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which of the two systems will be better?

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January 6, 2007 8:27:21 AM

hi
im back with another question. following are two systems, please tell me which one will be better.
system 1
amd athlon x2 3800+ socket 939
an nforce motherboard (am not sure which one for sure)
kingston 1gb ddr 400
connect 3D ati radeon X700
470W thermaltake tru2
320GB seagate hdd SATA
sony dvd-rw
msi tv @nywhere

system 2
core 2 duo e6300
Asrock 775dual-vsta (or some other better motherboard if u know any)
kingston 1gb ddr 400
connect 3D ati radeon X700
470W thermaltake tru2
320GB seagate hdd SATA
sony dvd-rw
msi tv @nywhere

now these two systems have only two things different, that is mobo and the processor. now there are two things that i will do after buying any of these systems, never overclock and i will get another 1 gb ram soon, nothing else. i will change my system after one or two years. now can u guys please tell me which system will be better. hope to hear from u guys soon. thanks.

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January 6, 2007 8:44:34 AM

Get second system, but change memory to DDR2 800.
January 6, 2007 9:18:56 AM

i meant that i will not change my Ram to ddr2 i will only add another 1 gb stick to my rig. now which one of the systems will be better?
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January 6, 2007 10:30:12 AM

The second system will be better.
January 6, 2007 10:35:22 AM

i currently have the same specs but my processor is amd athlon 3000+ socket 754 and msi k8n neo3-f. will it be better to get any of these systems or just add another gb to my current rig? and can u guys please tell me whether this mother board in system 2 will be fine or do u recommend any other.
January 6, 2007 10:54:23 AM

You mean same rig as mine?

But about adding the ram, wich tasks you use your pc for? Then we can tell you if it really be usefull.
January 6, 2007 11:09:17 AM

Second system will give you better upgrade paths. S939 is now officially no longer manufactured by AMD. This means "what is out there is out there". Eventually the retail channels like newegg.com will dry out the S939 stocks and you'll be left searching ebay for upgrades.
January 6, 2007 11:52:59 AM

i do gaming and encoding as well. not that hardcore though. but as i said i will only buy 1gb dddr 400 ram and buy some other stuff like ups and etc. i will change my system, any from the choice of system 1 or system 2, after 1 to 2 years.
January 6, 2007 11:57:22 AM

Get the second system, for gaming the x700 isnt that much power, but you probably already knew that.

But for encoding the extra 1gb ram will speeds things up, its also better in games. So yeah i'd say go for the extra ram.
January 6, 2007 1:46:59 PM

For your own best interests look at the Gigabyte GA-P965-S3 instead, or even the GA-P965-DS3.

Pair it with 2 x 1 GB of DDR2-533 or DDR2-667

DDR2-800 is total overkill for your needs and will only make a 0.5% difference, but cost 5-10% extra (total cost wise).

Do not buy a DDR1 Core 2 Duo mainboard if you can avoid it at all, and you can because you're building a new system.
January 6, 2007 2:33:17 PM

Second system is your best bet. I used the same mobo\CPU for testing purposes. I found that DDR was sufficient and managed to get the max allowable overclock from that board( 315fsb at the time). I would suggest an E6400 in place of the 6300. The higher multiplier will allow for a better OC. 2200MHz for the E6300 and 2500MHz for the E6400. But buying DDR ram at this point is a waste of money. After this upgrade, any future upgrade will demand DDR2. So if you plan on changing this system in a year or two, as you stated, you'll have to upgrade the ram anyways.
January 6, 2007 3:15:21 PM

i am thinking of buying another 1 gb DDR 400 ram and keep this current set up for some more time that is, amd athlon 3000+ socket 754 and msi k8n neo3-f. u r right that i will have to upgrade my ram later but the thing is that today i will get nothing if i sell my processor, motherboard , and my current 1gb single stick ram. thus i think i will be better off by buying 1 more gb ram and upgrade the entire system later on, like in around 1 to 2 years. in between this time i will upgrade my vga card and psu though, but will change the processor and mobo after sometime. and one more thing, i will not overclock any of my component, cause i have no knowledge about it and dont want to do it either. what do u think about my plan? will it be worth?
January 6, 2007 3:26:18 PM

Well the upgrade is worth it for now. You could do worse. But overclocking that thing would give you one decent boost. It really was simple to do. Just a matter of moving the FSB to 300 and up it by 5 until it won't boot. Then bring it back by 5 and test for stability. It's worth the effort.
January 6, 2007 3:36:17 PM

a person recommended me, above, a gigabyte ga 965p-s3. it looks like a good motherboard. can u guys tell me the cheapest motherboard for core 2 duo whose chipset is nforce. it must have 4 slots for ram and supports quad core and also have a pci express x16 not x8 or something. in this case it doesnt matter whether the ram is ddr2 or ddr. if the board is cheap then i can think of buying core 2 duo. so please help me search the cheapest nforce board. thanks.
January 6, 2007 3:55:24 PM

Quote:
Second system will give you better upgrade paths. S939 is now officially no longer manufactured by AMD. This means "what is out there is out there". Eventually the retail channels like newegg.com will dry out the S939 stocks and you'll be left searching ebay for upgrades.


