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Will the r600 drive down 8800 prices?

Last response: in Graphics & Displays
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December 20, 2006 7:15:12 AM

I'm banking on it. I'm looking forward to a price drop on the 8800's so that I can put that fast, efficient piece of hardware into my PCIe gaming machine. But will the r600 really drive down 8800 prices? I realize that no one is psychic but what is your speculation? Im really hoping they will go down with the r600 release because I'm not sure I'm willing to spend 400-600 USD on a DX10 card. =/

More about : r600 drive 8800 prices

December 20, 2006 9:17:20 AM

meh but I don't want an 8600 I want an 8800 :D  oh well I guess maybe Ill have to step up from another card (a la eVGA) so that it doesn't feel like it costs that much ;) 
December 20, 2006 3:47:44 PM

The first high end card from ATI will likely beat the 8800, prompting nvidia to release a still faster 8800 variant. It's one of those 2 cards that you want. Oh wait, you also said you didn't want to spend that much for a GPU. You can't have it both ways. :? I know the money is burning a hole in your pocket but try to have patience. Don't buy anything until ATI hits the scene, and both companies bring out their mid-range cards. This isn't life or death. You have plenty of time to read the reviews and then pick the best card for your budget. Anyone that can't wait a month to buy an upgraded pc part needs to check into computer rehab.
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December 20, 2006 4:29:43 PM

Yes, most likely current 8800 gtx/s will be discounted. Also, nV will be releasing their midrange line (8600...) as well as a die-shrinked 8800 gtx (8900?), and possibly DDR4 mem. The die-shrink should allow for faster core speeds, and DDR4 faster mem.

From the info that's come out so far, I reckon that at the time of their release, R600 will be roughly equivalent or a tiny bit faster than current 8800 gtx's. The 8900 refresh will probably nullify ATI's lead. However, if you are looking at buying at that time, I'd still go will nV since RD600 and R600 will still be working out driver and hardware issues while i680 and G80 will be proven. Also, there's always the question of availability of R600 at launch. It's quite possible that while 8800/8900's will be plentiful, R600s will be scarce and therefore selling at a premium (as was the case with the 1800s/1900s).

If you're looking at upgrading further out, I'd say it will be neck and neck. IMO, I've always been a fan of ATI technology though - they seem to innovate more while nV follows suit or copies others and brands better.
December 20, 2006 4:39:36 PM

the ATI cards r probably $100 cheaper than the nvidia's
December 20, 2006 7:21:01 PM

Nvidia does not even have Vista Drivers available IN BETA for 8800 cards.
It is a broken platform, or people would be using it with Vista now.


There is a huge fuss over this in the Nvidia forums, but they keep deleting the posts. Dont buy Nvidia, trust me. I have had my card for 1 month, and disputed the credit card purchase to get a refund..

It is not direct x 10 capable, and not vista compatible. They are trying to do a quick patch now to make it so. If you don't believe me, check this out. It is unbelievable how bad Nvidia messed up.. You will be reading about it in the papers soon, as their stock will surely plummet.
http://forums.nvidia.com/index.php?showtopic=23399
December 20, 2006 8:10:24 PM

Just wait. Stop trying to predict. You'll drive yourself crazy. Wait till the card you want comes out, wait for the intitial 2-3 month boom to be over, and then fork up the $. That's the way of the computer world.

The only real exception to this rule is processors.
December 20, 2006 8:16:53 PM

I don't think the ATI card will drive down the prices much.., maybe a little... I think the new DX10midrange cards will plug the price gap ($150-$300 range).

8O
December 20, 2006 8:58:12 PM

Well, if R600 beats the 8800GTX on performances the later price will go down for sure. NVidia will release a new faster version of the 8800GTX and sell the original model for a lower price to stay competitive.

If, on the other hand, R600 is slower, than it will come out at a lower price than the 8800GTX. How much slower will determine if it'll still be a viable upgrade to you.

But considering that "true" Dx10 games won't be out until late 2007 probably, not taking into account hybrid Dx10 ones, I don't know if these card will have the necessary power to run them at anything better than "no effect" mode.

I don't know myself, but I'm wondering...
December 21, 2006 6:09:51 AM

Quote:
Nvidia does not even have Vista Drivers available IN BETA for 8800 cards.
It is a broken platform, or people would be using it with Vista now.


There is a huge fuss over this in the Nvidia forums, but they keep deleting the posts. Dont buy Nvidia, trust me. I have had my card for 1 month, and disputed the credit card purchase to get a refund..

It is not direct x 10 capable, and not vista compatible. They are trying to do a quick patch now to make it so. If you don't believe me, check this out. It is unbelievable how bad Nvidia messed up.. You will be reading about it in the papers soon, as their stock will surely plummet.
http://forums.nvidia.com/index.php?showtopic=23399


Vista is still in beta why in the hell would they make drivers for an OS that is being changed? I'm sorry but I choose not to listen to people as biased as you seem to be.
December 21, 2006 6:35:04 AM

Also, wait for the benchmarks, as it will give you more infomation on how good are the R600s.
December 21, 2006 6:58:30 AM

I dropped my crystal ball, and it went all cloudy. Be patient.... All will be revealed....
December 21, 2006 11:44:48 AM

Quote:
From the info that's come out so far, I reckon that at the time of their release, R600 will be roughly equivalent or a tiny bit faster than current 8800 gtx's.


