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when should we see dx10 games

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December 18, 2006 1:26:32 PM

Ok, I'm in the market for a new build and I'm just trying to justify the cost of an 8800 gpu. When will games come out that really take advantage of dx10?

More about : dx10 games

December 18, 2006 2:19:51 PM

Yep - that's pretty much correct, although many are in production and design already. There has to be a decent return on an investment to design for DX10 as it is a whole lot more costly to do this AND design for DX9 as well then it was to design for DX9 and previous DX versions as well (hope that made sense!).

The return on investment will not really come until Vista, DX10 and it's related hardware are more widely available. The exception to the rule is the possibility of an absolutely must-have 'killer' game that people will actually go out and upgrade their PC for. If there are 3 or 4 of these in 2007, the tipping point will soon be reached where Vista is the dominant OS over XP and then the inevitable transformation takes place.

The proof of the pudding is however as they say in the eating. Whilst all new PCs from next year will inevitably be sold with Vista installed, not many will be pure gaming platforms. They will however to some extent be able to show off what DX10 can do, even in the early months of programming, and the more people see the dramatic shift then, the more that will convert.

I can't wait to see the R600 performance and then see how both ATI and Nvidia counter each other next year with revisions. Even though the prices are high, it's a great time to be a gamer with all this new technology coming in. :) 
December 18, 2006 6:09:40 PM

True DX10 should be out late next year.

Hybrids of DX9 and DX10 should be coming out mid '07.
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December 18, 2006 8:03:29 PM

You knucleheads are forgetting Flight Sim X

M$ has said when Vista goes retail they'll release a DX10 patch for it.
December 19, 2006 2:52:58 PM

He's right of course. You can bet there will be DX10 games available the same day that Vista arrives. Of course those games will also run as DX9 on your system if need be. No studio has announced a DX10-only game yet. There were a lot of people that bought highend cards in '06, so you can bet every single game will handle DX9 yet for a good 2 years, especially blockbuster titles that need high sales to recoup development costs. The first DX10-only game is likely to be a smaller title from a mid-level shop, probably middle to end of 2007. It's all up in the air until DX10 is here, Vista spreads, and how sales go for the entry level and mid-range cards, which is most of card sales.
a c 355 U Graphics card
December 19, 2006 3:06:27 PM

It will take time before DX10 only games will be announced because the vast majority of gamers will still have DX9 card for the next few years. Therefore, game developers will be developing hybrid DX9/DX10 games for the next few years. It took the announcement of DX10 and the release of Oblivion AFAIK (as far as I know) to finally sound the demise of DX8.1 games.
December 19, 2006 3:41:47 PM

Quote:
You knucleheads are forgetting Flight Sim X

M$ has said when Vista goes retail they'll release a DX10 patch for it.


Just keep in mind that Vista is going to be a slow upgrade. Don't expect to see some rush to buy it in 2007.

M$ has a chicken & egg problem here. It needs to sell Vista to make DX10 profitable for developers. Game devs won't waste time with DX10 until there is a market for it in the millions. A few early adopters and fanatics with SLI DX10 cards, Quad core CPUs and a BBQ aren't going to pay the bills. Game devs needs sales, especially now with the PC market being in such a sad state thanks to the console idiots.

Personally, I think MS should stop ripping people off and sell Vista for $100 if they want everyone to switch to DX10 sooner. Or, open up the backdoor for some piracy for those that can't afford it.

You hear that, MS? You want people to use Vista? Stop trying to be Exxon and give it to us on the same terms as XP!
December 19, 2006 3:42:57 PM

Quote:
You knucleheads are forgetting Flight Sim X

M$ has said when Vista goes retail they'll release a DX10 patch for it.


Wasn't Halo 2 to be available at Vista's launch as a DX10 game?
December 19, 2006 4:07:02 PM

I heard Halo 2 was going to be released for PC, but I haven't heard it'll be DX10. That would be cool though.
December 19, 2006 4:08:42 PM

Quote:
You knucleheads are forgetting Flight Sim X

M$ has said when Vista goes retail they'll release a DX10 patch for it.