What TC said. 939 is a dead end. If you want AMD, go with AM2 3800.

If you want the best value for your dollar, a 6300 with 533DDR2 will outperform a X23800 with more expensive DDR2 800
January 6, 2007 4:18:42 PM

I have to say go with the second system for the reasons already sited. Im always to late to the post and someone posts my solution/reasnos first.
January 6, 2007 4:20:08 PM

Quote:
a person recommended me, above, a gigabyte ga 965p-s3. it looks like a good motherboard. can u guys tell me the cheapest motherboard for core 2 duo whose chipset is nforce. it must have 4 slots for ram and supports quad core and also have a pci express x16 not x8 or something. in this case it doesnt matter whether the ram is ddr2 or ddr. if the board is cheap then i can think of buying core 2 duo. so please help me search the cheapest nforce board. thanks.



www.pricegrabber.com
January 6, 2007 6:20:48 PM

Even though the C2D E6300 is a faster processor than the 3800X2 and has a better upgrade patch, in this case, I think the AMD system will be the better choice because the DDR 400 memory with speed of 200MHz is slower than the 266MHz core speed of the C2D, so the memory and the CPU will not be running in sync and a memory divider is required. The E6300 will not be able to run at full speed and suffer a huge hit in performance. If you are interested in a C2D chip, pair it up with RAMs with at least 533MHz in speed.
January 6, 2007 6:28:19 PM

Dude the Core 2 Duo with DDR1-400 works fine, especially on the mainboard he was originally looking at. (The Asrock one).

Look around: www.anandtech.com

In fact it is only a few percent slower, and in some cases faster than DDR2-533.

Intel CPUs have a MCH (NorthBridge / Memory Controller Hub) that acts as an intermediate between the CPU and RAM.

The Athlon 64 lacks an external MCH.


CPU to MCH = 1066 FSB x 64 bits wide
MCH to RAM = 400 MHz x 64 bits wide x Dual-Channel.

With a 4:3 ratio it'll work fine, and with the cache on the Core 2 Duo one barely notices slow RAM, or slow timings on RAM.

Seach for "Asrock" and "Core 2" on Google and Anandtech, there is some damn good free information on this subject.


If you go back though history CPUs FSB and RAM have traditionally run Async, with the MCH as an intermediate.
January 6, 2007 6:35:43 PM

actually, i am thinking about asrock cause it is cheap and maybe i can then fit in core 2 duo e6400. but the only thing i am worried about is whether it is durable or not. one more thing, i will not overclock any of my components. will it be durable cause i have heard that via chipsets are the worst and are not durable.
January 6, 2007 6:55:55 PM

Quote:
hi
im back with another question. following are two systems, please tell me which one will be better.
system 1
amd athlon x2 3800+ socket 939
an nforce motherboard (am not sure which one for sure)
kingston 1gb ddr 400
connect 3D ati radeon X700
470W thermaltake tru2
320GB seagate hdd SATA
sony dvd-rw
msi tv @nywhere

system 2
core 2 duo e6300
Asrock 775dual-vsta (or some other better motherboard if u know any)
kingston 1gb ddr 400
connect 3D ati radeon X700
470W thermaltake tru2
320GB seagate hdd SATA
sony dvd-rw
msi tv @nywhere

now these two systems have only two things different, that is mobo and the processor. now there are two things that i will do after buying any of these systems, never overclock and i will get another 1 gb ram soon, nothing else. i will change my system after one or two years. now can u guys please tell me which system will be better. hope to hear from u guys soon. thanks.


Few things.

1. Choose the second systems processor.
2. A Core2Duo apparently will not work for that system.
3. I've never heard of or found a motherboard that supports both Core2 and DDR memory.

Putting all these in perspective, you'd have little choice but to go with the first system if you want to keep your DDR memory.
January 6, 2007 7:30:31 PM

Your kidding right? Of course it will work with DDR and Core2. I was using one for a week. Where do you get your information?
January 6, 2007 7:37:23 PM

Quote:
Get second system, but change memory to DDR2 800.


