Good build? Bad build? Please check...

[nem2k]

Ive decided on the components for my new system, can someone check for me and let me know what you think and if its all compatible?

The budget is £1200 (about $2300). No peripherals needed other than what is already listed

Will be using this computer for gaming and 3d work. I will also be overclocking the system

CPU: Intel Core 2 Duo E6600
http://www.scan.co.uk/Products/ProductInfo.asp?WebProductID=430633

GPU: Sapphire X1950XT
http://www.overclockers.co.uk/showproduct.php?prodid=GX-135-SP

Motherboard: Asus P5B Deluxe
http://www.overclockers.co.uk/showproduct.php?prodid=MB-150-AS

Case: Antec P180
http://www.ebuyer.com/UK/product/91721

Hard drive: Seagate Barracuda 7200.10 320GB
http://www.scan.co.uk/Products/ProductInfo.asp?WebProductID=397203

External HD: WD Premium myBook 250gb
http://www.komplett.co.uk/k/ki.asp?sku=318873

PSU: Enermax Liberty 500W
http://www.overclockers.co.uk/showproduct.php?prodid=CA-025-EN

DVDRW: Samsung Lightscribe 18x
http://www.overclockers.co.uk/showproduct.php?prodid=CD-080-SA

Sound card: Creative X-Fi Extreme Music
http://www.ebuyer.com/UK/product/112512

Headset: Speedlink Medusa 5.1 Home
http://www.ebuyer.com/UK/product/118195

Memory: Corsair 2gb 6400 XMS2
http://www.scan.co.uk/Products/ProductInfo.asp?WebProductID=402849

Heatsink: Tuniq Tower 120
http://www.overclockers.co.uk/showproduct.php?prodid=HS-000-SB

Fans: Scythe 120mm 1600rpm fan (x2)
http://www.overclockers.co.uk/showproduct.php?prodid=FG-005-SY

Floppy: Sony Black Floppy drive
http://www.ebuyer.com/UK/product/74629

USB flash drive: Sandisk 1gb
http://www.scan.co.uk/Products/ProductInfo.asp?WebProductID=450642

so what do you think? will it all work ok? Bear in mind that at some point im going to be dropping in an intel quad core and the 8800GTX, so i dont know how that would affect my current component selection

 

[Flewis]

Looks very good, my only concern would be the power supply not being quite powerful enough considering overclocking draws alot more power. Also psu's deteriorate over time so will produce less power in the future and may not be sufficient in a years time.

Why dont you buy the 8800GTX now and save having to get rid of the 1900 later on.

Otherwise some sound choices, those wd external hd's are sweet looking.

 

[nem2k]

what kind of powersupply would i need if i wanted to reach 3.5ghz with that cpu? will the 620W enermax liberty be enough?

the reason for the graphics card....
buying an 8800gtx right now seems like a waste of money. i have no games which require that kind of power, the most graphics intensive game i play right now is ghost recon advanced warfighter which im sure the 1950XT can handle
but i also wanted to wait for more dx10 games to come out so the graphics card can actually be pushed as opposed to sitting there not utilising its full power. plus by that time the r600 will be out then we can have some comparisons and see which dx10 card is actually the best as right now, nvidia have no competition

so what it boils down to, is the fact that i dont really NEED an 8800GTX, at least not until a game like UT2k7 comes out...unless there are some other opinions out there?

 

[crichards]

Very nice. If I was being really picky (and this is purely personal) I would forget lightscribe (takes aaaaages so you'll probably never use it) and go for a top-of-the-line Plextor.

 

[akhilles]

The ram & mobo are compatible, according to Corsair. It seems that TWIN2X2048-6400 is very compatible.

Yes, I'd get a psu at least 600W+. Enermax would be great.

 

[pinkcaddy]

That PSU only has 32A on 2 12V rails. I recommend the following supply for £15 more. It's got 41A total across 4 rails and has a high efficiency rating...

http://www.overclockers.co.uk/showproduct.php?prodid=CA-003-SS

 

[nem2k]

ah i see

any reason why i need the 41A though? is 32A not enough?

