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Overkill? Dual 8800 GTX 768's

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November 28, 2006 3:52:42 AM

Hey everyone!

Long time browser, first time poster. I have a quick question here. I am upgrading my graphics for my computer from an Asus EN7800 GTX to dual XFX 8800 GTX 768's with a BFG Aegis PhysX accelerator card. I'm not too worried about the space aspect, as i will be buying a new server case for these huge monsters (Been told they measure in at a tad over 11" long!) My main concern is going to be the PSU. If someone out here in THG forums has this similar setup, can you fill me in on the PSU that i will be needing to run this? My system specs are as follows:

AMD Athlon 64 3700+ (also considering upping this to a core duo extreme if needed)

Asus A8N32-SLI mobo

4 gigs of OCZ Platinum running at 2-3-2-5 @400mhz (no OC'ing for these yet)

Creative Labs X-FI Fatal1ty soundcard

WD 74gb Raptor

WD 40gb caviar

and the 7800 GTX ....which will be replaced on Dec 12th with the 8800's and that PhysX card. Any help will be greatly appreciated! Thanks in advance!!


-Luz
November 28, 2006 4:28:11 AM

Now see..the local comp store (whom i bull with every now and again) said i would need the 1kilowatt PSU to sufficiently run these two monsters. I'd rather not go for something like that, but i will if needed. But they did mention that he made sure to ask if he could transfer all my stuff from the Antec p180 that i have now to the new server case, and run some benchmarks. I just might oblige him on that, considering i cussed and fought with that 180 to get everything stuffed in!
Related resources
November 28, 2006 4:30:51 AM

My set-ups in my sig. I went with a 850watt PSU. If you goto NVIDIAs webiste SliZone they have a list of reccomended PSUs. I did some research and found most people with dual 8800s needed 750w and higher. So far 850w has been ample in my system which has 4 120mm fans, 4 raptors, dual 8800s, X-fi, cd rom, and a few 80mm fans, ect...

These cards are HEAVILY dependent on CPU power. You'll benefit alot if you went to atleast a E6400 and did a moderate o/c (3-3.2 Ghz). Otherwise you'll lose alot of the performance benefits of having the extra card.

I would hold off on the physics card. I wont get into the debate of "why we need it". If your going to get it, you might wait until the PCIex version is released. The 8800's are big as you noted and hog up alot of space. I couldn't fit another PCI card if I wanted to. The only slot I still have available is a PCI-ex which is declared to be a future 3rd graphics card(physics?) upgrade. Something to consider anyway.
November 28, 2006 4:35:03 AM

Wow. 1k PS's look to be closer to 260-300 dollar range. I figured that the other would work, but obviously your builder has more knowledge than I do about it.

Good luck with that build. It should be amazing.
November 28, 2006 4:37:49 AM

Thanks SOOOOOO much on that website! This will be my first SLI setup, so i never knew about that website. Stupid me. Although, i just might take your advice and hold off on that physx card....i've been looking through these forums and seem to notice a chain effect of why they aren't as good as they are hyped up to be.
November 28, 2006 4:38:01 AM

From nVidia's website:

Quote:
Extreme SLI PC*:
NVIDIA has tested the majority of power supplies in this high power category and therefore only recommends an SLI-Ready power supply.

Ultra High-End SLI PC*:
You must have a power supply that can provide a minimum of +12V @ 22A of dedicated power for the two graphics cards. Of this 22A requirement, +12V @ 5.5A must be available to each of the two PCI Express 6-pin auxiliary power supply connectors. The remaining 11A must be supplied to the motherboard for dedicated graphics card use.

High-End SLI PC*:
Minimum of 500-600W Power Supply with a minimum of +12V @ 30A for all PC components.

Mid-Range SLI PC*:
Minimum of 450-500W Power Supply with a minimum of +12V @ 26A for all PC components.

Entry-Level SLI PC*:
Minimum of 400-450W Power Supply with a minimum of +12V @ 22A for all PC components.