I'd speculate something similar but that is all we can do - speculate as there is bugger all information available on the R600 on which to make an educated guess.
December 22, 2006 7:01:35 AM

Quote:
I dropped my crystal ball, and it went all cloudy. Be patient.... All will be revealed....


im waiting. :lol: 
December 22, 2006 7:19:44 AM

Yes, Grasshopper.... as are we all. Some less patiently, some more so.

Bait the hook, the fishes will come.
December 22, 2006 12:46:59 PM

Quote:

Vista is still in beta


Wrong, I have a full and final version instaled on my PC
December 22, 2006 12:49:19 PM

Quote:

Vista is still in beta


Wrong, I have a full and final version instaled on my PC

But likewise, home versions are not yet available for retail.
December 24, 2006 12:29:10 PM

Quote:

Vista is still in beta


Wrong, I have a full and final version instaled on my PC

Are satisfied with it? How is it compare to WXP? 32 or 64 bit version you have?

I'm asking because I'll purchase a new computer in february and I want to get Vista... at least if it works well.

Thanks for the informations.
December 24, 2006 1:30:42 PM

Quote:
Vista is still in beta why in the hell would they make drivers for an OS that is being changed? I'm sorry but I choose not to listen to people as biased as you seem to be.


This is false. The final version of Windows Vista was released to MSDN subscribers more than five weeks ago, on 2006-11-17, and to volume license subscribers more than three weeks ago, on 2006-11-30. It was released to manufacturing on 2006-11-08 and so hasn't been in beta for a long time.
a b U Graphics card
December 24, 2006 1:49:17 PM

I am kind of new at this DX10 video business. But here is what I wonder ...

The 8800GTX has 128 unified shaders, the GTS has 96. I did a Google seach on R600. No hard data. A couple sites say the the R600 will have 64 shaders.

Unless the R600 architecture, speed, and drivers are superior to nVidia, I do not see how ATI is going to be competitive..

If the R600 is not competitive, it will not affect 8800 prices. And if the R600 is not competitive, I can see ATI delaying the release of the chip while they redesign it for greater performance.

I also expect, that like the 8800, the R600 chips will be pretty big, reducing the yield per wafer. This will also adversely affect prices.
December 24, 2006 2:08:30 PM

The difference is not as big as it seems at first looks. Altough nobody knows for sure, it looks like ATI shaders can do 4 operationas/cycles. Now, do 64 shaders*4 ops/cycle, that gives you 256 cycles*ops total. Not so bad compare to the 8800GTX 128.

If this is true, it looks like ones of those "I wins for newers games but looses in older ones" type of cards. Exactly what I ordered :twisted: . Who needs 400fps in H-L2 when you can't get more than 30fps with upcoming Crysis?

I might be totally off track, but we're only here to speculate.... no?
December 24, 2006 3:04:35 PM

Quote:
the ATI cards r probably $100 cheaper than the nvidia's
You're basing that off of what?
Quote:
Nvidia does not even have Vista Drivers available IN BETA for 8800 cards.
It is a broken platform, or people would be using it with Vista now.


There is a huge fuss over this in the Nvidia forums, but they keep deleting the posts. Dont buy Nvidia, trust me. I have had my card for 1 month, and disputed the credit card purchase to get a refund..

It is not direct x 10 capable, and not vista compatible. They are trying to do a quick patch now to make it so. If you don't believe me, check this out. It is unbelievable how bad Nvidia messed up.. You will be reading about it in the papers soon, as their stock will surely plummet.
http://forums.nvidia.com/index.php?showtopic=23399
That's what you get for using a gamers videocard on a corporate operating system. Nvidia is not responsible for fools like yourself who are unable to wait for the official consumer release in January.
Quote:
The difference is not as big as it seems at first looks. Altough nobody knows for sure, it looks like ATI shaders can do 4 operationas/cycles. Now, do 64 shaders*4 ops/cycle, that gives you 256 cycles*ops total. Not so bad compare to the 8800GTX 128.

If this is true, it looks like ones of those "I wins for newers games but looses in older ones" type of cards. Exactly what I ordered :twisted: . Who needs 400fps in H-L2 when you can't get more than 30fps with upcoming Crysis?

I might be totally off track, but we're only here to speculate.... no?
That is how it sounds with the R600, however rumors are the entire chip is clocked around 700MHz, and compare that to the G80s 128 shaders clocked at 1.35GHz, it makes it a much closer race than you'd think.
a b U Graphics card
December 24, 2006 4:49:30 PM

Quote:
Nvidia does not even have Vista Drivers available IN BETA for 8800 cards.


OK. nVidia has hardware, no Vista drivers; ATI, no hardware, no drivers. Since ATI has not delivered any kind of hardware to anyone, actual performance and pricing are based on speculation (sometimes educated) and wishful thinking.

Until ATI ships samples to reviewers, we will not have any real idea about performance. And until R600 cards hit the shelves, we will not know about pricing.

More of my speculation: ATI, like nVidia, was aiming for a pre-Christmas release, but did not make it.
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