Wasn't Halo 2 to be available at Vista's launch as a DX10 game?

http://www.gamepro.com/news.cfm?article_id=88368

Halo 2 for PC: DX9
December 19, 2006 4:14:08 PM

That's a shame. I would have bought it if it was a DX10 :( 

Just hope there are at least a few DX10 games coming out in H1.
December 19, 2006 4:17:57 PM

I know someone is going to flame me for this, but I don't think Oblivions visuals are all that impressive. Esp. indoor scenes.

Frankly, I think Quake 4 and Prey look the best for indoor scenes.
December 19, 2006 4:21:05 PM

Quote:
I know someone is going to flame me for this, but I don't think Oblivions visuals are all that impressive. Esp. indoor scenes.

Frankly, I think Quake 4 and Prey look the best for indoor scenes.


Shame on you...now we'll go into an off topic discussion...Bad Barney!!!
December 19, 2006 4:29:14 PM

Ok, well DX10 games are out NOW, well kind of, Company of Heroes has a DX10 patch for it coming soon (if not already, haven't checked lately), which enables new lighting techniques, along with a few cool effects, but the 1st native DX10 game you will see is probably going to be Supreme Commander which will probably be released in Jan/Feb of 2007 (but as you will soon hear the DX9 and DX10 versions look very similar), in terms of games that REALLY take advantage of DX10, they could be a year away.

At the end of the day, you should forget the 8800 is DX10 and look at how powerful it is instead, with a stonking amount of RAM and its new unified shader architecture, VERY.

In terms of justification, well, that depends entirely on what your running now, if you have still got a 6XXX series Nvidia or a X8XX series Radeon, then its easily justifiable, if like some mentalists on this forum, you have a X1900XTX and still want more juice, then no, its not worth the added expense at all.

Then again, sometimes you just have to say "fuck it"
December 19, 2006 4:52:27 PM

Quote:
you have a X1900XTX and still want more juice, then no, its not worth the added expense at all.


Heh, thats what I upgraded from and to me it was well worth it. 8)

there's always one speedfreak around, don't worry man, I'm just jealous.

anyone want to swap a X800XTPE for a 8800?
December 19, 2006 5:22:04 PM

Quote:

You knucleheads are forgetting Flight Sim X
M$ has said when Vista goes retail they'll release a DX10 patch for it.


Is Flight SimX a true Dx10 game? True as in also requiring 64-bit, multi-core, etc for max detail and optimal?
I will be surprised if it is.
December 19, 2006 5:28:04 PM

Your Oblivion looks impressive! I expect Crysis to look even better, but still impressive. Maybe I should get a 8800GTX sooner..
December 19, 2006 5:30:09 PM

Everyone DX10(direct3d) will not be backwards compatible! its been stated on TH. also, vista will not have dx10 at launch. check the microsoft site or google it.
only the cards will be capable of playing dx9 games.

but what 1 8800 card really have goin is the fact that they play dx9 games faster then 2 7900 cards in sli mode.
December 19, 2006 7:30:36 PM

Quote:
Everyone DX10(direct3d) will not be backwards compatible! its been stated on TH. also, vista will not have dx10 at launch. check the microsoft site or google it.
only the cards will be capable of playing dx9 games.


Wrong! The games will be backwards compatible, and vista will have DX10 at launch.

Oh god do you know how tempted I am to use the word "noob"
December 19, 2006 8:02:36 PM

Quote:

You knucleheads are forgetting Flight Sim X
M$ has said when Vista goes retail they'll release a DX10 patch for it.


Is Flight SimX a true Dx10 game? True as in also requiring 64-bit, multi-core, etc for max detail and optimal?
I will be surprised if it is.

Uh.... as far as I know DX10 doesn't require 64-bit, muti-core, etc. Its an API, nothing more and nothing less. I hate it when definitions get expanded to mean somethign they don't... Vista doesn't require muti-core or 64-bit, how could any component require it?
December 19, 2006 8:14:13 PM

I don't think it's a chicken and egg situation, more a matter of time. After all, we've been on dx9 for a while and yet we keep upgrading our cards, even if all the titles that come out in the next year are based on dx9 they'll still need more and more powerful cards to run them at high res and full effects at playable framerates....and how many (powerful) cards released from now on won't be dx10? not many i'll wager. So the need for more powerful cards for dx9 games will sooner rather than later put us all in the dx10 camp

Just my opinion, peace

Carod
December 19, 2006 8:31:36 PM

Quote:
I don't think Oblivions visuals are all that impressive. Esp. indoor scenes.