*Note: These power supply recommendations are based on the following test configurations using standard component clock speeds:

Extreme SLI PC Configuration:
Dual GeForce 8800 GTX or Dual GeForce 8800 GTS or Dual GeForce 7950GX2
AMD Athlon 64 FX-62 2.8GHz (AM2) or Intel Core 2 Extreme X6800 2.9GHz
NVIDIA nForce 680 SLI or NVIDIA nForce 590 SLI motherboard with 2GB system memory
Two HDDs in Raid 0 configuration
Two optical drives
PCI Sound Card
LCD at 2560x1600 resolution

Ultra High-End SLI PC Configuration:
Dual GeForce 7900 GTX or Dual GeForce 7800 GTX 512MB
AMD Athlon 64 FX-60 2.6 GHz or Intel Pentium EE 955 3.46 GHz
NVIDIA nForce4 SLI X16 motherboard with 2GB system memory
Two HDDs in Raid 0 configuration
Two optical drives
PCI Sound Card
LCD at 1600x1200 resolution

High-End SLI PC Configuration:
Dual GeForce 7800 GTX 256MB or Dual GeForce 6800 Ultra
AMD Athlon 64 FX-57 2.8 GHz or Intel Pentium EE 840 3.2 GHz
NVIDIA nForce4 SLI X16 motherboard with 2GB system memory
Two HDDs in Raid 0 configuration
Two optical drives
PCI sound card
LCD at 1600x1200 resolution

Mid-Range SLI PC Configuration:
Dual GeForce 7900 GT or Dual GeForce 6800 GT or Dual GeForce 6800
AMD Athlon 64 4000+
NVIDIA nForce4 SLI motherboard with 1GB system memory
Single HDD
Two optical drives
PCI sound card

Entry-Level SLI PC Configuration:
Dual GeForce 7600GT or Dual GeForce 6600 GT or Dual GeForce 6600
AMD Athlon 64 4000+
NVIDIA nForce4 SLI motherboard with 1GB system memory
Single HDD
One optical drive


Link: < http://www.nvidia.com/object/slizone_howtobuild_2.html >
November 28, 2006 4:38:51 AM

I just took a look at your board on the egg.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E1681...

No way you're going to fit that physics card in there. Either the X-fi or physics is going to have to go.

Edited to add: Maybe with a waterblock for cooling you might free up some space. I have not had one in my hand and can not comment if you'd have clearance for addition PCI components or not. Using the stock coolers you'll be left with one PCI and that's it.
November 28, 2006 4:43:19 AM

I'll never get rid of my Fatal1ty SC....the physx card is a goner....besides, i highly doubt i'll -need- it considering the two cards i have coming anyhow....with that 250 saved, i'll most likely end up with a 1k PSU....JUST to be on the safe side of the spectrum!
November 28, 2006 4:53:37 AM

Looks like the 680i recognizes just how much the PhysX card is worth...

:lol: 
November 28, 2006 5:11:52 AM

Great setup, except for the processor, 2 8800 GTX's and a 3700 is like matching 2 jaguars and a golf-cart. If you wanna stick with AMD at least get a X2 or a FX, but I would recommend getting a Intel Core 2 Duo 6600 or higher. Processors play more than you think on FPS.
November 28, 2006 5:31:55 AM

I have to agree.
I would think the more logical upgrade would to allocate the funds from one 8800 and get a E6600(or higher) with some decent cooling. This means a new board, CPU, and possibly RAM. You might even wind-up getting similar speeds to what you would have with dual 8800's. Then in the future you could weigh in buying that second card.

FYI: My system got around 11,000 3dmarks on one 8800GTX and 15,000 marks with 2 in sli. I've seen similar set-ups to yours declaring they get around 9K with only one GTX and want to know why the low numbers for their card. Their CPU is what bottlenecks and as you can see 2,000 marks is a good difference especialy with the amount of money invested. IMHO - I wouldn't be suprised if your 8800's in sli pulled off low 12's which is about what you'd get with 1 card and optimizing your CPU power for essentialy the same price.
November 28, 2006 6:23:39 AM

I would suggest you to get better cpu (or new system altogether) if you want to use 8800 GTX,esp. in SLI. Just my RM0.02
November 28, 2006 5:01:46 PM

Overkill? I think so.

Is there a game out there yet that will use all of that dual-8800 power?

You're better off getting a single 8800 now, and when Crysis is released get the second 8800. It'll probably be at least $50 cheaper by then, maybe more if the R600 is out...

And the physX card? Don't even get me started. But the short answer is 'useless'.
November 28, 2006 6:43:04 PM

Won't that processor heavily bottle neck dual 8800s? Hell, even a single one might be bottlenecked by a 3700.

You seriously have some money to burn if you're upgrading from a 7800 to dual 8800s. :lol: 
November 28, 2006 7:10:43 PM

I agree. I'd go with a complete system overhaul before throwing 2 8800's in there with that single-core.

I'd get at least a C2D E6600, 2GB DDR2 800, a good SLI board with dual x16 PCIE slots, and one 8800GTX (unless you can still afford two hehe). I think you'll get more benefit from a complete upgrade than from throwing 2 8800's in your current setup.
November 28, 2006 7:15:43 PM

I am running
e6600
3 gig pc 6400
2 x dvdrw
2 x 320 SATA II
Sound card
floppy
fan controller for 4 x 120 case fans
and a 8800 GTX.