WTF?
1st - This is a budget system
2nd- Why do you think he needs 800mhz on a budget?
3rd- He had never overclocked
4th- You don't need to spend $$$ on 800mhz to have performance

Last but not least - That mobo doesn't support ddr2 800

@lordszone

I´d go with the second system, just for upgrade matters.
Beware of that mobo, if u have 2x512 you have to sell it to upgrade, because 2 slots are for ddr and the other 2 to ddr2. Only pcie 4x, but it won't bottleneck your gfx card.
January 6, 2007 7:38:50 PM

bla bla bla

Double post! :D 
January 6, 2007 7:39:47 PM

bla bla bla

Double post! :D 

edit- crap, triple post....
January 6, 2007 7:40:06 PM

That's good for the original poster.

Going by Newegg's info the board the original poster chose for the second system is useable for Pentium D / Pentium 4 HT / Celeron D. My bad.
January 6, 2007 7:41:31 PM

I didn’t say DDR400 would not work with C2D, what I said was there will be a performance penalty for the combination of those two.
January 6, 2007 7:50:15 PM

Well, he has a 1gig stick at the moment, so another stick will serve him well fo this build. Lucky him :) 
January 6, 2007 7:53:03 PM

meme - hey dude - its me! guess what he's not kidding. Its the old amd bios that lives in media, people have not been properly informed that 6 months ago the amd ship sank, (now called amti) when they had no new products until lat 2007. The media has started catch on the last few months.


To: the post author --this was covered in tom's main articles many months ago overclocked e6400 (search it) totally smokes all amd? if i remember right. same thing xbtl - e6300 oc smoked them all was close the x6800 non-oc.

AMD had 1.5 yrs of glory when the unexpected leakage and failure of netburst. It looks like for AMD it back to emachines u go!

People are not really sure - even though amd has 4 different sockets = omg what confusion. AMD 4x4 is complete flop slower and almost twice as much juice! :x :x :x

Lets compare

Intel: new quad cores coming out this month $500, new low cost amd killer e4xxx series - ya - can u say oc, the new e6x50 series of 1333 bus chips - yuk! The new lower price e6x00 series. :idea: :idea: :idea:




AMD: slower new fab, 4x4??? when??
January 6, 2007 8:03:19 PM

Quote:
meme - hey dude - its me! guess what he's not kidding. Its the old amd bios that lives in media, people have not been properly informed that 6 months ago the amd ship sank, (now called amti) when they had no new products until lat 2007. The media has started catch on the last few months.


To: the post author --this was covered in tom's main articles many months ago overclocked e6400 (search it) totally smokes all amd? if i remember right. same thing xbtl - e6300 oc smoked them all was close the x6800 non-oc.

AMD had 1.5 yrs of glory when the unexpected leakage and failure of netburst. It looks like for AMD it back to emachines u go!

People are not really sure - even though amd has 4 different sockets = omg what confusion. AMD 4x4 is complete flop slower and almost twice as much juice! :x :x :x

Lets compare

Intel: new quad cores coming out this month $500, new low cost amd killer e4xxx series - ya - can u say oc, the new e6x50 series of 1333 bus chips - yuk! The new lower price e6x00 series. :idea: :idea: :idea:




AMD: slower new fab, 4x4??? when??


Not to mention AMD trashing, what's the main point of your post for this thread?
January 6, 2007 8:04:40 PM

Quote:
That's good for the original poster.

Going by Newegg's info the board the original poster chose for the second system is useable for Pentium D / Pentium 4 HT / Celeron D. My bad.



It's all good.
January 6, 2007 8:07:32 PM

Quote:
That's good for the original poster.

Going by Newegg's info the board the original poster chose for the second system is useable for Pentium D / Pentium 4 HT / Celeron D. My bad.



It's all good.

Good deal.
January 6, 2007 8:11:57 PM

Deal me in.
January 6, 2007 8:37:25 PM

Quote:
Deal me in.


What's your game, hearts, seven card stud, hold 'em?
January 6, 2007 9:03:50 PM

Hold 'em . There can be no other :D 
January 6, 2007 9:33:13 PM

Quote:
Hold 'em . There can be no other :D 


:razz: I think I still prefer hearts. Can't mess up as bad when you get wasted.
January 6, 2007 9:45:50 PM

When I get wasted, I prefer spin the bottle. But I'm always alone :?
January 6, 2007 9:58:54 PM

Quote:
When I get wasted, I prefer spin the bottle. But I'm always alone :?