I would be inclined to agree with you. Oblivion's graphics are too bright and colorful, almost to the point of being cartoonish. This is the same reason that I was not impressed by Far Cry. The overbright/bloom HDR effects are also way overdone. Crysis looks like it will be a reasonable improvement, and Quake Wars looks promising as well. Still, there is a lot to be accomplished before I'll be impressed.
December 19, 2006 8:41:35 PM

Am the only person that actually wants to keep XP? I'm keeping it until SP3 (release is scheduled for mid/late 2007), then I'll sadly make the transition.
December 19, 2006 8:49:51 PM

Quote:
Ok, I'm in the market for a new build and I'm just trying to justify the cost of an 8800 gpu. When will games come out that really take advantage of dx10?


Not this,,Again?
December 19, 2006 8:53:04 PM

Halo 2 is going to be DX9. It is even said on Bungie.net, in the FAQ. But the way that I see it, by October next year, if anyone wants to buy a new game, they'll need to get Vista and a DX10 card as well.
Although, Crysis is worth it.
Funny thing is though, with the graphical eye-candy that we'll be enjoying, oh, 2Q 2008, we will say that Crysis had crappy graphics. I forgot where, but I remember seeing a pic of a DX10 game in development that had a COMPLETELY life-like forest. That'll only be the begining
December 19, 2006 8:57:07 PM

Regardless of DX10 an 8800 (GTX or GTS) is going to be the best card out there. Going with anything else will give you inferior performance now and no DX10 when it is available. As far as DX10 games I think World in Conflict, due for release in Jan 07, is being touted as the first DX10 game. Personally I went from 7900GTs in SLI to a 8800GTS and still saw a noticalbe performance increase. I'd say if the price is too much without true DX10 go with something cheap ($150 or less) because anything more expensive will end up being wasted money since you'll almost certainly be spending the difference between a more expensive card and a 8800 to upgrade sometime this year.
December 19, 2006 9:02:24 PM

Correct you are, like the age old question "What If"?
Oh by the way, those were some sweet screenshots :wink:
December 19, 2006 9:21:47 PM

Quote:

but what 1 8800 card really have goin is the fact that they play dx9 games faster then 2 7900 cards in sli mode.


Ninja's 7800's in sli smoke the single 8800 :wink:
December 19, 2006 10:12:59 PM

Personally I think you would have to be a fool to buy a DX10 card now. First, you know it will be awhile before it becomes useful, and longer before it becomes necessary. Second, by the time it does, more mainstream DX10 cards will be out, better ones than the current ultra-uber high-end ones will be out, and the one you're drooling over now will be half the price.
December 19, 2006 10:14:25 PM

Quote:
Am the only person that actually wants to keep XP? I'm keeping it until SP3 (release is scheduled for mid/late 2007), then I'll sadly make the transition.


I will keep XP until I see an absolute need for vista. That will probably be a while. But I am ready for it when the time comes :wink:


ditto...I guess there will be a new club starting soon: The XP Users Support & Help Line :wink:
December 19, 2006 10:29:27 PM

Quote:
Personally I think you would have to be a fool to buy a DX10 card now. First, you know it will be awhile before it becomes useful, and longer before it becomes necessary.

You don't need to buy an 8800 for DX10 for it to be useful. The 8800GTS and 8800GTX are the best GPUs out now and are cheaper then less powerfull SLI and Crossfire solutions. Also they are necessary if you want to play games like Oblivion at max settings with AA and HDR at a decent frame rate. On a side note why would a gamer want to go to Vista at release, hasn't it already shown that current games w/ current hardware will run better on Vista?
December 19, 2006 11:04:03 PM

Quote:
On a side note why would a gamer want to go to Vista at release, hasn't it already shown that current games w/ current hardware will run better on Vista?


