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Need a little upgrade advise (fx-60 + x1950pro)

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January 6, 2007 2:32:43 AM

Hey Guys,

I'm just looking for a couple opinions on an idea I had recently when I found out about the X1950pro AGP cards recently released.

I was originally planning on building a new rig for dx10 when crisis shipped, but as I thought about it more I turned against the idea in favor of a HDTV + console purchase. Now learning of more upgrade options for the trusty pc i've shifted again. So now the idea is upgrading to an FX-60 and the X1950pro 512 AGP and then overclocking the FX if need be.

I have currently:
A64 3500+
X800XTPE
Abit AV8 (939)
2GB corsair C2 (4x 512 - sucks i know)

Built the rig 2+ years ago right before PCI-e hit it big. DOH!

So, the main questions are:

1. Does it make sense to upgrade from an x800 to a x1950? I have an idea the speed increase wont be that great, but atleast I'll get the shader 2.0 limitation out of the way and possibly create a solution where I can play the remainder of DX9 games that are released in the future. Being locked out of SC:D A really pissed me off (just because I know the x800 could handle it if UBI wasn't lazy and implemented a 2.0 shader path). I don't want to be locked out of anymore games.

2. If the X1950 isn't worth it, does it make sense to get an FX-60 (if it is worth it the fx-60 is a no-brainer.)? I know even my x800 is cpu bottlenecked and the FX should set it free. Then my only concern would be games that lock out the 2.0 shader path.

I just want to be able to play crysis, bioshock, supreme commander, STALKER, and alan wake when they come out at the maximum settings I possibly can. I'm not sure if any of those will lock out the 2.0 shader or not.

I don't want to invest in an entirely new rig now, cause that'll mean new mobo, ram, cpu, and gfx, which can add up to a whole lot of cash, as I wouldn't be too willing to go budget on any of it (I'm a very frugal person except when it comes to pc hardware - gotta have the best).

So, any advise?

PS. hopefully this upgrade now would keep me satisfied until DX10 becomes mainstream and I could get a new rig for less money than buying one "for the future" now.

More about : upgrade advise x1950pro

January 6, 2007 2:57:52 AM

Quote:
(4x 512 - sucks i know)


nah that's fine I have 2x512 without dual channel now that sucks :wink:

You won't be able to play a DX10 game at max with a DX9 card but with an x1950pro you should get some pretty good detail (seeing as this card seems to be the last hooah! for AGP) with good FPS. What's more important for some of those games is that you get a dual core CPU as some if not all of those games will be multithreaded and will receive a significant boost (not to graphics quality but to overall gameplay and maybe up to 10 extra FPS or more). As long as you don't feel like upgrading your mobo the FX-60 should do fine (it is dual core right?) although I'm not the best help in this area because I have not owned an AMD cpu yet and haven't done much research about them.
January 6, 2007 3:06:37 AM

fx 60 is on newegg for $440. thats way overpriced. i suggest getting a intel e6300 for about 180, a mobo for around 140, like the giga ds3, and some ram. 2 gigs at least if you plan on upgrading to vista. you may end up spending 100 bucks more, but you can overclock the hell out of the e6300 and it will be faster than the fx60. not to mention more upgradeable. if you can, i'd wait one month and see if you can't get a lower end dx10 card. they are supposed to come out in feb i think.
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January 6, 2007 3:29:38 AM

Go with an Opteron 170, and OC it to FX-62 territory @ 2.8 Ghz. Then use what you saved, plus some lunch money, for the 1950 Pro! :D  But it's not OK to use beer money :lol: 
January 6, 2007 3:58:17 AM

Quote:
nah that's fine I have 2x512 without dual channel now that sucks :wink:

2x is fine, the real problem was filling all four slots in combination with the 3500+... It's memory controller can only handle 333MHZ with all four slots filled. I've heard later chips like the FX, opteron, and X2s handle the four slot situation better. If it's only my motherboard that has that issue, I'm going to scrap AMD altogether.

Quote:
fx 60 is on newegg for $440. thats way overpriced.

overpriced? haha, I wonder what it was called when it was almost $1100. Yes I know that was a different time, but it wasn't that long ago.

Quote:
Go with an Opteron 170, and OC it to FX-62 territory @ 2.8 Ghz. Then use what you saved, plus some lunch money, for the 1950 Pro! :D  But it's not OK to use beer money :lol: 

To overclock that much would I need a watercooling setup?
Booze money comes from a different coffer... no need to worry about that mate.
January 6, 2007 4:09:28 AM

Quote:
To overclock that much would I need a watercooling setup?


