opinion E6400 is a good chip, with the E6600 though your Cache will go from 2MB shared to 4MB shared for memory i've never really messed with OCZ i use Corsair and Gskill, but i guess thats just preference thats the main stuff, other miniscule things are kinda just whateveryou wanna get
November 26, 2006 3:16:01 PM

Quote:
Was going to go with like a 200gig sata i have alot of drives so not really a big issue.
What all do you want to move over to your new system?
Nearly all the 965 C2D motherboards have limited support for older IDE drives - as in 2 IDE (1 DVD and 1 HD for example). If you have more IDE drives you want to carry over into the new system you might want to look at 975 motherboards. Some of them have 2 IDE channels (4 devices).
Any idea if you want to overclock your system? It makes a difference in what motherboard, RAM & CPU combo's get recommended.

i have 1 IDE on my 680 i have 2 DVD RW's and i have my HD's hooked up to Sata 3 but i guess its what he needs
November 26, 2006 3:20:38 PM

Right now i have a dvd burner and a couple of ide hard drives 120 gigx2
but drives are cheap enough i could get a sata and slave one drive from the burner.
November 26, 2006 3:42:01 PM

generally Geforce=better image ATI=faster

currently the Geforce 8800 series though is fastest out there
a c 90 B Homebuilt system
a b å Intel
a b À AMD
November 26, 2006 4:09:14 PM

The most performance improvement between the two video cards will come with the higher clocks and less because of the 512MB vs 256MB video RAM. If you're monitor uses 1600x1200 resolution or above the 512MB becomes more useful. At 1280x1024 resolution the 256MB X1950XT is a good match.

To give you some confidence in making a list of hardware you can always look at the guides out there such as this one: Intel High-End Platform Nov 2006
There are also upgrades, options as well as AMD systems to look over.
Since you have a monitor and peripherals you can easily find something in your budget range.

If you're thinking about overclocking the CPU mention that - as it makes a difference in how the final recommendations shake out.
November 26, 2006 4:34:50 PM

Thx so far guys for your help.. it will prob take a couple of days for me to get a good list of hardware.. i can only do this once so i have to be carefull on what i pick..
I was looking at this vid eVGA 640-P2-N821-AR GeForce 8800GTS 640MB 320-bit GDDR3 PCI Express x16 HDCP
But it makes me choke just thinking about spending that much on a vid card.
As far as what i have so far was this
mem
mobo
vid
cpu
case.. Dont know if it is good enough ?

Anthing so far i should change ?
November 26, 2006 4:42:44 PM

Quote:
generally Geforce=better image ATI=faster

currently the Geforce 8800 series though is fastest out there


Actually, it's the other way around ATI=better image,faster Nvidia=less heat
November 26, 2006 5:10:47 PM

as far as image goes Nvidia is king ATI aims towards high FPS Graphics Nvidia focusus on Good shades and a more "Lifelike" picture

For example, look at this picture http://radekhulan.cz/img/1/20060130-kvalita-ati-nvidia.jpg

the Nvidia sample is better shaded and looks more real

the ATI is quite a bit lighter and less shading
November 26, 2006 5:13:29 PM

i have the 8800GTX, i get better performance then a 7900GX2 in FEAR with no AA 4xAF and 1280x1024 res i get a max 305 FPS an average of 146 and 75 at lowest it screams
November 26, 2006 5:31:27 PM

The biggest advantage of using the newer 8800 series cards is the ability to render DirectX/10 once Vista is installed, also the advanced 3D imaging is a added bonus,
This is in addition to the much increased fps available with the 8800 series cards.
The E6300 or E6400 cpu is a logical choice, if your trying to keep up with the 8800 series card just forget about it now, the quad-core 6700 chokes trying to catch up, it's that fast and that powerful.
The GTS can be had for less than $500 if ya shop around, but it will be the best money you ever spent on graphics and guarantees compatibility with next years games.
November 26, 2006 5:36:47 PM

Quote:
generally Geforce=better image ATI=faster

currently the Geforce 8800 series though is fastest out there


I'm sure it's that ATi have had the better image quality, and the better performance recently!

Or maybe that's just me.
November 26, 2006 5:43:05 PM

Quote:
wheres your hat dawg?

I know huh, can't decide on a style....
either a texas cow-dog or the brama-bull brim
November 26, 2006 5:44:17 PM

ok i think i will go with the 8800 thx
you think this mobo will work out well ?
MSI P965 Platinum Socket T (LGA 775) Intel P965 Express ATX Intel Motherboard
and mem i am going to get CORSAIR XMS2 DOMINATOR 2GB (2 x 1GB) 240-Pin DDR2 SDRAM DDR2 800 (PC2 6400)
and cpu Intel Core 2 Duo E6400 Conroe 2.13GHz 2M sharing L2 Cache LGA 775 Processor
dont know if i will really notice a difrence with the Intel Core 2 Duo E6600 Conroe 2.4GHz 4M sharing L2 Cache LGA 775 Processor
i am stuck on what case and power supply.. dont know if i should get a case that comes with a power supply or not seams they are cheaper ones that come with cases ?
November 26, 2006 5:50:16 PM

for the most part looks good, however in the Core 2 E6600 you will have a little more flexibility in overclocking and you can never get enough cache :wink: as for the PSU and case, buy them seperately unless you want horrible stability and a PSU thats gonna fry in 2 the rest looks pretty good.
November 26, 2006 6:00:23 PM

Quote:
I am totally lost when it comes to intel chips.