 

[akhilles]

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16817151027

The Seasonic would be better, IMO. The more amps on +12v, the more future-proof. The longer the next psu upgrade.

 

[nem2k]

oh, well, i knew amps on the 12v rail was more important than power, but for longevity the wattage isnt as important as the 12v amperage?

lets re-evaluate then

looking at seasonic psu options, we have these:

http://www.overclockers.co.uk/productlist.php?groupid=701&catid=123&subid=589

so a few questions then

1) would a 500W seasonic be enough to power my future system with the upgrades i mentioned?

2) what is the difference, in terms of performance, between the M12, the S12 and the S12 Energy?

so i guess im just wondering why you both chose the 55W S12 energy model, over the other seasonic models which are in the link i posted above? modular cabling was something i was looking forward to, but if the other psus perform better then ill go with them no question, just wondering what makes them better than the M12

 

[UAL3312]

i've had a few PSU's the one i have now is by far my FAVOURITE!
PC power&cooling 750 Watt Silencer think its around 200 but its awesome very reliable powers my 8800 680i and C2D at 3.5GHz very nicely

 

[sailer]

I think 500wt is barely scraping by with what you have, never mind upgrades like a 8800 and a quad core cpu. I'd look more to a 700wt minimun like a Thermaltake 700wt W0106RU or a Seasonic M12 SS-700HM. Enermax also has a couple good psus.

 

[WizardOZ]

By and large looks OK.

You may want to consider the following changes / suggestions:

1) Case: take a serious look at the Thermaltake Armor Jr case: very flexible, water-cooling ready, BTX conversion kit available, no PS, cheaper than your proposed case (very nice as is, but not BTX ready, and water cooling may be difficult to fit in). Since you say you will be OCing, water cooling compatability and space are issues to consider carefully.

2) Video card: your observations re DX-10 and competition are dead on. You can always upgrade the card later as required, and competition is a good thing for pricing. Mind you, if you are going to do a lot of 3D modelling compared to gaming, you may want to seriously look at one of the workstation cards from either ATI or nVidea. Sadly, these cards may not be good game cards, even though they will generally outperform mainstream cards. Issue is what cards games are optimized for. And how is time between gaming and 3D modelling split?

3) Hard drives: you haven't said why you need the external WD drive. Is it for back-up? If it isn't for back-up, you should scrap it and seriously look at the WD Raptor 150 GB drive for your bootdrive and games, along with apps drive for quick boot and start of programmes. The Seagate 320 GB drive is for your data, I presume. You may want to consider getting 2 or 3 smaller drives and setting them up as a RAID 5 array for data security. Mind you, if you do go this route, a standalone controller is preferred. Some posts in these forums suggest that the onboard raid controllers on the same MoBo, from the same manufacturer, may not be interoperable, leading to inability to read existing arrays on old drives.

4) PSU See other comments in earlier posts. Given your stated requirements, min output I would suggest is 750 W.

5) Optical drive(s): I suggest you take a very close look at the LG line. They have had excellent reviews, and I have never personally experienced any problems with any of the LG drives I have used - CDs, CD-RW, Combo drives, DVDs or DVD burners. Liteon and Lightscribe are useful but the process takes a long time in both cases, is monochrome, and the media is considerabley more expensive. Also, I suggest that you get both a DVD reader and burner, with an audio Y-cable for connecting both to your sound card. This makes copying much easier and doesn't require space on the hard drive. Plextor is seriously overpriced, and offers no performance advantage. Unless you are looking for a SATA capable drive, Plextor is a waste of cash.

6) USB Flash drive: look at the OCZ Rally2 very carefully. I have one of these, very nice, and drivers are availble for legacy OSs like Windows 9x. This can be more important than one would think.

Hope this helps.

 

[bobert866]

I'd go with a better power supply, other than that it looks good to me.

 

[nem2k]

looks like theres a lot of advice to go for a different psu, therefore im going to seriously look into getting a seasonic once i learn about the differences (which i cant seem to find anywhere!)

in regard to wizardOZ's post...