My previous was an Opteron 170 OC'd to 3.0Ghz on high end air, so yes, a clean chip can OC to FX-62 speed. Opty 170 $188.99 at the Egg:

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E1681...

Best kept secret in AMD CPU's. Best socket 939 CPU! :D 
a b U Graphics card
January 6, 2007 4:41:39 AM

since you are on agp go with the better gpu and maybe an x2 3800.

if you had a pci-e mobo i would then suggest something like an opty or fx 60
January 6, 2007 5:25:03 AM

Quote:
since you are on agp go with the better gpu and maybe an x2 3800.
if you had a pci-e mobo i would then suggest something like an opty or fx 60


From what I've seen, not even the X1950pro agp card can saturate the AGP bus (the agp and pci-e versions have very similar benches), and as I've said I can tell my current cpu is a bottleneck in games. I don't think the 3800 is enough of a step up from my current chip. It seems like I'd be better off with a much faster cpu like the 170 (or 175) opty or something first and then worry about gfx after.

Unless you mean that the opty or fx would be overkill for agp. I'm not sure thats the case.

If I had a pci-e mobo I'd get a dx10 card.
a b U Graphics card
January 6, 2007 5:54:10 AM

Quote:
since you are on agp go with the better gpu and maybe an x2 3800.
if you had a pci-e mobo i would then suggest something like an opty or fx 60


From what I've seen, not even the X1950pro agp card can saturate the AGP bus (the agp and pci-e versions have very similar benches), and as I've said I can tell my current cpu is a bottleneck in games. I don't think the 3800 is enough of a step up from my current chip. It seems like I'd be better off with a much faster cpu like the 170 (or 175) opty or something first and then worry about gfx after.

Unless you mean that the opty or fx would be overkill for agp. I'm not sure thats the case.

If I had a pci-e mobo I'd get a dx10 card.

the 3500 you now have is 2.2 and going to a x23800 at 2.0 will not be a
bottleneck. the 3500 is not a bottleneck.

im saying that a dualcore will last longer but there is the agp limitation.
which as you said and are correct that the difference in agp and pci-e
isnt that much.

the main thing is dx10.

so imean to say that with agp it is best to get the best card
and a cheap dual core until you upgrade.
January 6, 2007 2:50:06 PM

Yes, the fx60 was overpriced at 1100 and its overpriced now. the intel e6600 beats it in almost every single benchmark, game, anything, and its 300 bucks. so yes, the fx60, espcially on a non upgradeable 939 mobo, is extremely overpriced. i'm no intel fanboy, but intels midrange stuff kicks amds top end right now. and even intels low end conroes kick everythings ass bc they overclock so well. my e6400 for 210 bucks oc to 3.0 will kick that fx60 in the butt.
a b U Graphics card
January 6, 2007 2:54:40 PM

Quote:
Yes, the fx60 was overpriced at 1100 and its overpriced now. the intel e6600 beats it in almost every single benchmark, game, anything, and its 300 bucks. so yes, the fx60, espcially on a non upgradeable 939 mobo, is extremely overpriced. i'm no intel fanboy, but intels midrange stuff kicks amds top end right now. and even intels low end conroes kick everythings ass bc they overclock so well. my e6400 for 210 bucks oc to 3.0 will kick that fx60 in the butt.


any cpu for 1000$ is overpriced.
January 6, 2007 3:36:54 PM

Eh,

So I guess the thing to do is grab myself a opty 170 and oc it, to at least bring this rig into the dual-core realm for multi-tasking and doing faster video work. Maybe even a little boost for the currents games I have.

When the time comes for a decision about DX10, maybe I'll build a new rig then.

Just seems silly how AGP and DDR ram have practically been abandoned before they became the bottlenecks of the system

AMD needs to pick a socket and stick with it. :x Atleast the intel guys could go from a Pentium 4 or D to the c2d without a mobo switch if they wanted.
January 6, 2007 4:56:36 PM

actually thats not true. i think the only mobo that might have been able to be compatible with both pentium d and c2d was the 975x, but most of them needed to be a different revision and still weren't compatible. they both do the socket change thing alot. its not just amd.
January 6, 2007 6:47:11 PM

Good choice on the Opty 170. You'll be very happy with it. Here's the stepping from the 170 I had OC'd to 3.0Ghz:

Model: OSA170DAA6CD
Stepping: CCBBE 0610DPMW
Serial: 1430261C60932
Core: Toledo

3.0Ghz is common with this stepping, and it's consistently the fastest 939 Opty AMD ever produced.

Good luck, and enjoy! :D 
!