Biggest difference from the recent AMD systems is probably the presence of a Front Side Bus (FSB). On the bright side, if you're willing to wait a year, the FSB should go away. :wink: Intel is also going to use an integrated memory controller eventually.

What is your current system? You didn't describe it ...

Quote:
Any help on what is best motherboard for these and vid card and even case and memory.

In the case of motherboards, you may actually want to wait and see what is coming out in the next month or two or three. Nvidia is already shipping the high end of their new Intel 600i series chipset. Motherboards based on the Nvidia 680i are very expensive though. (~$250 US) Hopefully in December or early January mobos based on the 650i Ultra will show up. FWIW, the 650i supports 4 PATA devices so we may actually see 650i motherboards that have two IDE connectors on them. Be still my PATA-using heart! :) 

AMD/ATI also has a new chipset coming out in the near future. I don't really know anything about it, but any added purchasing options for a Core 2 motherboard are always appreciated.

Quote:
Was going to go with like a 200gig sata i have alot of drives so not really a big issue.

Watch the sales. In particular, Frys.com seems to have very good prices on retail SATA drives every few weeks or so. FWIW, I'm partial to Seagate but only because their drives come with a 5 year warranty. Other manufacturers are more like 3 years or even as little as 1 year.

There is also the PATA->SATA bridge dongle route. Works for some people. Sometimes.

-john, the redundant legacy dinosaur
November 26, 2006 6:05:46 PM

Quote WR2:
Any idea if you want to overclock your system? It makes a difference in what motherboard, RAM & CPU combo's get recommended.

Quote WR2:
If you're thinking about overclocking the CPU mention that - as it makes a difference in how the final recommendations shake out.

One last time bobh...
November 26, 2006 6:11:51 PM

I wasnt really thinking about over clocking the system.. usually runs fine for what i do at defaults.. plus i am always afraid of damaging the componets..
November 26, 2006 6:21:16 PM

yeah Overclocking isnt bad, and eVGA doesnt void there warranty if you Overclock, and they actually support the Overclocking of their Cards basically its tinker here tinker there system wont boot and resets itself so you lower it a bit and keep trying to go higher if you go to high it wont hurt your components (unless you turn the voltages way the hell up) they just wont start and most motherboards will automatically go back to the systems defaults to get it to boot and u can go into BIOS and try it again, its a good time killer and is actually pretty cool seeing your 3dMark scores go up by 1,000-1500 just because you raised your clock speeds and they all work
November 26, 2006 6:31:30 PM

thats too small, your 8800 probably wont fit. try a full size case, i use the regular CM stacker its huge, but it keeps my components cool, 1 fan pushing in 2 out the power supply would be fine you wont need more then 700 W with your system but its always safe to have extra, so i would say stick with it
a c 90 B Homebuilt system
a b å Intel
a b À AMD
November 26, 2006 9:46:15 PM

The OCZ 700W is overkill unless you're thinking about running two high power video cards in SLI or Crossfire mode.

If you're still looking at the E6600, MSI Platinum MB and X1950XT video card something in the 500w-600w PSU would be fine. That Antec PerformanceTX and 500wPSU would work fine. So would the Thermaltake Matrix case with a PSU like Antec True Power Trio 550W $85 after rebate

C2D CPUs have a reputation for high overclocking ability. Even a mild overclocking of the E6600 can get you the same CPU performance as the $975 X6800 CPU. A real bargin for the $308 price of the E6600. And its surprisingly easy to do. But its not anything you must do starting out. It's just good to know you have some "extra power" in reserve if you need it in six months for a year.
November 27, 2006 12:55:00 AM

Quote:
ok i think i will go with the 8800 thx

No problem bobh, but i still think your a traitor for dumping AMD..
Report immediatly to the lab for shock treatment and we will cure this plague they call Intel..
November 27, 2006 1:19:57 AM

Agreed! In relation to the VGA choke-point associated with Intel CPU's, AMD doesn't suffer from this problem due to an -cough- INTEGRATED -cough- MEMORY -cough- CONTROLLER -cough- FOR THE -cough-cough- RAM -COUGH-COUGH-COUGH- !!! whew!!! I'm must be catching a cold, sorry. This allows the northbridge to interact with the CPU and VGA on a 1:1 level, other words, direct connect through the HTT Bus.