1) i saw the armor jr and it does indeed look like a very nice case. but water cooling isnt something im even considering for this build. im not confident enough to add WC to my system. maybe for my next build yes, but definitely not this one. and ive chosen an ATX motherboard for this, by the time i need to change motherboard again im probably going to end up buying a new case for all the new components anyway

2) ah well ill be gaming more than ill be doing 3d. i currently have an actual quadro in my machine, and the gaming side of things took a really big performance hit and i can barely play games like GRAW with anything more than 5fps!

3) now theres an interesting idea! never thought about getting raptors. yes the external drive is for backup of all my work, downloads, anything else i might want to throw on there incase my HD fails.

about the raptors...they are quite pricey and i dont think i could even afford 1 150gb drive, let alone 1 for boot and 1 for applications. is there a cheaper alternative to this? i really like the sound of speeding things up with a raptor, I just cant think of a cost efficient way of doing it as I have a budget to stick to

4) looking into seasonic psu right now. if anyone can explain to me the difference between their models then greatly appreciated

5) the reason i went with lightscribe isnt because im going to be using it more often, but because those drives are the same price as any other dvd writer so my thinking was, why not?
yeah im probably gunna throw a dvd reader in there at some point, but not right now because i hardly ever record from 1 disc to another, its usually putting things from my HD onto a CD

6) rally2...dual channel memory? thats crazy! crazy enough that i might want to buy it

 

[akhilles]

Before you buy any ram, make 100% sure it's compatible with the mobo.

Differences between M12 & S12: M = Modular, power cables are detachable; M has a 60mm fan in front to cool the hot spot that is the top of the case; S has up to 88% efficiency; the rest seem identical.

The most powerful Seasonic is M12-700 that outputs 700w & has 56A on +12V rails.

http://www.seasonicusa.com/m12.htm
http://www.seasonicusa.com/s12plus.htm

 

[nem2k]

I do believe the ram is compatible, i checked on the corsair website but if im wrong then please do inform me

how powerful of a psu do i need? there have been recommendations (from this thread as well as others) anywhere between 500W and 750W, and thats quite a range. i dont want to overspend when I dont need all the excess power. i think the component that will draw the most will be my future dx10 card

i think even the 500W seasonic has enough amperage on the 12v rails so im ok in that respect, its just the power which im unsure about

 

[akhilles]

Amazing! Neither newegg nor Sapphire lists the PSU requirements. I found something in reviews:

http://www.gamepc.com/labs/view_content.asp?id=1950pro&page=3

& yes, Ati cards are pretty power hungry. I'd say at least a 600W. That may be a bit pushing it. 700W will be more than plenty.

 

[nem2k]

are ATi cards more power hungery than the 8800 line from nvidia?

 

[WizardOZ]

looks like theres a lot of advice to go for a different psu, therefore im going to seriously look into getting a seasonic once i learn about the differences (which i cant seem to find anywhere!)

in regard to wizardOZ's post...

1) i saw the armor jr and it does indeed look like a very nice case. but water cooling isnt something im even considering for this build. im not confident enough to add WC to my system. maybe for my next build yes, but definitely not this one. and ive chosen an ATX motherboard for this, by the time i need to change motherboard again im probably going to end up buying a new case for all the new components anyway

I didn't say you had to watercool. I did say: "Since you say you will be OCing, water cooling compatability and space are issues to consider carefully." I would still recommend the Thermaltake case over the Antec: ignoring all other issues, the price is about 20 Pounds cheaper and it is more flexible and future-proof.

2) ah well ill be gaming more than ill be doing 3d. i currently have an actual quadro in my machine, and the gaming side of things took a really big performance hit and i can barely play games like GRAW with anything more than 5fps!

Well there it is - question answered!