Why? That just wastes the stuff. :razz:
January 6, 2007 10:35:10 PM

Welcome to my life :cry: 
January 6, 2007 10:40:45 PM

Quote:
Welcome to my life :cry: 


I have this weird urge to twist a knife and be really mean, but I think I'm not going to do that right now. You take care.
January 6, 2007 10:44:09 PM

First off, if you research the price difference between the s939 X2 3800+ and the E6300, you will see that the s939 X2 3800 + is more expensive. Now, the AM2 X2 3800+ can be found for less than the E6300, but, if that's not an option for you, then go with the E6300. You can get one from www.stalliontek.com for $160 w/ heatsink and fan and that includes shipping. I've purchased from stalliontek before, and have been very satisfied with the results. Check out pricewatch.com for more price comparisons.
January 6, 2007 11:09:40 PM

You are a true gentleman :p 
January 6, 2007 11:32:56 PM

Quote:
I've never heard of or found a motherboard that supports both Core2 and DDR memory.


I just built a comp using the Asrock DUAL-VSTA to run a C2D E6400 with DDR. It definitely works. This is however the only board I have found to do so. Asrock has a similar board for AM2 to use DDR (for people with expensive DDR sets who don't want to pay through the nose for DDR2 that hardly helps).

Jo
January 6, 2007 11:48:27 PM

Any overclocking on it?
January 7, 2007 1:24:15 AM

Quote:
You are a true gentleman :p 


Awe, shucks. I usually just get told to go away. :razz:

Quote:
I've never heard of or found a motherboard that supports both Core2 and DDR memory.


I just built a comp using the Asrock DUAL-VSTA to run a C2D E6400 with DDR. It definitely works. This is however the only board I have found to do so. Asrock has a similar board for AM2 to use DDR (for people with expensive DDR sets who don't want to pay through the nose for DDR2 that hardly helps).

Jo

That would be a first for me to hear. Thanks for the heads-up on it.
January 7, 2007 2:16:01 AM

Quote:
I've never heard of or found a motherboard that supports both Core2 and DDR memory.


I just built a comp using the Asrock DUAL-VSTA to run a C2D E6400 with DDR. It definitely works. This is however the only board I have found to do so. Asrock has a similar board for AM2 to use DDR (for people with expensive DDR sets who don't want to pay through the nose for DDR2 that hardly helps).

Jo

For those interested, it even let's you use AGP or PCIe. (The PCIe bandwith is limited, however, but it is still good enough for a 7600 or lower card). Anandtech did 3 articles on this board:
[http://www.anandtech.com/showdoc.aspx?i=2810&p=1
[http://www.anandtech.com/showdoc.aspx?i=2813&p=1
[http://www.anandtech.com/showdoc.aspx?i=2810&p=1


I converted one of my P4-Northwood systems with a 7800GS AGP card and DDR RAM over to an E6600 with this board. I must say, this new system just blows the freakin' doors off the old.

There are only 2 drawbacks on this board.
1) Doesn't OC with DDR RAM, and apparently it's not a good overclocker with DDR2. But, it's not designed to be a performance board.
2) Only 2 RAM slots for each type of RAM (No, you can't mix DDR and DDR2 on the board). I had 4 sticks of .5GB PC3200 originally, had to cut that in half. Not a big deal for XP, but I'll probably pick up a couple of 1GB sticks for Vista.
January 7, 2007 2:34:42 AM

Quote:


Quote:
I've never heard of or found a motherboard that supports both Core2 and DDR memory.


I just built a comp using the Asrock DUAL-VSTA to run a C2D E6400 with DDR. It definitely works. This is however the only board I have found to do so. Asrock has a similar board for AM2 to use DDR (for people with expensive DDR sets who don't want to pay through the nose for DDR2 that hardly helps).

That would be a first for me to hear. Thanks for the heads-up on it.


Quote:
I used the same mobo\CPU for testing purposes. I found that DDR was sufficient and managed to get the max allowable overclock from that board( 315fsb at the time).


Liar. Now go away :wink:


exit2dos. I was using DDR 500 and did get it to overclock. It wasn't difficult at all.
January 7, 2007 2:49:54 AM

I'm jealous - when I tried 500, the BIOS only recognized it as 400. Might be faulty RAM, but the machine I use the 500 in recognizes it as 500 - so I blamed Asrock, but it just may well be the RAM.

As far as DDR2 goes, I haven't tried it personally - just read Anadtech's report plus I've read in another thread somewhere that the person trying it couldn't get his E6600 past 2.8 (stable).

I guess I can't complain, as the difference at stock is amazing. My Core2 overclocking will have to wait for my Kentsfield build this spring.
January 7, 2007 2:59:27 AM

Max I've seen on that board is 320FSB-DDR2. 310 on DDR so he's at the limit. But,ya, that rocks.
!