1-A gamer would go vista for the pure thought of haveing dx10
2-how can current games/hardware run better, when vista is not even out yet :?
December 19, 2006 11:30:30 PM

Quote:
1-A gamer would go vista for the pure thought of haveing dx10
2-how can current games/hardware run better, when vista is not even out yet


People have been beta testing Vista for a while and those whom I've talked to have said that games run faster on rc2 then on XP. A big part of this, and why you'd go to Vista for games besides DX10, is that Vista is supposed to have much less overhead when playing games. One of the big pushes for Vista is it's improved gaming capabilities over

P.S.
you were kidding about 7800s smoking a 8800, right? :? Just need to check after your last statements.
December 19, 2006 11:33:16 PM

Just what i typed in my last post, the pure thought of DX10 :roll:

P.S."Who wants to beat this"..check the thread
December 19, 2006 11:46:37 PM

couldn't find the thread, try a link. Obviously you didn't read my response. Take a current PC and current DX9 game that runs on XP and supposedly you get better results (fps) on Vista. This is what I've heard from beta testers (there's no DX10 in beta). Even without DX10 current games should still play better on Vista then XP.

Quote:
People have been beta testing Vista for a while and those whom I've talked to have said that games run faster on rc2 then on XP. A big part of this, and why you'd go to Vista for games besides DX10, is that Vista is supposed to have much less overhead when playing games. One of the big pushes for Vista is it's improved gaming capabilities over
December 20, 2006 12:16:10 AM

Quote:
couldn't find the thread, try a link. Obviously you didn't read my response. Take a current PC and current DX9 game that runs on XP and supposedly you get better results (fps) on Vista. This is what I've heard from beta testers (there's no DX10 in beta). Even without DX10 current games should still play better on Vista then XP.end
Quote:


So you do not know! I do read the post people make, maybe you should read yours before posting :wink:

Quote:
People have been beta testing Vista for a while and those whom I've talked to have said that games run faster on rc2 then on XP. A big part of this, and why you'd go to Vista for games besides DX10, is that Vista is supposed to have much less overhead when playing games. One of the big pushes for Vista is it's improved gaming capabilities over


What people,Where's the link to these beta testers proving such b.s :roll:
December 20, 2006 12:26:46 AM

I never said I knew for sure and that I actually spoke to these people (friends, co-workers, others) so I have no link to these conversations. you call it bs, yet you don't even refute it. Do you know or have you heard about how Vista impacts current games with current hardware? One of the big down falls to windows gaming has always been the imense overhead of windows, leaving not enough resources for intense applications like video games. One of the advantages of Vista is supposed to be less overhead. Therefore it should follow that games will run better. I don't know for sure but wait until about 10 mins after it's released and we'll know for sure. If so then it would be worth installing, unless of course you like you're games to run slower.
December 20, 2006 12:36:38 AM

vista has already launched and it doesnt have dx10.

and what does "the games are backward compatable" mean? dx10 will not be. the general public will be able to get vista soon, and dude if it has dx10 i will apologize, but now that the businesses have gotten vista not dx10.
December 20, 2006 12:38:13 AM

Sure, you can run DX10 with a 32bit cpu and one core. What I was getting at is future games that will use advanced physics, advanced AI, etc, require the kind of power dual core 64bit cpus provide.
December 20, 2006 1:08:38 AM

Quote:
Everyone DX10(direct3d) will not be backwards compatible! its been stated on TH. also, vista will not have dx10 at launch. check the microsoft site or google it.
only the cards will be capable of playing dx9 games.

but what 1 8800 card really have goin is the fact that they play dx9 games faster then 2 7900 cards in sli mode.


where the fuc*k do you get your information? madmodmike? do us a favor and don't post in here again. your insipid information will confuse the noobs.
December 20, 2006 1:13:32 AM

and DX10 IS in Vista, it's just that nVidia and ATI don't have the (official public) drivers out for DX10 yet. so if u have an 8800gtx/gts, Vista will revert back to Dx9 until Dx10 drivers are released. they're all in beta right now.
December 20, 2006 1:17:32 AM

Quote:

You knucleheads are forgetting Flight Sim X
M$ has said when Vista goes retail they'll release a DX10 patch for it.


