Sign in with
Sign up | Sign in
Your question

Monitor help 6 bit 8 bit...what about frame rates?????

Tags:
  • Monitors
  • Components
Last response: in Components
Share
November 27, 2006 11:17:59 PM

i am fairly sure i am going to buy a new monitor, a wide screen. i am also fairly sure that i wanta screen bigger than 19" despite the low price.

there are a couple of 22" LCDs for £230-250 (~$500) but they have 6 bit panels, not 8 bit.

i understand that 6 bit allows faster response times but obviously has less clarity.

does anyone own a 6 it or 8 bit...or has owned a 6bit amnd moved to 8 bit?

most more expensve monitors seem to have a 700:1 contrast and an 8ms response time so i assume these are 8 bit panels when compared to 5ms, 1000:1 panels on the cheap end...so is going up to 8 bits really worth it?

and what about response times, whats the difference between black to white to black and grey to grey? and is it worth accepting 8ms response times for an expensive 8 bit or sticking with 5ms and 6bit?

(i dont play many games, i watch films alot and i like photoshop so i assume 8 bits is rather a must...but new technology being what it is some 6 bits may be no different...or better)

please help

thanks:) 

More about : monitor bit bit frame rates

a c 196 C Monitor
November 29, 2006 7:31:16 PM

Here's a reply I made in another thread to some in the graphics design profession:

Quote:
Since color accuracy is very important in your perfession I recommend not going for those cheaper LCDs since they are most likely 6-bit LCDs. 8-bit LCDs are what you are looking for.

6-bit LCDs - Cheaper, faster response rates (usually lower than 8ms), but prone to have lots of color inaccuracies and image artifacts. These monitors uses 6 bits of data to represents each color of blue, green and red. That means this type of monitor can produce 64 shades of each color (64 = 2^6). This translates to a total of 262,144 actual colors (64^3; or 64 x 64 x 64). That's not a lot of colors to work with. Interpolation is the process used to increase the number of colors that the LCD can show on the screen. Interpolation is basically a way to mathematical "guess" what a color should be. Since guessing is not 100% accurate this can lead to discoloration and artifacts. Some manufactures lists the number of colors at 16.2 million instead of 16.7 million for the 8-bit LCD monitors. But some manufacturers list this 6-bit LCDs as being capable of producing 16.7 million colors. Thus, blurring the line can tricking some consumers into thinking the monitor is better than it actually is.

8-bit LCDs - These monitors are more expensive than their 6-bit counterparts, and have typically slower response times (8ms or higher), but they have better color accuracy. These monitors can truly reproduce 16.7 million colors. Since 8 bits of data is used to represents blue, green and red, 256 shades of each color is possible (256 = 2^8 ). This translates to 16.7 million colors (256^3; or 256 x 256 x 256).

Eizo produces a line of professional LCD screen specifically for people in the graphic profession. These LCDs are sometime referenced as being capable of producing 10-bit colors which translates to 1024 shades of each color and can potentially reproduce about 1.07 billion colors. However, these are not true "10-bit monitors" and they are still listed as being capable of producing 16.7 million colors. These are 8-bt LCDs and I believe they use a bulit-in look up table to provide more color accuracy (different from the interpolation process). Needless to say, these are expensive monitors; generally in excess of $1,400.

I have no experience with Apple LCDs, nor have I done any research on them.


I had a chance to compare a 6-bit LCD (Samsung 225BW) vs. an 8-bit LCD (Samsung 215TW) side by side at J&R Computer World in NYC. The Samsung 225BW is 1" larger and about $60 - $80 USD cheaper than the 215TW. Unfortunately there were no games installed so I could not see how bad the ghosting issue is on each of them.

I used the Autumn desktop background to check for clarity, discoloration and image artifacts. I left the LCD at default settings since I was on my lunch hour. In terms of clarity, the 8-bit Samsung 215TW was noticably better than the 6-bit Samsung 225BW. Texts were easier to read on the 215TW despite being 1" smaller, and images were clearer too. Part of the reason could be increased spacing in between each pixel since the 225BW is 1" bigger, but has the same max resolution as the 215TW.

Color accruary is a potshot since I left both monitors at thier default settings. I honestly did like the 8-bit 2215TW better though. But it could have had better default settings.

Unfortunately I did see some image artifacts on the 6-bit 225BW LCD monitor. Some of the trees' bark seem to be "blocky" which is the result of pixelation artifacts. I looked at the same areas on the 8-bit 215TW LCD and saw no such artifacts.