I am running the Thermaltake True Power 2.2 550W

Idle- 108 - 120 Watts , at load 220 Watts is as high as it gets.

OC to 3.2 gig, and max on the vid card, 250 Watts. This is measured by the output of the PSU itself.

A top quality PSU should be able to handle the load at around 600 W for SLI.

The 12 volt rail is the key.

If I was going to run SLI, I would get a GOOD 500-600W 2.2 (2x6 pin connectors) PSU and the ~ $80 aux PSU with twin 12 v rails that fits in the 5.25 bay for card 2.


So- summed up-

Get new processor, e6400 or better, that 3700 is outgunned.

New motherboard, since new socket.

upgrade ram,

current planned psu and 1 8800 GTX for now

Ditch physx

Later- add 8800 and aux psu for SLI.
November 28, 2006 8:53:37 PM

Thank you EVERYONE for your input! After serious consideration at work today and after i read all these comments, i have decided to ditch the sli setup for the 8800 and go for just one 8800 gtx....as for the cpu/motherboard...i pretty much have those in mind...and the PSU shouldn't be very hard to find now that i'm downgrading. NOW comes the next dillema....i have alot of money invested into my ram....ddr 400 .....what ram do i need to get to go well with the new intel? I haven't used intel since the 486 days....so i'm pretty much out of the loop when it comes to them. Someone told me that intel and amd boards use different types of memory....confirm?


-Luz
November 29, 2006 1:51:38 AM

Read wusy's OC guide for conroe, helps a lot, but bottom line, the pc5300 or 5400 seems to be the sweet spot in DDR2 for the conroe family.

Biggest bang for your buck, unless you plan on OCing heavily, then step it up to the pc6400.
November 29, 2006 2:45:42 PM

Buy 8800gtx and run it on high quality. makes games gpu bound and faster cpu makes no difference. stay with 3700 amd. Then check out better gfx cards later on and see if cpu makes a differnce then. 8800gtx can not run oblivion on highest image quality in 1280 x 1024. It can run it in 1920 x 1200 on very high though. But if you want the best, no.
November 29, 2006 11:54:45 PM

If you can afford it, there's no such thing as overkill.
Honestly though I'd just go with one GTX, an SLI board and get something in the midrange C2D with the money.
If and when multithreaded games come out you'll be that much happier because there are somet things a graphics card can't do that your cpu will need to do. And having a dual core will be that much better.
Even better, I'd go with Dual GTS, and use the savings of selling off your old stuff, plus about $200 per card and put that towards an e6400 or 6600 setup.
If you can actually buy all this, I bow to you sir.
November 30, 2006 12:12:55 AM

I already have everything planned out thanks to everyone's input! I'm gathering up :

1. Intel Core 2 Duo E6700
2. ONE XFX 8800 768 GTX
3. Asus P5N32-SLI
4.PNY 2gb PC-5300
5. 550 Coolermaster PSU (and the add-on 250wt PSU just for the second vid card when i get it)
6. Thermaltake (i believe) Titan case.

So yeah....everything's going to get an overhaul, and i posted up at my job the parts that i'm selling.....for $500 ....maybe i'll get a bite or two from that....thanks again everyone!!!!!!
November 30, 2006 1:07:36 AM

The only thing you might want to change is the mainboard. Even with immature BIOS and it's few quirks the 680i is a fantastic board. If your not planning on over clocking I'd say maybe it'd be worth saving a few bucks.

ECS and EVGA both have one on newegg for 249 right now. If you wern't having future plans of sli I'd suggest a p5b series. Either way 590 is ok, just that most overclockers will say to stay away due to low max FSB.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E1681...
November 30, 2006 1:11:07 AM

I hate to make more suggestions after you confirmed what you want like that but here goes anyway for your benefit.

I'd recommend getting an E6600 instead of the E6700, the price difference is huge compared to the performance difference, get the E660 and use the saved money and a good CPU cooler for it to overclock. Of course if your overclocking you want to get DDR2 6400 ram instead (800mhz) to really go well.
November 30, 2006 3:04:57 AM

Tom's just did a review today showcasing the 8800's accross different platforms. Might be worth a minute to check it out.
http://www.tomshardware.com/2006/11/29/geforce_8800_nee...

Good reason to skimp on the 6700 and put more money into a good o/c mainboard, some ddr800, and aftermarket cooler. You don't have to skimp, but the E6600 is the price/performance sweetspot to o/c. This set-up when finely tuned would be much faster, especialy when you plug your second 8800 in.
December 3, 2006 2:14:17 AM

Hat...