3) now theres an interesting idea! never thought about getting raptors. yes the external drive is for backup of all my work, downloads, anything else i might want to throw on there incase my HD fails.

about the raptors...they are quite pricey and i dont think i could even afford 1 150gb drive, let alone 1 for boot and 1 for applications. is there a cheaper alternative to this? i really like the sound of speeding things up with a raptor, I just cant think of a cost efficient way of doing it as I have a budget to stick to

Why are you assuming more than one Raptor drive? Haven't you heard of partitions? What you want to do is get one (1) 150 GB Raptor, install it as the boot drive and partition as follows (see comments about back-ups and external drive below):

1) C: drive 40 GB. Install OS and all utilities like antivirus, firewall etc. here. Size is enough to leave space for application files that must be installed on root drive, fonts etc. Also enough space for temp directory and printer spool files, etc.. You should also create a fixed size swap / page file to prevent disc fragmentation. If you allow Windows to set the size of the swap file it will vary in size dynamically, leading to serious disc fragmentation. Recomended size of swap file is usually 2 to 3 times amount of physical RAM present in system, up to 1GB RAM, then equal to physical RAM. You may want to consider creating a seperate partition for the swap / page file and setting the location and size of the swap file to that of the special partition. Makes optimizing the file with Norton Utilities easier and faster.

2) Games - size is 90 to 100 GB. Should be enough space for all your games and any temporary and save files they generate.

3) Applications 10 to 20 GB. Install things like your Office Suites, A/V editing/creation and 3D Modelling software here.

Size of Games and Apps partitions depends on amount of software you have in each class, and future purchases.

With this setup, you are protecting your OS from problems due to disc fragmentation etc., from games, giving your apps and games some security and reducing problems if you do have OS crashes that require reboots - your games and apps files won't be corrupted.

If you are planning to use Windows XP, it includes disk partitioning software but it remains destructive. You really should get a copy of Partition Magic to do the job. Among other things, it can re-size partitions on the fly without data loss, convert between file systems, etc.. I have used this software since DOS days Version 2, and have never had any problems. Absolutely brilliant software.

Your 320GB data drive should also be partitioned into at least 2 logical drives. Use one for your serious data and the other for the rest.

Some will say that it is too complex to adminster multiple partitions and unnecessary. The issue of a small loss of storage space due to file system overhead will also be raised. These are bogus concerns. Seperate partitions for your data make backing up much easier and efficientr. And you might want to consider the trivial point that the majority of security gurus recommend one to have sepreate partitions for data and apps and OS. In my experience it is a very bad idea to ignore the experts.

As a simple analogy, most back-packs are one big bag. Yet when you pack them for a trip, you don't just throw everything you are taking loosely into the bag. Your tent, clothes, sleeping bag, cooking gear, food, etc. are all in their own individual bags. Despite the fact that the individual bags of gear take up some space in the pack. Why is that? Your hard drive is like the bag of your back-pack. Same principles apply.

Backup: the external drive is easiest approch, and has maximum capacity, but is also most expensive. In any case, why do you need to backup anything other than your data and download files?

You do have your original OS, Utilitity, Apps and Game discs on hand, don't you? So you don't need to back these files up. Patch files and updates are another issue - see below.

You can use your DVD burner to backup your data as you go. If you get a dual layer burner and media, along with relatively inexpensive back-up software, you can use the burner for backing up your data automatically. You should also ensure that patch files and assorted downloads of drivers, utilities and music are backed up on DVD.

External hard drive not really needed, therefore.

RAID is something to consider for later. Here is an excellent intro to principles of RAID:

http://www.pcguide.com/ref/hdd/perf/raid/

The rest of that site is also extremely useful.


4) looking into seasonic psu right now. if anyone can explain to me the difference between their models then greatly appreciated

There is a member of these forums with the user name verndewd. His signature includes a link to a series of PS reviews. You really should check it out.


5) the reason i went with lightscribe isnt because im going to be using it more often, but because those drives are the same price as any other dvd writer so my thinking was, why not?
yeah im probably gunna throw a dvd reader in there at some point, but not right now because i hardly ever record from 1 disc to another, its usually putting things from my HD onto a CD

No worries, but you should still get a y-connector sound card cable for future reference.

6) rally2...dual channel memory? thats crazy! crazy enough that i might want to buy it

What's crazy about it. Works very well.

You haven't said what you are planning to do with your existing system. You may want to consider keeping it and getting a good KVM switch so you can run both systems. Use the older system as a test-bed for playing with Linux for instance. You may need to get some extra speakers for the old system if you do keep it.

Also, it is important to remember that many current MoBos don't include or support Serial or Parallel ports. If you have a parallel port printer, you should look at an adaptor to convert parallel to USB, and any serial devices you have may also be in the same boat. With serial devices, you will need to check with the manufacturer if the device does actully support a serial to USB converter. Some don't.