There were also no movies installed on the display computer. But based on reading several review articles of various monitors 6-bit monitors are more likely to display artifacts in movies. This is especially true when viewing HD content. I don't recall 8-bit monitors have this issue, or maybe there were too few to remember.

I personally have a Planar PX191 LCD which is an 8-bit 19" LCD. It's and older LCD and I can definitely see ghosting effects when gaming. The monitor is rated to have a response time of 25ms going from b-w-b; which was typical for almost all 8-bit LCDs back in 2003. Grey-to-grey I'm not sure since that wasn't used much back then. I would guess grey to grey would have a response time somewhere between 16ms and 20ms.

Response times measure the time it takes to a pixel to change color. Black to white to black was used in the past and it represents the worst possible condition because it's going from one extreme color to another and then back again. Thus this gives relatively high response times. Grey to grey has becomes more prominent lately because people prefer to so lower response times and it is actually a little more realistic. Games and modern movies are in color so it is more likely for scenes to have various shades of color rather than simple black and white. There is no industry standard when it comes to response times so if Viewsonic say their LCD is 5ms and Samsung says thier is also 5ms does not mean the LCDs were measured in the exact same way.

I'm on the prowl for another LCD screen and I do play games as well. I am only considering 8-bit LCDs even though they are more likely to have ghosting issues in games.
November 29, 2006 8:51:53 PM

hmmm....that was pretty helpful:)  well i like my colours to be nice..and i dont think i could stand to have artifacts on screen from blurring.

i was doing some more reading up on panels and it seems that 8 is obviously better than 6 for colours..but i suppose its also down to individual manufacturers software too.

did you notice anything regarding contrast ratios on those monitors? is it worth having a 6bit for the high contrast ratio...is the interpolation worth putting up with? i know it means the difference between the lightest and darkest shade...but all these 6bit panels seem to have high contrast ratios compared to 8 bits...so are 8 bit colours a bit more washed or are the contrast ratio differences ineffective because of the amount of renderable colours?

thanks!!
Related resources
a c 196 C Monitor
November 29, 2006 9:37:38 PM

The Samsung 225BW has a contrast ratio of 700:1 and brightness of 280 cd/m2.

The Samsung 215TW has a contrast ratio of 1000:1 and brightness of 300 cd/m2.

In general brightness and constrast are subjective. I found that both monitors provided good enough levels of both without having to adjust them. Higher numbers are better since the scale allows you to better fine tune the settings to your liking.

The my Planar PX191 has a contrast ratio of 700:1 and brightness of 300 cd/m2. That's nice but if I max out the settings the monitor is way, way too bright. In the OSD (on screen display) menu I set the contrast to 55% and brightness to 70%. That is more than enough to please my eyes. So either one of the Samsung could me adjusted to meet almost everyones needs. In general setting the brightness too high tends to washout colors, and settng the contrast too low tends to muddy the color and lose some details.

I think the difference between 700:1 and 1000:1 contrast ratio is negligible since it will not lessen the color inaccuracy 6-bit monitors. I think the best thing for you to do is to go into a store and play around with some LCDs. That way you can judge for yourself if 1000:1 is absolutely necessary.

Also be advised that manufacturers tend "lie" about thier specs. I've seen 300 cd/m2 before, and I have to admit that even when I lower the brightness of my Planar PX191, it is still at least just as bright as other 300 cd/m2 LCD monitors. Either the other companies are lying, or Planar was real conservative and the actual brightness levels is higher than what they spec it out to be (that's a good thing though).
December 1, 2006 5:06:55 PM

8-bit can display 24-bit color, 6-bit can display 18-bit color. (see above post for exact color numbers).

Basically 8-bit is better, as it gives you a better recreation of the original source and doesn't need to interpolate any colors.

With contrast ratios, the higher the first number, the deeper the blacks will be. For movies I would recommend a high contrast ratio, because a lot of movies have dark scenes and I would think you'd want to still see details rather than a mass of black.

Brightness is what it says it is, but in my experience LCDs with high brightness are usually covering up flaws. I can't find the link now, but I remember reading that a 300cd/m2 brightness is like staring at a 60W light bulb and is far too much for comfortable viewing.

When comparing models in the store, adjust them first to display the same picture, and then adjust brightness and contrast to what looks the best to you. Then stand back and look at all of them and pick the best one. Of course, this usually is the more expensive model, but this is something you're going to be staring at for at least 3-4 years from now.
!