Thanks sooooo much for all your advice and help! I ordered my new parts the other day and here they are...per everyone's suggestion.

1. Intel Core2 Duo 6600 retail box.

2.eVGA 8800GTX 768 -went with this one over the BFG simply because i've been hearing great things about eVGA lately.

3.Thermaltake toughpower 750watt PS with the additional 250watt sli videocard add-on psu.

4. eVGA nForce 680i SLI motherboard (i believe this should be the best bang i can get...from some reviews i have read)

5. OCZ dual channel gold XTC pc-6400 2gb


Now i do realize you said to go with an aftermarket cpu cooler. Which do you suggest me using? Keep in mind that i did not upgrade my case yet...and i'm using the Antec p-180 case. Thanks for everything!!!
a b U Graphics card
December 3, 2006 2:39:37 AM

Any AMD at the moment will underpower even one of those cards ;) 

Quote:
Hey everyone!

Long time browser, first time poster. I have a quick question here. I am upgrading my graphics for my computer from an Asus EN7800 GTX to dual XFX 8800 GTX 768's with a BFG Aegis PhysX accelerator card. I'm not too worried about the space aspect, as i will be buying a new server case for these huge monsters (Been told they measure in at a tad over 11" long!) My main concern is going to be the PSU. If someone out here in THG forums has this similar setup, can you fill me in on the PSU that i will be needing to run this? My system specs are as follows:

AMD Athlon 64 3700+ (also considering upping this to a core duo extreme if needed)

Asus A8N32-SLI mobo

4 gigs of OCZ Platinum running at 2-3-2-5 @400mhz (no OC'ing for these yet)

Creative Labs X-FI Fatal1ty soundcard

WD 74gb Raptor

WD 40gb caviar

and the 7800 GTX ....which will be replaced on Dec 12th with the 8800's and that PhysX card. Any help will be greatly appreciated! Thanks in advance!!


-Luz
December 3, 2006 2:45:40 AM

Quote:
Any AMD at the moment will underpower even one of those cards ;) 




So i've been told :)  Tis why i have my new list up. Recieved my cpu and keyboard today...the rest of my new rig will be here monday. I can hardly sleep thinking about all those goodies! Now i need to get a nice cooler and get those OC numbers up!

December 3, 2006 3:11:07 AM

Spare me. The 8800s are so powerful that a C2D will even hold it back a little.

And you're not taking overclocking into account. An OC'ed AMD64 can be just as fast in gaming as a stock C2D. Of course the C2D is faster, that doesn't automatically make it faster period. Never deal in absolutes :wink:
December 3, 2006 3:30:23 AM

Quote:
Hey everyone!

Long time browser, first time poster. I have a quick question here. I am upgrading my graphics for my computer from an Asus EN7800 GTX to dual XFX 8800 GTX 768's with a BFG Aegis PhysX accelerator card. I'm not too worried about the space aspect, as i will be buying a new server case for these huge monsters (Been told they measure in at a tad over 11" long!) My main concern is going to be the PSU. If someone out here in THG forums has this similar setup, can you fill me in on the PSU that i will be needing to run this? My system specs are as follows:

AMD Athlon 64 3700+ (also considering upping this to a core duo extreme if needed)

Asus A8N32-SLI mobo

4 gigs of OCZ Platinum running at 2-3-2-5 @400mhz (no OC'ing for these yet)

Creative Labs X-FI Fatal1ty soundcard

WD 74gb Raptor

WD 40gb caviar

and the 7800 GTX ....which will be replaced on Dec 12th with the 8800's and that PhysX card. Any help will be greatly appreciated! Thanks in advance!!


-Luz


You don't need a server case for two 8800gtx's. You're believing the fearmongering. I have an 8800 sli setup fit in an antec p180 just fine. Admittedly mine are the watercooled BFG's which only take up one slot each, but my point is the length isn't an issue.
December 3, 2006 8:23:41 PM

You can also find ways around the length. If you have one of those Lian Li cases with the hard drive cage between a 120mm fan in the front and the PCI slots behind that, you can take out the hard drive cage, mount the hard drives in the 5.25" bays with some of the silencer kits from modding sites like Performance PCs, then put in those monster 11" cards. Now they won't be blocked by the drive cage, they'll get the full air flow from the 120mm fan in front of them, and your hard drives will be quieter because of they way they're mounted.