Hope this reply helps.

 

[nem2k]

the old computer....im selling it on so i wont be keeping it. monitor and all peripherals will be kept though

youre probably right about the external hard drive. i originally wanetd to buy it because its an easier way to back things up than recording onto DVDs and stuff. it was only there for convenience so i dont really need to buy it right now. same with the usb flash drive, its not something that i desperately need (yeah im trying hard to find a way to fit the raptor into my budget!)

the thing i dont understand is why you would partition the drives that way

i thought about it today and figured id do it like this:
take the raptor, divide it into 2 75gb paritions; one for windows and all applications, and the other for my games
then take the seagate drive, partition into 2 for my files (documents, downloads), and for my media (videos, music etc)

that slightly differs from the way you mentioned as i partition the raptor differently

what i dont understand is why you have a partition for windows and utilities, and then a seperate one for applications? why not put them on the same drive?
and ontop of that, i dont get why you have things like firewall, antivirus on the windows partition and not the applications one :?

could you explain please? im sure it is a more effective method, if i understood it

 

[WizardOZ]

the old computer....im selling it on so i wont be keeping it. monitor and all peripherals will be kept though

OK - so you won't need the KVM switch.

youre probably right about the external hard drive. i originally wanetd to buy it because its an easier way to back things up than recording onto DVDs and stuff. it was only there for convenience so i dont really need to buy it right now. same with the usb flash drive, its not something that i desperately need (yeah im trying hard to find a way to fit the raptor into my budget!)

The external hard drive has the following advantages wrt backups:

1) capacity is much greater, so you don't have to do it as often and incremental backups don't require new media like the DVD does.

2) its much faster, and less fussy.

But, what is the purpose of a backup? And what is the technical definition of a backup?

The purpose of a backup is to have a secure, defined copy of the files in question. So that if anything happens to the original data, you can restore it quickly and easily.

Technically speaking, the backup is supposed to be on a medium - be it tape, CD-R/RW, DVD, Hard Drive that is stored off-site to enable system restore in case of a catastrophic disaster on-site, including the building burning down. This actually means that you have to have multiple copies of the backed up data. An external hard drive connected to the system that is not moved off-site does not qualify as a backup system. And multiple external hard drives get really expensive fast. More critically, what do you think would be the impact on your "back-up" external hard drive if your system was compromised by a hack or other malfeascent software attack? On what basis do you assume that a live extermnal hard drive wouldn't be compromised at the same time? A DVD burner controlled by independent back-up software is much less likely to be compromised. Note that a compromise can happen, just much less likely. If you do your back-ups properly, it won't matter, because you will have clean backups of your datas etc..

the thing i dont understand is why you would partition the drives that way

i thought about it today and figured id do it like this:
take the raptor, divide it into 2 75gb paritions; one for windows and all applications, and the other for my games
then take the seagate drive, partition into 2 for my files (documents, downloads), and for my media (videos, music etc)

that slightly differs from the way you mentioned as i partition the raptor differently

what i dont understand is why you have a partition for windows and utilities, and then a seperate one for applications? why not put them on the same drive?
and ontop of that, i dont get why you have things like firewall, antivirus on the windows partition and not the applications one :?

could you explain please? im sure it is a more effective method, if i understood it

Ok Here we go.

The basic reason you want your major apps on a seperate partition from your Windows OS is that regardless of which version of Windows you are running, it becomes necessary to reinstall Windows at least once a year to every 3 months, depending on the version. The older the version, the more frequent the re-install - it is the nature of the beast. At least once a year, wipe and reinstall everything from scratch. Where I work, the desktop systems are leased and are running Windows XP. The IT bunch have yet to install SP2, let alone some of the other security patches. I have observed wierd behaviour and performance problems from time to time on my system. I have no doubt that compromises of my system have occurred, especially since anybody can log into my machine and download and install whatever they want. At least once a year or every 6 months, it is a very good idea to wipe and re-install the OS, particularly if you have reason to belive it has been compromised.