Hope this steers you back towards the path of righteousness! :mrgreen:
November 27, 2006 2:05:03 AM

Actually would like a sleeping pill but gotta work long and hard to have enough cash to buy an all new rig when 4x4 and DDR3 come out. On a side note however, I've got a patent-pending on the worlds first ever liquid cooled credit card that's guaranteed to cure any and all problems assocciated with building a cutting edge rig. All one needs to do is hijack some unaware person's eBay account or password for their bank and the card does the rest all at the ever cool temp of "I JUST SPENT $15K ON MY RIG AND IT STILL AIN'T BIG ENOUGH". So I think that in the next 6 months I'll be set for life! :mrgreen:
November 27, 2006 12:23:14 PM

ok i got most together on what i need and thx for all that helped me so far.. i am having trouple picking the mobo. Seams alot have issues on reading reviews. anyone use the Intel Core 2 Duo E6600 Conroe and that can help me on what is the best mobo to use that didnt have any issue's ?
Thx again guys
November 27, 2006 12:45:27 PM

Quote:
ok i got most together on what i need and thx for all that helped me so far.. i am having trouple picking the mobo. Seams alot have issues on reading reviews. anyone use the Intel Core 2 Duo E6600 Conroe and that can help me on what is the best mobo to use that didnt have any issue's ?
Thx again guys


And the winner is....
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E1681...
November 27, 2006 1:43:56 PM

You don't need to upgrade. There's plenty of life in that old dog yet :lol: 
November 27, 2006 3:16:50 PM

Quote:
ok i got most together on what i need

Be interested in what components you finally decided to go with if you wouldn't mind listing them.

-john
November 27, 2006 3:39:06 PM

yeah once i get a finale list together i will post it for sure..
As far as motherboards i was also looking at this board eVGA 122-CK-NF68-AR Socket T (LGA 775) NVIDIA nForce 680i SLI ATX Intel Motherboard
Anyone try this one out ?

And i will always love my AMD Systems i have just wanted to try out a intel for awaile now..
Infact this computer i am on is a AMD 4800 but my other amd 4800 took a dump and the sharing the computer with wife does not work out since we are both big gamer's
November 27, 2006 3:53:59 PM

Quote:
Quote:


you could do better on the case,and for overclocking the 6400 is better for the money.
the memory for core 2 doesnt need to run at 800 to be fast,you can save money with a good overclockable lower speed memory.

and i would really consider the 8800 as the video card to have.

Oh and also i have noticed others going with lower speed mem is there a reson for that ? some people having timing issue's or something ? And if so what speed/type should i get ?
November 27, 2006 4:11:02 PM

Quote:
Oh and also i have noticed others going with lower speed mem is there a reson for that ? some people having timing issue's or something ? And if so what speed/type should i get ?

I'm not qualified to recommend specific brands of memory so I'll try to sit back and let others who know speak up.

:oops:  Uh-oh, didn't work! CORSAIR XMS2 2GB (2 x 1GB) DDR2 675 (PC2 5400) looks interesting for $200, doesn't it? :oops: 

As to why the slower memory, it's mostly because slower = cheaper and the premium you pay for high-speed DDR2 is a big one. Intel Core 2 systems do not require high speed memory to perform well. Partly because of general CPU design and partly because of the furshlogin huge L2 cache on the Core 2 CPUs.

If you run Core 2 at stock speed all you need is DDR2-533 so the SDRAM will run at a 1:1 ratio with the 266MHz FSB. People usually get something faster because they plan to overclock and want to guarantee they can keep a 1:1 FSB:SDRAM ratio when they push up the FSB speed.

-john, the redundant legacy dinosaur
November 27, 2006 4:46:11 PM

Quote:
some people having timing issue's or something ?

Decided I'd try to respond to this just to find out if I actually understand the issue or not.

My take on the problem is that it's related to the fact that none of the higher speed DDR2 available today will run at its rated specs at the supposed DDR2 standard voltage of 1.8 volts. For example, if you look closely at any DDR2-800 SDRAM that is CAS 4 or better you'll probably see that it requires 2.0 volts or higher to meet that spec.

The timing problems arose because the SPD info on some DDR2 was being programmed with the high performance timings. A mobo would then read the SPD info and try to run with the tight timings at the standard DDR2 voltage of 1.8v when it needed to be 2.0v or higher. Worst case result was that the motherboard would not boot.

Should be less of a problem now because most memory manufacturers program their SPD with less aggressive timings so the memory will work at the rated speed with 1.8v. Motherboard makers have also apparently made tweaks to their BIOSes to address this, but I have no idea what sort of tweaks those might be.

None of which speaks to the issue that all (?) of the high-speed DDR2 memory out there at the moment needs a "non-standard" voltage to work as advertised. Oh, well. Some standards are less important than others, I guess. :roll:

Hope I'm at least pretty close to reality ...

-john
!