You just have to get inventive, that's all. A little ingenuity can mount an 8800GTX SLI setup in a resonably small mid-tower case with no problem.
December 3, 2006 8:30:21 PM

Well i decided against the sli setup for right now...and i'm only going with one 8800gtx...but yes, the p180 has the HDD cages...and i was thinking of doing that, but wasn't sure where to go with the HDs themselves...thanks for the input!!!!!
December 3, 2006 11:20:35 PM

Quote:
Hat...


Thanks sooooo much for all your advice and help! I ordered my new parts the other day and here they are...per everyone's suggestion.

1. Intel Core2 Duo 6600 retail box.


Now i do realize you said to go with an aftermarket cpu cooler. Which do you suggest me using? Keep in mind that i did not upgrade my case yet...and i'm using the Antec p-180 case. Thanks for everything!!!


No problem.

I suggest taking a look at the overclocking guide put out by Wusy. It's still a great way to get started. He has some good advice on aftermarket coolers for o/c'ing.

http://forumz.tomshardware.com/hardware/Core2Duo-Overcl...

I'm using the Scythe Ninja which has been an excellent cooler, but it's huge! It fits nicely in my cooler master stacker 810.

Make sure you measure your clearance to the side of your case. If you have any doubts, I'd suggest buying local with a good return policy. This would forgo paying for shipping twice. The other thing I'd suggest is check out some of the extreme overclockers forums to see if they have similiar set-ups.
a b U Graphics card
December 4, 2006 7:51:11 AM

Quote:
Spare me. The 8800s are so powerful that a C2D will even hold it back a little.

And you're not taking overclocking into account. An OC'ed AMD64 can be just as fast in gaming as a stock C2D. Of course the C2D is faster, that doesn't automatically make it faster period. Never deal in absolutes :wink:


the E6700 beats any 90nm A64 cause they can only get to ~3ghz if there lucky

if you have the $$$ for two geforce 8's, Intel is the only way to go to get maximum performance FULL STOP.

besides, even in other benches, intel with a geforce7 tops the charts.
December 8, 2006 9:39:01 PM

Hey everyone!


I finally got my new rig built and i'm loving it! I have a c2d 6600, eVGA 8800GTX 768, Thermaltake Toughpower 750 with the add-on 250PS just for the vid card, the eVGA 680i SLI motherboard and some OCZ gold ddr2-800 ram! Love this new setup, but NOW i had to take out one of my drives just to fit the new vid card. I couldn't take the whole cage out, beccause i had nowhere to go with the HDs, which is not a big deal. Now i'm looking to upgrade the case, and i want the best case i can get. I looked into the Tai-Chi and the Stacker 830 i think.....anyone have reviews about these two awesome cases? Any input is appreciated!


-Luz

P.S I'm also considering liquidcooling in the very near future, so i need a case that will make it very easy to add-in the cooling. Anyone have any thoughts on a top-end watercooling kit????
September 25, 2007 3:11:27 AM

Luzah said:
Hey everyone!

Long time browser, first time poster. I have a quick question here. I am upgrading my graphics for my computer from an Asus EN7800 GTX to dual XFX 8800 GTX 768's with a BFG Aegis PhysX accelerator card. I'm not too worried about the space aspect, as i will be buying a new server case for these huge monsters (Been told they measure in at a tad over 11" long!) My main concern is going to be the PSU. If someone out here in THG forums has this similar setup, can you fill me in on the PSU that i will be needing to run this? My system specs are as follows:

AMD Athlon 64 3700+ (also considering upping this to a core duo extreme if needed)

Asus A8N32-SLI mobo

4 gigs of OCZ Platinum running at 2-3-2-5 @400mhz (no OC'ing for these yet)

Creative Labs X-FI Fatal1ty soundcard

WD 74gb Raptor

WD 40gb caviar

and the 7800 GTX ....which will be replaced on Dec 12th with the 8800's and that PhysX card. Any help will be greatly appreciated! Thanks in advance!!


-Luz


Don't forget that if im not misstaken if you Have or are going to have Windows Vista It DOES NOT SUPPORT SLI Mode for Dual Cards...I may be wrong but check it out just incase.
a c 143 U Graphics card
September 25, 2007 3:35:46 AM

Yeah, Vista does support SLI now by now. Man, I wish you hadn't resurrected this ancient thread. I spent 5 minutes reading and wondering before I noticed the dates :) 

a b U Graphics card
September 25, 2007 3:40:26 AM

I did the same thing, aevm. I almost suggested a e6750 but when I saw the date, I realized this is an old thread.
September 25, 2007 4:51:44 PM

man... jake37, wasn't it a little uneccesary to say that several months after the event?
!