Arguably, if the apps and utilities are installed on the same drive as the OS, reinstalling and re-patching the OS will make no difference to the function and stability of these apps. And if the OS drive is wiped then everything has to be re-installed from scratch anyway. On many levels this is fundamentally true and correct. There is a big however coming here.

If you have your Apps installed on a seperate partition, then the likelihood of those files becoming corrupt in the normal re-install cycle of Windows is slim. Reinstalling Windows does NOT require reinstalling utilities and apps, because the links etc already exist and are not being overwritten. So you save a lot of time and effort by having a seperate partition for your apps. You don't need to re-install and re-patch your apps when you do this for the OS. Same point applies to utilities, but see below.

Utilities must be installed on the OS drive because they won't function if the OS drive is compromised in any way. I speak from hard experience. I had a situation where I installed my Norton Utilities on an "applications" partition. The OS sort of booted, and I could see and access the boot / root drive, but none of the other drives. I knew what the problem was, but the OS did not have the tools to deal with the issue. Any "solutions" available from the OS would have resulted in total loss of ALL data files. Unacceptable. My Norton Utilities could have easily dealt with the situatuion, without any data loss, but were inaccessable. Only option was wipe and reinstall. Fortunately, my data was on a seperate partition. Welcome to the wacky world of Windows - "repair" tools lead to data loss, wipe of C drive doesn't.

Installing apps on a seperate partiton has the following benefits:

1) it minimizes the amount of space used on the C drive, maximizing available space for temporary and spool files.

2) it eliminates the possibility of file corruption due to problems with Windows.

3) it minimizes the time required for a system restore when it is only necessary to reinstall and repatch Windows as opposed to wipe and reinstall.

The USB Flash drives are getting unbelievably inexpensive. They are also extremely useful, never mind convenient. You really should consider getting one very seriously.

Hope this helps.

 

[nem2k]

oh ok i get it

but...

1) how do you know what programs fall under the category of "utilities"?

2) what exactly is the point of a reformat? sounds like youre saying you can keep all applications, all files and documents in place, and just wipe the OS and reinstall that. when i always thought a reformat was taking absolutely everything off the drive, then reinstall the OS and apps for a cleaner and more efficient hard drive?

3) is there anything really wrong with installing utilities and apps on the same drive as the OS? i know it maybe be inconvenient to have to reinstall programs when you do a reformat, but is there anything wrong with that method? will it slow down the system at all?

 

[Dahak]

Everything looks good except for the power supply.If you plan on getting an 8800gtx,I would highly recommend a 750watt psu or higher.I currently run a 520watt sli ready psu and i do run two 7800gt's in sli mode.But I still need a more powerful power supply.Keep in mind that just because it says 750watts does not mean it is using 750watts,it just means that the power supply can run at a sustained 750 max output for whatever hours it is rated for.Goodluck.

Dahak

AMD X2-4400+@2.570 S-939
EVGA NF4 SLI MB
2X EVGA 7800GT IN SLI
2X1GIG DDR IN DC MODE
WD300GIG HD
EXTREME 19IN.MONITOR 1280X1024
ACE 520WATT PSU
COOLERMASTER MINI R120

 

[akhilles]

WizardOZ, the mods are missing out this opportunity to sticky your posts in the storage forum. Coming from a Linux background, I know what you are talking about. i.e. /home = my doc, can be on another partition/drive. You should really write an article for this site or other about data management.

It's sad that there are multiple competing data backup tools, but not one preference backup tool that can schedule auto backing up of every app's & game's preferences. I know you could do it manually in some apps like MSBACKUP. I guess people enjoy re-entering hundreds of firewall rules.

are ATi cards more power hungery than the 8800 line from nvidia?

I don't know about the upcoming Ati R600, which better kicks 8800's rear. The 8800 uses more power than the X1950. The 8800 GTX needs TWO PCI-E power cables.

http://www.hwupgrade.com/articles/video/13/the-nvidia-geforce-8800-gtx-and-gts-in-sli_5.html

 

[WizardOZ]

oh ok i get it

but...

1) how do you know what programs fall under the category of "utilities"?