Is Flight SimX a true Dx10 game? True as in also requiring 64-bit, multi-core, etc for max detail and optimal?
I will be surprised if it is.

Son, where did u hear DX10 requires 64bit and multicore processors? For the record, it doesn't and it won't.

And yes, Flight Sim X is a true DX10 game. It was completely designed around DX10, but M$ had to revert back to Dx9 near the end of development because the Vista date slipped to Jan '07. They've shown in off in DX10 a couple different times and it looks ridiculously better in DX10.
December 20, 2006 1:42:55 AM

There a lot of Improvements in DX10 that is very good and will free up the CPU to do more work like Playing the game, AI, PhysX

http://tomshardware.co.uk/2006/11/08/what_direct3d_10_i...

Check that link above (I really recommend looking though all of them pages before commenting in here)

The Direct benefit of making an DX10 patch is the games are going to use Less CPU for rendering Just making the games use the DX10 API (to bad no DX10 for XP but that’s what M$ are counting on users buying it even thought there are already workarounds that work surprising well but its an little long winded {small rant})

NVIDIA has been working with the NVIDIA supported games to bring an DX9/10 patch out (game makers including Company of Heroes have already made the patch or in final testing)

I can't even test DX10 out on my 8800 yet as NVIDIA are been annoying slow to bring an new driver out for vista even though DX10 support has been in vista for last 4-6 weeks
December 20, 2006 5:05:13 AM

Quote:

Son, where did u hear DX10 requires 64bit and multicore processors? For the record, it doesn't and it won't.

And yes, Flight Sim X is a true DX10 game. It was completely designed around DX10, but M$ had to revert back to Dx9 near the end of development because the Vista date slipped to Jan '07. They've shown in off in DX10 a couple different times and it looks ridiculously better in DX10.


Ya, I didn't describe things well. I was thinking of other things that go with DX10 games, like advanced physics and better AI. Sure, DX9 (like FarCry1) can run on a Pentium pro, but who will want to.
December 20, 2006 5:36:24 AM

Quote:
vista has already launched and it doesnt have dx10.

and what does "the games are backward compatable" mean? dx10 will not be. the general public will be able to get vista soon, and dude if it has dx10 i will apologize, but now that the businesses have gotten vista not dx10.



Look man, I know your new but dont just post things up for the sake of it, people might read that and actually believe you, and lets be fair, most of what your saying is wrong. Just post in threads where you actually know something about the topic that your talking about/have a valid point, if you dont you will get flamed.
December 20, 2006 7:03:39 AM

Quote:
vista has already launched and it doesnt have dx10.

and what does "the games are backward compatable" mean? dx10 will not be. the general public will be able to get vista soon, and dude if it has dx10 i will apologize, but now that the businesses have gotten vista not dx10.


your post hurt my brain while it was trying to comprehend it. But I did get that you were very confused. That part I got.
December 20, 2006 10:19:03 PM

Quote:
vista has already launched and it doesnt have dx10.

and what does "the games are backward compatable" mean? dx10 will not be. the general public will be able to get vista soon, and dude if it has dx10 i will apologize, but now that the businesses have gotten vista not dx10.



Look man, I know your new but dont just post things up for the sake of it, people might read that and actually believe you, and lets be fair, most of what your saying is wrong. Just post in threads where you actually know something about the topic that your talking about/have a valid point, if you dont you will get flamed.

plz, go to this site:

http://www.microsoft.com/windowsvista/default.aspx

and find where it STATES that directx10 is included with the OS. i can see directx9L is stated that the api is included.
now check this site:

http://www.microsoft.com/windowsxp/default.mspx

now can u see that directx is on the 1st page.

do anyof u understand the meaning or are u guys still in highschool?

directx10 is not ready for distribution!
ms is hoping it will be by the time vista launches on Jan 30, 2007, or theyd have a download site for it,
cause u all know the the business version is out?
!