Utilities include, but are not limited to: Antivirus, firewall, Norton Utilities, Acrobat reader, your MP3 players, video players, Quicktime. Generally speaking, a utility is a programme that does something specific like disc optimization, reading specific file formats, etc.

2) what exactly is the point of a reformat? sounds like youre saying you can keep all applications, all files and documents in place, and just wipe the OS and reinstall that. when i always thought a reformat was taking absolutely everything off the drive, then reinstall the OS and apps for a cleaner and more efficient hard drive?

From time to time, Windows becomes corrupted enough that a simple re-install of the files is not enough to fix the problems. This happens because, improvements in stability in XP notwithstanding, there is a common thing called the "Blue Screen of Death" in Windows. Sometimes even a Black Screen. Additionally, Windows - even XP - locks up or otherwise fails without a BSOD. When Windows crashes like this, the system has to be shut down "improperly", usually by turning the computer off with the power switch. This means that open files and active processes are not closed correctly. The ultimate consequence is corrupted OS files: either cross-linked, truncated or otherwise damaged. Up to a point, the OS will continue working approximately correctly even with damaged files. But it will be less stable, slower and strange things will happen periodically. These "little" anomalies can often be corrected by re-installing Windows, without having to reformat the root drive. But eventually it is necessary to reformat the root drive and re-install everything from scratch. And, if your system is compromised by a Trojan, Worm or other Malware, then it is necessary to reformat the root drive and re-install everything. This leads us into your next question.


3) is there anything really wrong with installing utilities and apps on the same drive as the OS? i know it maybe be inconvenient to have to reinstall programs when you do a reformat, but is there anything wrong with that method? will it slow down the system at all?

There is nothing "wrong" with installing your apps on the root drive along with the OS and your utilities. OS and Utilities must be installed on the root drive, everything else is optional. The advantage, from your perspective, of installing your major apps on a seperate partition is that it insulates the files that make up your apps from the corruption problems that occurr on the root drive every time Windows Blue-Screens or just locks up. No, your system won't be slowed down if you install your apps on a seperate partition. Even if it was, the difference would be far too small for you to notice. More critically, what is more important to you - a marginal slowdown in overall performance or the major apps you depend on failing due to file corruption? Remember, if you don't actually format the root drive where the OS is installed and just re-install the OS, none of the registry and other links to your apps are lost. This means that you don't have to re-install your apps or utilities when you only re-install the OS.

I hope that things are clear now.


As an additional thought about how you could set up your system, regardless of what you end up using as a primary boot drive, you should seriously consider doing the following:

Create a second primary partition on the boot drive of about 20GB in size. Sacrifice some of the space you would use for the games and apps partitons to make this partition.

Install a Linux distribution in the second primary partition and set up your system to enable dual-booting into either Windows or Linux.

You will also need to create a small data exchange partition on your data drive, say 5 GB, formatted as FAT32. Linux can read NTFS partitions, but can't write to them, so you will need a tranfer point for data you create in your Linux apps if you want to do anything with them using Windows apps and vice versa. You may also want to create a data partition of about 10 to 20 GB in native Linux file system format.

The Linux distribution you want to use is SuSe, especially since they have made a deal with Microsoft and are now able to offer improved support for MS format files.

I appreciate that this is getting a little more complex than you either expected or may feel comfy with. Bear with me, and consider this very carefully. There are many advantages to having the capability of dual booting into either Windows or Linux. Do a little digging. If you do this, you will have an opportunity to learn a new OS, which is the one that actually runs about 80% of the web - Apache server is a Linux app, and is the server that runs most of the systems that are the web. More critically, Linux is more secure than Windows, and even if the Windows side gets compromised, you will still have a functioning system. Even better, it may be possible to use the Linux side to fix parts of the Windows side enough to be able to restore it without having to wipe and re-install. BONUS!!

Oh yeah, here is another reason to get Partition Magic - it can convert partitions from one file system to another without data loss in real time. Including assorted Linux file systems. This is an extremely useful and powerful package.

Some of your questions and points lead me to direct your attention to the last line in my signature. I very strongly recommend that you look it up and read "The Moon Is Harsh Mistress" where the expression first appeared.

Once again, I hope this is of use and helpful.